108 suspects died in US custody

[CptStern]

at least 108 suspects died while in US custody at least 26 of those are being investigated as homicides


"At least 108 people have died in American custody in Iraq and Afghanistan, most of them violently, according to government data provided to The Associated Press. Roughly a quarter of those deaths have been investigated as possible abuse by U.S. personnel."


source

 

[Raziaar]

at least 108 suspects died while in US custody at least 26 of those are being investigated as homicides


"At least 108 people have died in American custody in Iraq and Afghanistan, most of them violently, according to government data provided to The Associated Press. Roughly a quarter of those deaths have been investigated as possible abuse by U.S. personnel."


source

Of course though, this means everybody in america is guilty and evil because of this right? I mean... screw all those evil military guys, since they killed all these people.

No. Wrong. You said the government provided that information, yes? That means they're not trying to cover it up, and instead are letting people know of the fact that it happened. And they're investigating them as abuses/homicides... so where is the ammunition to yet again attack every american?


And no, Stern... i'm not directing this at you. I'm just directing it at those who would take this and use it as another means to bash the states.

 

[CptStern]

but too bad the torture was endorsed and sanctioned by the government ...their copies of the Human Exploitation Resource Manual must be getting all dog-eared

 

[Raziaar]

but too bad the torture was endorsed and sanctioned by the government ...their copies of the Human Exploitation Resource Manual must be getting all dog-eared

Where was it endorsed and sanctioned? How the hell is it endorsed and sanctioned if these people are going to likely be prosecuted for murder/torture/abuse?

Thats like saying police endorse murders, but they still prosecute the criminals to the fullest extent of the law anyways.

 

[CptStern]

Where was it endorsed and sanctioned? How the hell is it endorsed and sanctioned if these people are going to likely be prosecuted for murder/torture/abuse?

Thats like saying police endorse murders, but they still prosecute the criminals to the fullest extent of the law anyways.

read this

"CIA interrogation manuals written in the 1960s and 1980s described "coercive techniques" such as those used to mistreat detainees at the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq"


they're literally "going by the book"

 

[Raziaar]

read this

"CIA interrogation manuals written in the 1960s and 1980s described "coercive techniques" such as those used to mistreat detainees at the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq"


they're literally "going by the book"

Since when are the CIA the government as a whole? You're talking about a secretive intelligence agency that employs assassins, and does all sorts of shady stuff. You don't have to pursuade me on the CIA, since I already know they are capable of some evil shit. Everybody has known this for a long time now.

So if you wanna talk about the despicable actions of the CIA, i'm whole-heartedly on your side, but they're not the government, and is able to very easily work their way around the government.

 

[Ennui]

stuff like this gets me so depressed.

 

[clarky003]

dont feel depressed , it happens all the time, its good people like us who should beable to stop it from happening, but unfortunately our democracey doesnt allow outside influencial input unless your qualified and influencial in the first place, (eg, own lots of stuff), yes and no choice votes consist of 'our' democracey. Its far too generalised, its breeding corruption, and that if anything, is the root cause of all this crap that is going on today. But we dont care! aslong as we have a nice life, house and car... great democratic process .

if the government know about this, its their responsibility to give a truthful explaination, arnt they supposed to over see institutional operations.

 

[smwScott]

Since when are the CIA the government as a whole? You're talking about a secretive intelligence agency that employs assassins, and does all sorts of shady stuff. You don't have to pursuade me on the CIA, since I already know they are capable of some evil shit. Everybody has known this for a long time now.

So if you wanna talk about the despicable actions of the CIA, i'm whole-heartedly on your side, but they're not the government, and is able to very easily work their way around the government.

Well fair enough, but the point is that American soldiers were performing the torture with CIA techniques. It very much was a case of the government doing this, the CIA (which is a government organization, I don't see how the government avoids responsibility for its actions) had little involvement.

 

[CptStern]

Since when are the CIA the government as a whole? You're talking about a secretive intelligence agency that employs assassins, and does all sorts of shady stuff. You don't have to pursuade me on the CIA, since I already know they are capable of some evil shit. Everybody has known this for a long time now.

So if you wanna talk about the despicable actions of the CIA, i'm whole-heartedly on your side, but they're not the government, and is able to very easily work their way around the government.

here read these documents: it proves that not only did the bush administration know about the torture they sought out ways to get around international law and expand on methods of information extraction

 

[Kebean PFC]

its good people like us who should beable to stop it from happening, but unfortunately our democracey doesnt allow outside influencial input unless your qualified and influencial in the first place, (eg, own lots of stuff), yes and no choice votes consist of 'our' democracey. Its far too generalised, its breeding corruption, and that if anything, is the root cause of all this crap that is going on today. But we dont care! aslong as we have a nice life, house and car... great democratic process

There is no such thing in the world as a perfect democracy, becuase if everyone had a say in what happened, nothing would.

On Topic: Wow stern, another anti US thread... jeeze it is almost a regular occurance, every 2-4 days another one. Alright, so the US is torturing people, its not like you are the almighty saint. If these people were terrorists, then i am sorry, but i could care less about their "welfare." If these were innocent people (Inocent of EVERYTHING, not just not being terrorists) then i think that it is wrong, and we should cease and decist. But i do believe that these people were here for a reason, and that reason was they had informaton about terroristic activities. If they did, lets get it out of them. I don't see any conclusive evidence eitherway.

Oh, and its not like the government is trying to hide it, so i think they did this for a good reason.

 

[CptStern]

On Topic: Wow stern, another anti US thread... jeeze it is almost a regular occurance, every 2-4 days another one.

enough with the "anti-american" crap, I've already answered that dozens of times

Alright, so the US is torturing people, its not like you are the almighty saint.

you're comparing me to the US of A?

If these people were terrorists, then i am sorry, but i could care less about their "welfare." If these were innocent people

well, it seems some must be innocent but they've also suffered torture

(Inocent of EVERYTHING, not just not being terrorists)

so you're saying that if they happend to rob a quickie mart they should still be tortured? i thought you said you supported torture of terrorists?

btw there's no trial

(then i think that it is wrong, and we should cease and decist.

I agree

 

[The Monkey]

We had a torture thread here. This should be used to discuss this very event, not torture as a whole. And this is sickening, but not suprising.

 

[clarky003]

But i do believe that these people were here for a reason, and that reason was they had informaton about terroristic activities

I dont think its a matter of what we 'believe', its a matter of what is right and what is wrong. Appreciating the fact that whatever they have done , even in illegal circumstances doesnt exclude them from being a human being, and considering the very war in which they are subjected to is an Illegal one, its all the more unsatisfactory.

to reiterate, the war was started because according the competant proffessional's Iraq had an active Wmd program that was active and a present threat to the world. But Rumsfeld and rice claimed otherwise in 2002, that there was no threat.. uncertainty?, more likely biased opinion, that they thought could be set straight in time, to suit to their manipulative needs.

probably the most comprehensive site on events leading upto today.

http://www.iraqtimeline.com/

 

[KoreBolteR]

what about the terrorists, when they catch the real innocent people...

blow them up, shoot them and behead them.

yeah looks like these terrorists gettin killed are as bad as the terrorists killing innocents (even children and women)./sarcasm

 

[The Monkey]

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html

 

[KoreBolteR]

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html

tell that to the terrorists.

 

[Laivasse]

what about the terrorists, when they catch the real innocent people...

blow them up, shoot them and behead them.

yeah looks like these terrorists gettin killed are as bad as the terrorists killing innocents (even children and women)./sarcasm

That's like saying the police should be allowed to rape rapists and rob thieves, because "that's what they would do to us!" These Iraqis had no trial either.

Regarding this specific incident, it seems typical of the US' heavyhanded approach in everything it does. The resentment that this kind of approach breeds is fuel to the fire that you're (supposedly) trying to put out. Perhaps if the Bush administration focussed less on trying to instil almost religious anti-terrorist fervour and fear in the populace, then US troops wouldn't have some kind of Crusader-complex and this type of thing could be averted.

 

[Korgoth]

That's like saying the police should be allowed to rape rapists and rob thieves, because "that's what they would do to us!" These Iraqis had no trial either.

Regarding this specific incident, it seems typical of the US' heavyhanded approach in everything it does. The resentment that this kind of approach breeds is fuel to the fire that you're (supposedly) trying to put out. Perhaps if the Bush administration focussed less on trying to instil almost religious anti-terrorist fervour and fear in the populace, then US troops wouldn't have some kind of Crusader-complex and this type of thing could be averted.

Ah thats what I'm talking about. I just had to quote this great post. Lets see if any of it soaks in now.

 

[KoreBolteR]

That's like saying the police should be allowed to rape rapists and rob thieves, because "that's what they would do to us!" These Iraqis had no trial either.

Regarding this specific incident, it seems typical of the US' heavyhanded approach in everything it does. The resentment that this kind of approach breeds is fuel to the fire that you're (supposedly) trying to put out. Perhaps if the Bush administration focussed less on trying to instil almost religious anti-terrorist fervour and fear in the populace, then US troops wouldn't have some kind of Crusader-complex and this type of thing could be averted.

no, its like a virus on a computor, the only way to solve the problem.. is to exterminate all the 'parasites'.

if these terrorists want to terrorise and kill innocent people, they should think twice.. cos they know if they get caught they will get killed, not put in some 5-star hotel room.. :/.

terrorists are the Virus' of this world.
US are the anti-virus'.

 

[Laivasse]

no, its like a virus on a computor, the only way to solve the problem.. is to exterminate all the 'parasites'.

if these terrorists want to terrorise and kill innocent people, they should think twice.. cos they know if they get caught they will get killed, not put in some 5-star hotel room.. :/.

terrorists are the Virus' of this world.
US are the anti-virus'.

That is a terrible, terrible way of looking at things.

For the record., I've never had an antivirus prog that didn't screw up the PC or miss loads of threats. It's better to rely on common sense. Dunno how that figures into your analogy.

 

[KoreBolteR]

That is a terrible, terrible way of looking at things.

For the record., I've never had an antivirus prog that didn't screw up the PC or miss loads of threats. It's better to rely on common sense. Dunno how that figures into your analogy.

why ..? :/

these are heartless children killers, if the US lets them back out they will strap themselves up to explosives and ignite in a crowd, or jus go on a killing spree..

and people like you want them free, just because the country holding them are america. face it.

 

[The Monkey]

tell that to the terrorists.

Tell that to the US government. No one here supports the terrorists, but do you want to compare yourself with the people you're accusing?

 

[KoreBolteR]

Tell that to the US government. No one here supports the terrorists, but do you want to compare yourself with the people you're accusing?

but you do not see that the terrorists are doing worse things than the US, but people never accuse them of anything :/, the media just ramble on about little american problems and make them sound a thousand times worse. and tbfh, the media seem to favour the terrorists than the US govt.

your comparing me to the terrorists? please explain.

the day i become a terrorist, is the day i kill innocent people, EVEN children and women.(in other words, i will never become a terrorist, plain and simple.)

i could easily kill a terrorist (as long as it was certain he was one). im sorry if you dont like my view, but u cannot change it.

 

[Korgoth]

but you do not see that the terrorists are doing worse things than the US, but people never accuse them of anything :/, the media just ramble on about little american problems and make them sound a thousand times worse. and tbfh, the media seem to favour the terrorists than the US govt.

your comparing me to the terrorists? please explain.

the day i become a terrorist, is the day i kill innocent people, EVEN children and women.(in other words, i will never become a terrorist, plain and simple.)

i could easily kill a terrorist (as long as it was certain he was one). im sorry if you dont like my view, but u cannot change it.

Yeah instead of strapping a bomb to ourselves and blowing up a shopping center, we tend to drop said bomb from a plane and blame it on the sad truth that war sucks.... Whatever, we aren't completely innocent, as you would like to think... How many innocent Iraqi's have we blown up since the war began?

 

[KoreBolteR]

Yeah instead of strapping a bomb to ourselves and blowing up a shopping center, we tend to drop said bomb from a plane and blame it on the sad truth that war sucks.... Whatever, we aren't completely innocent, as you would like to think... How many innocent Iraqi's have we blown up since the war began?

that was after evidence that there were major fighters and officials were in the building s that were being targeted.

it is a sad fact that soem civilians died tho..

but comparing it to terrorists blowing themselves on PURPOSE, to killa bunch of innocents is bit dodgy.. if there was a US marine by them i'd understand, but there isnt, theres just normal people trying to make livings for thier families, and then peop,e like the terorists come along and ****ing blow them up!! :angry:

just because they are trying to make some decent money, instead of joining the terrorists and killing other innocents. shameful tbh.

 

[Korgoth]

that was after evidence that there were major fighters and officials were in the building s that were being targeted.

it is a sad fact that soem civilians died tho..

but comparing it to terrorists blowing themselves on PURPOSE, to killa bunch of innocents is bit dodgy.. if there was a US marine by them i'd understand, but there isnt, theres just normal people trying to make livings for thier families, and then peop,e like the terorists come along and ****ing blow them up!! :angry:

just because they are trying to make some decent money, instead of joining the terrorists and killing other innocents. shameful tbh.

The sad fact is, both sides of the conflict believe they are doing what they are doing, for the greater good of the people... Its true, and sometimes the truth hurts, but you have to see that both sides are horrible mistaken. Their logic is flawed, and their actions are the lowest of the low on the humanity spectrum.

The comparison is not our soldiers = terrorists, if you take it that way then patriotism has worked you over. The comparison is our leaders are = to terrorist leaders. Both of which think violence will triumph their cause, and it is a never ending cycle.

 

[KoreBolteR]

The sad fact is, both sides of the conflict believe they are doing what they are doing, for the greater good of the people... Its true, and sometimes the truth hurts, but you have to see that both sides are horrible mistaken. Their logic is flawed, and their actions are the lowest of the low on the humanity spectrum.

The comparison is not our soldiers = terrorists, if you take it that way then patriotism has worked you over. The comparison is our leaders are = to terrorist leaders. Both of which think violence will triumph their cause, and it is a never ending cycle.

i agree with most of that i suppose..

but on a side note i would rather trust the US govt and let them be my leaders than any Al-Qaeda/Taliban members.

if the terrorists ruled us and not blair/bush we wud be well and truly ****ed... no media, no protests, no freedom..

just tyrancy and whoever opposed them WHAM, thier heads will roll down the street before they could say "get rid of these killers"

 

[Nofuture]

that was after evidence that there were major fighters and officials were in the building s that were being targeted.

it is a sad fact that soem civilians died tho..

but comparing it to terrorists blowing themselves on PURPOSE, to killa bunch of innocents is bit dodgy.. if there was a US marine by them i'd understand, but there isnt, theres just normal people trying to make livings for thier families, and then peop,e like the terorists come along and ****ing blow them up!! :angry:

Wake up, Kore. Bombs have been also droped on PURPOSE.
On 19th March 2003 the USA attacked a nation which has never attacked US and which has never threatened to attack US.

"On War & Peace: No decent targets in Afghanistan, so bomb Iraq

By the afternoon on Wednesday [after Sept. 11], Secretary Rumsfeld was talking about broadening the objectives of our response and "getting Iraq." Secretary Powell pushed back, urging a focus on al Qaeda. Relieved to have some support, I thanked Colin Powell. "I thought I was missing something here," I vented. "Having been attacked by al Qaeda, for us now to go bombing Iraq in response would be like our invading Mexico after the Japanese attacked us at Pearl Harbor."
Powell shook his head. "It's not over yet." Indeed, it was not. Later in the day, Secy. Rumsfeld complained that there were no decent targets for bombing in Afghanistan and that we should consider bombing Iraq, which, he said, had better targets. At first I thought Rumsfeld was joking. But he was serious and the President did not reject out of hand the idea of attacking Iraq. Instead, he noted that what we needed to do with Iraq was to change the government, not just hit it with more cruise missiles, as Rumsfeld had implied.

Source: Against All Enemies, by Richard Clarke, chapter 1"


A war is justifiable if at all only in case IT IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARILY. It was not!


What about the US marines?? Wanna watch another video about "brave" US Marines shooting wounded person ON PURPOSE?
Here are exterpts from the transcript:

Unarmed And Wounded POW Shot In The Head By U.S. Marine

"NORMAN HERMANT: This is the what the fighting looks like in Fallujah.

Buildings are the front line.

It's in this environment that a US Marine unit approached a mosque on Saturday.

This footage was filmed by an American journalist documenting the fighting.

AMERICAN JOURNALIST: These are the guys from yesterday.

These are the wounded that they never picked up.

NORMAN HERMANT: The journalist can clearly be heard saying these are wounded from a previous battle the day before.
They had been left there, clearly unarmed.

US MARINE 1: (Shouts) He's ****in' fakin' he's dead!

US MARINE 2: Yeah!

He's breathing!

US MARINE 1: He's fakin' he's ****in' dead!

NORMAN HERMANT: "He's dead now," a voice says after the man is shot.

US MARINE: (Shouts) Hey!

This one's still alive!"

...

NORMAN HERMANT: This isn't the first time concerns have been raised about illegal combat killings in Fallujah.

The end of this shootout last week provoked protests as well.

It appears as if a wounded insurgent had been gunned down.

These shootings not only raise legal concerns, they may pose a military problem for multinational forces as well.

There's a risk if insurgents believe they'll be killed if wounded, they'll never surrender.

By fighting on to the death, they may believe they have nothing to lose."


And this increases the resistance and hate.

Well done, Marines?!

 

[Kebean PFC]

Ok about your book quote, THAT IS A BIASED SOURCE OK?? AND IS MY TYPING IN CAPS HELPING YOU TO UNDERSTAND?? DON'T PLEASE!!

I love it when people bring up that video, out of context, that man WAS NOT INNOCENT! He was running down the street with a locked and loaded Kalashnikov the day before. No one know how many US troops he killed. The US marines shot him, then shot him again becuase he didn't die the first time. Since you have never been in the military you wouldn't know, so i would suggest you think about what you are saying. You don't lewave enemy alive behind you. What if he had a pistol in his pocket? What if when the medics came to pick him up in a vehicle and he popped the pin off a grenade in his pocket? What now, you have cause even more US casualties. Of course thats ok because its not your sons/daughters dieing in a Desert, thousands of miles from home. No one cares about the welfare of the troops, we want equality and fair treatment for the terrrorists! Let our people bleed, so the enemy can gain strength. Sounds like a plan to me.... ;(

Based on most of the posts against the US and her soldiers, that is what you would all like to happen.

 

[Nofuture]

I love it when people bring up that video, out of context, that man WAS NOT INNOCENT! He was running down the street with a locked and loaded Kalashnikov the day before. No one know how many US troops he killed. The US marines shot him, then shot him again becuase he didn't die the first time. Since you have never been in the military you wouldn't know, so i would suggest you think about what you are saying. You don't lewave enemy alive behind you. What if he had a pistol in his pocket? What if when the medics came to pick him up in a vehicle and he popped the pin off a grenade in his pocket? What now, you have cause even more US casualties. Of course thats ok because its not your sons/daughters dieing in a Desert, thousands of miles from home. No one cares about the welfare of the troops, we want equality and fair treatment for the terrrorists! Let our people bleed, so the enemy can gain strength. Sounds like a plan to me.... ;(

Based on most of the posts against the US and her soldiers, that is what you would all like to happen.

What you are writing here refers to the video I posted link in another tread (Baghdad Residents Kill Three Militants) I suppose.

Two comments to that video:

1. Dear Sir;

I saw both the video on the front page and read the letters from the Marines.

Disgusting.

I too, am recently returned from seven months in Iraq, with a Division Cavalry unit. I see nothing to defend in that video and am glad that you have archived it so that others can see it. As a scout with over twenty years in the Army, mostly in combat units, I would say that what is captured on the video appears to be murder and in violation of the Law of Land Warfare.
This is not how warriors behave but how thugs operate. If the Iraqi man was indeed laying in ambush or setting an IED, then it is entirely appropriate to shoot him and to shoot him until he is no longer a threat. Once he ceased combat operations however, it became the soldiers' job to treat him and give him the same aid they would have one of our wounded soldiers receive.

That's how the Law of Land Warfare works.

To use him as a target and appear so joyful about it demonstrates that murder occurred and not combat operations. That is not a reflection of how callous all the soldiers are or what is encouraged or allowed in units. That unit has a problem. Any commander that glosses over that incident is neglecting his duty.

In the opening days of the war, our medics treated many Iraqi casualties, sometimes heroically. That's what you do. Its the law. I have no love lost for Iraqis, especially after watching the ones so happy to get a handout dance so gleefully in soldier's blood.

Our troops killed plenty, engaging in combat actions. My instructions to soldiers on missions almost always included the words - "if at anytime you feel threatened, shoot, shoot first and shoot center mass." But at no time were any of our soldiers instructed, allowed or countenanced to murder an injured person, be he combatant or not. I took pride that my commander insisted we "keep our mean faces on. We are not here to make
friends" but also insisted on the humane treatment, even recommending our PA for an award solely for working heroically on an Iraqi casualty.

This man had attempted to engage our forces, was shot and shot bad and eventually died. No one was happy that a human died. We understood that if we are to expect to be treated a certain way upon injury or capture, then we must treat the enemy the same way. That's what warriors do.

1SG Perry D. Jefferies


2. Former US general said on German TV about this:

"That was deliberate assassination of a badly wounded individual"

These two persons, who commented this video, had ar have to do with US army, don't they?

3. And according to GENEVA CONVENTIONS IT WAS MURDER.

Clear???


The case in the second video, the excerpts of transcription I've written, must be cristal clear even for you: Unarmed and wounded POW was shot in the head by U.S. Marine. What excuse do you have for this?

 

[Nofuture]

Ok about your book quote, THAT IS A BIASED SOURCE OK?? AND IS MY TYPING IN CAPS HELPING YOU TO UNDERSTAND?? DON'T PLEASE!!

Instead of writing it in caps, just prove it. But it will be difficult do, I suppose. So far I know, even Bush's administration coudn't.

 

[Kebean PFC]

I cant condone what they did, but i cant blame them.

Any book about the war is a biased source. You can't look at that and go "Ah, only the facts."

Just for the record, i am against the war, but I believe we should give our troops all the support we can. If we don't this will turn into another Veitnam.

 

[KoreBolteR]

Wake up, Kore. Bombs have been also droped on PURPOSE.

yeah of course its been on purpose.. to kill the terrorists and former Saddam regime loyalists.

On 19th March 2003 the USA attacked a nation which has never attacked US and which has never threatened to attack US.

But this country had secret meetings with Al-Qaeda was part of the terrorist regime, therefore in my eyes a terrorist government. Even the people of Iraq hated Saddam.

"On War & Peace: No decent targets in Afghanistan, so bomb Iraq .

that wasnt the reason at all? where are you getting all this bs, another anti-america media source?

By the afternoon on Wednesday [after Sept. 11], Secretary Rumsfeld was talking about broadening the objectives of our response and "getting Iraq." Secretary Powell pushed back, urging a focus on al Qaeda. Relieved to have some support, I thanked Colin Powell. "I thought I was missing something here," I vented. "Having been attacked by al Qaeda, for us now to go bombing Iraq in response would be like our invading Mexico after the Japanese attacked us at Pearl Harbor."

yes. if mexico was having secret relations with japan.. :|

Iraq was the centre of all corruption, where an evil tyrant ruled, as in a lot of arab nations, and had secret talks with Al-Qaeda reprasentatives Yes, the same ones who attacked the United States on Sept 11th

Powell shook his head. "It's not over yet." Indeed, it was not. Later in the day, Secy. Rumsfeld complained that there were no decent targets for bombing in Afghanistan and that we should consider bombing Iraq, which, he said, had better targets. At first I thought Rumsfeld was joking. But he was serious and the President did not reject out of hand the idea of attacking Iraq. Instead, he noted that what we needed to do with Iraq was to change the government, not just hit it with more cruise missiles, as Rumsfeld had implied.

sources, wtf? these sound like your imagination, and to be honest, it sounds pathetic.

A war is justifiable if at all only in case IT IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARILY. It was not!

it was, Saddam was meeting Al-qaeda bosses from afghanistan and all round the middle east.. Saddam killed thousands of his own people.. should we leave somebody so evil in power of a poor country like iraq, he had the country in a hostage situation.

he was meeting the same terrorist organisation that killed 3000 americans on 9/11! he needed to be put out of power.. sadly things have not turned out in our favour atm.

What about the US marines?? Wanna watch another video about "brave" US Marines shooting wounded person ON PURPOSE?

did you know , the las ttime the soldiers thought this terrorist was dead, but he was actually PRETENDING to be dead, and as they checked him, they realised he was still alive, just about to say "put your hands on your head", he exploded killing a few Marines while doing so..

he wasnt wounded.. he was lying on the floor pretending to be dead, for all the troops knew he could have blown himself up at anytime... and he was a TERRORIST, the guys that shoot innocent civilians.. even children and women! :frown:

the terrorist made the mistake when he decided to join them in my opinion.
were not gonna have any sympathy for those iraqi civilian killers.

 

[Kebean PFC]

No one cares about the welfare of the US troops, we want equality and fair treatment for the terrrorists!

The sad truth of the matter is that we want to be so morally and politically correct that we forget who we are dealing with. These people are not the Germans in the 1940s. Or any other conventional military we have fought. These "Freedom Fighters," will kill the soldiers that are treating thier wounds.

I don't know about you, but i would rather be safe then dead... even if that meant shooting a man who was down.

 

[KoreBolteR]

The sad truth of the matter is that we want to be so morally and politically correct that we forget who we are dealing with. These people are not the Germans in the 1940s. Or any other conventional military we have fought. These "Freedom Fighters," will kill the soldiers that are treating thier wounds.

I don't know about you, but i would rather be safe then dead... even if that meant shooting a man who was down.

kebean, wp.. im glad there is people with common sense in here.

 

[Nofuture]

Any book about the war is a biased source. You can't look at that and go "Ah, only the facts."

Hmm, I woudn't say so. If e.g. somebody who was in war writes after that a book about what he saw was happening there, why should it be biased?

Anyway, the book I mentioned is not directly about war, it's about certain persons and decisions they made what lead to war. That details I wrote about were stated by Clarke, former counterterrorism official in the Bush and Clinton administrations.

There are also other proves, e.g. five hours after Pentagon incident without any evidence of linking of Saddam to the attacks of 9/11 Rumsfeld was already ordering to draw plans for striking Iraq: The notes quote Rumsfeld as saing he wanted "best info fast", "judge whether good enough hit SH", "go massive", "sweep it all up, things related and not".

 

[staticprimer]

But this country had secret meetings with Al-Qaeda was part of the terrorist regime, therefore in my eyes a terrorist government.

Can you give a source on that? Because I recall the Bush administration itself saying there was not any connection.

 

[Nofuture]

yeah of course its been on purpose.. to kill the terrorists and former Saddam regime loyalists. .

Wake up! What TERRORISTS? Give me a source!

But this country had secret meetings with Al-Qaeda was part of the terrorist regime, therefore in my eyes a terrorist government.

As far as I know even Bush's administration couldn't find even a slightest link of Saddam to terrorists.

Did YOU found it? Can YOU prove it?

Iraq was the centre of all corruption, where an evil tyrant ruled, as in a lot of arab nations, and had secret talks with Al-Qaeda reprasentatives Yes, the same ones who attacked the United States on Sept 11th

A prove? A source?

sources, wtf? these sound like your imagination, and to be honest, it sounds pathetic.

???? Hmm, ... ???

I did give my source!

it was, Saddam was meeting Al-qaeda bosses from afghanistan and all round the middle east..

he was meeting the same terrorist organisation that killed 3000 americans on 9/11!

A source? A prove?


Regarding the assassinations of wounded enemies: Geneva conventions are still in force, they must be applied in Iraq too, don't you know?


BACK UP YOUR STATEMENTS!
You hardly have ever done this, do you?

 

[Korgoth]

No one is demanding equal treatment for terrorists, or however the hell else you guys are trying to spin this to make yourself look right. The truth is, some don't see the war as good vs. evil like you do... Some see this war as ignorance vs. ignorance with humanity being the loser. We think we are right, they think they are right and in the end neither side is right, both are wrong, both are killing, and the people on the outside are getting sucked into this vortex of hate created by the fanatics on boths sides.