15 yr old canadian spared the death penalty

[CptStern]

"The Pentagon will not seek the death penalty against Omar Ahmed Khadr, the Canadian detainee at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, who has been charged with killing a U.S. army medic during a battle in Afghanistan in 2002."

The decision is a victory for the Canadian government's view that the al-Qaeda terrorism suspect should not face execution because he was only 15 when he is alleged to have committed the crime. The U.S. change of heart may also result from a Supreme Court ruling in March that bans the death penalty for minors."

source


a few facts:

Canada has been cricised for not doing enough to ensure that one of their citizens received a fair trial or fair treatment. Canada also has to interfere if one of their citizens faces the death penalty. Canada has kind of swept this under the carpet. On the one hand the Khadr family has been a pain in canada's backside but at the same time canada has a duty to enure the safety of their citizens regardless of crime

International law forbids capital punishment for minors ..he was 15 at the time he was captured. Either reason could be why the US decided to not seek the death penalty in this case even though they had said from the beginning he faced the death penalty

1 american soldier was killed and another was injured; Sergeant Layne Morris, is suing Khadr's family for damages ...which kind of odd as it's war

Khadr spent 36 months in guantanamo bay in solitary confinement, claims torture and abuse. He hasnt had any communication with his lawyer or family since being captured. Canadian lawyers retained by his family had to hire american lawyers to learn the wearabouts of Khadr, and even then the american lawyers are forbidden by law from disclosing any details to canadian lawyers

Khadr has only recently been charged with the murder of Sergeant 1st Class Christopher Speer who was engaged in a firefight with Khadr and 5 others. Khadr was the only survivor. Khadrs compound was under attack for 18 hours that included 50 soldiers and numerous airstrikes. Speer was killed when a gernade landed near him persumedly thrown by Khadr. Khadr was shot when the soldiers moved in to secure the position but surviverd his wounds

Khadr's father was killed in 2003 in a firefight with pakistani forces, he had suspected ties with osama bin laden. Khadr's 14 yr old brother was paralysed in the attack.

Soon after the arrest of Khadr, his mother said on canadian televesion that she believed dying fighting the enemy was an honour and she would be proud had her son died in the fight with coalition forces

Khadr's brother Abdurahman worked for the CIA after leaving guantanamo bay as a spy in bosnia


source

 

[The Monkey]

He killed the american soldier in battle? Should every soldier killing enemies be charged with murder? That wouls sure get lots of troops out of Iraq! :upstare:

 

[CptStern]

2 words: Enemy Combatant®

 

[Gargantou]

This is bloody ridiculous imo!

 

[Sainku]

Should not really be an issue, you guys remained neutral throught the war. No reason to treat him any different than any other combatant,
other than the fact that our countries are such great buddies :upstare:.

Of course, now that he has gone and fought the good fight in the name of islam, he won himself a ticket straight to heaven :angel: so he probably doesn't care if he gets cooked in the chair.

EDIT: I dont think I read that right the first time.

 

[Kangy]

Yeah, kinda stupid of the family to sue, to be honest. Can you imagine the cases there'd be after a war the size of WW1?

 

[spookymooky]

It depends if he was actually in a country's military or not. The insurgents in Iraq are not legally enemy combatants.

I did not know Canada has the death penalty. I know the US was banned from some list of humane countries because it retains the death penalty. I hadn't heard that this is the case with Canada. Interesting.

 

[BirdMan]

I did not know Canada has the death penalty. I know the US was banned from some list of humane countries because it retains the death penalty. I hadn't heard that this is the case with Canada. Interesting.

It's not the case. We dont have death penalty.

 

[spookymooky]

It's not the case. We dont have death penalty.

Oh. I see, I completely misunderstood that article. Thank you.

 

[DreamThrall]

2 words: Enemy Combatant®

Medics are not combatants, unless they take up arms, according the law of armed conflict and the geneva convention. Same goes for chaplains. Although in this case, the circumstances are a bit murky since it was a grenade he threw.... kinda hard to prove that he was targeting the medic with a grenade, especially if he was the only survivor.

 

[CptStern]

Medics are not combatants, unless they take up arms, according the law of armed conflict and the geneva convention. Same goes for chaplains. Although in this case, the circumstances are a bit murky since it was a grenade he threw.... kinda hard to prove that he was targeting the medic with a grenade, especially if he was the only survivor.

the two medics present took part in combat ..I listened to an interview with Sergeant Layne Morris this morning

 

[satch919]

Well, I don't know the case so I can't really make an accurate comment. I'm for the death penalty for murderers and such but in war, I'm not so sure. We might be able to extract information from the little scumbag, if we haven't already.

Think of all the Germans we captured during WWII. We didn't execute all of them because they had killed an American(s). Same thing goes for Germans capturing Americans.

That's definitely a tough call.

 

[CptStern]

Well, I don't know the case so I can't really make an accurate comment. I'm for the death penalty for murderers and such but in war, I'm not so sure. We might be able to extract information from the little scumbag, if we haven't already.

Think of all the Germans we captured during WWII. We didn't execute all of them because they had killed an American(s). Same thing goes for Germans capturing Americans.

That's definitely a tough call.

the geneva accords state that all pows must be released and returned to their country of origin, unless that is they are guilty of war crimes ..but because this is an unlawful combatant, it doesnt apply

 

[satch919]

the geneva accords state that all pows must be released and returned to their country of origin, unless that is they are guilty of war crimes ..but because this is an unlawful combatant, it doesnt apply

Lock him up and throw away the key. Simple as that.

 

[CptStern]

Lock him up and throw away the key. Simple as that.

which is what they did for 36 months in solitary confinement without being charged


btw no other enemy combatant has ever faced the death penalty

 

[spookymooky]

which is what they did for 36 months in solitary confinement without being charged


btw no other enemy combatant has ever faced the death penalty

But he's not an enemy combatant, is he? Officially, isnt he a terrorist?

 

[JNightshade]

well, "officially". But I think the quotes around the word show you just how seriously I take that.

 

[spookymooky]

What nation was he fighting for, otherwise? What nation has declared war on us?

 

[CptStern]

But he's not an enemy combatant, is he? Officially, isnt he a terrorist?

unlawful combatant ..just read the material supplied, it explains it all

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

He killed the american soldier in battle? Should every soldier killing enemies be charged with murder? That wouls sure get lots of troops out of Iraq! :upstare:

Al Qaeda are not soldiers, they are criminals.

An example of a soldier would be the legitimate armed forces under Hussein while the US was actually fighting the state until the government collapsed and we dissolved their military officially.

Minors should not be excluded from the death penalty. However, review of the circumstances in each case (as with ANY) will determine if they receive it. In the case he should, this is a dissapointment.

Soldier- uniformed, representing and comprising a state's armed forces:
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/photos/cp_iraqi_soldier021208.jpg

Stateless, unlawful terrorists:
http://www.kein-plan.de/bitte-ziehen-sie-durch/pics/Irakkrieg_-_Nick_Berg_2004-05-11.jpg

 

[CptStern]

Al Qaeda are not soldiers, they are criminals.

An example of a soldier would be the legitimate armed forces under Hussein while the US was actually fighting the state until the government collapsed and we dissolved their military officially.

Minors should not be excluded from the death penalty. However, review of the circumstances in each case (as with ANY) will determine if they receive it. In the case he should, this is a dissapointment.

Soldier- uniformed, representing and comprising a state's armed forces:
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/photos/cp_iraqi_soldier021208.jpg

Stateless, unlawful terrorists:
http://www.kein-plan.de/bitte-ziehen-sie-durch/pics/Irakkrieg_-_Nick_Berg_2004-05-11.jpg

try reading the material provided ..no evidence he was al qaeda


and YES minors are excluded from the death penalty, according to INTERNATIONAL law, as well as american law

 

[DeusExMachina]

Al Qaeda are not soldiers, they are criminals.

An example of a soldier would be the legitimate armed forces under Hussein while the US was actually fighting the state until the government collapsed and we dissolved their military officially.

Minors should not be excluded from the death penalty. However, review of the circumstances in each case (as with ANY) will determine if they receive it. In the case he should, this is a dissapointment.

Soldier- uniformed, representing and comprising a state's armed forces:
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/photos/cp_iraqi_soldier021208.jpg

Stateless, unlawful terrorists:
http://www.kein-plan.de/bitte-ziehen-sie-durch/pics/Irakkrieg_-_Nick_Berg_2004-05-11.jpg

I agree with Tenjin. While I most definetly do not support the War in anyway shape or form, the man was doing his job. All soldiers do are their jobs. They don't need crap from the left or the right. Its all about their orders. This boy wasn't a lawful combatant, he was practically a terrorist.. He deserves what should be given to him.

And to keep my liberal buddies happy

Another thing I can't stand is how our soldiers are glorified. War isn't glorious. These men aren't heroes. With that said, I don't believe the family should be suing the boy's family. While the boy is an unlawful combatant, the soldier knew what dangers awaited him in the Gulf so this should come as no surprise. His family has no right to sue them for such a thing. Death is something a soldier always faces.

Oh and this torture bullshit in Guantamano bay has to stop. Wtf is wrong with these soldiers? Do they realize how badly America is represented everytime they do shit like this? ****ing morons. Showing your patriotism does not mean ****ing beating them and making them lay on each other naked. Goddammit.

"The only glory of war is surviving."

 

[CptStern]

I agree with Tenjin. While I most definetly do not support the War in anyway shape or form, the man was doing his job. All soldiers do are their jobs. They don't need crap from the left or the right. Its all about their orders. This boy wasn't a lawful combatant, he was practically a terrorist.. He deserves what should be given to him.

he does not deserve to be executed, even the soldier he wounded said he was defending himself ..no other pow faces the death penalty

And to keep my liberal buddies happy

Another thing I can't stand is how our soldiers are glorified. War isn't glorious. These men aren't heroes. With that said, I don't believe the family should be suing the boy's family. While the boy is an unlawful combatant, the soldier knew what dangers awaited him in the Gulf so this should come as no surprise. His family has no right to sue them for such a thing. Death is something a soldier always faces.

I agree

Oh and this torture bullshit in Guantamano bay has to stop. Wtf is wrong with these soldiers? Do they realize how badly America is represented everytime they do shit like this? ****ing morons. Showing your patriotism does not mean ****ing beating them and making them lay on each other naked. Goddammit.

the soldiers are following orders directly from the Department of Defense ..while they're certainly guilty the people who ordered the torture are moreso

"The only glory of war is surviving."

but apparently this doesnt hold true for the enemy

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

Oh and this torture bullshit in Guantamano bay has to stop. Wtf is wrong with these soldiers? Do they realize how badly America is represented everytime they do shit like this? ****ing morons. Showing your patriotism does not mean ****ing beating them and making them lay on each other naked. Goddammit.

"The only glory of war is surviving."

That wasn't at Guantanomo, that was at Abu Ghraib in Iraq and the soldiers have been charged for it. Don't know why people keep thinking it was at Gitmo.

 

[DeusExMachina]

That wasn't at Guantanomo, that was at Abu Ghraib in Iraq and the soldiers have been charged for it. Don't know why people keep thinking it was at Gitmo.

...Didn't something happen at Guan?

Well, my point still stands.

 

[CptStern]

That wasn't at Guantanomo, that was at Abu Ghraib in Iraq and the soldiers have been charged for it. Don't know why people keep thinking it was at Gitmo.

the torture is systematic ..the majority of prisoners released from gitmo have complained of being abused and tortured. It was NOT an isolated incident, abu gharib just happened to have the best documentation of abuse


torture is widespread and was ordered by the Department of Defense

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

...Didn't something happen at Guan?

Well, my point still stands.

Main thing there was was the Newsweek report of a US Soldier kicking a koran and flushing it down the toilet. The report sparked massive riots in Afghanistan that killed many people. Newsweek later retracted the story saying they made a mistake.

 

[CptStern]

Main thing there was was the Newsweek report of a US Soldier kicking a koran and flushing it down the toilet. The report sparked massive riots in Afghanistan that killed many people. Newsweek later retracted the story saying they made a mistake.

so it's a resort I take it?

http://www.aclu.org/torturefoia/released/052505/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/13/AR2005071302380.html
http://web.amnesty.org/pages/guantanamobay-index-eng
http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2003/s962052.htm
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnew...eadline=-MY-HELL-IN-CAMP-X-RAY-name_page.html
http://www.globalpolicy.org/wtc/analysis/2003/0326gua.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4262095.stm
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/04/28/60minutes/main691602.shtml
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A14936-2004Dec20.html

yup everything is just peachy:


"According to REDACTED an unknown number of guards entered his cell, unprovoked, and started spitting and cursing at him. The guards called him a "son of a bitch" and a "bastard," then told him he was crazy. REDACTED rolled onto his stomach to protect himself . . . A soldier . . . jumped on his back and started beating him in the face. REDACTED then choked him until he passed out. REDACTED stated that REDACTED was beating him because REDACTED was a Muslim and REDACTED is a Christian. REDACTED indicated there was a female guard named REDACTED who was also beating him and grabbed his head and beat it into the cell floor."


http://www.aclu.org/torturefoia/released/052505/3836_3889.pdf

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

I never said it's a resort and I'm not trying to play down what it is- it's a prison/detainment camp for captured terrorists. You don't work with kid gloves on there, but allegations of a human rights abuse due to panties is absurd.

 

[CptStern]

I never said it's a resort and I'm not trying to play down what it is- it's a prison/detainment camp for captured terrorists. You don't work with kid gloves on there, but allegations of a human rights abuse due to panties is absurd.

panties? what am I missing here?

and yes you did play down the human rights abuses that are the norm at gitmo

 

[Vigilante]

He killed the american soldier in battle? Should every soldier killing enemies be charged with murder? That wouls sure get lots of troops out of Iraq! :upstare:

Yeah, it would, if Iraq were capable of having a judiciary system instead of letting the non-existant Allah decide everything and kill all captured American troops.