$780 Billion

[Warped]

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Democratic and Republican senators have reached a tentative agreement for a $780 billion stimulus package, according to two Democratic sources and a GOP negotiator.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has taken the list of cuts to the nearly $900 billion Senate bill to fellow Democrats, the sources said.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/06/stimulus/index.html

Ugh, haven't we learned anything this year and last?? You can't stimulate something that is dying twice. If it didn't work the 1st time it sure as hell won't work the 2nd time around. Why aren't we taking "the strong will survive the weak will die" approach to this. Thats what Capitalism and a free market is. If something fails its for a reason, if something succeeds its because it most likely should.

Anyone else sick of big government shitting on us??

 

[Mr Stabby]

get rid of the pay roll tax instead.

 

[Laivasse]

Politics forum?

And the reason people aren't taking the 'strong will survive, weak will die' approach is because that's the kind of social darwinistic, free market cultist bullshit that got eveyone into this mess in the first place - with investment managers profiteering with impunity and the wealthiest 1% of society making 20% of all earnings.

Sorry lads, but why do you think the GOP resorted to 'socialist' wealth redistribution policies once the shit hit the fan? Because it's the only option.

Why are they resisting now? Because it's a good opportunity to discredit Obama's 'bipartisan' capability, and also to slip a bit of pork into the bill. I'll be surprised if it doesn't eventually pass.

 

[Dan]

Ugh, haven't we learned anything this year and last?? You can't stimulate something that is dying twice. If it didn't work the 1st time it sure as hell won't work the 2nd time around. Why aren't we taking "the strong will survive the weak will die" approach to this. Thats what Capitalism and a free market is. If something fails its for a reason, if something succeeds its because it most likely should.

Well then according to your logic, the American government should fail and is destined to be replaced by a stronger one that doesn't support its industry during a recession.

 

[Krynn72]

Why aren't we taking "the strong will survive the weak will die" approach to this.

Because they'd rather take the "Rich get richer and the poor get poorer" approach. These "bailouts" serve very few people, and destroy the rest of us. Sounds like capitalism to me!

 

[PimpinPenguin]

Why don't government's just reduce meaningful taxes instead of all these bailouts? Here in England the interest rate has been set to a record low of 1% screwing over savers and rewarding the pricks that spent to much and got us into this mess and further making the Pound a joke of a currency.
The VAT cut again another fail tax relief, many retailers didn't pass it on and it wasn't big enough to really make people go out an spend.Now we will have to pay for that failure with higher VAT and higher NI.

We've bailed out the banks once and we the taxpayers were promised that the government would force banks to start lending since we own 70% of them, they did not.Instead we gave them yet another bailout and still they are holding on to the cash and not lending. Instead they are still using that money for massive party's payed for by us, we are paying them bonuses for paying back a small amount of the cash they borrowed. The Goverment are giving to money to the wrong people, the ones who ****ed up get the cash yet we the taxpayers so far have got **** all.

Think yourself lucky you don't have a one eyed scottish idiot who thinks his saving the world calling the shots.

 

[The Monkey]

The government can and must regulate the economy to prevent the market forces from spinning out of control. The main reason this is happening, at least according to most economists I've heard (such as last year's Nobel Prize winner in economics), is because of the current laissez-faire philosophy that has had a renaissance during the past couple of decades. It set into place a system that allowed greed and selfishness at the cost of the economy's well-being and fair distribution.

 

[speedbump]

It took 70-years for the Soviet Union to fail. I predict that Pelosism will go belly-up in about 70-months...

 

[Ravioli]

Amero, NAU, NWO...here we come

 

[unozero]

Amero, NAU, NWO...here we come

prisonplanet is that way ------->

 

[staticprimer]

Stimulus plan != bailout. In very simple terms it is the government making up for the loss of demand in the economy due to the faltering economy. Demand isn't going to create itself in a receding economy, so the government creating that demand is the most reliable way to stop a total economic implosion.

 

[Leto]

is there any program to come from this $780 billion, like I don't know, a plan or a system that would need $780 billion, or are we just throwing cash everywhere?

 

[jet_porkins]

House and Senate have come to an agreement on the bill. Will be signed by Obama in a few days.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29136678/

 

[Vigilante]

$780 billion more our government has borrowed from China for the American people

 

[jet_porkins]

$780 billion more our government has borrowed from China for the American people

Uhh. I might be missing something but isn't this taxpayer money?

 

[Ravioli]

actually its made out of thin air thanks to the federal reserve. Hyper Inflation ftw

 

[Calhoun]

Uhh. I might be missing something but isn't this taxpayer money?

It's not taxpayer money, it's the money that taxpayers have to pay off for the government.

 

[Vigilante]

Uhh. I might be missing something but isn't this taxpayer money?

We borrow a lot from China now.

 

[Leto]

wait, why would you make China our loan shark?

 

[Kadayi]

We borrow a lot from China now.

Indeed you do, but this isn't one of those occasions. The money is being magicked into existence by the FR as others have pointed out.

 

[No Limit]

It took 70-years for the Soviet Union to fail. I predict that Pelosism will go belly-up in about 70-months...

Why go after Pelosi and not the guy that is actually calling the shots? Is it because Obama is far too popular and you would be absolutely insane to do that? The fact the stupid PR campaign that the GOP developed spills over to these forums amazes me, I would think most people would be too smart to fall for that bullshit, I guess I was wrong.

Oh, and what Laivasse said.

 

[jet_porkins]

Well it's done. Obama signed it into law today. If this works, democrats will stay the majority in congress for years to come.

EDIT: Supposedly this government website will ensure transparency and show exactly what money has been spent where, given to whom, etc.

www.recovery.gov

 

[speedbump]

Why go after Pelosi and not the guy that is actually calling the shots? Is it because Obama is far too popular and you would be absolutely insane to do that? The fact the stupid PR campaign that the GOP developed spills over to these forums amazes me, I would think most people would be too smart to fall for that bullshit, I guess I was wrong.

Oh, and what Laivasse said.

'Why go after Pelosi'? Gee, I don't know... Maybe it's because Obama's brand-new in the office, and is still more of a figurehead than a writer of congressional legislation at this point. Pelosi's been salivating to ram this kind-of pork-filled 'simmulus' down amerika's throat since 04. Tom Dashcle's li'l replacement-girl... " Don't worry, Tommy... We'll teach those mean ol' Repubbies a thing 'r two about fiscal chaology... "

She originally wanted 940-billion, poor thing... Maybe that's why she booked-on-out to Italy to get some first-hand sympathy from the Pope this-week... " Don't worry, Nancy... The mean ol' Senate still cheesed-off 540-million for your district, so-far... Plus you 'n your hubby can still freely 'borrow' from your campaign pac-reserve at-will... There-there, now... quoting from the Book Of Al Gore Sr. chapter 11; verse 818: 'When in-doubt, remodel. ' "

 

[No Limit]

I am having a hard time understanding you, I think you need to calm down because you aren't making a lot of sense. What do you mean Obama is just a figurehead? This was mostly his bill. He is the one that pushed for this package and even if he had total control over it the thing wouldn't have looked all that different. So again, it begs the question; why go after Pelosi and not Obama on this?

And I would love to hear your opinion on what we should do to fix the mess Bush and the republicans have gotten us in to.

 

[jet_porkins]

While I agree with Limit that the stimulus was originally Obama's plan, it was Congress that piled on the pork. Obama didn't really care about the waste that was attached to it because he just wanted the thing passed.

 

[No Limit]

While I agree with Limit that the stimulus was originally Obama's plan, it was Congress that piled on the pork. Obama didn't really care about the waste that was attached to it because he just wanted the thing passed.

How much pork are we talking about? Any time you ram a bill through congress pork will be added, that's how our politics work. The basic principle of what Obama wanted is there. This is not Pelosi's bill, this is Obama's. The only reason speedbump mentioned Pelosi is because he's playing these stupid political games that RNC talking heads play with the media, I can't believe I'm seeing that bullshit here.

 

[jet_porkins]

How much pork are we talking about? Any time you ram a bill through congress pork will be added, that's how our politics work. The basic principle of what Obama wanted is there. This is not Pelosi's bill, this is Obama's. The only reason speedbump mentioned Pelosi is because he's playing these stupid political games that RNC talking heads play with the media, I can't believe I'm seeing that bullshit here.

At least $8,000,000,000. If you ask me it's a small number, with respect to the bill (slightly more than one percentage point of the overall spending). $8 billion is a lot of money though. That's a little lower than paying for the Iraq war in one month, to put it into a little perspective. I'm not trying to say Obama won't be accountable for the bill's success, you're right when you say it's his bill. He did in fact say that if this thing doesn't start generating jobs fast enough then he would expect the American people to elect a new president come 2012.