Animating

[PaulSimon]

Hi,can I animate just the biped in 3ds max and then rig one character and then copy all the animations that I made earlier to the rigged character?

So I can start making animations now and I dont have to wait for a model

Thanks

 

[The Dark Elf]

no because you don't know exactly how the bones would work this time around. So you would run the risk of doing a lot of work that can't even be used properly. Best to wait or do it the other way around and model first, rig later.

 

[PaulSimon]

Are you absolute sure about that?
I know you can copy animations from character to character, when they have the same bones. And when models are about the same size, its even better.

So I dont really see the problem,what do you mean by "how the bones would work this time around"?

 

[The Dark Elf]

Originally posted by PaulSimon
Are you absolute sure about that?
I know you can copy animations from character to character, when they have the same bones. And when models are about the same size, its even better.

So I dont really see the problem,what do you mean by "how the bones would work this time around"?

well HL2 uses a new type of model (likely an updated mdl format) for its characters and new kinds of animation methods that nobody at this moment in time, outside of Valve or Softimage know exactly how they work, and if they say they do then they've been using the stolen files, so I wouldn't listen to anything they say.

And since your wanting to use Max, and HL2 editing is geared towards XSI, and since only basic stuff can be exported/imported between different programs at the best of time, then its quite possible whatever you do in Max regarding bones and rigging just wont work correctly, if atall in HL2.

The basic model and texture sure no problem, but converting skeletons from Max to XSI could give you a lot of headaches, especially if you've done a load of them and found they just don't want to work... maybe months down the line there might be some plugin made to handle it, maybe Valve have one now for that, but who knows, go ahead and do your rigging, if im wrong im wrong and nobody gets hurt, but if im right then do expect me to say I told you so while you redo all those different rigs from scratch

 

[random.hero]

i think Valve are already making plugins for Max, not sure what version, but they are. again, im not sure what they support, but i doubt they would make it so only XSI users can make full working HL2 models. for most modellers, that would mean learning a completely new program.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

http://collective.valve-erc.com/ind...06159032409491000&question=106159102681084900

I'd assume theses plugins supported animation exportation as well.

 

[random.hero]

nice 1, but does anybody know what version of Max it will support ?

 

[The Dark Elf]

Originally posted by random.hero
for most modellers, that would mean learning a completely new program.

Exactly what Softimage are hoping for, Max is currently the program to use for game 3D work. Softimage have the film and TV industry covered, next step is the games industry as there's a good deal of untapped profits for them there, what better than to push the current program of choice out of the way by making it as complicated as they can to use other programs by being real cosy with certain developers over a predefined amount of time (they don't care if it takes a few years, not with the kind of profits they stand to gain in the long run by taking the lead in the games industry)

It's business is all. Alias tried a different approach, being friendly, but while Maya and other Alias tools are used for games development (like with all apps out there) It certainly didn't take Max's crown (hey look at me, i hate max and here I am admitting it is the program of choice for games heheh) So Softimage are doing things differently, allying themselves with the best people for getting their software noticed more, and who better than those responsible for the game thats modded more than any other. Get all those modders using their software, and thats a sizable chunk of the user base.

Granted many will resort to piracy simply because 97% of users just wont have that kind of money. But thats short term and a calculated risk, those users don't matter, their just doing the leg work for Softimage. Long term it'll attract other games developers to follow suite when they begin to see first hand the benefits. These are the ones that'll pay the big bucks, slowly Max will be phased out and eventually Discreet will likely quit with Max and concentrate more on their compositing and color correction software such as Lumere(sp) Combustion, and all the others they develop for professional and high end only use.

They have managed to get themselves noticed in that area and are doing pretty well for themselves, so if their gonna drop anything, it'll be the application of theirs that is well known for being pirated more than any other (can't tell me all those young teens own legit copies ).... and if you look closely, thats what they've begun to do - giving those apps a higher priority than Max. Softimage isn't scared, they got their bases covered years ago with Softimage|3D. Softimage aren't fussed about Discreet's pro-end gear as its not in direct competition with them right now.

So while Max and maybe Maya and Lightwave might get a look in and still be able to do stuff, don't count on it being easy and/or possible to do the advanced stuff.


Edit: and before some smartarse pipes up calling me an XSI fanboy, I use whatever software I need to get the job done, I'm not loyal to any of them and will drop an app if it can't do what I need it to do.

 

[ChrisArt]

You can store bip animations as an animation file, then apply that animation file to a new bip. No problem

 

[random.hero]

ahhh nads, so ill be a learning Softimage soon then

i guess i didnt see that coming :rolling:

 

[The Dark Elf]

Originally posted by random.hero
ahhh nads, so ill be a learning Softimage soon then

i guess i didnt see that coming :rolling:

ok for some obscure reason that thread about polys n stuff you and I were in has been deleted, haven't a clue why since it was a sensible discussion lol

anyhoo my reply to that (and don't worry about learning XSI, its a great program for modeling, just a bit confusing right at the beginning, but deffinately worth getting used to for its nifty "why didn't I think of that" features )

Originally posted by random.hero
yeah true, thats because they make the model, then realise that they can reduce polys, then get one finger on the left mouse button and another on the delete button and away they go. i know that i wouldn't want to create a model with 1 side missing, only to find that its seen in the animation process

What I mean is I don't see models that are finished like that. It's like its completely forgotton. Same goes for many maps, the sides of brushes you'll never see without noclip, almost always they haven't been removed (given some specific texture that isn't calculated to help speed things up) the pro maps have it a plenty, but many mods don't. As for the models, its not hard to delete poly's as you go, I do it all the time, much easier as you know where you are with it, just involves forward planning, blocking out animation sequences and such, skipping back and forth to different stages to check on things. Also with UV mapping it'll save a ton of time deleting as you go, and allow for better quality textures, as your not setting up UV maps to include poly's you'll later remove, allowing you to make more of the image area and less wasted space. I dunno, just seems a logical step to me I guess.. There's also plugins/scripts out there that can run through animation sequences and use a POV, usually the camera, to pick which polys wont ever be seen and delete them, overcoming the accidently removing poly's that are at some point in view.

-

ahh, i think I might have been the cause of that other thread to be deleted.. I only suggested an image res limit on image links, oops

 

[random.hero]

hehe its ok, it was interesting while it lasted. i guess if i want to get into this as a profession, as i might well be in the future, it might be a good use of time to learn more than one program (hint hint XSI hint) anyways, im good with Max for the moment, s'good for noobs like myself