Any foreigners in City-17?

[Ruzhyo]

I've been wondering for a while why there were no foreigners in City-17. I mean, apart from the true 'aliens' everyone spoke English. It just seemed a bit odd to me. I know that a lot of the core content would have to be in English to advance the game but for me it would not have been a problem had some of the citizens been foreign. In fact it would have only served to increase my immersion as it is a fact of life now, especially in English-speaking countries. Maybe there is an explanation somewhere but I haven't seen one.

 

[el Chi]

It wasn't that they spoke English, it was that they were - with the exception of Grigori and Cubbage - all Yanks!

 

[A True Canadian]

Exactly, all the locals were eliminated first.

This explains why people are being sent to City 17 via the trains. All the people who originally lived in the city were either killed off or made into combine soldiers.

The Americans (or Yanks ) were likely tranferred after the local residents were taken care of. Otherwise there would be too many citizens to deal with.

A theory as to the reason why those in North America were not dealt with earlier is likely due to how messed up things got during the portal storms. Black Mesa was in New Mexico, and therefore the portals would be a lot worse down there. With so much Xen wildlife to contend with, the Combine probably recognized the problems they would have, and developed their urban centers in places where the Xen creatures wouldn't be such a pain in the ass to contend with.

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.

If the Combine feel the humans are a potential threat, then it would make sense that they would eventually track down the survivors and take complete control of the species.

At least, that's how I understand it.

 

[el Chi]

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.

I agree with what you said, except for that bit. Nevertheless, it would've been cool to encounter people from other nations.
Games and films tend to forget that there are other countries in the world besides the US. Even when it's set in Europe (HL2, WW2 games/films) the place is over-run with Yanks.

 

[Max35]

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.

Actually that would be around twenty years.

 

[Ruzhyo]

Exactly, all the locals were eliminated first.

This explains why people are being sent to City 17 via the trains. All the people who originally lived in the city were either killed off or made into combine soldiers.

The Americans (or Yanks ) were likely tranferred after the local residents were taken care of. Otherwise there would be too many citizens to deal with.

A theory as to the reason why those in North America were not dealt with earlier is likely due to how messed up things got during the portal storms. Black Mesa was in New Mexico, and therefore the portals would be a lot worse down there. With so much Xen wildlife to contend with, the Combine probably recognized the problems they would have, and developed their urban centers in places where the Xen creatures wouldn't be such a pain in the ass to contend with.

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.

If the Combine feel the humans are a potential threat, then it would make sense that they would eventually track down the survivors and take complete control of the species.

At least, that's how I understand it.

Well I can appreciate that, but for me there is still the problem of the citizens in City-17 all being Western (with the exception of Grigori). Even if the local population were wiped out it wouldn't stop other nationalities being sent there along with all the American citizens. Unless the Combine specifically controlled the trains so that only one nationality went to each City... but then that still seems a bit strange. I think that it el Chi is right and it is simply a case of Valve not really considering other nations and languages at all, which is strange when you take into account all of the signs in different languages in and around City-17. After all, not being able to understand another citizen wouldn't affect gameplay (as long as they didn't have core information) as it didn't when the Vortigaunts were speaking in their native tongue. In fact, I feel it would have added to the overall feel of the game. If a citizen would have asked me, in Spanish, if they could have a beer then I would have been pleased that I knew what they were saying. Sometimes little touches can make a big difference.

 

[kupocake]

You want foreigners, change the language settings

 

[Ruzhyo]

No comprendo

 

[spf18]

do you mean No entiendo?

 

[A True Canadian]

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.

I agree with what you said, except for that bit. Nevertheless, it would've been cool to encounter people from other nations.
Games and films tend to forget that there are other countries in the world besides the US. Even when it's set in Europe (HL2, WW2 games/films) the place is over-run with Yanks.

As a Canadian, I know exactly what you're talking about. I'm still waiting for a damn Canadian campaign in a WW2 game (i.e. Call of Duty).

Actually that would be around twenty years.

Really?? They never really mentioned how long the gap is between the two games. I just always assumed it was around 10.

Well I can appreciate that, but for me there is still the problem of the citizens in City-17 all being Western (with the exception of Grigori). Even if the local population were wiped out it wouldn't stop other nationalities being sent there along with all the American citizens. Unless the Combine specifically controlled the trains so that only one nationality went to each City... but then that still seems a bit strange.

Well not necessarily. I doubt the airports work, so the only means of travel overseas would be by boat. Speaking of which, there was supposed to be a level in Half-Life 2 that took place on a ship which I believe was called the Borealis. That was how Gordon was supposed to arrive in City 17, but it was cut when the more interesting Trainstation level was introduced.

Anyway, the reason for ships transporting people goes back to the theory that there weren't any major Combine Citadels installed in North America (due to Xen wildlife being too thick). All the other continents (like Asia, Africa) would be more suitable to install Citadels because the portals aren't as bad. Now given how high the population is in these parts, the Combine would have their hands full even without those so-called Yanks on the other side of the ocean.

With City 17 supposed to be situated in eastern Europe, a ship coming from the west would land in western Europe, transfer the cargo (humans) to trains, and then take them to the closest city. It's possible that City 17 is the closest City to the western seaboard and therefore would be the main place to accept the North Americans.

I think that it el Chi is right and it is simply a case of Valve not really considering other nations and languages at all, which is strange when you take into account all of the signs in different languages in and around City-17. After all, not being able to understand another citizen wouldn't affect gameplay (as long as they didn't have core information) as it didn't when the Vortigaunts were speaking in their native tongue. In fact, I feel it would have added to the overall feel of the game. If a citizen would have asked me, in Spanish, if they could have a beer then I would have been pleased that I knew what they were saying. Sometimes little touches can make a big difference.

Yeah, the Vortigaunts speaking English is a little odd, but they are supposed to be intelligent. If humans can learn to speak fluent in a secondary language in a matter of years, then I'm sure the Vortiguants can too. And with all the different minorities passing through, plus the fact that they're hive-minded, they're bound to pick up a library of languages to speak with.

Perhaps the G-Man chose to drop Gordon into City 17 at that moment because most (if not all) the population speak English. It would be a huge asset in battle to be able to communicate with your squad. If Gordon was dropped in while the population was filled with minorities, I bet he wouldn't have gotten the same kind of help.


Or maybe Valve just didn't want to include minorities because the accents would sound phoney.

 

[Rizzo]

No nintendo?

In games/movies they all speak english mostely. Just so you understand.

 

[Lightice]

Well not necessarily. I doubt the airports work, so the only means of travel overseas would be by boat. Speaking of which, there was supposed to be a level in Half-Life 2 that took place on a ship which I believe was called the Borealis. That was how Gordon was supposed to arrive in City 17, but it was cut when the more interesting Trainstation level was introduced.

Anyway, the reason for ships transporting people goes back to the theory that there weren't any major Combine Citadels installed in North America (due to Xen wildlife being too thick). All the other continents (like Asia, Africa) would be more suitable to install Citadels because the portals aren't as bad. Now given how high the population is in these parts, the Combine would have their hands full even without those so-called Yanks on the other side of the ocean.

With City 17 supposed to be situated in eastern Europe, a ship coming from the west would land in western Europe, transfer the cargo (humans) to trains, and then take them to the closest city. It's possible that City 17 is the closest City to the western seaboard and therefore would be the main place to accept the North Americans.

That sounds like the most likely in-game scenario for the large numbers of North Americans in Eastern Europe. If City 17 was the westernmost or even among the most westernmost inhabited cities in the planet, it would make sense to move at least the Eastern Americans there. Ofcourse Valve's main reason was without doubt that most of their players are Americans and wanted them to feel comfortable with the NPCs.

Still, it's a shame. When I first started playing Half-Life 2, my first taught was "I'm in an Enki Bilal comic!" Alas, the complete lack of French, Yugoslavians or Africans, or any other interesting ethnicities broke that illusion pretty soon, as did the pure good guy vibes of the Resistance. For a proper Bilal mood (or my interpretation of one), the Resistance should have been mean and gritty bunch with one internal conflict after another, utter contempt towards all those who don't dare to resist and some crazed commanders keeping all the rest at their toes. At least one sane and intelligent female character would have been needed, too, but we already have her, don't we?

 

[Mr.Magnetichead]

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.
t.

Rubbish, complete horseshit. Do you think that us Europeans somehow don't know how to fight? Oh we know how to fight, the thing is that we use guerilla tactics.

Who would be better to fight in a European city than Europeans? We know how our cities work.

Infact do you know what? I bet there were European rebels in HL2, however you just never saw them because you only dealt with yanks who didn't realize it's a bad idea to set up bases 50 feet away from enemy positions and patrol routes.

Really?? They never really mentioned how long the gap is between the two games. I just always assumed it was around 10.

Nope. The youngest people in the game look to be in their 20s. And as they were the last generation to be born before the suppression field was turned on we can assume that 20 years has passed.

 

[Ruzhyo]

Well not necessarily. I doubt the airports work, so the only means of travel overseas would be by boat. Speaking of which, there was supposed to be a level in Half-Life 2 that took place on a ship which I believe was called the Borealis. That was how Gordon was supposed to arrive in City 17, but it was cut when the more interesting Trainstation level was introduced.

Anyway, the reason for ships transporting people goes back to the theory that there weren't any major Combine Citadels installed in North America (due to Xen wildlife being too thick). All the other continents (like Asia, Africa) would be more suitable to install Citadels because the portals aren't as bad. Now given how high the population is in these parts, the Combine would have their hands full even without those so-called Yanks on the other side of the ocean.

With City 17 supposed to be situated in eastern Europe, a ship coming from the west would land in western Europe, transfer the cargo (humans) to trains, and then take them to the closest city. It's possible that City 17 is the closest City to the western seaboard and therefore would be the main place to accept the North Americans.

While that makes sense it still doesn't explain why there were no other nationalities in the city. Now, having not been to America I cannot say I've seen it with my own eyes but as far as I'm aware there is a large immigrant population in America, and if none of these appear in City-17 and your theory is correct then it means that the Combine must have sorted out the ships so that they only contained Americans. I cannot think of many viable explanations for that.
Another point is that if there were a mixture of nationalities and languages in the city then it would greatly hamper communication between citizens, which in turn would make any organised rebellions much less effective. Now for the Combine that can only be a good thing.

 

[Mr.Magnetichead]

Another idea is that everyones had 20 years to learn English.

 

[AJ Rimmer]

Another idea is that everyones had 20 years to learn English.

Why should they learn english? They're in eastern Europe, they shoul've learned to speak russian. Or, you know, Combine-ian.

 

[A True Canadian]

Couple this with the fighting nature and stereotypical culture of modern Americans and you could see how many of them would be able to survive for the 10-or-so years until Half-Life 2's setting. Once things calmed down, then the Combine probably went out and picked up the stragglers.

Rubbish, complete horseshit. Do you think that us Europeans somehow don't know how to fight? Oh we know how to fight, the thing is that we use guerilla tactics.

Who would be better to fight in a European city than Europeans? We know how our cities work.

Of course the Europeans can fight. They use tactics that are in most cases far superior to that of the Americans.

I must have misphrased the response. What I was trying to get at was that the US people would be able to ward off invaders more easily because of the way guns are so integrated into their society. Weapons in the European cities aren't as abundant as they are in the US, and therefore, the ordinary citizen would rely more heavily on their military for their survival than the US citizens who will be able to defend themselves more easily.

If the theory that there were no (or limited) Combine cities in the US is true, then the American citizens would only be fighting a single entity instead of two. Unfortunately for the other parts of the world, they not only have to deal with the Xen creatures, but a highly proficient force such as the Combine. The battles would be a lot tougher for those parts of the planet.

We won't know for sure if my theory is correct until we get more details on the 7 Hour War.

Infact do you know what? I bet there were European rebels in HL2, however you just never saw them because you only dealt with yanks who didn't realize it's a bad idea to set up bases 50 feet away from enemy positions and patrol routes.

It's possible. Perhaps the only citizens who speak to Gordon are the ones who know his story (i.e. Americans). The European rebels were probably smarter than to think that all their problems would go away because of some guy in a hazard suit. I too would have a hard time believing that an American scientist/turned combat extraordinaire was to be the guy to save the world.

 

[Mr.Magnetichead]

Why should they learn english? They're in eastern Europe, they shoul've learned to speak russian. Or, you know, Combine-ian.

A large majority of Europeans speak at least some English and it's also the chosen language of both the US and Britian who are the nations most likely to offer an extended period of resistance due to their militaries structure.

 

[AJ Rimmer]

A large majority of Europeans speak at least some English and it's also the chosen language of both the US and Britian who are the nations most likely to offer an extended period of resistance due to their militaries structure.

Yes, but the majority of people would still be speaking whatever language of whatever country City 17 is. At least until the transfers started, but I'd imagine that didn't happen right away.

 

[Lightice]

A large majority of Europeans speak at least some English and it's also the chosen language of both the US and Britian who are the nations most likely to offer an extended period of resistance due to their militaries structure.

But very few Europeans speak English in American accent - with some ear to language, you can easily tell Brits apart, too (Colonel Cubbage was a terrible stereotype, BTW). While my English is quite good, even compared to my countrymen, as far as understanding and writing goes, my accent is terrible, because I so rarely actually speak in English.

And the war still lasted for seven hours. That includes the US, so it really doesn't seem that they'd have managed to defend any longer than other parts of the world - even if they did, how much difference an hour or two makes?

 

[Mr.Magnetichead]

My dad is English and yet he's been living in the US for something like ten years now. Ne no longer has an English accent.

Accents are a leartn trait and they do change over time. We're talking 20 years here people, most of you havn't even ben alive that long.

 

[Lightice]

Accents are a leartn trait and they do change over time. We're talking 20 years here people, most of you havn't even ben alive that long.

Accents can indeed be learned and delearned. However, do note that the people in City 17 are not immigrants who have lived decades in United States - on the contrary, both in appearance and language they appear to be refugees from United States into the Eastern Europe. If anything, they should have picked up the local accent and even language, assuming that the original residents are still around.
If the refugees originate from several parts of the world, the question still remains why they should assume American accent, out of all things. Most likely the mixture of languages would end up as some sort of pidgin dialect in the course of two decades, if the circumstances were like that.

Alas, the only credible possibility still is, that all these people are Americans and the original locals are gone, at least almost completely.

 

[Thunderclap]

Humans have a huge advantage against the Combine in a guerilla war. They know the terrain, are adapted perfectly to the terrain, and have a civilian population who will happily shelter and supply them. Thus, the Combine regularly transfer people to put them in a foreign terrain they do not know (Americans in Russia) and keep them confused and scared. If all goes well humans will adopt a defeatist atitude: "Why try to start an insurgency here when we're going to be transferred anyway in 8 months?"

 

[Mr.Magnetichead]

Accents can indeed be learned and delearned. However, do note that the people in City 17 are not immigrants who have lived decades in United States - on the contrary, both in appearance and language they appear to be refugees from United States into the Eastern Europe. If anything, they should have picked up the local accent and even language, assuming that the original residents are still around.
If the refugees originate from several parts of the world, the question still remains why they should assume American accent, out of all things. Most likely the mixture of languages would end up as some sort of pidgin dialect in the course of two decades, if the circumstances were like that.

Alas, the only credible possibility still is, that all these people are Americans and the original locals are gone, at least almost completely.

Why should anyone else learn americanized english? Because the leaders of the resistance and the only people left who know what's going on are all speak English.

 

[Ruzhyo]

Why should anyone else learn americanized english? Because the leaders of the resistance and the only people left who know what's going on are all speak English.

Or maybe because Freeman 'speaks' English he was either guided towards the Western resistance leaders or naturally gravitated towards them. Who knows what other factions were present in City-17.

 

[Herr Mike]

Or that it's easiest to hire American voice actors...

 

[Rizzo]

Or its a product aimed for internationel sales. Why have it in a languish no one understands?

 

[Ruzhyo]

Or its a product aimed for internationel sales. Why have it in a languish no one understands?

My point wasn't to have the entire game in a different language, just to have a few individuals that were not Western. They wouldn't even have to be core characters. Besides, for International sales there is the option to change the language settings for the entire game.

 

[Langolier]

Of course the Europeans can fight. They use tactics that are in most cases far superior to that of the Americans.

History might disagree with you.

Americans, Europeans, Iraqis, virtually all people can grasp the idea of Gurrilla warfare. I doubt that anyone is fighting very differently on any continent. In the former US they probably just have a somewhat easier time coming across firearms and ammunition. Over all though the situation is probably about the same.

I think we're looking too much into this. Do you really expect Valve to higher voice actors with perfect accents to speak French, German, Slavic, whatthe****ever for every language setting in the game?

If it so offends you (everyone complaining I mean) then start playing only European-made games. If you want a Canadian campaign in WWII, then find some Canadian studio to make it for you. If you want American movies about foreign troops durring WWII, or any War, then you are shit out of luck and you better start watching domestic films instead of American ones.

 

[Lightice]

Why should anyone else learn americanized english? Because the leaders of the resistance and the only people left who know what's going on are all speak English.

Understanding of English is quite common in Europe. Talking it in American accent is not.

 

[ríomhaire]

1: Everyone in City 17 is a foreigner as they're all American (Cubbage and Gregori are both outside City 17)
2: I think that quite posibly everone in City 14 through 17 or something like that is American and maybe all Americans are in Eastern Europe to disorientate them. And something like all Austrailians being moved to Norway and all Japanese going to Egypt. Also posibly why Breen set up in 17.

 

[AJ Rimmer]

1: Everyone in City 17 is a foreigner as they're all American (Cubbage and Gregori are both outside City 17)
2: I think that quite posibly everone in City 14 through 17 or something like that is American and maybe all Americans are in Eastern Europe to disorientate them. And something like all Austrailians being moved to Norway and all Japanese going to Egypt. Also posibly why Breen set up in 17.

Right, confusion prohibits the development of organized rebellion. It took 15 years for the City 17 to grow to a respectable size.