Anyone else wish Valve would have remained silent?

[DarkStar]

When Valve first announced HL2, I was mightily impressed at how Valve was able to keep quiet about such a large project for 5 years. Avoiding all the "when it's done" nonsense by simply not announcing the game until near the end of the development cycle just seemed like such a refreshing, new way to deal with the issue. It also made me think that they actually must be very close to completing the project if after 5 years they were finally announcing it with a release date attached.

Well, here we are in the midst of the so-called "holiday season" and it seems that HL2 has a slim-to-none chance of coming out anytime soon. All I wish is that Valve had stuck to their guns and not announced the project until it was ACTUALLY close to being done. For a brief-fleeting moment in time it seemed like a high-profile game was going to transcend the chaotic, murky and generally unpleasent world of "when it's done," but alas...

HL2 is now officially in WID limbo.

 

[Chris D]

This is Valve's style. They did it with HL1.

They delayed it, scrapped it started again, then released it.

I wasn't around for the original HL1 hype, but I can imagine it being much like this.

I wonder if there's any forums still in existance that contains the type of community we've had here?

Obviously it'd be a lot smaller but I can just imagine it to be just like this one.

 

[Pjotr]

Originally posted by DarkStar
Well, here we are in the midst of the so-called "holiday season" and it seems that HL2 has a slim-to-none chance of coming out anytime soon. All I wish is that Valve had stuck to their guns and not announced the project until it was ACTUALLY close to being done. For a brief-fleeting moment in time it seemed like a high-profile game was going to transcend the chaotic, murky and generally unpleasent world of "when it's done," but alas...

And how on earth would Valve be able to predict a source code theft 6 months before it takes place? Why don't people remember the most likely cause of this delay, amnesia or what?

In due time, after release of the game, I'm sure the whole horrible story will surface and we will all forgive Valve, or at least feel sorry for them.

 

[Frosty]

Originally posted by Chris_D
This is Valve's style. They did it with HL1.

They delayed it, scrapped it started again, then released it.

I wasn't around for the original HL1 hype, but I can imagine it being much like this.

I wonder if there's any forums still in existance that contains the type of community we've had here?

Obviously it'd be a lot smaller but I can just imagine it to be just like this one.

You can see the evidence with the early screenshots. Barney was originally going to a Military Police officer. LOL! And then there was all the aliens that they cut out, like the ant lion (aka Mr. Friendly, which is returning in HL2 in a rather cooler and different form) and all that stuff. Anyway, Christmas isn't all about games. What about the Alien Quadrilogy box set? So very sweet. Nine DVDs of Alien series goodness.

 

[OFFMason]

I wished Valve would have kept their mouths shut. When it comes down to it, we're all buying the game. A rebellion in the form of not buying the game tickles me because the people saying, "I'm not buying, screw valve", will be rushing to the front of the line once it comes out.

The problem is, Valve lacks humility. This isn't a question of fact, whether or not they have the right to postpone the game or not, this is a question of values. The people working at valve need to be human, and they need to learn to set themselves apart from the evil monsters that they place into their games.

Game companies should set release dates when they are sure that they can meet said deadline. Isn't that what the release date is for, a notification to potential customers when they should prepare their systems or otherwise monies for a software release?

Throughout this time Valve has taken little consideration to the feeling of the vast array of customers and potential customers that have fed them and their families at home. I'm no lawyer, so I can't argue whether or not Vavle is guilty of false advertisement and so on, but in the court of human and business ethics I'd sentence them to painfully wait for something they love dearly.

 

[Dr. Freeman]

to answer the title of the thread.. yes..

i said this a month ago.. not sure what happened to that thread.. but i feel Valve should have waited til the very last minute with announcing anything about HL2.

especially since they wanted Steam to be a big part of HL2.. *shrug* i think Valve were a little short sighted on Steam for whatever reason..

anyway.. HL2 does not need to be hyped.. and this forum is one good reason why amoung a million other reasons..

 

[Jackal hit]

Originally posted by OFFMason
I wished Valve would have kept their mouths shut. When it comes down to it, we're all buying the game. A rebellion in the form of not buying the game tickles me because the people saying, "I'm not buying, screw valve", will be rushing to the front of the line once it comes out.

The problem is, Valve lacks humility. This isn't a question of fact, whether or not they have the right to postpone the game or not, this is a question of values. The people working at valve need to be human, and they need to learn to set themselves apart from the evil monsters that they place into their games.

Game companies should set release dates when they are sure that they can meet said deadline. Isn't that what the release date is for, a notification to potential customers when they should prepare their systems or otherwise monies for a software release?

Throughout this time Valve has taken little consideration to the feeling of the vast array of customers and potential customers that have fed them and their families at home. I'm no lawyer, so I can't argue whether or not Vavle is guilty of false advertisement and so on, but in the court of human and business ethics I'd sentence them to painfully wait for something they love dearly.

they don't HAVE to make a game you know. it's THEIR project, not yours. let's say i'm making some artwork, and imma unveil it for some people(such as a commisioned work, but payment upon completion, which i do) and they don't put me on a schedule, it's my schedule. now i'm working to make them happy, they are my customers, but if i'm doing the piece, and suddenly i realize, "hey this is no where near the quality it needs to be, i need to rework it and make it excellent" it doesn't make me some kind of unfeeling monster, and it doesn't make me lacking in humility. what it means is "it's not done, wait a little while, you won't be sorry." the customer can either say "okay great, i look forward to see how it comes out" or they can say "hey you're a jerk, you arrogant bastard, how dare you take your time for your project?"
what i think may have gone on in valve's mind is "hey let's make this great game that people can love... that is our brainchild... oops, not gonna be ready when we thought..." it's not valve's fault for people going out and buying new hardware or whatever for the game. it's the buyer's fault for going out and spending money. saying otherwise is showing a general lack of accountability... which eh i suppose there IS a lot of that in the world... since most people are cattle.
:rant over:..heh sorry, i've been wanting to say that for a while... like ever since sept 30 and people were all pissed.


okay on topic, hmm yeah i think if valve hadn't said anything about hl2 until... say i dunno around this time of year or something... i say this because i was fine before hl2 was announced and got all that media coverage back during e3.... and everything would be the same now. however, i don't really care that they DID announce it and do whatever, it's a game, doesn't really make a difference to my life. sure, i'll play it, maybe get addicted and probably love it... but ehh... it's a game.

 

[MultiVaC]

Originally posted by OFFMason
I wished Valve would have kept their mouths shut. When it comes down to it, we're all buying the game. A rebellion in the form of not buying the game tickles me because the people saying, "I'm not buying, screw valve", will be rushing to the front of the line once it comes out.

The problem is, Valve lacks humility. This isn't a question of fact, whether or not they have the right to postpone the game or not, this is a question of values. The people working at valve need to be human, and they need to learn to set themselves apart from the evil monsters that they place into their games.

Game companies should set release dates when they are sure that they can meet said deadline. Isn't that what the release date is for, a notification to potential customers when they should prepare their systems or otherwise monies for a software release?

Throughout this time Valve has taken little consideration to the feeling of the vast array of customers and potential customers that have fed them and their families at home. I'm no lawyer, so I can't argue whether or not Vavle is guilty of false advertisement and so on, but in the court of human and business ethics I'd sentence them to painfully wait for something they love dearly.

You act like Valve has just murdered your family. They delayed their game, I'm sure we'll survive.

 

[DavidRoss]

Originally posted by Jackal hit
they don't HAVE to make a game you know. it's THEIR project, not yours.

I work at a retail store... on one of the motos they put up is this. "we are not doing the customer a favor, they are doing us a favor by shopping here"

I like this line, because it really puts into perspective what a company should be doing.

i think the gaming industry has gotten lazy, they think they are doing us a favor by making these games. while infact it is the customer who is doing them a favor by buying the game.

The reason that Valve can act they way it does is because it has power over its customers. they can have no PR, they can say one thing, and do another... and people will buy the game. However this can not last forever. people only tolerate this sort of behavior from a company that in the end provides a good fix. as soon as valve cant give gamers that fix anymore its dead. when you play the game like they do, you cant mess up.

lets take Raven for example. they have made some not very good games, but they can live though it because they are consistent. they tend to do what they say, and just because you dont like this game, the next one might be to your liking.

Say Valve only sells 1,000 copys of its game.... do you think the company would survive? No, like i said, as soon as they strew up, and don't have a fun game for us at the end of the day, people wont put up with their crap anymore.

 

[iamaelephant]

Well put DavidRoss

 

[Tamer17]

Valve delayed the game so WE will get a better product once released . Your are talking like Valve delayed the game for no reason , just to upset us .

For god's sake , they are improving the game and polishing the game so we get a better game . If the game was released you would probablly bitch about that it's not polished and has bugs.

Why won't the announce the game on E3 ? It's the biggest computer gaming show in the world , it's the best place to show the game.

Get things in prespective. Valve is making the game better and you are bitching about it.

 

[phantomdesign]

The problem is, Valve lacks humility

Well, they seem to be more humble than the vast majority of developers which is why HL1 was a success. They recognized their fan base and did what is best for the. Probably the exact same thing is happening right now.

 

[PvtRyan]

Horribly ironic, at the E3, everyone praised Valve for keeping such a big project secret for 4 years, now everyone is bitching at Valve for keeping their mouths shut.

 

[Mr. Redundant]

Re: Re: Anyone else wish Valve would have remained silent?

Originally posted by Pjotr
And how on earth would Valve be able to predict a source code theft 6 months before it takes place? Why don't people remember the most likely cause of this delay, amnesia or what?

In due time, after release of the game, I'm sure the whole horrible story will surface and we will all forgive Valve, or at least feel sorry for them.

naw thats what people assume it was, however The delay was actually announced before the theft, so it would have delayed regardless.
people give the hacker too much credit.. Valve have stated that the game "simply was not done".
none of the silly hacker nonsense helped, but it didnt cause what we are experiencing now.


I have pretty much given up on HL2 (aka Im not anticipating it like I used to, in fact if it doesnt come out in April 2004 I still wouldnt be surprised), then again Im constantly busy.
I agree one hundred percent with Darkstar, thats exactly how I feel, however "shit happens" so I wasnt all that surprised either.

 

[mrchimp]

Originally posted by Tamer17
Valve delayed the game so WE will get a better product once released . Your are talking like Valve delayed the game for no reason , just to upset us .

For god's sake , they are improving the game and polishing the game so we get a better game . If the game was released you would probablly bitch about that it's not polished and has bugs.

Why won't the announce the game on E3 ? It's the biggest computer gaming show in the world , it's the best place to show the game.

Get things in prespective. Valve is making the game better and you are bitching about it.

Well said and I think that I should add to it by saying people are takeing computer games way too seriously, nobody here has actually paid valve for HL2 yet (even if you have pre-ordered it) and Hl2 is not a vital part of your life, you can just go and do something else with your free time you know.

I'm one of those people who bought a brand spanking new graphics card for Hl2 and I'm not complaining so I don't think you should be either.

 

[koopa]

Maybe I'm crazy but I've never thought that Valve were that good at PR (or even customer support, for that matter). The likes of Epic generally handle this sort of thing far better. With all the 'yes it's coming out/no we can't talk about it/etc' stuff it's just put everybody off the game and done nothing but harm to Valve's image.

I sometimes get the feeling that Valve is a bit like one of those talented mod teams that never really plan anything. They've got a bunch of top guys, but no real cohesion as to what to do with them.

On the plus side - at least it's not as bad as waiting for DNF

 

[Neutrino]

Originally posted by Pjotr
And how on earth would Valve be able to predict a source code theft 6 months before it takes place? Why don't people remember the most likely cause of this delay, amnesia or what?

Originally posted by the_prodigy
Many said that if Valve wasn't hacked, we would see HL2 in 2003. Sadly, we wouldn't have.

-----Original Message-----
From: Arzin
Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 12:49 PM
To: Gabe Newell
Subject: -

Hi Mr. Newell,

I'm gonna ask you a question assuming HL2 will release in 2004. If Valve
wasn't hacked, would we really have seen Half-Life 2 on 30th September
or later on in 2003?

It would appreciate it if you could answer this. It wouldn't really help
the situation or anything, but I would just like to know.

Arzin

Gabe: no

 

[Jackal hit]

tamer17, and mr chimp, well said... i'm thinking that a lot of people here are taking a GAME waaaaaay too seriously... i mean c'mon people. can it raise your kids, can it feed you, can you use it for sustenance, does it give you money(sure in some cases, but no, you won't make money off of it... grow up), does it love you, does it do anything for you other than entertain? you all (people who bitch and moan) sound like immature children. really you do, please reflect a little bit on what big bad evil valve is doing to YOU PERSONALLY.

HINT: valve is doing nothing TO YOU... as i said in my last post on this thread, YOU are doing it to YOU. (i put it in different words, don't tell me i didn't lol) additionally... you really don't have to buy valve's product if you don't like them... no one is twisting your arm.
peace.

edit: yeah it's true about the leak and release date... not the cause.
edit again: unless the e-mail is fake
edit once again: ehhhhhh

 

[Edcrab]

I can't help thinking that maybe Valve shouldn't have mentioned the game at all until finalisation. Seriously, they'd have been heralded as the saviours of the gaming world if they'd slated the game for Q1 2004- presuming their *ahem* rivals didn't beat them to it. An early release? Simply maintains and strengthens community faith. And yes, despite considering myself a blatant fanboy I am still bitter regarding the truly pathetic handling of the whole September 30th fiasco.

Still, I like to think that the main priority here is quality. I'd like to think I could last past April if it meant playing a superior game, although god knows whats going on right about now.

 

[iamaelephant]

When will you people learn that almost no one is pissed about the delay, we're pissed about how VALVe handled it. Was it really necessary to get everyone's hopes up until 1 week before release and then tell us it's delayed? I'm not pissed about the delay, I've followed many a game and almost all of them have been delayed, but Valve did it in a pretty shitty way, in my opinion.

 

[Gorgon]

Originally posted by iamaelephant
When will you people learn that almost no one is pissed about the delay, we're pissed about how VALVe handled it. Was it really necessary to get everyone's hopes up until 1 week before release and then tell us it's delayed? I'm not pissed about the delay, I've followed many a game and almost all of them have been delayed, but Valve did it in a pretty shitty way, in my opinion.

its my opinion too. :dozey:

 

[OFFMason]

Oh my gawd, the point of my post flew over your heads, don't comment on posts you don't fully understand. Don't assume you know what I said, because most of the responses to my post are hilarious. This topic is whether or not we think Valve should have remained silent, think of that for a second and then reply.

No, I didn't say it as if they killed my family. Maybe you don't care much about the game, but I'm not talking about you personally. I believe that a majority of the people that will buy this game are die hard fans as myself. Don't tell us you will release a game a certain date when you are unsure of it, thats just lazy PR. They should know that if they don't get the game done by the release date, that it'll only create problems and make people upset, its an obvious cause and effect. The other problem is, they have a PR department and they don't use it. If you are going to miss your deadline, atleast the humility in a proper time frame to notify the communtiy and tell us you can't make it.

I've studied some law, and law is usually very ethical and justified, and it suggests that even if you don't have a contract and you make a statement and the other party relies on that statement and you don't go go through with what you said.... you will be held accountable. I'm sure there were a few people who might not have known that these dumb companies usually go over the release date, bought some new PCs in preperations for the game and lost money. Thats the law side of the argument. They should've kept their mouth shut until they were sure, because the release date's only purpose is that people know and prepare for a release of something.

These people don't have common-sense. And for that they should be punished. As I've said, eye for an eye, let them wait for something they've wanted and have been waiting for.

 

[OFFMason]

Games and cars are the same thing to men as candy is to a child. If you don't think the same you probably have a vagina or have been castrated. Think of how it feels if you were to come up to a kid, show him a picture of a candy bar, walk away and eat one in the far distance.

Don't tell me I'm taking it too seriously. I'd be taking it seriously if I shot anyone for this, I'm just letting you know, its not fun for anyone.
This game is delayed and the way they delayed it was unprofessional and unethical in business terms.

You say they don't have to make a game? Are you kidding me? Thats Valve's purpose, making video games. These people are obligated to their customers. Reliance is a big issue in law and I think Valve would be found guilty for improper public relations.

 

[koopa]

Originally posted by OFFMason
This game is delayed and the way they delayed it was unprofessional and unethical in business terms.

Unprofessional? Yes. Unethical? Not even close. The law doesn't come into this. There's no contract, no obligation - if one of us decides to rush out and buy some new stuff (done it myself)... well, we're fools

 

[OFFMason]

The definition of ethics is, right conduct. You think this is right conduct?

By notifying the gaming community of a release date, you are creating a binding PR statement with potential customers. The release date is in actuality a date in which a company will present an offeree with an offering, contract or product and its almost like giving an offeree the opportunity to accept a contract by buying the game, and to some people they must prepare in advance be it financial reasons or otherwise. If this were to go to court, Valve would be fully responsible for the reliance issue.

So even if there is no contract, in law we are still relying on the idea that there may be a contract.

 

[OFFMason]

The term release date in a court wouldn't mean, "oh this is when it might come out", but it'll mean what its supposed to be defined as, "this is when we will release our product, unless otherwise given a timely notice and reason." Problem is, no one has the balls here to screw with corporate America, neither do I.

 

[koopa]

Originally posted by OFFMason
The definition of ethics is, right conduct. You think this is right conduct?

'Right' here means 'morally justified'. I accept that Valve have a slight 'responsibility' not to intentionally mislead, but given that people understand how this stuff works the moral obligation is very weak.

Originally posted by OFFMason By notifying the gaming community of a release date, you are creating a binding PR statement with potential customers.

Do you mean binding in a moral sense, or a legal sense? In a legal sense I'd say they weren't (I'm sure, if you dig around in the small-print on the press releases it says that all dates are provisional/the information does not consitute a contract/may change in future/etc).

There's no contract (not oral, not written) because the customer didn't enter into one. At no point did I (as a customer) signify my acceptance of their terms - there is no mutual agreement. Not only that, I'm sure the legal hand-waving present in the press releases and on the websites absolves them of any responsibility.

IMHO it's only a contract when you buy the game. Your case is a little different if you pre-order.

Naturally I am not a lawyer, just some dumbass on a forum...

Originally posted by OFFMason So even if there is no contract, in law we are still relying on the idea that there may be a contract.

Do you think there is or is not a contract - you can't have it both ways

 

[iamaelephant]

This conversation is irrelevant because Valve isnt going to court and isnt getting sued and it's a rediculous notion to believe Valve is the least bit accountable in a legal sense. The point is, Valve screwed up with appalling PR and rediculously amatuer conduct, and the crappy thing is we all pay for this (by having to wait longer with no new info) while Valve will no doubt sell just as many copies of their game as they would have if they hadnt screwed us around.

And if you went and bought yourself a new PC or upgraded your system for HL2, then thats not Valves fault, it's yours, that is an undisputable fact.

 

[OFFMason]

How is it rediculous to believe Valve is accountable in a legal sense when I just showed you a totally justifiable notion of that? LoL

You don't need a contract in law for a party to rely on something you said and the person that said something would be totally accountable for what ever action you took in that reliance.

A Release Date is almost as saying, "there will be an open contract open to your acceptance the day this product is released, and this release date is a notification so you can prepare...". And if someone buys a new computer so that they can be ready to play on that date, and the game isn't released due to a very unprofessional late notice by the company, the company is responsible.

For all my economics majors, lets say a company were to make an initial stock public offering on a certain day that they announced, and you sold a companies stock so you can buy the other company's first public offering. Lets say the company you just sold gains .50 on every stock, and the company with the initial public offering decides not to release stocks. You lost a crap load of money, and you will win in court. PR is a very legal business, and if you **** up, be sure to know that you will be eaten up in court.

Causing someone to rely on your statement and not acting on it is purely unethical. "When Valve announced Half-Life 2 in early May, some were surprised by Valve's firm insistence that the game would be ready to ship on September 30", as described on gamespot. THEY FIRMLY INSISTED, if you don't think that binds a company, you must be the most stale person alive. Well if you believe its irrelevant only because it won't happen, well than this whole topic is irrelevant because our discussion will not force the game to come out any quicker.

 

[GhostValkyrie]

Originally posted by Chris_D
Obviously it'd be a lot smaller .

You have no idea. We were so close knit, too...
That was back in the day of Jeh and Lady Ice, back when PHL was more friendly. Man...it's been a long time. Thanks for making me feel so decrepit, Chris_D.

 

[iamaelephant]

Originally posted by OFFMason
Blah blah, bunch or irrelevant crap that I've already stated but still makes no logical sense....

Causing someone to rely on your statement and not acting on it is purely unethical.

Unethical? Hell yes, but that doesnt make them legally responsible coz some dumbass impatient nerd went and bought himself some hardware. The fact is the dumbass impatient nerd never lost any money, he got exactly what he paid for.

 

[HybridM]

It's Ridiculous not Rediculous.


I honestly don't know why the HL2 thing is such a big deal to people. I want the game too, but jesus. Delays happen, I don't care how valve went about announcing it. You don't know what went on internally.

 

[OFFMason]

No, what I pointed out is just one case. And I'm just giving you a legal standpoint. Legally they are unethical and in the court of morality they've failed to keep up with the guidelines. You all need to understand if these people had any respect for us, we would be hearing from them constantly with updated news on goings on. They asked the community for favors, such as not downloading the stolen code and beta. Did most of us stay away? Yes. Do we owe them this respect? Not at all. We as gamers had enough humility to stay away from something so juicy as the leaked beta, can they not grant us the same respect in return and give us timely feedback?

I'm not pissed off at the delay. What I am pissed off at is the way they handled it, and missing deadline. It was an official statement on behalf of Valve. Official meaning, in the name of the company, legal. This is both a legal **** up and a moral **** up. Valve should be more human!

 

[MultiVaC]

Originally posted by OFFMason
Valve should be more human!

Mistakes are human. You're blowing this WAY out of proportion. We're not talking about genocide or a government conspiracy. It's nothing more than bad PR. I wouldn't even go so far as to call it unethical. It's simply unprofessional.

 

[OFFMason]

Yes mistakes are human, but we shouldn't have been told anything if mistakes were a possibility of taking place. Valve sure as hell knew when they pushed that release date on us that the possibility of them not making it was a clear and present danger. Its unprofessional and unethical that they feel its ok to just throw around release dates like that. It is a serious problem because this is an example of how the corporate world can get away with anything. This is exactly what Bush is trying to fix. This is a huge problem, he wants more consumer confidence and right now I have no confidence in Valve because they've ****ed up way too much. This is Presidential Level **** Ups.

 

[Tamer17]

WTF? you know how many video game companies promised a certain release but failed to release it on the promised date ? alot. I don't fans of those game bitch about contract and legal stuff , which are stupid.

We don't know when Valve knew they won't hit the date , and yes the could and shold have given us a sooner statement, but they didn't , deal with it . They not responsible for people who bought hardware just for HL2 , the people are those that decided to buy , on thier own mind , and they should have taken in consideration that there could be delay.

Yes , Valve should have told us sonner , and they didn't and that upset all of us for some time , but hey 3 months have passed and you still moan anout it!

Yes , they should have handled it better , give us sonner head's up notice. I was upset about it for couple of days and after that I stopped.

Valve are humans , the make mistakes , even if it bothers us very much , you shouldn't bash and bitch so much.

Remember , it's only the 2nd game Valve are making . They still aren't experienced in PR as other companies .( and still , experienced comapnies upset thier funs today).

 

[OFFMason]

I wasn't only talking about Vavle when I was arguing about business ethics. I'm only using this as an example because this a ****ing Half Life 2 forum. Any company that ****s up Release dates should be fined or worse. According to judicial system they sure as hell are responsible. Release date doesn't mean, "We think it might be released this day", it was an official statement on behalf of Valve. The only reason from Vavle's point of view would be to notify potential customers of when to be ready, there is no other reason.

If they released a statement that said, oh it might be released Q4 of 2003, then I wouldn't bitch. But giving us an exact date, and making it official only binds the company to that official statement, it doesn't do anything else.

 

[Pitbul]

Originally posted by OFFMason
No, what I pointed out is just one case. And I'm just giving you a legal standpoint. Legally they are unethical and in the court of morality they've failed to keep up with the guidelines. You all need to understand if these people had any respect for us, we would be hearing from them constantly with updated news on goings on. They asked the community for favors, such as not downloading the stolen code and beta. Did most of us stay away? Yes. Do we owe them this respect? Not at all. We as gamers had enough humility to stay away from something so juicy as the leaked beta, can they not grant us the same respect in return and give us timely feedback?

haha you just OWN3D Valve.:cheers:

 

[H-52]

Well, this question pretty much ansewered itself.

Let's not forget people, that Valve didn't only hype the game, the gave a specific release date. They kept repeating over and over again that the game would be availeble on september the 30th of this year. As far as I know they didnt condition this date at all. They stated that the release date was solid. Even worse, they didnt warn tgose people off that upgraded their PC's to handle the new wonder game. We are talking about a fair outlay of money here. A major system upgrade or an all-new PC are not cheap. And let's not forget, not all gamers are rich.

And then, completly out of the freakin' blue, Valve let's us know that "sorry folks" but the game has been delayed. Since then Gabe Newell has been forced to admit that the game was quite simply not ready. Just look at the 'ask valve' thread that is still up there. And oh yes, instead of offering an apology and an explenation they chose this time to go silent. The only thing we get to hear is some cock and bull story about a sucurity breach that absolutly no-one believes.

Legal??? Perhaps. Ethical ???? HAH!!!!!!!

 

[Tamer17]

Valve sayed the game will hit the shelves on 30 the september . It didn't. I don't see any reason to sue them. Stuff happens.

They declared a certain relaese date , so what? doesn't it mean that the game will be released that day 100%? no. They didn't mislead or tricked anyone. They were sure that the game will be released in that certain date (like everyone here is sure about stuff and promised things) , but for some reason they couldn't release it. Does that give us the option to sue them? no.

Don't tell me that what happnes to a one man isn't the same as with a company. It's the same basic . I you promsie someone to give him back his book at certain date , but you end up for some reason not giving him the book . you can't ue him , like you can't sue Valve, don't tell me Valve is a company and companies must not do that stuff , because they are humans , and can miss a date , and don't tell me there is money involved here , cause the people who bought hardware for the game , bought on thier own mind . Valve didn't tell us : "go buy new computers , new gfx cards , the game will be released on 30th sep. so go buy now".

The bottom line is that you can't sue them.

I don't believe that you are even talking about it . Valve missed the date . They should have told us sonner. That's it. You are upset for couple days ,and that's it. After the anger has gone , you can look at the things better : the game got delayed ? it happens alot . They should
have told us sooner? yes . End of story.

I don't understand why people are still angry ,still bitching to a point of law sue.

I geuss you are stuck on the "Anger" stage , and haven't accepted the case.