Bush Flunks 9/11 commission report

[dream431ca]

The commission that went over the 9/11 responce is not very happy..to put it lightly. They blame the administration for spending too much time in Iraq and not enough time fixing the security flaws. They also say that the US is no where near ready for another "attack" if one occurs.

"It's not a priority for the government right now," said the former chairman, Thomas Kean, ahead of the group's release of a report today assessing how well its recommendations have been followed.
"More than four years after 9/11 ... people are not paying attention," the former Republican governor of New Jersey said. "God help us if we have another attack."

They also said because of the response of Hurricane Katrina was such a bad response, that if another attack occurs, it would be very similar to the response to katrina.

http://www.southcoasttoday.com/daily/12-05/12-05-05/a10wn520.htm

 

[CptStern]

just goes to show you that the "war on terror" is a load of baloney. He didnt care then he doesnt care now:


Richard Clarke (terrorism says that as early as the day after the attacks, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld was pushing for retaliatory strikes on Iraq, even though al Qaeda was based in Afghanistan.

Clarke suggests the idea took him so aback, he initally thought Rumsfeld was joking.

"The president dragged me into a room with a couple of other people, shut the door, and said, 'I want you to find whether Iraq did this.' Now he never said, 'Make it up.' But the entire conversation left me in absolutely no doubt that George Bush wanted me to come back with a report that said Iraq did this.

"I said, 'Mr. President. We've done this before. We have been looking at this. We looked at it with an open mind. There's no connection.'

"He came back at me and said, "Iraq! Saddam! Find out if there's a connection.' And in a very intimidating way. I mean that we should come back with that answer. We wrote a report."

Clarke continued, "It was a serious look. We got together all the FBI experts, all the CIA experts. We wrote the report. We sent the report out to CIA and found FBI and said, 'Will you sign this report?' They all cleared the report. And we sent it up to the president and it got bounced by the National Security Advisor or Deputy. It got bounced and sent back saying, 'Wrong answer. ... Do it again.' "

 

[Icarusintel]

As my Homeland Security professor stated today, the only true yardstick we have in measuring the effectiveness of our anti-terrorism policies is whether or not we have had another attack, and simply put, we have not. So, say what you will about Bush and the US preparedness, the simple fact is that we have not been attacked again.

Now, saying this, I also know it is not a matter of "if" but a matter of "when" and it will certainly happen again, but who knows when that might be

 

[CptStern]

As my Homeland Security professor stated today, the only true yardstick we have in measuring the effectiveness of our anti-terrorism policies is whether or not we have had another attack, and simply put, we have not. So, say what you will about Bush and the US preparedness, the simple fact is that we have not been attacked again.

Now, saying this, I also know it is not a matter of "if" but a matter of "when" and it will certainly happen again, but who knows when that might be

as 9/11 proved, the other side has a lot of patience

 

[Solaris]

As my Homeland Security professor stated today, the only true yardstick we have in measuring the effectiveness of our anti-terrorism policies is whether or not we have had another attack, and simply put, we have not. So, say what you will about Bush and the US preparedness, the simple fact is that we have not been attacked again.

Now, saying this, I also know it is not a matter of "if" but a matter of "when" and it will certainly happen again, but who knows when that might be

Poor reasoning.

We are under attack of aliens.
I have saved the world, but need funding to do so. My freind gave me a $100 dollars a week, and this was sufficent, but now hes dead, so its up to you. My proof is there have been no alien attacks, as I have repelled them.

Replace aliens with terrorists and Money with civil rights and you get the picture.

 

[clarky003]

well said solaris, get those money grubbin religious neo con fanatic's out of the whitehouse plx.

 

[Absinthe]

As my Homeland Security professor stated today, the only true yardstick we have in measuring the effectiveness of our anti-terrorism policies is whether or not we have had another attack, and simply put, we have not. So, say what you will about Bush and the US preparedness, the simple fact is that we have not been attacked again.

No offense to your professor, as I'm sure he's an intelligent man, but that's a whole lot of nonsense for reasons Solaris has pointed out.

 

[Icarusintel]

No offense to your professor, as I'm sure he's an intelligent man, but that's a whole lot of nonsense for reasons Solaris has pointed out.

you wanna know the fun part? his job outside of teaching is coming up with policies for the US gov't to use, most specifically in terms of homeland security

Solaris,It may not be the greatest reasoning, but do you have a better way to demonstrate whether or not we're prepared for a terrorist attack?

 

[Revisedsoul]

you wanna know the fun part? his job outside of teaching is coming up with policies for the US gov't to use, most specifically in terms of homeland security

sounds a little bias to me then

 

[No Limit]

But we all know that according to righties the federal government is not responsible for disasters such as terrorist attacks, it is up to the locals. :dozey:

 

[FictiousWill]

my Homeland Security professor

Say what? I don't think those are real.

 

[gick]

'Homeland Security' eh?

LOL

 

[Icarusintel]

Say what? I don't think those are real.

well, maybe I should've been more specific, the professor teaching my Homeland Security class, which is a real class, but he has degrees in other things related to Homeland Security

 

[SAJ]

"Homeland Security professor " ?!
Homeland Security classes ?!
Thats a pretty scary concept .

 

[Glirk Dient]

The fault of Katrina was different than if there was a terrorist attack. It's not like we weren't prepared to deal with it. There were just people at fault and confusions that shouldn't have happened. We did good on 9/11 and since have upped our security and readiness for terrorist events. I don't see why we would be any less prepared.

 

[SIGbastard]

The 9/11 commission is now working for private parties. It is no longer funded by the government. That could mean that it will be biased towards the views of the funder now. I don't know or have an opinion. I just found the information interesting.

 

[Icarusintel]

"Homeland Security professor " ?!
Homeland Security classes ?!
Thats a pretty scary concept .

actually, it's very interesting, it's always nice to know a bit more about what the government is up to, don;t you think?

 

[CptStern]

actually, it's very interesting, it's always nice to know a bit more about what the government is up to, don;t you think?

oh come ON!!!! americans are fed so much disinformation it isnt funny


how else would you explain this


or this


or the fact that the "war on terror" was a big lie from the get go


or the fact that 2 years later a majority of americans still believe this:

* 88 percent of U.S. adults believe that Saddam Hussein would have made weapons of mass destruction if he could have (down slightly from 90% in November).
* 76 percent believe that the Iraqis are better off now than they were under Saddam Hussein (same as November).
* 64 percent believe that history will give the U.S. credit for bringing freedom and democracy to Iraq (up slightly from 63% in November).
* 64 percent believe that Saddam Hussein had strong links to Al Qaeda (up slightly from 62% in November).
* 61 percent believe that Iraq, under Saddam Hussein, was a serious threat to U.S. security (down slightly from 63% in November).



never in my 30+ years of life have I ever witnessed mass brainwashing in this large of a scale ..it's like after 9/11 you lost all ability for independent thought

 

[Solaris]

never in my 30+ years of life have I ever witnessed mass brainwashing in this large of a scale ..it's like after 9/11 you lost all ability for independent thought

QFT.
911 scared the American populace, and to a large extent the UK into doing whatever our masters say.

 

[CptStern]

yes but had they been paying attention for, I dont know, the last FREAKIN 50 years they would have seen through the deception ..it wasnt all that hard. I personally NEVER had a doubt as to the BS bush was spewing. You didnt even have to research all that hard to come to the conclusion that saddam was almost helpless due to 12 years of crippling sanctions and constant bombing

 

[clarky003]

"ninety five percent of the world need to be told what to do and how to behave"

Arnold Schwarzenegger.

we are sheep and the stupid thing is alot of us dont even know it because of the smoke screen that is capital idealisim being projected into our way of life, that and most of the neo con right and its supporters are too busy with a boner for war and subsequent profit's gained to really care.

 

[Icarusintel]

oh come ON!!!! americans are fed so much disinformation it isnt funny
never in my 30+ years of life have I ever witnessed mass brainwashing in this large of a scale ..it's like after 9/11 you lost all ability for independent thought

you don't even know what is being taught in my class, and you're incredibly wrong in thinking its merely disinformation being fed to us - my most recent project was actually looking at the Patriot act and dissecting a few different parts of it and examining how they effect the rights given by the Constitution, along with our own personal beliefs about what rights we have

the rest of the class has also been discussing what exists in the homeland security structure, what is being done, what could be done better, what we think about all of it, how it should be done, how it is effecting our daily lives, etc.

we're given facts and told to analyze them based on the past and our beliefs, so don;t go labelling it some right-wing propaganda machine - the teacher won;t even tell us his political beliefs so as not to bias the class's opinion of what he is saying

It's funny you talk about brainwashing, because a fair amount of the people I've met disagree with all of those statements you're showing there, funny how that works when you actually sample a bit more of the population

 

[CptStern]

you don't even know what is being taught in my class, and you're incredibly wrong in thinking its merely disinformation being fed to us - my most recent project was actually looking at the Patriot act and dissecting a few different parts of it and examining how they effect the rights given by the Constitution, along with our own personal beliefs about what rights we have

ummmm I was referring to the lead up to the war ...I guess that's why I mentioned it

the rest of the class has also been discussing what exists in the homeland security structure, what is being done, what could be done better, what we think about all of it, how it should be done, how it is effecting our daily lives, etc.

we're given facts and told to analyze them based on the past and our beliefs, so don;t go labelling it some right-wing propaganda machine - the teacher won;t even tell us his political beliefs so as not to bias the class's opinion of what he is saying

It's funny you talk about brainwashing, because a fair amount of the people I've met disagree with all of those statements you're showing there, funny how that works when you actually sample a bit more of the population

oh no!!! americans disagree with my assessement that the war in iraq is a sham, will wonders never cease. Anyone who still believes the war was just, is either hopelessly naive or worse yet a willing participant in the destruction of a nation

...you need to talk to people outside of your own close minded group

 

[SAJ]

actually, it's very interesting, it's always nice to know a bit more about what the government is up to, don;t you think?

Yes, yes it would be interesting, but only as a component of another class. As part of comparative law, order and civil rights, a homeland security module would be informative, but a class on its own is just a bit creepy.

So , tell us a bit more about this fath**(oops , meant home) land security class.

 

[Icarusintel]

oh no!!! americans disagree with my assessement that the war in iraq is a sham, will wonders never cease. Anyone who still believes the war was just, is either hopelessly naive or worse yet a willing participant in the destruction of a nation

...you need to talk to people outside of your own close minded group

actually, I was referring to THESE statements,

or the fact that 2 years later a majority of americans still believe this:

* 88 percent of U.S. adults believe that Saddam Hussein would have made weapons of mass destruction if he could have (down slightly from 90% in November).
* 76 percent believe that the Iraqis are better off now than they were under Saddam Hussein (same as November).
* 64 percent believe that history will give the U.S. credit for bringing freedom and democracy to Iraq (up slightly from 63% in November).
* 64 percent believe that Saddam Hussein had strong links to Al Qaeda (up slightly from 62% in November).
* 61 percent believe that Iraq, under Saddam Hussein, was a serious threat to U.S. security (down slightly from 63% in November).

I guess I need to be as specific as you think you are

I talk to people all the time who agree with your point of view - and trust me, i talk to plenty of people who share none of the same political views as me, like my ex-gf, she was liberal as they come

 

[Glirk Dient]

oh come ON!!!! americans are fed so much disinformation it isnt funny

Yeah...thats the media for you. However just because people aren't aren't against the Iraq conflict and bringing them democracy doesn't mean they are all disinformed.

 

[CptStern]

actually, I was referring to THESE statements,

you wrote:

you're incredibly wrong in thinking its merely disinformation being fed to us

how else would you explain this, the poll was conducted in february of this year:

* 88 percent of U.S. adults believe that Saddam Hussein would have made weapons of mass destruction if he could have
* 64 percent believe that Saddam Hussein had strong links to Al Qaeda (up slightly from 62% in November).
* 61 percent believe that Iraq, under Saddam Hussein, was a serious threat to U.S. security


those are leftovers from when bush and co. were lying their way into iraq:


We have sources that tell us that Saddam Hussein recently authorized Iraqi field commanders to use chemical weapons -- the very weapons the dictator tells us he does not have.

George Bush February 8, 2003


Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction.

Dick Cheney August 26, 2002


We know where they are. They are in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad.

Donald Rumsfeld March 30, 2003

I guess I need to be as specific as you think you are

I talk to people all the time who agree with your point of view - and trust me, i talk to plenty of people who share none of the same political views as me, like my ex-gf, she was liberal as they come

it's says something about you ...I tend to believe it's stubborness rather than ignorance that keeps you from seeing the painfully obvious (I'm not insulting you, I'm just making an observation ...if you stop to think about it for a second you'll realize I'm kinda complimenting you ). Btw you're attending a military college are you not? If so you have to admit that bias has to play in there somewhere; after all, you wouldnt want an army full of dissenters.