Contraception for 11 year olds

[ríomhaire]

Ireland's Minister for Health, Mary Harnady(sp?) has proposed alowing children as young as 11 to get contraception/morning after pill because of the underage pregnancy 'crisis' that is happening. It is illegal for these children to have sex so this is effectivly aiding a crime. Now, here's an interesting fact, the media and government is saying there is a crisis but there are as many under-age pregnancies as there were 30 years ago. So, do you think that it is alright to sell contraception to 12 year olds? Surely it would just encorage theem to have sex?

 

[Eg.]

hell yes they should get an abortion at that age. but its should be treated as the most shameful thing to do. to not let them get an abortion is one of the worse things to do, but we need to make the causes for the process seem as shameful as possible

 

[French Ninja]

It's disgusting for kids to have sex at that age, but should be allowed to use contraception.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

That is ****ing sick. 11 Years old?

I remember thinking the year was great because all the girls were 'getting bigger' but Jesus Christ none of us were ****ing. What the hell is wrong with these people?

 

[Adabiviak]

This depends on what (in your opinion) the problem with 11-year olds having sex. Is it the typically unwanted pregnancy? Is it the divine damnation because they were'nt married yet? Is it the social damnation because they are considered too young? It's probably a mixture of some of these (or others) and unless you don't care about unwanted pregnancies, they should be handing out contraceptives. If they are unavailable now, their restriction hasn't prevented these pregnancies. If they are made available, at least the pregnancy part will be helped. Getting them to stop having sex will require better parental and social standards. Good luck with that!

 

[jimbo118]

they're not selling it to the kids dude, its for emergency cases only...and only the parents can get it. Its not like they're giving them out over the counter to horny 11 year olds...

 

[Kangy]

I agree with it. There should be greater campaigns to tell these kids to leave the damned sex thing for a good few years, but there's always going to be some that don't listen. It's completely unfair to not provide the treatment. As Eg said, there needs to be lessons learnt from those who're in the situation anyway.

 

[TheSomeone]

You think 11 year olds are going to think "Hey, we can get an abortion anyways!"? Them getting an abortion isn't gonna change the fact they'll be ashamed for the rest of their lives. Making an 11 year old have a baby is awful.

 

[baxter]

It makes you wonder how bad it can get from here.
11 year olds, for Christ Sake.......Where did the age of innocence go?

 

[15357]

It makes you wonder how bad it can get from here.
11 year olds, for Christ Sake.......Where did the age of innocence go?

down the hellish crevices of the internet.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

How many more lives will goatse claim?

 

[el Chi]

It is illegal for these children to have sex so this is effectivly aiding a crime.

I take your point, but that is somewhat like saying ambulances shouldn't pick up people who've overdosed on drugs because they were breaking the law in the first place.
On the other hand, I totally see what you mean - 11 is too young to be having sex. Whether or not offering them contraception at that age would be seen as condoning underage sex is debatable. I can see that they'd rather be safe than sorry, but it's still rather unsettling.
Are there any kinds of figures to support the idea that there is a large proportion of kids around 12 who're having sex?

 

[Raziaar]

Geez, at 11 years old I was having sex with myself, not others!

 

[baron insig]

at 11, i was still just a kid who played lotsa computer games, then at 12 well lets just say i met raziaar

 

[Raziaar]

at 11, i was still just a kid who played lotsa computer games, then at 12 well lets just say i met raziaar

Don't include me in any of your sex talk.

 

[el Chi]

Don't include me in any of your sex talk.

...if the boot fits... :naughty:

 

[Gray Fox]

I those teens wanna have sex let them and give them contraception.
A country like sweden wich has the most loose laws on sex but best education on it has the least pregnancies in the world.

 

[ríomhaire]

I those teens wanna have sex let them and give them contraception.

As young as 11

 

[Gray Fox]

Yeah, if necesairly yes, some people allredy are in their teens when 11, most not. And it may be unnormal, but it won't hurt them. Most hurt from sex comes A from misuse by older people(pedo's) and B by shame that is unnecesairly put on by society. Who generally views sex as healthy and fun and stress releaveing, if you're above 18, but if your younger, just getting a lot hormones, have a lot of homework and stress, then sex is very bad.
Simply if 11 year olds have sex with people of their own age, and do so out of their own will, give them contraception. Sex won't kill them.

 

[CptStern]

doesnt matter if you give them contraception or not, they'll still have sex ...would you rather have sexually active/responsible 11 year olds or pregnant 11 year olds?

 

[Raziaar]

doesnt matter if you give them contraception or not, they'll still have sex ...would you rather have sexually active/responsible 11 year olds or pregnant 11 year olds?

[SARCASM]Pregnant 11 year olds.[/SARCASM]

 

[CptStern]

cuz you have first hand experience on raising a child right? it's a walk in the park, any 11 year old would have no problems raising a baby :upstare:


I'm in my 30's, my wife and I planned for the pregnancy (which costs about $20,000 a year including daycare and saving for university) yet we still have had moments of difficulty .......but an 11 year old single mother should have no problems

 

[Raziaar]

cuz you have first hand experience on raising a child right? it's a walk in the park, any 11 year old would have no problems raising a baby :upstare:


I'm in my 30's, my wife and I planned for the pregnancy (which costs about $20,000 a year including daycare and saving for university) yet we still have had moments of difficulty .......but an 11 year old single mother should have no problems

Did you not read the disclaimer of may or may not be true? lol. Of course I don't want pregnant 11 year olds.

And i'm only 20, I have had no experience raising a child first hand experience. But I have had 10 years of second hand experience raising multiple children. I spent nearly half of my life living with my uncle and helped to raise his three young children while he was at work, and basically in general. I'm no stranger when it comes to knowing about the needs, wants, and care needed for taking children of children ages 2-17. 10 years of experience will do that to ya

There was no daycare in the family... My brother and I were the daycare for much of their life. And to this day, since they've moved down to texas too, I keep close ties to all of them.

 

[CptStern]

second hand experience doesnt compare to the real thing ...how many times during that time did you get up in the middle of the night for feedings? did you spend 24 hours in a delivery room with your wife while the baby was born? did you visit the hospital every single day for 3 months while your baby was in an incubator? did you stay up for 7 hours straight when he was sick and wouldnt fall asleep even though you had to go to work in the morning? baby sitting your brother and raising a child doesnt compare in the least

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

doesnt matter if you give them contraception or not, they'll still have sex ...would you rather have sexually active/responsible 11 year olds or pregnant 11 year olds?

How many sexually active 11 year olds can there be? If it's really becoming a problem that really, really says something about society today. That's a patch, but aside from that things need to be done to help stop the overall problem. I've always wondered at why the groups who give out condoms,etc, are TOTALLY (well, most I've read or talked to) against abstinence? It needs to be pushed, obviously. That doesn't mean you can't help deal with the problems that arise from underage sex, but you must also help to stop it.

 

[Raziaar]

second hand experience doesnt compare to the real thing ...how many times during that time did you get up in the middle of the night for feedings? did you spend 24 hours in a delivery room with your wife while the baby was born? did you visit the hospital every single day for 3 months while your baby was in an incubator? did you stay up for 7 hours straight when he was sick and wouldnt fall asleep even though you had to go to work in the morning? baby sitting your brother and raising a child doesnt compare in the least

Since when do I have to have done all that to know how to help raise a child in the age bracket that I gave you, being 2-17?

10 years of experience making sure the kids are fed, taken care of, off to school, do their homework(as well as doing that all for myself too), and getting to bed on time, helping to resolve their disputes etc etc etc. 10 years of that, and you mock my experiences because I haven't gone through it all from day 1? I 'know' how to raise children, and I have done so as a child myself, with three kids. Why do you see it fit to tell me I don't have the experience to raise children? What did I do or say in this thread to make you argue about that with me? Nothing...


And on an aside note, I find it funny you stand by those people who would have considered your incubated baby a prime canidate for having its skull collapsed and brains sucked out should the mother want it if it was still inside her body. I mean... its just an unintelligent organism unworthy of life.

 

[CptStern]

you have absolutely no clue


first of all a baby cannot survive incubated prior to 22 weeks (extremely rare)

second of all, most abortions are performed before the third trimester ..in fact it'll only be performed if the mother is at risk after 24 weeks ...and even then the birth is INDUCED not by D&E


my son was incubated at 24 weeks because HE WOULDNT HAVE SURVIVED OTHERWISE

 

[Raziaar]

second of all, most abortions are performed before the third trimester ..in fact it'll only be performed if the mother is at risk after 24 weeks

Just because thats when most of them are performed, doesn't mean there aren't people out there who support the decision to be made at ANY stage in the development process.

You looked at that baby in the incubator, and you felt an attachment to it, yes? You thought it was a wonderful thing, and deserved to live as the incubators brought it on to the proper development period. It doesn't shock you, that babies have been, and are aborted around the 6th month period where your baby was. Does the fact that they are even aborted just a few weeks prior to that too, in much larger numbers change anything? There's not really a magical line there that can determine when its life, and when its not.

What i'm saying, is that many babies are aborted, because of the mothers choice, at the same stage that your baby was put into that incubator.

 

[CptStern]

How many sexually active 11 year olds can there be? If it's really becoming a problem that really, really says something about society today. That's a patch, but aside from that things need to be done to help stop the overall problem. I've always wondered at why the groups who give out condoms,etc, are TOTALLY (well, most I've read or talked to) against abstinence? It needs to be pushed, obviously. That doesn't mean you can't help deal with the problems that arise from underage sex, but you must also help to stop it.

why cant abstinence education go hand in hand with education on contraception?

 

[CptStern]

Just because thats when most of them are performed, doesn't mean there aren't people out there who support the decision to be made at ANY stage in the development process.

so? it's not legal in most western countries after the second trimester ...so I cant see how your point has anything to do with the subject at hand ...please lets not discuss abortion because NONE of you know first hand what it entails

 

[Raziaar]

so? it's not legal in most western countries after the second trimester ...so I cant see how your point has anything to do with the subject at hand ...please lets not discuss abortion because NONE of you know first hand what it entails

You said your baby was incubated for 3 months, right? So was it withdrawn from your wife around the 6th month period? If that's the case, that baby was in the second trimester, and is perfectly legal to suck the babies brains out. I think thats wrong... did looking at your child in that incubator not bring you to think its wrong? Or did you go into that hospital every single day, so that you could reach the one point much further down the line from the first day it was put in, where you could suddenly jump up and say, "That's my baby!" instead of "Thats my foetus!" when it crossed this magical barrier where it was no longer just an unintelligent, lump of flesh like people claim.

You're fine with people killing their own children at that stage... at that stage where you devoted every single day for 3 months to be there for your own?

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

why cant abstinence education go hand in hand with education on contraception?

That's what I was asking. The contraception programs I've seen refuse to teach abstinence. And the few abstinence programs that I have seen are religious and so don't do contraception (there might be some out there but I've never seen a non religous group that promotes abstinence.)

So kids either get one or the other and not both.

 

[CptStern]

You said your baby was incubated for 3 months, right? So was it withdrawn from your wife around the 6th month period? If that's the case, that baby was in the second trimester, and is perfectly legal to suck the babies brains out.

nope ..the third trimester starts at 28 weeks and goes to 40 weeks

I think thats wrong... did looking at your child in that incubator not bring you to think its wrong?

wrong, wrong wrong ...3rd trimseter is ILLEGAL unless it endangers the well being of the mother

Or did you go into that hospital every single day, so that you could reach the one point much further down the line from the first day it was put in, where you could suddenly jump up and say, "That's my baby!" instead of "Thats my foetus!" when it crossed this magical barrier where it was no longer just an unintelligent, lump of flesh like people claim.

You're fine with people killing their own children at that stage... at that stage where you devoted every single day for 3 months to be there for your own?

please SHUT UP, you have no ****ing clue as to what you're talking about


you're really pushing the boundary here ...dont bring my family into this as I wouldnt do the same to you

 

[CptStern]

That's what I was asking. The contraception programs I've seen refuse to teach abstinence. And the few abstinence programs that I have seen are religious and so don't do contraception (there might be some out there but I've never seen a non religous group that promotes abstinence.)

So kids either get one or the other and not both.

IMHO abstinence is just not realistic ..it might work for staunch christians but not for the population as a whole ...how could someone possibly sustain it till they're married? ...again I can only see religious justifications in abstaining sex ...it wouldnt apply to everyone else

 

[Raziaar]

Meh. My facts are a bit messed up, I admit. I'm not sure when the frist trimester begins.

But you have three trimesters, if a trimester is three months, where does that place each trimester?

I don't deny my lack of knowledge on the matter, but it doesn't require a baby development genius to feel it is wrong or not to abort babies at certain points.

 

[Raziaar]

MHO abstinence is just not realistic ..it might work for staunch christians but not for the population as a whole ...how could someone possibly sustain it till they're married? ...again I can only see religious justifications in abstaining sex ...it wouldnt apply to everyone else

Yes, the whole 'save it until marriage' thing is religion based. I understand that. But do you not put some sort of age barrier on the act of sex? There are kids that have sex well before the age of 10. Should they be allowed to go about it if they're both consention? The boys on my block growing up, used to fool around with this girl who lived on the corner. THey were about 5-6 years old, and for some freaking crazy reason, they were all interested in sex. I doubt they could actually do anything in regards to penetration and all that, but is that really an appropiate age to be experimenting sexually?

There's gotta be a line drawn, religion or not. Its just sick otherwise.

 

[CptStern]

yes it dioes ...every single case of terminating a pergnancy is different ..dont generalise ..because until YOU'VE lived through it you cant possibly even begin to understand even an iota of how hard that decision is to make

 

[CptStern]

Yes, the whole 'save it until marriage' thing is religion based. I understand that. But do you not put some sort of age barrier on the act of sex? There are kids that have sex well before the age of 10. Should they be allowed to go about it if they're both consention? The boys on my block growing up, used to fool around with this girl who lived on the corner. THey were about 5-6 years old, and for some freaking crazy reason, they were all interested in sex. I doubt they could actually do anything in regards to penetration and all that, but is that really an appropiate age to be experimenting sexually?

There's gotta be a line drawn, religion or not. Its just sick otherwise.

how old was Mary when she was visited by the holy spirit? in this day and age god would be arrested for statutory rape

 

[Raziaar]

how old was Mary when she was visited by the holy spirit? in this day and age god would be arrested for statutory rape

Don't sidestep the question here. Is there no line that should be drawn for kids who try to experiment sexually, no matter how young they are? There are kids out there who have their first sexual experiences at the ages of 5-9.

Or no matter their age when they become curious, they should just be left to their own devices?

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

IMHO abstinence is just not realistic ..it might work for staunch christians but not for the population as a whole ...how could someone possibly sustain it till they're married? ...again I can only see religious justifications in abstaining sex ...it wouldnt apply to everyone else

At least throughout school anyways. Abstinence until of legal age. Still not ready, but it's better than there being 11 year olds having sex.. I know it won't stop all cases, but it's sure to stop some and that's what's important.