Could someone please explain CS:S damage model to me?

[DarKnyt]

New to CS, but a veteran of many online shooters

Yes, I've searched this forum, and the web - but I haven't been able to find a concise explanation of how damage to the player is calculated in CS:S. Many of the games I play have precise damage calculations that allow you to quickly calculate the ordnance you need to bring to bear, including the consideration of armor, shield, etc.

Through my playing and careful observation, I don't seem to be able to find a consistent pattern. It almost seems like a dice-roll sometimes.

Is there a cone-of-fire semi-random dispersion? How specific is the location based damage and does anyone know of a breakdown of this including weapon strength. I don't know much about CS:S code or I would go poking around it to find out.

It just seems that too many times after a firefight I look into the console for damage stats and they make little to no sense. I will see an enemy using the same gun as me doing more damage in much fewer hits, sometimes the other way around, me-to-him. (yes I understand the concept of head-shots, these are body shots).

I also will often encounter a tango in a hallway and I KNOW that we are the only ones there (so no other enemies could be shooting), yet after my death I will see only 1 or 2 of my hits in the console, when I KNOW I saw 4 or 5 hit - Hell, I can sometimes even count the fresh blood marks on different walls and know that the damage stats are wrong. I play on a 3mb line on servers with 20 and 30 ping ( I usually have a ping less than 50, often in the 30's).

I never got into the old CS mainly because of the poor implementation of server connections ( I could just never reliably and consistently get into games). The new CS:S is a TON of fun and looks GREAT. I really enjoy playing it for the most part, but when dying often makes no sense, I find it difficult to rectify how pro clans deal with this on a much higher playing level.

 

[Yellonet]

I certainly can't explain... Headshots are always best... but the body seems to be able to take very much damage... sometimes I shoot someone with 20 bullets in their gut and then POW I get a headshot and die...
Also, it's a bit strange that you can't run when you're being shot, but you can aim perfectly.

 

[MadLog1c]

I certainly can't explain... Headshots are always best... but the body seems to be able to take very much damage... sometimes I shoot someone with 20 bullets in their gut and then POW I get a headshot and die...
Also, it's a bit strange that you can't run when you're being shot, but you can aim perfectly.

You can't aim perfectly while being shot. Your accuracy goes down by like 70%.

 

[CobaltIsLife]

Yeah mate there is a big netcode problem at the moment which really needs to be sorted before anything can be properly analyzed about the game.

I just made a big thread about it if you want to read:

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1093579#post1093579

Its got vids of the hitboxes and the problems they have in relation to the player models.

 

[exodusuk]

just adapt to it i spose

 

[DarKnyt]

just adapt to it i spose

That's what I've had to do, but it greatly diminishes any real feeling of accomplishment if I know that in the final analsysis, if you really want to get down to it - all things being equal between me and the other guy - it was just luck.

If we're both doing the same things and it just turns out that more of my bullets randomly hit him than his hit me, even though we are both aiming dead on - it sorta ruins it. Know what I mean?

Now, I don't know for sure if this is how it works, but I'm getting the impression that it definitely has some random component to it.

 

[House]

There are definate damage differences between weapons and where you shoot a model. Each hitbox is given a specific damage meter. The head being the weakest and the torso being the strongest.

The thing I see most people new to cs complain about is that they fire a barrage of bullets at someone and die before killing them. The fact is you may think you're hitting them but you're not. If you're spraying it's most likely that you are getting maybe 1 bullet in. And yes sometimes it's luck but if you want to be good at this game you need to learn the recoil movements of all the weapons otherwise you're gonna get frustrated.

 

[SpooK-]

MadLog1c is it really suitable to put that in your signature? some people don't know what it does

 

[DarKnyt]

There are definate damage differences between weapons and where you shoot a model. Each hitbox is given a specific damage meter. The head being the weakest and the torso being the strongest.

The thing I see most people new to cs complain about is that they fire a barrage of bullets at someone and die before killing them. The fact is you may think you're hitting them but you're not. If you're spraying it's most likely that you are getting maybe 1 bullet in. And yes sometimes it's luck but if you want to be good at this game you need to learn the recoil movements of all the weapons otherwise you're gonna get frustrated.

Thanks for your reply, but in reading your response, I'm not sure I was entirely clear in my first. I'm not chugging along at full sprint and expecting 100% accuracy while jumping off walls like I'm in Q3 or UT. I understand the concept of hitboxes, location based damage, burst fire, recoil and not just spraying and praying on full auto. I'm talking about carefully observed instances of crouching, and not moving with burst fire.

You also don't mention specific knowledge of the damage model or of the cone of fire concept I've seen mentioned but never really elaborated on. The point of my question is to understand if there is a sort of randomness to the disperion of bullets when you fire. This existed somewhat in Max Payne when you did bullet time.

Now -about 'thinking I'm hitting them but I'm not' - I have definitely observed numerous instances where I can SEE my bullets impacting the player - I can even count the new blood marks on the wall and by looking in the console at damage stats, I KNOW that it isn't registering everything. But that may be a netcode issue.

Your comments are accurate, but don't really address the deeper, code-based question.

 

[bam23]

You can't aim perfectly while being shot. Your accuracy goes down by like 70%.

That's actually not true. Your accuracy is reduced while being shot without armor, as your view bobs with every hit. It's the same as 1.6

You're fine with armor though.

 

[drthunder227]

Distance matters

Distance also counts... a far shot hurts less than a close up one, and if your first 3 shots dont hit on full auto then drop to shooting the feet. Most pople miss shooting WAY above the head where they cant even see the bullets hit. So if you MUST shoot full auto aim at their feet.

 

[Eclipso]

I recomend playing counter strike 1.6 getting the "hang" of it and the weapons,hitboxes,recoil, and damage given/taken and then come back and play source, I think you will answer you own questions that way. Valve is still working on doing what needs to be done to adjust and tweak source so hopefully in due time( hopefully sooner then later) they will get some of these mistakes fixed.

 

[gurra]

When it comes to guns, recoil, damage, movement and combat in general CS:S pretty much sucks. A few things that not so good about this game that have so much potential:

- The crosshair doesn't give you a good idea how good your accuracy is at the moment.
- You can continue firing with good accuracy while being hit.
- You can aim way to good while moving, especially sideways
- You can't move while being hit, you like... freeze?
- You can't run, I mean RUN
- You can't bash with rifles or any other gun for that matter
- You can't lie down
- You can't use bipods on weapons that have them (M249, AWM, SG550)
- The silencer on the colt always seem to be attached from a third person view, even if it's not.

 

[oni_666]

I know this guide does'nt tell you where on the body bullet hits do most damage, but it does tell you what weapons do most damage, and how many shots on target are required for a kill, hope this helps a little.

http://www.cstrike-planet.com/view.php/csinfo/weapons/

 

[jmjneary]

here she is a pic of the model and the damage it takes

 

[DreadLord]

here she is a pic of the model and the damage it takes

from what gun? an AWP will put that man down anywhere. A deagle will take him down in certainly less hits than it says..

 

[jmjneary]

its basic for most asault rifles the most widly used guns in the game

 

[Adamtehgreat]

I don't know if its my ping, but I've noticed that if you die before the bullet you fire hits, it becomes null and just doesn't do damage to them. I have counted multiple instances where I have clicked at them with my deagle, only to be killed before the bullet hits by someone with a faster rate of fire. It kinda annoys me, seeing as I know I havn't missed
Also noticed that certain bipod errors seem to disregard damage. erorrs like arm_bipod (or somethign liek that) in console.
Then again... this could be just a ping issue. I usually get around 50

 

[GiaOmerta]

Adamtehgreat, I've noticed this as well. I honestly think the projectiles go null if you die or drop from the server.

 

[RogueAngel]

One way to tell how many hits and how much damage the shots did is to go to the console when you die using the ~ key(make sure this is enabled in advanced options). It will give a display of damage and hits to you and from you. I so often see:

<Some one I shot's name> 72 damage in 4 hits (or something similar)

Damage from <person who killed me> 177 damage in 1 hit.

<start of rant> I swear I am a freaking bobble-head in that game the number of headshots I have against me. I always go for the body shot and while they are being hit they shoot off one shot and get me in the head. Doesn't the helmet stop a headshot or not? What's the point of buying one if it doesn't. <end of rant>

 

[CookieCuttah]

Well the helmet saves you from shotgun, smg, pistols ((Except deagle)) and famas/galil. Headshots. So it's pretty good actually.