Hl2 MP = Corporate Chess?

H

Hunchback

Guest
First of all, this thread supposes that a HL2 themed MP has been investigated, if not already produced.

So, if we accept this then the question is - where is it? A simple answer could be that it was just discarded along the way in favour of HL2 singleplayer. Personally i don't buy this, not only are Valve perfectionists and never ones to shy away from developmental problems, but it reduces the HL2 package as a whole...

What i reckon is that it has been made and its more or less done. It's been withheld, probably with the hope that its a STEAM only product, thereby forcing all who bought HL2 - especially those who bought it retail through Vivendi - to subscribe to Valve's idea of the gaming future....they win either way...

There are others that know the Vivendi/Valve relationship better than i, but i think i'm right in saying that HL2 was the last contractually required title Valve had to make for them....if this is so, then the first expansion pack - essentially HL2 mp - can be published by others, or probably more preferebly, by Valve themselves....

HL2 will be bought with or without this 'secret mp'. I think the delay in the release is the wrangleling over this issue of mp...perhaps Vivendi will forget the steam / creative copyright problems if they also get the chance to release the first exapnsion pack via retail...

anyway - thoughts?

d

P.S. Watch out for the pcz review...a few minor spoilers in the review....
 
I'm sure we'll find out the answers in that Prima behind the scenes book.

The answer is probably as simple as "they wanted to focus all energy on the single player"

Speaking of which EB games says 25th of October for that? Is that for real?
 
Hmm interesting theory.
I found it hard to believe Valve'd just thrown away MP in favor of a ported mod-from-the-past.
This all sounds ... right, well at least I hope it is.
It also fits with the things the gabeth preached.
Good thinking Joe!
 
Valve's MP game is Team Fortress 2, HL2's MP is CS:S. I'm guessing TF2 will be the first Valve title published by Activision.
 
+ remember we are getting all our info from magazines who obviously reviewed a non retail version,

we shall know when it goes gold and there after if Valve have been playing chess.

the only thing in my mind that would explain such a move, is this 'Suprise' , it could well be something special, saved till the last moment, or it could be a dissapointment..

Valve ? Dissapointment ? , surely the two dont go together.
 
"concentrating on s/p" will probably be there answer...it isnt true though...even D3 had mp....

and also lets clear something up, as its being released HL2 has no MP.

CS : source, 2, and TF2 e.t.c are all set outside the HL2 universe....its the 'package' HL2 that has MP...

also, for MP this does not automatically read DM...if i'd have to guess what the 'real' mp is...it'd be closer to a team DM, with vehicles and striders a plenty....

d

P.s. any news about the court ruling? pcg us score?
 
Doom 3's multiplayer is an absolute steaming pile of brown and green faeces of an ape.

It is the perfect argument for not including mp in a game designed for a sp experience. Though obviously the engine needed a mp component and they had to release something.

I bet Valve went through the same thought process. The game needed to ship with mp something but there's simply not enough people working at Valve to create a MP experience from the ground up that will meet the standard Valve set for themselves IN unison with a single player experience to cause us to blow our loads. To undertake such a task would push back the development back quite a long way.

They have also been working on TF2 for 6 years as well. 6 years of development for a MP only game. Most likely all their "cool" and "original" mp ideas went TF2. BF1942 is predominantly MP that took about 5 years to create. Creating fantastic MP is not as easy as some people seem to think.
 
i know what you're saying.....a thought's just come to me...who's to say TF2 isn't HL2 based...i do remember reading that it's a source game from the ground up...

hmm

d
 
Mr-Fusion said:
Doom 3's multiplayer is an absolute steaming pile of brown and green faeces of an ape.

It is the perfect argument for not including mp in a game designed for a sp experience. Though obviously the engine needed a mp component and they had to release something.
Click to expand...

I agree that the MP portion of Doom 3 was disappointing, however, they laid the groundwork for others to build on. This is more of a disappointment in that when Doom came out, od Doom 2, it was considered an MP game to be honest. Really the first FPS/MP game that really started the genre.

However, the play of doom 3 MP does not lend itself to other mods like CTF or Bombing run, ala UT2003. The enviroment excludes this as being ridiculous. I would really like to see someone brainstorm on a new type of MP game for Doom 3. I think it could be done while still translating the atmosphere of Doom 3.
 
The DM of the original HL had some fantastic mods... but realistically, DM will NEVER be as popular as other team based games such as TF2 and CS:S...

Of course we would all favour a MP component, but from valves perspective they probibly did not have the time to even finish it with the source code theft among other things, I would suspect they put all of their time into the SP aspect..... and good on them if they have, the MP aspect is purely a bonus that would keep me busy for a few hours maybe...

With that said however I would VERY much like a HL2DM in the future...

did anyone play the mod "suprise" for HL1?

damn that was cool
 
Hunchback said:
First of all, this thread supposes that a HL2 themed MP has been investigated, if not already produced.

So, if we accept this then the question is - where is it? A simple answer could be that it was just discarded along the way in favour of HL2 singleplayer. Personally i don't buy this, not only are Valve perfectionists and never ones to shy away from developmental problems, but it reduces the HL2 package as a whole...

What i reckon is that it has been made and its more or less done. It's been withheld, probably with the hope that its a STEAM only product, thereby forcing all who bought HL2 - especially those who bought it retail through Vivendi - to subscribe to Valve's idea of the gaming future....they win either way...

There are others that know the Vivendi/Valve relationship better than i, but i think i'm right in saying that HL2 was the last contractually required title Valve had to make for them....if this is so, then the first expansion pack - essentially HL2 mp - can be published by others, or probably more preferebly, by Valve themselves....

HL2 will be bought with or without this 'secret mp'. I think the delay in the release is the wrangleling over this issue of mp...perhaps Vivendi will forget the steam / creative copyright problems if they also get the chance to release the first exapnsion pack via retail...

anyway - thoughts?

d

P.S. Watch out for the pcz review...a few minor spoilers in the review....
Click to expand...
Valve are contracted for 2 or 3 more titles. Can't remember if they have to be specific for the Half-Life universe. (3xPong please :p)
 
i have great hopes for seeing hl2dm with the release of the game. to me no dm give ppl a reason to complain about hl2, i dont see why valve would miss it out, they did have 6 years to make the game, mp would be a small part of it. and with all the beta testing done for css, the core of hl2 mp would be there already in a bug free form. it would be a let down for me, we dont all love cs
 
mutt said:
i have great hopes for seeing hl2dm with the release of the game. to me no dm give ppl a reason to complain about hl2, i dont see why valve would miss it out, they did have 6 years to make the game, mp would be a small part of it. and with all the beta testing done for css, the core of hl2 mp would be there already in a bug free form. it would be a let down for me, we dont all love cs
Click to expand...
Exactly how I think about it, however taken in consideration that Gabe himself told us there wil be no HL2 mp included when HL2 ships, I dont have any reason to assume it will be in it at the release.
It ofcourse would be a nice surprise and 'some nice joke of valve' but whats the chance of that?
 
Nice post(s) Hunchback.
You could be onto something there, regarding contractual obligations (and the limits thereof).
Whilst its true that VULVA(sp?) are obliged to produce HL3 for vug , that shouldnt preclude them from liscencing the source engine to themselves(sneaky) for other single or multiplayer games.
As long as its in no way related to the Half-Life universe, they should (in theory) have a free hand to produce(and distribute via steam) an unlimited number of add-ons , without breaking their contract with vug.
All very interesting.

EDIT : Although, if the above is true, then TF2 most defininately will not be HL2 themed.
 
perrkele said:
Valve's MP game is Team Fortress 2, HL2's MP is CS:S. I'm guessing TF2 will be the first Valve title published by Activision.
Click to expand...

CS:S is seperate dont even say its related to HL2 it just makes it sound bad. Its basicly the first mod and its not really its the first port. One of the main reasons in them doing CS:S was to show that it doesnt take an awful lot of time to port an old mod you just basicly gotta redo maps and models.
 
Ok, so next you'll be telling me that Quake 4 has no multiplayer?

Why the hell would Valve abandon one of the most original, funny and devastatingly clever multiplayer games ever?

Yes the multiplayer is not gonna ship with HL2, this is obvious from the recent pc zone and gamer reviews which clearly state that there is no option (otherwise they'd be tanning it and half the reviews would have been dedicated to it). However, to leave it out completely would...

A)Be Mightily foolish
B)Cause absolute uproar
C)Just not make any sense whatsoever!?

So, i think you should all hold on to your hats and i'm also wondering if half life source has multiplayer? That'll be awesome enough so stop cryin.
 
methinks the guy writing the prima book is rubbing his hands: "Ooooh cool another chapter, when I thought is was already over.."

SAJ said:
VULVA(sp?)
Click to expand...

wtf? haha
 
SMEGHaMMeR said:
So, i think you should all hold on to your hats and i'm also wondering if half life source has multiplayer? That'll be awesome enough so stop cryin.
Click to expand...

Yea give us more ported mods!!!

Sad, sad, sad...
 
hunteraz said:
HL2 MP = CS:S and mods based on / around it. End of story.
Click to expand...

look, CS:S is standalone you just happen to get it with HL2. Its like the CE getting a T-shirt. its not part of HL2 and as we know so far HL2 has no MP.


SMEGHaMMeR said:
Yes the multiplayer is not gonna ship with HL2, this is obvious from the recent pc zone and gamer reviews which clearly state that there is no option (otherwise they'd be tanning it and half the reviews would have been dedicated to it). However, to leave it out completely would...
Click to expand...

Maybe Valve didnt want the MP put in the review code because they wanted HL2 to be rated on its SP alone because that is the main part of the game after all. Valve dont want HL2 to get a massive score because its got a cool MP, They want HL2 to get a massive score cos its a cool SP game
 
ViolenceJack said:
look, CS:S is standalone you just happen to get it with HL2. Its like the CE getting a T-shirt. its not part of HL2 and as we know so far HL2 has no MP.




Maybe Valve didnt want the MP put in the review code because they wanted HL2 to be rated on its SP alone because that is the main part of the game after all. Valve dont want HL2 to get a massive score because its got a cool MP, They want HL2 to get a massive score cos its a cool SP game
Click to expand...
Already said before but:

There is no options for playing Half-Life 2 online according to some preloaded files.
 
FISKER_Q said:
Already said before but:

There is no options for playing Half-Life 2 online according to some preloaded files.
Click to expand...

The key to this is "preloaded files". Its not the whole game.
 
ViolenceJack said:
The key to this is "preloaded files". Its not the whole game.
Click to expand...

Yeah although these preloaded files are responsible of the UI. Guess you can't have multiplayer without options for it eh?
 
my thing is this: CS:S is not a HL2 multi...it's a HL2 MOD. you would think the MP would be somewhat themed.


of course, i could be wrong, but the reviewers, if they tested at valve, only say what valve wanted. What? no files that admidt HL2MP?...would ruin the surprise, no? We still need HL2 levels...so another pre-load may modify things.
 
Hunchback said:
First of all, this thread supposes that a HL2 themed MP has been investigated, if not already produced.

So, if we accept this then the question is - where is it? A simple answer could be that it was just discarded along the way in favour of HL2 singleplayer. Personally i don't buy this, not only are Valve perfectionists and never ones to shy away from developmental problems, but it reduces the HL2 package as a whole...
Click to expand...

i agree with u that VU and Valve are playing corporate chess and theres certainly alot of evidence around to suggest Valve can/would use the mod community to its advantage.

Clavius said:
Hmm interesting theory.
I found it hard to believe Valve'd just thrown away MP in favor of a ported mod-from-the-past.
Click to expand...

why do u find that hard to believe? wait, don't answer that..i know what u mean... just like u, i was surprised at this move.
i mean why make a HL2 themed MP when u can just as easily convert CS to Source and include it as the MP and make this the strategy in the legal battle vs VU?

plus, as mentioned above with Steam, Valve can easily release an MP component any time and the expansion pack could offer things that HL2 may not have in terms of MP.
 
ViolenceJack said:
look, CS:S is standalone you just happen to get it with HL2. Its like the CE getting a T-shirt. its not part of HL2 and as we know so far HL2 has no MP.
Click to expand...
You can't say that - CS:S isn't standalone. AFAIK you cannot purchase HL2 without CS:S and you can't purchase CS:S alone. We could have a semantic debate about the difference between HL2 MP and HL2 MP component but when it gets down to it MP is just multiplayer not themed SP.

cadaveca said:
my thing is this: CS:S is not a HL2 multi...it's a HL2 MOD. you would think the MP would be somewhat themed.
Click to expand...
The CS IP is Valve's and they've published two retail games with it so calling it a mod is a bit of a misnomer. But yes it is unusual to release a MP component that doesn't have the same theme / universe as the SP.
 
FISKER_Q said:
Yeah although these preloaded files are responsible of the UI. Guess you can't have multiplayer without options for it eh?
Click to expand...

Wasnt there MP on the leak not that that means much. You could open up the MP seperate to the SP its been like that for other games and its the way CS:S is gonner be to HL2 so they could have a HL2MP using a seperate exe. Anyway, i thought the files were encrypted how could you find out solid proof that there isnt MP when you cant actually check the files out.

Still what is this suprise they mentioned. i thought it was ment to come with the reviews but there wasnt really any suprise at all.

Wolf said:
You can't say that - CS:S isn't standalone. AFAIK you cannot purchase HL2 without CS:S and you can't purchase CS:S alone. We could have a semantic debate about the difference between HL2 MP and HL2 MP component but when it gets down to it MP is just multiplayer not themed SP.
Click to expand...

Although you can purchase CS:S without HL2, they said awhile ago that they would sell the ports on there own. I dunno about retail but it will be through steam.

Like i said, getting CS:S with HL2 is like the t-shirt with the CE its not part of the game. Like when people bought there ATI cards and got the voucher for HL2
 
I may be mistaken, but I think that since the Sierra thing, they have decided to NOT offer the current standalone ports individually, but only as additional games included with HL2.

The recent list of offerings is complete AFAIK.
 
Homercidal said:
I may be mistaken, but I think that since the Sierra thing, they have decided to NOT offer the current standalone ports individually, but only as additional games included with HL2.

The recent list of offerings is complete AFAIK.
Click to expand...

The VU lawsuit was filed in 2002 so that statement isnt exactly true but i think that they wouldnt be going retail anyway and they will have it so you can purchase them on there own through steam or you can buy like the silver package to get what you get. At least i dont think that any of the source ports can be claimed by VU as they have no legal connection to them.
 
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