Huge Bug in CS: Source!

[Frost]

When I am able to see any of the floor my FPS is around 50-60, when I move up my view enough so I cannot see the floor anymore my FPS shoots up to 99 FPS, I have V-Sync enabled and max_fps set to 100 so thats the highest it will go. I've attached some screens to show you what I mean.

This is while not looking at the ground. (99 FPS)
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=9851&stc=1

Now I stood still and tilted my view down just enough to see the ground.

This is when I move my view down so I can see the ground. (51 FPS)
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=9852&stc=1

 

[Shuzer]

Your FPS is higher because your graphics card isn't rendering as much in the scene where you're look in the sky. When you look at the ground, it renders more, and down goes the FPS. This happens in any game. How is this a bug?

 

[Frost]

Your FPS is higher because your graphics card isn't rendering as much in the scene where you're look in the sky. When you look at the ground, it renders more, and down goes the FPS. This happens in any game. How is this a bug?

Please go in the game and try it... Did you even view the screenshots... A 50 FPS difference because I tilted my view down 1 inch! I know the more intense the scene and more geometry the card has to draw the bigger the performance hit but this HAS GOT TO BE A BUG!

 

[Shuzer]

Was hard to read that counter, tiny..

Either way, you're right in that it shouldn't make that much a difference for an inch, but it's nothing to write home about. Maybe VALVe wants to give you low FPS.. CONSPIRACY!

 

[Sparta]

its no bug. Its just drawing more normal maps on the ground. At least thats my guess

 

[Shuzer]

its no bug. Its just drawing more normal maps on the ground. At least thats my guess

Somehow, that ground doesn't look normal mapped to me

 

[Frost]

THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THIS IS NOT A BUG! Here is what you need to do, open one screenshot in one window and the other in another window. Maximize them both and then click back and forth between the two images... there is no reason for a 50 FPS performance hit no matter what. THIS DOES NOT happen in Quake 3, CS 1.6, CZ, UT2K4, Doom 3, SOF II I just tested those all.

Sorry about the small screenshot size, the upload limit was 100k so I shrank them from 1280x1024 to about 1024x768

 

[DarkGhost86]

Hmmmmm..... I hope Vavle should fix that FPS BUG...

 

[schaf]

I think it hasd something to do with the dust (no, not the entire map, only the sand thingy swirling around )
Because I recognized that fps hit, too. And tried around a bit. :rolling:

 

[Neutrino]

Can you recreate this situation consistently and in different locations and get the same effect?

If yes, it is a bug, or atleast would seem to be a problem.

If no, then it's just an oddity that doesn't mean anything.

 

[twinviper]

Yeah, I know what you're talking about Frost.

It happens to me too when I have V-Sync enabled. FPS is at 85fps then I tap the mouse and it changes to 42.5fps. My current solution is to just play the damn game with it off even if it means dealing with ripping graphics. I dunno if this is a bug or not, it could just be the way V-Sync works though, i ain't sure.

 

[moondynejoe]

if you have vsync enables then in order to avoid screen tearing (which is the whole point ) then the fps needs to be a multiple or devision of your refresh rate. therefore even if it can show 39fps then it will show 30 for a 60hz refresh rate. at least this is my understanding. so when you are looking at the sky it can draw 60fps because it is mostly sky but then if you move down it may be ablt to sh0w 42 fps but it has to fit into 60 so it shows 30. this is one of the reasons most people turn vsync off. i bet your refresh is at 60hz try turning off vsync and see what happens.

 

[moondynejoe]

i tried to edit my post above but the 15 min expired so i am posting the better version here. Mods feel free to get rid of the above post. sorry

If you have vsync enabled, then in order to avoid screen tearing (which is the whole point ) the computer will ensure the fps is a a multiple or devision of your refresh rate. Therefore even if it can display 39fps then it will only show 30 if you have a 60hz refresh rate. So when you are looking at the sky it can draw 60fps because it is mostly sky but then if you move down it has to generate all those textures and geometry and although it may be able to generate 42 fps it will only show 30 as this is a multiple og 60. this is one of the reasons most people turn vsync off. I am willing to bet that your refresh rate is set at 60hz, try turning off vsync and see what happens.

EDITED: to make more sense (i hope)

 

[Alec_85]

I still want to know if I can turn those dust clouds OFF ;( I am certain that they are responsible for our lousy fps. The game draws them all at the same time which lowers overall performance. And when they clip walls, it's butt-ugly

 

[moondynejoe]

yeah the smoke grenades cause the same thing. but if you go turning all these goodies off then you may as well go back to playing cs 1.6. At least you get 300fps then LOL

 

[BigWalnutZ]

yeah the smoke grenades cause the same thing. but if you go turning all these goodies off then you may as well go back to playing cs 1.6. At least you get 300fps then LOL

i am only using a fx5200 currently and I have no drop from the smoke. it isn't like 1.6....clouds and other textures maybe but not the smoke

 

[pgod]

It's not a bug, Triple Buffering is just missing.

If you enable V-Sync with Double Buffering your fps will be capped at the Hz of your monitor. If you have 100Hz the fps will be stuck at 100.
If your graphics card can't render the scene with 100fps it will jump to 50fps. So if you would get 99 fps without V-Sync, you will get 50fps
with V-Sync enabled.

That's a common problem and the solution is Triple Buffering. I can't explain it in all its technical glory but you will get all the steps between
100 and 50 fps as you would without V-Sync in the given example.

Triple Buffering can't be forced by a graphics card driver in DirectX applications, that's only possible in OpenGL applications. In DirectX the
applications have to call for Triple Buffering.

Currently there is no option available in Source to enable this feature. So the only way to get your fps smooth is via disabling V-Sync, you
have to get used to eventual tearing

 

[Alec_85]

Triple Buffering can't be forced by a graphics card driver in DirectX applications, that's only possible in OpenGL applications. In DirectX the
applications have to call for Triple Buffering.

My CS:S defaults to Triple Buffering in the menu?! I'm not following

yeah the smoke grenades cause the same thing. but if you go turning all these goodies off then you may as well go back to playing cs 1.6. At least you get 300fps then LOL

True but a nade there & a nade there doesn't make much difference fps-wise (well not here). And I find that new smoke/dust twirling around to be generally annoying & I get somewhat distracted by it from time to time. And it makes it harder to spot enemies (duh!) ;(

If it can boost my fps 100% (which I have no doubt. That would mean 20-40 fps more) than I don't care if it looks SIMILAR to 1.6

 

[Shuzer]

My CS:S defaults to Triple Buffering in the menu?! I'm not following

That's trilinear filtering. Not triple buffering.

 

[Ragnarokk]

I'm confused about what exactly vsync does. What is this tearing exactly?

 

[John Romero]

I'm confused about what exactly vsync does. What is this tearing exactly?

vsync makes your framerate match your refresh rate of the monitor. so if you have 60hz set on the monitor your framerate will be 60fps locked except for times where slowdown occurs or the video card just cant cut it. it will be smooth. with vsync off, you sometimes experience tearing...you can see a line in the screen showing where the rays in your monitor are currently drawing a line. you see theres a ray gun shooting photons at the screen in a top to bottom motion and when your refresh rate is higher or lower than your framerate and you dont have it synced then you will be able to see this line at times when your framerate normally drops like when you turn, and sometimes just standing still you can see it. thats called tearing. i cant show you a screenshot cuz its an effect produced by the monitor and not the video card. but have you ever seen when you look at a tv with a camcorder and you see the lines scrolling down it? thats tearing because the refresh rate on a tv is slower than the shutter speed on the camera.

 

[westie]

Does it really make much difference 50frames is still very playable.

 

[Ragnarokk]

Good explanation, I've never actually noticed it, so I'd wager thats why I couldn't tell the difference between vsync on and off.

 

[Alec_85]

That's trilinear filtering. Not triple buffering.

Oh... I'm ashamed :E *tries to pay more attention to details* Now that you mention, I have seen Triple Buffering in the graphics settings on the desktop (you know, right-click).

 

[Ages120]

This isn't a bug. It's called culling in action. When you move your view up its dropping a bunch of polygons from being drawn saving a lot of resources. Also the ground is normal, bump mapped, or whatever tech they used. It's not really noticable since only muzzle flashes make it noticable.

 

[r5a]

LOOOOOOL, FPS bug. rofl.

Shuzer's first reply was exaclty it. IF anything, they have not put in the final tweaks for performance in yet.

 

[Bicka]

*Apoligises for bringing up an older thread*

Chris_D do you fancy emailing Gabe about triple buffering?

I only ask because you do seem to get a reply first and theres no answer to this yet.

Cheers

(anyone else want to give it a shot, have a go, just I've sent 2-3 emails before and never gotten a reply)