If it weren't for the leak, would we have HL2 today?

[The Monkey]

Now almost one year has pasted since the game was originally supposed to be released, and that make one think, if it weren't for the leak, would we have HL2 today?

 

[Roland Deschain]

I doubt it, the leak was mostly demorilizing and might have taken away some time from development (to catch the thiefes and file the police report).

 

[brightgreen]

I'm sick of seeing people call the leak a BETA, ugh

 

[Pauly]

I think we would of had the game September 30th 2004 without the STOLEN build.

 

[The Mullinator]

It probably added a month or two to development time as they probably had to re-write alot of code to make any hacks developed using the stolen version useless with the final game.

 

[Neutrino]

They already stated that the leak was not the major reason for delay. They just didn't have the game nearly as done as they thought they would. Just poor planning and judgement.

 

[The Monkey]

I'm sick of seeing people call the leak a BETA, ugh

I love you too.

 

[PatPwnt]

The game was no where near complete in the leaked BETA. brightgreen why do you care if people call it a BETA?

 

[fez]

the game wasnt finished regardless of the code theft. valve already stated this, the ppl who voted yes are just dumb

 

[Asuka]

No. The game wasnt finished.

 

[geowa]

the leak was about 10 % finished: it didnt have ai or working objects, only the engine was there not the game

 

[Mr. Redundant]

no, Valve said so themselves.

 

[zencat]

the game wasnt finished regardless of the code theft. valve already stated this, the ppl who voted yes are just dumb

exactly

 

[ButtHoleMcGee]

They already stated that the leak was not the major reason for delay. They just didn't have the game nearly as done as they thought they would. Just poor planning and judgement.

Quoted for emphasis.

 

[The Monkey]

Yes, I know that the game's delay was mostly beacouse of the gamne being incomplite. So, the theft may have caused a little piece of delay, right? Otherwise there would have been no reason at all for me to do this tread.

 

[Democritus]

If Vivendi is not lying, Valve might have stalled development to put pressure on them to relinquish certain rights. Seems an odd thing to do, but Valve seems adamant about doing things its way. I suppose it makes sense since Vivendi did not fund any development of HL2.

 

[The Mullinator]

If Vivendi is not lying, Valve might have stalled development to put pressure on them to relinquish certain rights. Seems an odd thing to do, but Valve seems adamant about doing things its way. I suppose it makes sense since Vivendi did not fund any development of HL2.

Vivendi never said that Valve did delay development, they said that Valve threatened to delay back in 2002 I think.

 

[fragShader]

Vivendi never said that Valve did delay development, they said that Valve threatened to delay back in 2002 I think.

nah read the original gamespot article. they complain about a bunch of stuff

including Sierra/VUG's promissory fraud claim based on Valve's false promises that it would continuously develop games to completion; Sierra/VUG's fraud claim and claim for breach of the covenant of good faith and fair dealing based on Valve's concealment of Steam and its strategically delayed development of the Valve games to coincide with the commercial release of Steam; Sierra/VUG's unilateral mistake claim based on its mistaken belief regarding the status of development of the Valve games upon signing the 2001 SPA; Sierra/VUG's breach of contract claim based on Valve's failure to use diligent efforts to continuously develop the Valve games to completion;

ie they misled VUG about how much they had finished already, and they delayed completion until Steam was ready.

 

[TMPer Tantrum]

I think that, without the leak, HL2 would probably be, if not released, then at least Gold by now.

 

[Feath]

I think that, without the leak, HL2 would probably be, if not released, then at least Gold by now.

Indeed, we are that close to the game going gold that it's safe to that even if the leak only added two weeks to the development time, then it would be gold by now.

Whether Vivendi would've released it by now is another argument.

 

[dream431ca]

Talking about what happened in the past is not going to get HL2 released sooner. I just don't like speculation very much. It's pointless to even think about it.

 

[63]

Talking about what happened in the past is not going to get HL2 released sooner. I just don't like speculation very much. It's pointless to even think about it.

Well, it does show Valve and VUG that we as the community actually do care about there little legal games..

 

[[Dragoon]]

The leak had little or no effect on the development. They never would have made Sept. 30, and they probably knew it.

How could the leak have set them back a year in development?

 

[63]

The leak had little or no effect on the development. They never would have made Sept. 30, and they probably knew it.

How could the leak have set them back a year in development?

Emotional Stress. How would you feel if the project you have been working on for years was stolen by some angry dweeb? Furthermore, can you imagine the embarrassment of telling everyone that you would release on Sept 30/03, and in an instant have everyone know just how far behind you were?

 

[Zeus]

No, because Valve used the leak to try and make it sound like it contributed to the delay. It happened to Doom 3 and carmack said "it doesn't really hurt us that much". Typical valve lies

 

[63]

No, because Valve used the leak to try and make it sound like it contributed to the delay. It happened to Doom 3 and carmack said "it doesn't really hurt us that much". Typical valve lies

That's a complete lie. Gabe said that the leak did not affect the development. I don't have a source, but I've heard it many times...

 

[ButtHoleMcGee]

Yeah, all of the employees at Valve must have cried about it, wasting away in their rooms listening to The Cure.

I don't think they sat around and worked slower because of the leak. Valve still had tons of work to do on the game and just had a poor estimation of when HL2 would be done.

 

[Pauly]

I'm sick of seeing people call the leak a BETA, ugh

Its not a leak dude. Its a stolen build of the game. Leak is when someone has a version of the game and puts it out on the net. Like the Doom 3 e3 build was leaked(another company leaked it). Hl2 build was stolen(hacked)

 

[Zeus]

That's a complete lie. Gabe said that the leak did not affect the development. I don't have a source, but I've heard it many times...

Well I also heard that they said it did affect development, I don't have a source, but I've heard it many times.

 

[bam23]

Gabe was interviewed in that edb productions video.

If i remember correctly, he said that they didn't get as much done as they wanted to or thought they would.

 

[Feath]

No, because Valve used the leak to try and make it sound like it contributed to the delay. It happened to Doom 3 and carmack said "it doesn't really hurt us that much". Typical valve lies

What a really ignorant thing to say. The Doom 3 leak was NOTHING compared to the Half-Life 2 stolen build. The Doom 3 leak was a little e3 demo that had little - no content from the final game, the stolen build included (close to) everything that Valve had worked on. And a lot of it wasn't finished.

And, a lot could be seen from the reaction of

Doom 3 fan: "This is not representative of the final game, even if people say that it looks like plastic it's probably just because it's not finished and doesn't work properly on their graphics card".

Half-Life 2 fan: "OMG, The Combine is scripted in Traptown, Valve lied to us, they said that there were no scripted sequences. They are liars and I'll never believe them again".

It's easy to see to see how the stolen build could've affected Valve by using empathy. Imagine if your house was broken into, and several of your . You wouldn't just smile and carry on, it would affect you. Likewise, Valve had something. A lot of people's first experience of the game would've been their unfinished work. And they knew that the final experience was going to be a lot better.

Valve don't deny that there was work to do on Half-Life 2. The long delay was because of BOTH these causes. I don't understand why people try to claim that it must be either the theft or the amount of work, but can't be both for some reason.

 

[[[LuCkY]]]

Now almost one year has pasted since the game was originally supposed to be released, and that make one think, if it weren't for the leak, would we have HL2 today?

No because the leak was a ploy/excuse to delay the game. It was setup.

 

[Brian Damage]

Oh, right, they leaked their valuable source code on purpose.

Sheesh.

 

[Zeus]

What a really ignorant thing to say. The Doom 3 leak was NOTHING compared to the Half-Life 2 stolen build. The Doom 3 leak was a little e3 demo that had little - no content from the final game, the stolen build included (close to) everything that Valve had worked on. And a lot of it wasn't finished.

And, a lot could be seen from the reaction of

Doom 3 fan: "This is not representative of the final game, even if people say that it looks like plastic it's probably just because it's not finished and doesn't work properly on their graphics card".

Half-Life 2 fan: "OMG, The Combine is scripted in Traptown, Valve lied to us, they said that there were no scripted sequences. They are liars and I'll never believe them again".

It's easy to see to see how the stolen build could've affected Valve by using empathy. Imagine if your house was broken into, and several of your . You wouldn't just smile and carry on, it would affect you. Likewise, Valve had something. A lot of people's first experience of the game would've been their unfinished work. And they knew that the final experience was going to be a lot better.

Valve don't deny that there was work to do on Half-Life 2. The long delay was because of BOTH these causes. I don't understand why people try to claim that it must be either the theft or the amount of work, but can't be both for some reason.

Maybe they shouldn't have even shown us the scene if they were so concerned about people finding out the scene was fake. Instead they got their fans hopes up and had them be shot down when valve's scene was revealed to be scripted where the door kicks itself in. HL2 claimed to have AI that could do this sort of thing, yet it was fake, therefore they lied... and yes, I know I'm going to be jumped on by fanboys from the moment I press "Submit reply".

 

[Feath]

Maybe they shouldn't have even shown us the scene if they were so concerned about people finding out the scene was fake. Instead they got their fans hopes up and had them be shot down when valve's scene was revealed to be scripted where the door kicks itself in. HL2 claimed to have AI that could do this sort of thing, yet it was fake, therefore they lied... and yes, I know I'm going to be jumped on by fanboys from the moment I press "Submit reply".

Don't use the really annoying matyr thing. "Oh no, poor me going to get attacked by fanboys". It gets so old and is only used by people who can't back up what they say.

Valve never said that it was unscripted. They didn't say "This door scene is unscripted, isn't that cool?". The E3 demos weren't meant to be played, they were meant to show off what the game was going to be like when you played it. If you are so convinced that they said it wasn't scripted, then please, find a quote.

 

[Zeus]

Don't use the really annoying matyr thing. "Oh no, poor me going to get attacked by fanboys". It gets so old and is only used by people who can't back up what they say.

Valve never said that it was unscripted. They didn't say "This door scene is unscripted, isn't that cool?". The E3 demos weren't meant to be played, they were meant to show off what the game was going to be like when you played it. If you are so convinced that they said it wasn't scripted, then please, find a quote.

Hey, I say that I'm going to get attacked by fanboys because every time I post something bad about their precious little baby valve, they jump down my throat and try anything they can to personally insult me. For example I'm in a thread with a bunch of fanboys telling me "VALVE DOESN"T OWE YOU ANYTHING NOOB" and "OH UR A LITLE WINEY CRYBABEY!!111" because I questioned valve's buisness ethics. I've been on these boards since may of 2003, been waiting for hl2 since god knows when, I think I have the right to say what I think about valve without fanboys attacking every statement I make.

And about the game,we'll see what happens when the game comes out. Let's see if the combines are smart enough to kick in doors without requiring line after line of script. Let's see if striders can impale a man without requiring lots of coding.

 

[ButtHoleMcGee]

Valve don't deny that there was work to do on Half-Life 2. The long delay was because of BOTH these causes. I don't understand why people try to claim that it must be either the theft or the amount of work, but can't be both for some reason.

I just don't think that the leak truly created this long delay. Yes, the leak contributed to minor game changes and security changes, but the fact of the matter is that the game just wasn't finished.

Gabe Newell himself states this in the e3 2004 OdB interview.
Link to video interview.

 

[Feath]

I just don't think that the leak truly created this long delay. Yes, the leak contributed to minor game changes and security changes, but the fact of the matter is that the game just wasn't finished.

Gabe Newell himself states this in the e3 2004 OdB interview.
Link to video interview.

Well, Mr "I don't read what you wrote but I'll reply anyway" what I'm saying is that the game wasn't finished AND the Source code leak happened.

 

[fragShader]

And about the game,we'll see what happens when the game comes out. Let's see if the combines are smart enough to kick in doors without requiring line after line of script. Let's see if striders can impale a man without requiring lots of coding.

um, striders and combines can't do jack sh.t without lines of code. they are game characters and code is what makes them do stuff.

i think the issue you are concerned about is wether ata certain spot in the game they do the same thing all the time, or if they give a convincing illusion of autonomy. either way it's all lines of code...

EDIT: rude words

 

[Feath]

[snip]

And about the game,we'll see what happens when the game comes out. Let's see if the combines are smart enough to kick in doors without requiring line after line of script. Let's see if striders can impale a man without requiring lots of coding.

Of course the AI isn't going to be able to do anything like that without Valve coding it? That's was AI is. It's not real, it's programmed. Whether or not these things only occur because map makers tell them to, the point is, Valve did not say that the E3 2003 demos didn't contain any scripted elements.

I don't understand the hostility some people have against scripted. What's bad about it if it creates a good gaming experience? People seem to attack it as if it's the worst thing a game could have.