If the Universe is infinite, then we have a problem

[dream431ca]

So I was reading a book called "The Hidden Reality" and it describes parallel universes and other similar topics using string theory and such (but in plain English) and one part of the book blew me away and I thought I might share it with you all since I found it so amazing.

The book tackles the question: "What would the universe be like if it was infinite?" No one knows how big the Universe actually is but if it was infinite some very strange things occur. Now there are only a certain amount of particles in the universe that can be assembled in various ways, but that also has a limit. Lets pretend that a universe of only 10 Lego blocks existed. You could only arrange those 10 Lego blocks in so many arrangements before repeating the arrangements because you have run out of ways to assemble them. The same is true with atoms and particles. They can be assembled in a unbelievably huge amount of ways but there is a limit.

This presents a problem if the Universe is infinite. The atoms would be assembled in all the arrangements they can possibly be arranged but then you run of ways to arrange them so you start to repeat arrangements. That means, if the universe is Infinite, there is an infinite number of Earth's and an Infinite number of "You's". If you were to travel far enough you would eventually find a planet that looks exactly like earth, that has the exact same population and actually find yourself. What's more is the other you might look a like but you would be someone totally different. You might be a rock star, a scientist, a serial killer etc... But because the Universe is Infinite, you could keep on going and find another "you". What's even more remarkable is scientists theoretically know how many different ways you can assemble matter and thus they know how far you have to travel before you find your other self.

I was blown away by this and I thought I might share it. Please comment if you wish.

 

[Krynn72]

Why is that a problem?

 

[Kitfox]

And then if you kill all the other yous, you become the one.

 

[dream431ca]

Why is that a problem?

Paradoxes are not liked in science, that's why it could be considered a problem. But I do find this very interesting.

 

[dream431ca]

And then if you kill all the other yous, you become the one.

It would be impossible to do that in an infinite universe because there would be an infinite number of yous. Sorry for double post.

 

[Kitfox]

5char

 

[Stigmata]

Well that certainly explains deja vu.

 

[ríomhaire]

You can't run out of arrangements in there is an infinite number of things to arrange. Also, there probably isn't an infinite amount of matter in the universe.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

there probably isn't an infinite amount of matter in the universe.

And even if it's possible that there's another you, this is why that's certainly not a guarantee.

 

[Mr. Djees]

You can't run out of arrangements in there is an infinite number of things to arrange. Also, there probably isn't an infinite amount of matter in the universe.

OP forgot something, in the book the author is talking about an infinite universe with an infinite number of cosmological horizons with a finite size and a finite amount of matter, which is why you would eventually run out of ways to arrange it. Looks like he is talking about a Level 1 multiverse

 

[DEATH eVADER]

Paradoxes are not liked in science, that's why it could be considered a problem. But I do find this very interesting.

I wouldn't really count it as a paradox as both Person A and B are independent bodies and does not require symbiosis to live, unless both bodies are quantum entangled. One dies the other dies.

 

[Viperidae]

infinite parallel universes

"What would the universe be like if it was infinite?"

Pick one.

#2 is the plot of the Myst series.

But we know it's not infinite. /WELP THAT WAS A FUN THREAD

 

[KiplingsCat]

This stuff doesn't come up on my Cosmology exam. So I try not to invest more than a fleeting moment's thought in it. To be honest, in the unlikely event of KiplingsCat = infinity being true, I don't think it would overly bother me. They'd all by necessity be really far away.

 

[Stylo]

#2 is the plot of the Myst series.

Man, the original Myst was mega.

 

[The Monkey]

I don't understand the whole infinite universe thing. Didn't all matter and energy emerge from the "point" of the big bang? If so, how could anything be further than 13 billion light years (time passed since Big Bang) away from that point? Shouldn't the diameter of the universe be 26 billion light years, accordingly?

 

[ríomhaire]

Monkey I'm not that familiar with cosmology stuff but I think that actually depends on the shape of the universe. As far as I know there is no proof that the universe is actually flat and if the universe isn't flat then I don't think the idea of 2*time since big bang = diameter thing would hold true.

 

[bobtheskull]

Doesn't need to be flat. The same radius/diameter would apply to a sphere.... as and explosion should technically travel in all 3 dimensions equally in a frictionless environment with no obstacles, but then again, would that original explosion have operated in the laws of physics as we know them? Who says the laws didn't change after the explosion?

Damn.... nosebleed......

 

[bobtheskull]

And, that also assumes that there was nothing travelling at faster than the speed of light

 

[Stigmata]

And it also depends on whether or not microwave background radiation is the energy input of the meta-universe which surrounds the black hole that is our universe.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

UGH! The universe is not infinite! It's not a big truck! It's a series of tubes!

Trust me I know what I'm talking about I know cosmetology

 

[KiplingsCat]

Doesn't need to be flat.

"Flat" in this context doesn't really mean flat like a page...flat has all kinds of crazy meanings to cosmologists. The universe could be spherical or elephant shaped and still be "flat". But beyond that I'm just as confused as anybody.

 

[bobtheskull]

I dunno, but I favour the idea of our universe being spherical, and being an particle in another universe, which in turn is a particle in another universe.... and so on

 

[Stylo]

I think the universe is kinda like an asymmetrical pie that keeps expanding into like... an infinite kitchen.

 

[ríomhaire]

I dunno, but I favour the idea of our universe being spherical, and being an particle in another universe, which in turn is a particle in another universe.... and so on

Sorry yeah, I should have clarified (though I don't know the details myself) but the universe being "flat" in this case has nothing to do with it actually being a sphere or a disc in the usual way you're thinking of. It's to do with the geometry of space. For instance the angles of a triangle in flat space have to add up to 180 degrees. In curved space it can be more or less than this.

 

[Viperidae]

as and explosion should technically travel in all 3 dimensions equally in a frictionless environment with no obstacles

Except the distribution of galaxies clearly shows this wasn't the case. Matter and energy was not distributed uniformly, causing galaxies to form unevenly.

IIRC from Hawkings' work, its shape is not what we would classically call a sphere.

 

[Destructo-Bot]

The universe is infinite in that it has no reachable boundary. The fabric of the universe itself is expanding faster than light can travel, so you could never reach the "edge" of space because it is always moving away faster than a material object can travel. There are a finite number of particles in a boundless universe, and while it is supposedly possible for a duplicate you to exist, it's bloody unlikely.

 

[tomemozok]

If there are infinite numbers of you,it will make a hell of a deathmatch round on unreal

 

[Xevrex]

I'd posit that considering there is likely to be a finite amount of types of elements in space, since higher and higher energies are required to force more and more protons/neutrons/electrons together into a single atom, there would be a finite amount of permutations. The only way there would be infinite permutations would be if there would be infinite amounts of energy to create new elements with more orbitals and more places for electrons to go and bonds to form. Unless energy is constantly spilling in from, say, another universe (so the universe isn't a closed system with a finite amount of potential energy), there should not be anywhere in the universe with infinite streams of energy. So I'm guessing that, if the universe is infinite in that it repeats arrangements, then yes there would be another "you" out there, another Earth, theoretically an infinite amount of Earths and yous.

Correct me if I'm wrong because I'm only going based off of current knowledge

 

[Maestro]

I believe Douglas Adams addresses these issues quite handily in the second or third Hitchhikers' Guide. Specifically, some planet has erosion that perfectly forms giant casinos that make our Vegas monstrosities look like toys.

 

[Bad^Hat]

The universe isn't infinite as that is a sub-optimal business model for spacetime content delivery. Sooner or later it will stop expanding and we'll have to buy the DLC.

 

[YROC]

Trust me I know what I'm talking about I know cosmetology

I lold

 

[Bad^Hat]

I could tell you a thing or two about cosmets.

 

[Gargantou]

Cosmetology.

 

[xcellerate]

I believe Douglas Adams addresses these issues quite handily in the second or third Hitchhikers' Guide. Specifically, some planet has erosion that perfectly forms giant casinos that make our Vegas monstrosities look like toys.

I'm surprised to only see this mentioned once. Whenever I hear people mention an infinite universe this is exactly what I think back to, then I'm jealous of my iteration that's a billionaire.