Lots Of Leaked PS3 Goodness! Get Them While You Can! *56K*

[Kschreck]

NOTE: This is not illegal content. Well at least it's on GameSpot, IGN, GameFaqs and every other forum and no one has complained there. Anyways I figured might as well post them here as well.

Here are some pictures of some games from Sony's press conference at GDC:


Ratchet And Clink Images:

I-8 Now Renamed As Resistance:

Motorstorm:

F1/Interface:

Warhawk:

The Getaway:

---Non Games---


Vehicle Dynamics:

HS/Havok Ragdolls:

More F1 Interface?

Some of the symbols look a little strange..telephone and camcorder (?) symbols under some names? Voice/video chat, I guess?


Other Stuff:

New PS3 Controller?


More Information:


That's all the game/demo shots, but there are more slides and stuff here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/sgda/1...in/photostream/

Found from this blog:

http://www.wonderlandblog.com/wonde...hil_harris.html

It also has a transcript-ish summary of the conference.


Here is the main link where I found all of this stuff. More stuff might be added to this link sometime:


http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=92000


This is the realtime stuff. All of it looks like it could be done on the 360 and none of it looks as good as the original E3 videos. Guess I should have guessed that being Sony. Still some of it looks ok. Ratchet And Clink PS3 looks pretty good but the rest of the stuff so far doesn't impress me. Guess I will have to wait and see more of this stuff and better quality versions to see if the PS3 will offer any better visuals over the 360. So far it has just been hype. What are your thoughts on this stuff?

 

[Llama]

in b4 lock

Happy bannage

 

[Kschreck]

Why would I be banned? It's on GameSpot and GameFaqs and has been there for several days.


http://www.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=24469100&page=0


If a corporate site isn't shutting it down then why should this post be considered bad?


EDIT: Also on IGN and GAF. If this post gets modded then thats pretty darn lame.

 

[Llama]

I dunno? Maybe it wasnt leaked at all?

Either way, anything 'leaked' = bad.

 

[Kschreck]

Nah it's not illegal. It's now on Joystick


http://www.joystiq.com/2006/03/25/motorstorm-resistance-and-more-pictures-from-sonys-gdc-keynot/


Also on Flikr and even here:


http://ps3.qj.net/


Absolutely no reason for locking this thread. I try and do something nice for you guys and share information thats you guys may not have seen and I just get told that my topic is going to be locked. Not very friendly.

 

[Asuka]

Just like the 360 it will take time in makeing the best looking games. Look at the stuff PS2 is doing now?

 

[Llama]

Nah it's not illegal. It's now on Joystick


http://www.joystiq.com/2006/03/25/motorstorm-resistance-and-more-pictures-from-sonys-gdc-keynot/


Also on Flikr and even here:


http://ps3.qj.net/


Absolutely no reason for locking this thread. I try and do something nice for you guys and share information thats you guys may not have seen and I just get told that my topic is going to be locked. Not very friendly.

Dude, leaked material isnt legal. If it is legal then it isnt leaked. Yeah okay I was wrong, but chill.

 

[MiccyNarc]

Llama, STFU.

Looks beatiful. Thanks for the head's up dude.

 

[WhiteZero]

It's on GameSpot, so it's not illegal.
Get over it Llama.

 

[CyberPitz]

Llama, the new wannabe mod.

Looks great, Can't wait to see some real final products..like a PS3 in my hands.

 

[Llama]

Yeah okay, sorry

 

[Icarusintel]

Honestly, neither the X360 or PS3 has impressed me much technology-wise. I tend to prefer some of the Sony developers though, so I'll end up getting a PS3 for the new Metal Gear Solid, Devil May Cry, Final Fantasy, etc.

 

[^Ben]

OH WOW LOOK AT THAT, THAT LIKE BLOWS ANYTHING THE 360 CAN DO!!!!! ZOMG!!!! REMEMBER GUYS KEN SAID PS3 WAS LIKE 800000* MORE POWERFULL THAN THE X3SHITTY LAWL!!!

/sarcasm

 

[Gorgon]

the graphics is excellent. I still need to see these games running on ps3.

 

[Dalamari]

Do they have a workin PS3 yet? or are they still running all of this off a computer

 

[weskerQ8]

i believe in sony, wooo , sony till nov.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

R&C looks nice, eveything else..... Meh.

 

[armanguy]

saweeet!

 

[VictimOfScience]

Um, guys? Loke already posted these in the current PS3 tech demo thread. Try reading even just a tiny bit before posting old news. The thread's been near the top of the list for the last week! How could you miss it???

Everyone move along now....

 

[VirusType2]

I try and do something nice for you guys and share information thats you guys may not have seen and I just get told that my topic is going to be locked. Not very friendly.

There was already a link to the HD video (83.4MB) of all of this that Victim of Science posted, so I have seen it.

It is at least as impressive as 360 trailers and videos and gameplay.

That dirt racing game with the motorcycle and Killzone2 look awesome.

Impressive, untill you consider the fact that very rarely in all of that 83.4 MB of video is there any actual gameplay.


It is all some kind of pre-rendered or real-time cut scenes or just plain CGI video.

I can play the hottest Computer graphics Hollywood can muster - on my home DVD player.

I think they actually showed gameplay footage from Warhawk, beyond that I don't recall any of these games actually being played.

Take GT 5 for example; They never show anyone playing it, its all replays. Now we all know the replays always look great. The view from behind the car while you drive? Nothing different from GT 4 except a higher resolution and some shiner cars.

Forza Motorsport for the 360 had many people saying that this game is the same as the Xbox version with higher resolution - calling the 360 an Xbox 1.5,
despite everyone who played the game saying that the game was fantastic and was definately not possible on an Xbox becuase the game featured so much more than just 3x the resolution of the Xbox counterpart.


So now can all the 360 fanboys officially call the PS3 a PS 2.5 becuase their car racing game is the same game in a higher resolution? Like ? I bet they haven't touched the AI - still. basically 10 year old car AI. Get ready for lots of this from what I've heard about the Cell - its either great visuals or great AI - not both.


Very well. I look forward to the day they finally release this great machine so I can hurry up and not buy one. That way we can really compare these two monster machines on a level playing ground instead of comparing trailers and tech demos.



I think if Sony does the smart thing though, and thats to keep letting videos "leak" so they can show off everything but gameplay for as long as they can.



Also, I've heard that game development is WAY behind schedule though for the PS3, so I won't hold my breath. Shame becuase by the time the price comes down enough and I can afford a PS3, Microsoft will cut their throat by droping the price so low you would be a fool to pay 3x the price for basically the same thing on a shiner blu ray disc.


I think Merill Lynch was saying that the new coating on the discs fixes the problem of disc scratching - which is great news, but they have recalculated the price of all the hardware, and without a hard drive, the PS3 it was about $800 in parts thanks mostly to this blu ray drive and cell processor.


Please correct me if I'm off on anything here as I usually am when it comes to this stuff, there is only so much I'm willing to read about a machine that is way out of my price range for a console. Even the 360 is too expensive for my blood.

I have Lamborgini taste in cars, with a Honda budget.


Besides you should know I'm interested in top of the line PC here. Im interested in Mods and modding, programing, photo/video editing and all the hundreds of other tasks that a PC can do that a console can't.


After the PS3 and Revolution have their spot in the limelight upon their release, PC hardware is going to be right there with all of these systems - if not better.


I'm just mad becuase I'm ****ing broke bitch! If I was really rich I'd just buy everything. \0/ wooo0000!


EDIT: here is a link that is interesting for next gen game fans
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060326/ENT/603250309/1005

 

[Cole]

Get ready for lots of this from what I've heard about the Cell - its either great visuals or great AI - not both.

Now, the graphics are still handled GPU. AI is handled CPU. See where im going? There two seperate things.
Now both the 360 and Ps3 are geared toward graphics not AI. Really the Ps3 and 360 processors are completely different but in the end it's like this.
360 and it's processor with 3 cores all sharing the same cache and can be used like a dual core processor today. If a program wants it can have 1 core do one thing and the other do a different thing.

Cell works like this. You have on main processor with it's own cache. You have 7 SPE's. Each SPE has a very small amount of cache so the costs arn't outrageous to make. Now to get past this, they rely heavily on streaming. So the SPE's have alot of bandwidth between them to stream information. This would allow you to put the main processor on the most intensive calculations like if your going over the top in AI. Sound, Physics, and etc can all be handled by a different SPE.
SPE's are most optimized in Float Point Processing(Decimals) making them deadly for calculating physics.

They work entirely different, and Cell when used effective and properly you can get much more out of it than the 360 processor. As an article has put it "The 360 and Ps3 can pull off the same effects, but the Ps3 will just be able to pull off more of them at the same time."

I think Merill Lynch was saying that the new coating on the discs fixes the problem of disc scratching - which is great news, but they have recalculated the price of all the hardware, and without a hard drive, the PS3 it was about $800 in parts thanks mostly to this blu ray drive and cell processor.

Yeah so wtf is your point? Xbox 360 costs about $725 to make. Sony can take a loss at selling them at the price of a 360. Really it aint that hard. Add in the HD and plus a blu ray player and you got yourself quite a bargain. They make tons of money off of the licensing fee's for games. Microsoft lost a ton with the orignal xbox.

Besides you should know I'm interested in top of the line PC here. Im interested in Mods and modding, programing, photo/video editing and all the hundreds of other tasks that a PC can do that a console can't.

With ya completely here!

After the PS3 and Revolution have their spot in the limelight upon their release, PC hardware is going to be right there with all of these systems - if not better.

Yeah but Revolution gots that nice controller thats actually something new...very new and hopefully will be able to pull off some very nice games to go with it.

 

[VirusType2]

Yeah so wtf is your point? Xbox 360 costs about $725 to make. Sony can take a loss at selling them at the price of a 360. Really it aint that hard. Add in the HD and plus a blu ray player and you got yourself quite a bargain. They make tons of money off of the licensing fee's for games. Microsoft lost a ton with the orignal xbox.

WTF WTF WTF??!?!!!

relax Minerel. Whats with all the hostility from some of you guys lately?

Im such a nice guy. :stare:

I make a very compelling argument with a dozen great points and you focus on one point and say
"what the ****" to me like I am way off here.

Lets be open minded about these machines instead of defending them like Im talking about your mother.

Besides, I clearly stated at the end to correct me if Im wrong becuase Im not reading up on the latest news.

Early estimates had the 360 at like $225 cheaper

manufacturing estimates were just that - estimates, and everyone has a different estimate. So is there no point in this discusion at all? I guess as you can find one website saying one thing and other saying the other. I think it's pretty clear that the 360 is much cheaper to make.
http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1497&Itemid=2
at the bottom of the page the price difference has the manufacturing cost of the 360 at $155 less. Thats with no hard drive for the PS3 so say a proper hard drive costs them $15

So you want to tell me $170 or so is nothing to make a point about?

So if the 360 was $1 and the PS3 was $170 which one would you buy? Both ok bad example.

If the 360 was $99 and the PS3 was $269 and both have many great games and pretty much equal performance. Which one are you buying?

But the thing is, they aren't 170 and 269 dollars, the 360 is already a really high price, why pay another $100-$150 more for a Blu Ray movie player that is stuck in their console? If I would buy one, it would be after the prices settle down and the thing is cheap as balls. I can see the HD-DVD players for $99 in about 7 years at Wal mart. ( look at the price of DVD recorders. When they came out they were $999. now they are $99. ) But Sony is a total rip-off on everything they sell, they have been relying on their name for like 20 years, instead of making the best products like they used too, they make good products and price them like they are the best.. and the blu ray is always going to be expensive.


I mean there is no way I'd dive into a new DVD type format the day it's released when movies will be very few and more expensive. And isn't that the point of getting this new blu disc type format? Or is it really the damn games? Yes I though so.

I just hate the direction Sony takes with its machines.

The PS1 was great. It used the cheap and popular CD ROM.

It was a game machine that - like all CD roms, could play Audio CD's.


Since the advent of the PS2 and PS3 they want their playstation to be my moviestation, and Im just not interested. It's unfortunate that I will miss out on their first party games becuase they want to sell me things I don't need. When I buy a shirt at the store I don't want to pay twice as much becuase it comes with an answering machine. I don't want an answering machine. Its a shame becuase I like that shirt. ****ers. lOL


Why everytime they release a new machine the price has to double? PS4 will cost $1600 at this rate. Stop adding more crap than the machine is worth is what I say.

Feel free to disagree.

Microsoft lost a ton with the orignal xbox.

Microsoft intends to break even on the Xbox 360 within the first year or two of the console’s 6-7 year life cycle. In contrast with the first Xbox, which was manufactured using off-the-shelf components from Nvidia and Intel, Microsoft owns the intellectual property inside the Xbox 360 console.

This gives the software giant greater control over price, since it can shop around for chip manufacturers and reduce costs as technology advances.

The Blu Ray player advantage of the PS3? Do you want to be paying extra for Blu Ray format discs?

I can just see those movies for sale now, at least $10 more. like $20 dollars for a DVD wasn't enough money? Lets pay $34 for a blu ray movie ****it. Pay 50%-100% more for movies that you can get on HD DVD. No way. thanks, ill stick to DVD or HD DVD.

Anyway I see this machine as most likely doing really well late into the game when prices are way down they will be in many households like the PS2 is, especially since it does offer much more room on the disc.

Consoles kill PC gaming:
Sony would love to kill PC gaming, run predominantly by MS windows. Thats all good for them since they only have a few games on PC that they can just make for their Playstations. Im not happy about that I'll admit. At least the 360 is said to be easy to create games for both platforms, so thats another reason I'd rather own one that isn't hurting PC gaming.

Let me ask you this since you seem to know the most about PS3. Know anything about blu ray movies being available to rent?

Yeah but Revolution gots that nice controller thats actually something new...very new and hopefully will be able to pull off some very nice games to go with it.

Yea. This machine might turn out really well, as long as they really can keep their price down and come out with great NEW software. Hopefully they get more 3rd party support this time

 

[OCybrManO]

blah blah blah

1) Paragraphs are your friends. Do not fear them.

2) Get to the point.

Seriously, I'm running in 1600x1200 with the window taking up most of my screen and it still took you about half of the page just to get through your rant about the price (faulty logic and all). I have to go into Full Screen mode just to fit the whole post on one screen... and, even then, it's a tight fit. That's not the real issue. If it had been either a well-written and informative post or an isolated incident I wouldn't say anything. Your posts have been annoying me for those same reasons as long as I can remember. If you're drunk, wait until you can think straight before posting. If you're sober, take some writing classes.

 

[VirusType2]

1) Paragraphs are your friends. Do not fear them.

2) Get to the point.

Seriously, I'm running in 1600x1200 with the window taking up most of my screen and it still took you about half of the page just to get through your rant about the price (faulty logic and all). I have to go into Full Screen mode just to fit the whole post on one screen... and, even then, it's a tight fit. That's not the real issue. If it had been either a well-written and informative post or an isolated incident I wouldn't say anything. Your posts have been annoying me for those same reasons as long as I can remember. If you're drunk, wait until you can think straight before posting. If you're sober, take some writing classes.

Are you a teacher? Because If you are a teacher, you fail. So stop trying to teach me. I'd probably just take half a page to describe how I would get my revenge on you, (psychopath and all)

I'm not drunk. I've got ADD, Bipolar with psychotic episodes, OCD, and I dropped out of school. I also stay up for 48 -63 hours and sleep for 13-16. Not by choice, and I don't exactly operate at peak performance after staying up for several days. Have you tried this?

But you know what hurt my education worse is that I skipped school once or twice a week since I was in 2nd grade - old enough to take the bus and "miss it". This continued until 12th grade when I failed for the first time for missing too many days.

I missed about 45 days of school every year since 2nd grade ( we have like 200 days of class per year), and also I almost never did homework and rarely did classwork. Teacher hands out test, I don't even write my name on it.

I had no idea what any of the answers were since I didn't do any of the previous work. I would aim for a .0% average in some classes, just to show how much I cared. I would get lucky on the final exam (or it was easy) or I would do summer school or night school, which was always easier. I sure as hell didn't mind taking one summer school class over doing the whole year again.

Anyway, I think I am actually a really good writer, in fact I have had many people compliment me on my writing skill - not bad for someone with a 0% grade average the entire year. If my syntax is just unbearable than why would you even bother to read it? God forbid I put a spaces where I think it makes things more clear.

Let me ask you this. Why do you say I have faulty logic but offer no reason? Not smart enough to read or not smart enough to say how my points aren't on point, or not smart enough to maximize your browser to a full window while wondering why the text doesn't fit on the screen? Smart guy!

Or maybe, now here is what I think; you are the biggest playstation fan-boy and you start getting real uptight anytime anyone with less education "schools you"


You need me, because you are an idiot that would pay $500-$600 for a PS3 and pre-order it from Japan because its discs can hold more information - which isn't even a significant factor since you should know that running in higher resolutions like 1600x1200 don't actually use any more disc space than a normal DVD! It is only pre-recorded video footage that this type of disc space comes into play. And well if you want to watch pre-recorded video footage than the PS3 is the perfect machine for that, since thats all it has shown so far!

Ignore the fact that the machine has a reputation of melting. Sure I'm going to pay that much for a machine to play the same movies that weren't worth a movie ticket. Forget that there are 1000's of movies available on DVD. When you decide to buy a new movie for the Blu Ray I want you to feel left out that your section is very tiny. Also, please forget that you don't even own a HDTV.

Finally if you don't want to read it what I write, then either click my tag and ignore it, or STFU, because you have annoyed me in the past as well but I never said what I really think about you, or tried to insult you, until you felt compelled to tell me that I write like an illiterate.

 

[JNightshade]

Well, you know, I was going to post my take on the images, but it seems that Cybr and Virus have filled the page with bickering

 

[OCybrManO]

Well, you know, I was going to post my take on the images, but it seems that Cybr and Virus have filled the page with bickering

I beg to differ. I only made one relatively short post. This will be my contribution to the bickering...

...

First, I want to address one point. Yes, I'm a Sony fanboy. That's why the last Sony product I owned was the original Playstation. I only have a PS2 because Kamikazie left his at my house. It is currently propping up my router.

If you want me to point out the obviously flawed logic in your two-part price rant... here goes:

* You start by quoting an arbitrary third-party estimate of the PS3's cost and speaking as if it will retail for that same price, or more. Well, either that or Microsoft is going to cut the 360 down to Revolution prices... according to your "3x the price" statement. Even if they cut the Premium 360 to $300 the PS3 would need to retail for $900 (higher than even the parts estimate you quoted) to make that true. You end by asking for people to correct your mistakes.

* Someone points out that Sony and Microsoft both sold their previous consoles for a loss and that Microsoft is doing the same with the 360... meaning that no one but Sony knows how low Sony is willing to go. This person also has a similar cost estimate for the Xbox 360.

* You then proceed to get angry about someone correcting a mistake and switch to dismissing the same kind of estimate upon which you based your original argument... and try to use bad math (varying the prices to throw the proportion out of balance) to make the possible price difference look worse than it might be. Also, in the same post, you mock Sony's choice of using DVDs in the PS2 because DVDs can be used to play movies (and they just happen to have several times the data storage)... while ignoring Microsoft's choice to do the exact same thing.

Must I go on? I think not. Now, back to the attempted insults at me and the self-victimization you use to rationalize your mistakes. "Have you tried this?" Yes, I have. You skipped school? So did I. You didn't do your classwork? Neither did I. You failed classes? Yep, same here. You have a form of depression? I was depressed for two or three years straight. Seriously, enough with the excuses.

You need me, because you are an idiot that would pay $500-$600 for a PS3 and pre-order it from Japan because its discs can hold more information - which isn't even a significant factor since you should know that running in higher resolutions like 1600x1200 don't actually use any more disc space than a normal DVD! It is only pre-recorded video footage that this type of disc space comes into play. And well if you want to watch pre-recorded video footage than the PS3 is the perfect machine for that, since thats all it has shown so far!

You must be the idiot if you think the game art is going to take up the same space on games designed to run at 640x480 on TVs through crappy composite cables as it will on a system intended to run games designed for 1920x1080 through HDMI cables. The higher the pixel detail of the screen the more the flaws will show through... requiring textures several times larger than before... unless you like muddy textures. Over the next few years more and more games will outgrow a single DVD. People said the same shit when DVDs were first introduced and now something like 95% of all PS2 games are on DVDs instead of CDs. Yeah, games won't get bigger... that's why I still buy all of my games on floppy disks.

Ignore the fact that the machine has a reputation of melting. Sure I'm going to pay that much for a machine to play the same movies that weren't worth a movie ticket. Forget that there are 1000's of movies available on DVD. When you decide to buy a new movie for the Blu Ray I want you to feel left out that your section is very tiny. Also, please forget that you don't even own a HDTV.

Which machine has a reputation of melting? The one that isn't even out yet or the one that currently doubles as a $400 space heater? The only melting I've heard of has been from the 360. Have the PS3s been doing it, too? Also, in case you didn't catch it the last few times I discussed it on these forums... I do own an HDTV... a 51" HDTV, in fact. Luckily, I already have a DVD player. So, I don't have to worry about not being able to play DVDs. Phew. I really dodged a bullet. Actually, even if I didn't have a DVD player already I doubt the PS3 would be unable to play DVDs... since it is supposed to be able to read DVDs even though the PS3 games will all be on Blu-Ray, IIRC. So, if I buy a PS3 (in case you have forgotten, I've only ever said I might buy one as a second console if I have the money) I'll be able to play both DVD and Blu-Ray movies. Wouldn't that make my "section" larger than yours?

 

[VictimOfScience]

This thread has its origins in redundancy anyway, so if others can fill it up with fruitless arguing, more power to them. Its best to keep that sort of thing confined...

That said, its really going to come down to the selection of games in the new generation. I won't buy a console for higher graphical fidelity alone. Its a matter of do they have the new games I want to play and if they look better, its a win-win situation.

The Cell architecture is so damn interesting that I really hope there are some ambitious programmers out there that can use it to its fullest potential but I think that'll take a while to come to. That was Sony's mistake this generation: not letting developers have full access to so much proprietary system information and documentation. Most of the games that really wowed us on that platform were developed by first-party participants for a reason. Sony has realized that to succeed in this new generation they cannot repeat this behavior and are clearly making it known that from the get-go they are providing everything that they can for every developer that wants to work on the new platform and I think its really going to pay off.

MS and the XNA environment, on the other hand, have made it much easier to get programs up and running on the 360 and the PC simultaneously, so it will be interesting to see what platform is preferred by what developers.

 

[Cole]

But the thing is, they aren't 170 and 269 dollars, the 360 is already a really high price, why pay another $100-$150 more for a Blu Ray movie player that is stuck in their console? If I would buy one, it would be after the prices settle down and the thing is cheap as balls. I can see the HD-DVD players for $99 in about 7 years at Wal mart. ( look at the price of DVD recorders. When they came out they were $999. now they are $99. ) But Sony is a total rip-off on everything they sell, they have been relying on their name for like 20 years, instead of making the best products like they used too, they make good products and price them like they are the best.. and the blu ray is always going to be expensive.


I mean there is no way I'd dive into a new DVD type format the day it's released when movies will be very few and more expensive. And isn't that the point of getting this new blu disc type format? Or is it really the damn games? Yes I though so.

Sony care about both Blu-Ray and the Games as there children or else Blu-Ray would be scrapped in a heart beat. They want to push Blu-Ray in, just as they did with DVD's. The Ps2 was a pretty cheap DVD player.

I can just see those movies for sale now, at least $10 more. like $20 dollars for a DVD wasn't enough money? Lets pay $34 for a blu ray movie ****it. Pay 50%-100% more for movies that you can get on HD DVD. No way. thanks, ill stick to DVD or HD DVD.

Thats not ****in Blu-Ray or DVD's. You know how cheap it is to make a DVD, it's also very cheap to make a Blu-Ray disc. It's just damn greedy people and paying off a $100,000,000 movie. It's why actors get paid millions. Thats the reason for the costs.

Let me ask you this since you seem to know the most about PS3. Know anything about blu ray movies being available to rent?

All matters on the final protection scheme upon the release and who made the Blu-Ray Discs. My guess completely off the top of my head that is yes, definently. Why the hell wouldn't they? How the hell could you stop them? You can't really stop em...

You need me, because you are an idiot that would pay $500-$600 for a PS3 and pre-order it from Japan because its discs can hold more information - which isn't even a significant factor since you should know that running in higher resolutions like 1600x1200 don't actually use any more disc space than a normal DVD! It is only pre-recorded video footage that this type of disc space comes into play. And well if you want to watch pre-recorded video footage than the PS3 is the perfect machine for that, since thats all it has shown so far!

Yeah and people by an Xbox 360 just because it will be able to have better graphics same with the Ps3.... which is why im not getting either, only the revolution.

Also resolution does affect game size. Not the Resolution but the game, but a 256 x 256 image will take up less space than a 2000X2000 size image. Much less space infact. Infact heres something: Take a 256x256 area are compared to a 2000x2000 area and lets be nice and only use 256 colors to make the math easy.(256 is the max 1 bit can hold or 8 0's and 1's).
65536 is the area. Now lets say each pixel there is in a 256 color range therefor each one takes up 1 bit. 524288 0's and 1's to pass through the processor for that color. This is also how much space it will take up. (512Kilobytes)

4000000 is the area. Keeping the 256 color range so each one takes up 1 bit(8 0's and 1's is a bit having a max value on 256). 32000000(31250 Kilobytes, 320) passes through the processor for that color. Also how much space it will take up. On a 256 color a 2000x2000 image will be about 3.2megs on a high resolution color it matters on the color.

Therefor whats the difference between them to? a 61x difference. It takes 61 times the space and computting power to handle a 2000x2000 image compared to a 256x256 image in 256 color based area. This value would get bigger\stay the same depending on what colors you use.

Of course this is without compression software, but in the end you see the difference and it's massive a 61x difference and when you have a image that is all in a higher color that requires several bits the difference will only get bigger. Since 0-256 all takes up the same you can't get any lower than a 61x difference on less you use colors that requires many bits on the 256x and one within the 256 range on the 2000x, but why the hell would you try and stick yourself to a 256 color pallete when you have a 2000x image? So that would be an unfair comparission.
Isn't Binary Fun!! No, but damn easy.

Sure I'm going to pay that much for a machine to play the same movies that weren't worth a movie ticket. Forget that there are 1000's of movies available on DVD. When you decide to buy a new movie for the Blu Ray I want you to feel left out that your section is very tiny. Also, please forget that you don't even own a HDTV.

Ps3 will be able to play DVD's and Blu-Ray. Not only that but as the future goes on and more companies decide to take it up it will only expand. I personally don't care if it expands. We are still making movies on VHS, when blu-ray comes around we will have DVD and Blu-Ray. Since Microsoft left support on HD-DVD with the Xbox 360 im thinking that HD-DVD will in the end just fail.

 

[JNightshade]

I say: f*ck 'em both, I'm getting a Revolution.

 

[Mutley]

Getaway was a good game, looks awesome for PS3. Anyhow, not getting any consoles. Prefer to save for a DX10 Vista PC.

 

[Combine Hybrid]

The graphic looks no different from Xbox360... all that hype...

LoL... sony...

 

[VirusType2]

Thats not ****in Blu-Ray or DVD's. You know how cheap it is to make a DVD, it's also very cheap to make a Blu-Ray disc. It's just damn greedy people and paying off a $100,000,000 movie. It's why actors get paid millions. Thats the reason for the costs.

No, the blue ray is not cheap to make. If a DVD costs $0.03 to make and a blu ray disc costs $10.00 to make, is that cheap? No, it's about a billion times more expensive (bad math and all) Of course the movie stars need to get paid. Showbuisiness is big business. Sports stars and movie stars get paid so much because they draw the crowds and bring in the sales. So if you think that the actors and suits are willing to take a 50% cut in profit on Blu Ray movies you have lost your mind! The price of the blu ray disc will be tacked on to the cost of the blu ray movie itself.

By most estimates, Blu-ray discs will cost at least $10 more than current-generation
DVDs. HD-DVD is much more manufacturer-friendly, as the disc structure ...

And doing a little research just now to find out the facts, I learned that while I guessed right that the Blu Ray movies will be $35, they will be asking more for HD DVD as well:

Retail prices for HD DVD movies are set at US$28.99, slightly less than the expected US$35 price for Blu-ray movies.

First, I want to address one point. Yes, I'm a Sony fan-boy.

It bleeds through in your text. Besides, there was no need to admit it, I actually expected you to deny it.

If you want me to point out the obviously flawed logic in your two-part price rant... here goes:

* You start by quoting an arbitrary third-party estimate of the PS3's cost and speaking as if it will retail for that same price, or more. Well, either that or Microsoft is going to cut the 360 down to Revolution prices... according to your "3x the price" statement. Even if they cut the Premium 360 to $300 the PS3 would need to retail for $900 (higher than even the parts estimate you quoted) to make that true. You end by asking for people to correct your mistakes.

I asked people to correct me where I'm wrong with facts, not with my paragraph structure and I NEVER spoke as if they would retail for that same price or more; In fact - I said the opposite 3 times in one paragraph, "manufacturing estimates", "much cheaper to make", and "manufacturing cost". READ:

manufacturing estimates were just that - estimates, and everyone has a different estimate. So is there no point in this discussion at all? I guess as you can find one website saying one thing and other saying the other. I think it's pretty clear that the 360 is much cheaper to make.http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?op...=1497&Itemid=2
at the bottom of the page the price difference has the manufacturing cost of the 360 at $155 less. Thats with no hard drive for the PS3 so say a proper hard drive costs them $15

Way to lie about the facts in order to have any sort of ammunition for the war. Taking a page from America? (just kidding <3 America) I did make one mistake in that I assumed the Sony hard drive would add $75-$100 more to Sony's manufacturing costs. That was just honest mistake.

* Someone points out that Sony and Microsoft both sold their previous consoles for a loss and that Microsoft is doing the same with the 360... meaning that no one but Sony knows how low Sony is willing to go. This person also has a similar cost estimate for the Xbox 360.

Yea thats right, no one but Sony knows how much they will ask for their system when they release it. How does this relate to me having flawed logic? What's your point? Sony will take a loss on their system when they sell it, this has been the trend for consoles for quite a while. But the more it costs them to manufacture it, the more they must ask for with the retail price. If it cost Sony $100 - $200 less to manufacture it, then when you go to the store to buy it, the retail price would reflect that in it's entirety.

* You then proceed to get angry about someone correcting a mistake and switch to dismissing the same kind of estimate upon which you based your original argument... and try to use bad math (varying the prices to throw the proportion out of balance) to make the possible price difference look worse than it might be. Also, in the same post, you mock Sony's choice of using DVDs in the PS2 because DVDs can be used to play movies (and they just happen to have several times the data storage)... while ignoring Microsoft's choice to do the exact same thing.

First of all, I didn't get angry, here is what I said to him:

relax Minerel. Whats with all the hostility from some of you guys lately?

I'm such a nice guy. :stare:

I make a very compelling argument with a dozen great points and you focus on one point and say
"what the ****" to me like I am way off here.

Lets be open minded about these machines instead of defending them like I'm talking about your mother.

Besides, I clearly stated at the end to correct me if I'm wrong because I'm not reading up on the latest news.

Thats not me getting angry, thats me asking for respect when you speak to me, or I will show you none when I speak to you. I am not trying to make enemies here on this forum, on the contrary.

[you] switch to to dismissing the same kind of estimate upon which you based your original argument... and try to use bad math (varying the prices to throw the proportion out of balance) to make the possible price difference look worse than it might be.

First of all, I kept the proportion 100% accurate. Maybe you are not very good at math as well as reading.
Besides, I didn't dismiss it, I said:

Early estimates had the 360 at $225 cheaper

manufacturing estimates were just that - estimates, and everyone has a different estimate. So is there no point in this discussion at all? I guess as you can find one website saying one thing and other saying the other.

.. Even though I would think Merill Lynch (my source) is a bit more credible than Joystiq Finally, I said maybe this isn't even worth discussing since its not a fact - it's an estimate.

...and try to use bad math...

- is this a technical term Cyberman? I gave an example using an intermediate source with a cost estimate in-between Minerel's source and my source:

at the bottom of the page the price difference has the manufacturing cost of the 360 at $155 less. Thats with no hard drive for the PS3

So if the 360 was $1 and the PS3 was $170 which one would you buy?

My only mistake was a big one where I mistakenly thought that the hard drive for the PS3 would add $75-$100 to the manufacturing costs of the PS3, where it actually will be significatly less costly for them. It will cost us $100 however.

Must I go on?

You never had anything to go on. I don't even think it makes sense to you. You deliberately misconstrued everything I said because either:
1) You don't read well
2) You don't like me
3) You're a Sony fan-boy
4) all of the above *check*
You don't even want to know the truth and get uber assaultive when I tell it like it is - so much so that you would hit me below the belt and dismiss all the things I have said as "blah blah", and then call me illiterate. At least I can figure out my maximize button on WindowsXP so the text fits on the screen. That would at least make me computer literate.

Now, back to the attempted insults at me and the self-victimization you use to rationalize your mistakes.

rationalize my mistakes? What mistakes? A paragraph is not a paragraph because multiple sentences are strung together, If I put a space in between each sentence it was because they were a new thought or topic:

par·a·graph:
A distinct division of written or printed matter that begins on a new, usually indented line, consists of one or more sentences, and typically deals with a single thought or topic or quotes one speaker's continuous words.

Besides I shouldn't have to dot every "i" and cross every "t" for you to be able to read what I'm saying. I've read posts from people who spell 90% of their words wrong and I still completely understand what they are saying. If you can't read what I'm saying to you than it is you that is illiterate.

"Have you tried this?" Yes, I have. You skipped school? So did I. You didn't do your classwork? Neither did I. You failed classes? Yep, same here. You have a form of depression? I was depressed for two or three years straight. Seriously, enough with the excuses.

OK so you stay up for two or three 24 hour day cycles every time before you sleep again? I'm afraid I don't believe you. I've never met anyone else with this problem, but lack of a need for much sleep is a symptom of Bipolar. Stop trying to say you had anywhere near the problem that I have.

Also, I've never even heard of anyone to have such a severe problem with truancy as I had. Depressed for two or three years straight you say? I've been depressed for 31 years, and if that was my only problem, I wouldn't even be depressed.

Seriously, enough with the excuses.

Is it an excuse if you beat a man in a foot-race if their "excuse" is that they have no legs? It's not an excuse - it's a reason. Finally, If my syntax is annoying to you then I suggest you go to another forum where they don't speak English since you are having trouble reading it.

You must be the idiot if you think the game art is going to take up the same space on games designed to run at 640x480 on TVs through crappy composite cables as it will on a system intended to run games designed for 1920x1080 through HDMI cables. The higher the pixel detail of the screen the more the flaws will show through... requiring textures several times larger than before... unless you like muddy textures. Over the next few years more and more games will outgrow a single DVD. People said the same shit when DVDs were first introduced and now something like 95% of all PS2 games are on DVDs instead of CDs. Yeah, games won't get bigger... that's why I still buy all of my games on floppy disks.

Cables don't have anything to do with how much disc space you are going to need and I never said that modern games don't use higher rez textures or use more disc space. My point was that unless you are playing HD movies, that huge amount of extra disc space isn't necessary, yet and is costing everyone who buy the system an exorbitant amount of money:

[disc size]isn't even a significant factor since you should know that running in higher resolutions like 1600x1200 don't actually use any more disc space than a normal DVD! It is only pre-recorded video footage that this type of disc space comes into play. And well if you want to watch pre-recorded video footage than the PS3 is the perfect machine for that, since thats all it has shown so far!

Also resolution does affect game size. Not the Resolution but the game, but a 256 x 256 image will take up less space than a 2000X2000

[blah blah binary 000329423..] but in the end you see the difference and it's massive a 61x difference and when you have a image that is all in a higher color that requires several bits the difference will only get bigger. Since 0-256 all takes up the same you can't get any lower than a 61x difference on less you use colors that requires many bits on the 256x and one within the 256 range on the 2000x, but why the hell would you try and stick yourself to a 256 color pallete when you have a 2000x image? So that would be an unfair comparission.

No it doesn't work like that Minerel. First of all the textures won't be 2000x2000, that would be extremely rare if at all - like say a boss that was almost 2x the size of the dragon at the end of Doom 3!

EDIT - just went and checked to make sure I'm right:
Doom 3 Cyberdemon 1024 x 1024 textures,
Doom 3 RoE dragon named Maledict: 1024x1024 sized textures.
Both are uncompressed RGB true color 24-Bit, TGA images (Lossless, supports transparancy)

Anyway, here's how it works. There is one copy of the detailed texture of a 3D object - called a diffusemap, and its a large, high rez texture, say 256x256, 512x512, 1028x768 depending on the texture (small monster small texture size, dragon large texture size) Depending on the screen size and texture resolution selected, it will downscale the texture. In the computer games we play today this is the case.

There is only one diffusemap in a nice high rez, capable of screen resolutions higher than 1600 x 1200 in some games. If you play the game in this high of a resolution, the image is not downscaled or compressed and thus can require much texture memory and memory bandwidth. (Doesn't the PS3 have problems with memory bandwidth?) When you select a lower resolution than that - say 800x600, it is a software downscaling of that single texture to make it the appropriate size.

DVD's aren't ancient technology, they aren't even fully utilized. The 360 for example has a double layer DVD. Therefore, like I said, high resolution gaming does not significantly affect disc space usage and thus a larger disc is not necessary for high resolution graphics.

The only extra disc space higher resolution graphics uses at all is for the relatively very small amount of code needed for the math calculations for the different resolutions. They've had high res (HD sized resolution graphics on the PC for years)And PC games do use 16 million color TGA images not 256 color. I should know I've been working on all of this stuff in my Doom3 mod. Next gen systems are basically PC's so I am certain that it's the same story.

I'll be able to play both DVD and Blu-Ray movies. Wouldn't that make my "section" larger than yours?

No it would make you a fool for buying a PS3 so you can play DVD's IMO. LOL If you want it to last as long as they will keep selling them for, I wouldn't want to waste the hours on the lazer (they eventually burn out) or risk overheating it to play DVD's. More commonly though, it is a mechanical failure with drives. Regardless, you know Sony will be more than happy to sell a second PS3 to everyone to replace the first one that breaks somewhere a few years after you buy it.
Besides you should read this:

Warner also published research that suggests HD DVD may get off to a quick start, and next-generation DVDs may see a more successful launch than the original DVD format back in 1997. 600,000 players are expected to be sold -- some 450,000 HD DVD and 150,000 Blu-ray players. Only 305,000 DVD players sold in the first year, the company said.

Triple layer HD DVDs will hold 45 GB (xbox540 anyone)?
I know you are not that great at math so I did it for you. Look up to the above quote
HD DVD = 450,000 and Blu Ray = 150,000. Exactly three times more expected to sell.

Looks like HD DVD is getting 3 times more support than blu ray and that the HD DVD will do better than the original DVD did.

.. the Blu ray? Warner Brothers research says that Blu ray will sell half as well as the DVD did. Thanks for all the damn formats guys! And thanks for making us need to keep it around in order to play a video game system. (Ulterior motives and all)

Read this for another big reason 360 is better for some:
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=103352