Maybe creationism isnt so rediculous.

Man, i really should put my theory of everything down here soon.
It is really the best explanation for everything where everyone can agree.
It'd take quite a bit of writing and i'd prob get over-excited again.
 
So many misconceptions... I love the way that they "prove" that the big bang theory is obviously wrong by showing lots of buildings blowing up.

EDIT: anyone who calls themself a creationist should be banned from referring to the 2nd law of Thermodynamics.
 
Pretty interesting...I'm about 13 mins into it.
 
Feath said:
So many misconceptions... I love the way that they "prove" that the big bang theory is obviously wrong by showing lots of buildings blowing up.
Click to expand...
Obviously youre a visual learner :) what they are actually SAYING makes more sense.
 
gh0st said:
Obviously youre a visual learner :) what they are actually SAYING makes more sense.
Click to expand...

Not really. The Big Bang wasn't a huge explosion it was a huge expansion. The order that came from the Big bang was due to intermocecular forces and gravity.
 
Ok.. then explain the variations in size, orbit (backwards, sideways, etc), terrain, atmosphere, and so forth, of the planets. I would recommend not arguing until you see the whole thing, its pointless.
 
Fools, they have the idiotic idea about "fine tuning" for us.
Lets see, if we were not here then we wouldn't be able to think consciously about it.
It is only because the situation of a seemingly infinite has thrown at least 1 suitable situation for the evolution of life that we can think that.

"Oh we're at the centre of the universe" ....it is idiotic archaic thinking, and i'm disgusted such "top scientists" can be so idiotic.
ARE THEY BLIND?
Think about it, if you CREATED a sealed fish tank and invented robots inside that were self conscious like us, they would detect "oh it's perfectly tuned for our existence"
Now, if the same environment occured naturally, which it can.........think of infinity.
Wouldn't we think they same? even if we were not created?

Are we alive on the sun? no, therefore there is no one on the sun to think "oh this is perfect for us"......because it isn't.
 
gh0st said:
Ok.. then explain the variations in size, orbit (backwards, sideways, etc), terrain, atmosphere, and so forth, of the planets.
Click to expand...

All the planets in the solar system orbit the same way.

Anyway, In t'beginning there was the big bang. This formed various fundamental particles (in a process I don't knowoff the top of my head). These particles joined together to create protons, neutrons and those joined together to form loads of hydrogen and a bit of Helium. This hydrogen/Hellium was spread out over the entire universe (in fact, it was the entire universe). But, it wasn't spread completely uniformly. This is important. The bits that were collected near to each other were attracted to each other (because of gravity). This made them move towards each other. Because they were moving together, the mass increased and so the gravitational attraction increased. So eventually, we end up with pockets of gas.


As the gas collected together, it started to spin (this is a mathematical thing that's been proved. It's due to gravity). As it heated up and span it collected together to form massive stars.

[insert not very important bit about Supernovae and the formation of heavier elements, if you want I can explain]

Now, when our solar system came to be formed it. We had the same gas but also some heavier elements. When the gas and elements collected and start to spin, the lighter elements were thrown to the outside of this swirl, whereas the heavier elements were near the centre. The gas collected together to form the sun (which contains 99% of the mass of the Solar System) and planets. The planets closer to the sun were made up of the heavier elements which is why we get rocky planets closer to the sun. The planets further away from the sun were made up of the lighter elements, which is why we get gas giants like Jupiter.

Some of this may not be totally correct, by the way. I'm surprised I remembered as much as I did.
 
I find it quite funny that they are using various things like differing rotations of planets as prove the solar system wasn't formed naturally. What exactly is their explanation? God was bored? In fact, why have any other planets at all? Why not just have a sun and Earth?
 
No, gh0st. Just no. Otherwise Apos will administer the smackdown again.

But in all seriousness, I can't debate this, I haven't got an hour to spare to watch the vid as the exams are coming up and I need all the study time I can get :(
 
quote from video: "it really raises a question nobody wants to answer, if the universe began in a singularity, then what happened prior to that singularity?"

This very statement contradicts itself. The universe is an embodiement of time and space. Time is a dimension of the universe. Both space and time began at the same moment. Time isnt some big long infinite strand that runs in both directions. Time is finite. How then, could you have an infinite wait before the universe was created? You can't. Time is a dimension of space and was therefore created at the same time (so to speak) as the start of the universe.
 
LOL, the end of the movie just polished it off for me.
CHRISTIAN CRUSADE!
 
I ended up getting really bored and turning it off.

I'll end on this note: The video makes numerous references to Evolutionists ignoring certaining things. Like why Venus spins the other way and why the moon is like it is. Scientists don't ignore these things and there are explanations you can find, if you care to read up on it.
 
quote from video: "the solar system should have the same composition throughout....if the sun is mostly hydrogen and helium, then the inner planets should share its composition..."

this statement is so wrong it makes me want to laugh. When the solar system formed the densest elements went towards the center. Iron, silicon, lead, and other elements formed the inner planets and the asteriod belt. Naturally, since the sun was the star of the system, it is made of hydrogen and helium, because that's what stars are made of. It wouldn't "give away" its hydrogen and helium to the planets, instead it produced the heavier elements and those became the planets.

As for the "law of entropy", that is utter bull when applied to everything in the universe and somehow saying it contradicts big bang. The universe is expanding at a rapid rate, which becomes more and more rapid over time. Soon, just as they claim, the universe will be nothing but a few widely spaced electrons.

but what they fail to realize is that all universes die. Virtually every universe has a beginning and an end within multidimensional space, I have no idea how this contradicts the law of entropy in any way, because indeed the universe is running down, so how does that contradict the big bang? Ill even lay it out in their simple and flawed logic: just as a baby is born, turns into an old man, and dies, the universe was born, went through a massive period of growth and will die...and that proves them how?
 
Ok, this video is pissing me off;)

I'm only 8 minutes in and it's telling me that the only reason anyone believes in Evolution is because they were brainwashed in highschool. Well, what about the millions who are forced fed creationism from the day they were born, thats not indoctrine by any means.:O
 
theotherguy said:
quote from video: "it really raises a question nobody wants to answer, if the universe began in a singularity, then what happened prior to that singularity?"
Click to expand...
It also begs the question: "If God created the universe and all things, what was He doing before creation? Twiddling his thumbs? Biding his time?
 
el Chi said:
It also begs the question: "If God created the universe and all things, what was He doing before creation? Twiddling his thumbs? Biding his time?
Click to expand...
Well like the vid said...god created time or something...or he's out of the realm of time.
 
Saying god created everthing is just annoying, because then you get on "who created god" arguents.......it would just be like a reverse russian doll situation, no end to it.

Now my theory of everything works, includes everything and is infinite.
Neither evolutionists or creationists can argue with it because it goes to the roots, it's not about life, it's about everything.
 
Yeah, this video doesn't do much to sway my mind. Actually, it made me stupider.
 
el Chi said:
It also begs the question: "If God created the universe and all things, what was He doing before creation? Twiddling his thumbs? Biding his time?
Click to expand...

How did god come about? Did he just appear out of nothingness? Or was he born? This is why I'm Atheist.
 
Dag said:
How did god come about? Did he just appear out of nothingness? Or was he born? This is why I'm Atheist.
Click to expand...
As christians will tell you "he is just there"
"he always has been and always will" crap
And then in that video they start having a crack about big bang theory coming from nothingness or a singularity.
Not hypocritical or anything in the slightest.
 
The big Bang theory doesn't really take. I mean, theres just some super condensed ball floating around in nothingness? Then, suddenly, it blows up for no reason at all? And not only that, but a huge explosion. How big was all that mass supposed to be before the big bang? A thimbleful? And that exploded big enought to fill up the universe as we know it? Hah. Everyone knows I created everything.
 
Dag said:
The big Bang theory doesn't really take. I mean, theres just some super condensed ball floating around in nothingness? Then, suddenly, it blows up for no reason at all? And not only that, but a huge explosion. How big was all that mass supposed to be before the big bang? A thimbleful? And that exploded big enought to fill up the universe as we know it? Hah. Everyone knows I created everything.
Click to expand...
That's why i have my theory of everything that works.
 
short recoil said:
Saying god created everthing is just annoying, because then you get on "who created god" arguents.......it would just be like a reverse russian doll situation, no end to it.

Now my theory of everything works, includes everything and is infinite.
Neither evolutionists or creationists can argue with it because it goes to the roots, it's not about life, it's about everything.
Click to expand...
Well give it to us then. :D
 
Shit happens. Thats the best theory you can ever hope to find. :)
 
Maybe creationism isnt so rediculous.
No, it is.
Sorry, but basically saying that the universe is too complicated and therefore there must be "magic" at work is rediculous.
 
blind stupidity..why does religion have to try to disprove things we can see/hear/touch with intangible things?

why can't people let god and science get along?look for the damned middle ground FFS!

we evolved from apes,that maybe god had put a little more into than the others which is why they are still in the trees and we are where we are..just a thought

god isn't left out of the loop and science isn't demonized..compromise!!
 
Well I for one believe in god and evolution...I don't see how anybody can't.I believe god started the big bang and has had everything planned since the beginning of time.Everything happens for a reason...you just have to see it.


(That's my opinion btw.)
 
I'm probably odd because no theory has ever satisfied me.

Creationism has all the oft-repeated flaws, but the Big Bang theorum doesn't really impress me either (hell, some Creationists believe the Bang was just the voice of God as it is). Just as you have the "where the hell did God come from then?" argument you get the "well where the hell did the something come from amongst all that nothingness?".

It's easy to tell why a tiny minority* still subscribe to the Steady State theory...

*Well, depends what source you read. Meh.
 
short recoil said:
That's why i have my theory of everything that works.
Click to expand...
I'm not trying to be a ass or anything but maybe you should post this theory that's going to put 1000's of years of ideology and science to rest instead of just telling us how logical it is.
 
I dont believe in either... i think when it comes to the _____ of life, both theories are made by us and are not perfect. The bible isnt an enyclopedia, just like there are things on earth that we dont understand yet. All in due time.
 
If you are a strong religious person, please read no further-

Religion was created as a way for man to cope with events around him with which he did not understand. Back in the Medieval days, many things were misunderstood, or just not understood at all, and so many had a blind faith to religion. Nowadays, many of these unexplainable events have been found out, and science has made them no longer mysteries. So in reality, both are probably wrong.
 
The bible is more or less a guide to help live your life by...just like many other religious/spirtual books.It's that simple...

Seems like now'n days most religious folks are forgetting the side that makes up religion and that's spirtuality.I noticed that most only go to church because they believe in a god and think they have to follow some rules so they can get into a great place or just go because it's been taught to them since they was born.Now of course that's just my observation...What happened to enlightenment? :(
 
I am going to go against the grain and say it is impossible to rule out divine intervention.

I watched a documentary, years ago where there was universal agreement on how the universe was created. An accepted picture was put forward, cataloguing a chain of events, starting from one millionth of a second after the big bang.

What was not accepted and continues to be debated was what happened one millionth of a second before the big bang.

It is impossible to say what happened before the creation of the universe, time, and space and within this impossibility lays the possibility that there really was divine intervention.

It also posses the question...Why create one universe, why not two, three, or even thousands, millions?

The possibility that God did create the universe is, in my option as valid as any other opinion.
 
Ok, here are the basics of my theory.
Ever wondered how stuff can be so random?
I mean, look at yourself in a mirror, think about why there is a round earth, with a "liquid" flowing on it.........it's all wierd, how on earth has this all come about?
Most people either think the universe has always been there or it was created by something extra universal.
Now, for obvious reasons the creation idea is just silly (who created god?, why is god there?)
My theory would go above god and still allow for it, whatever it may be.

Now, we do know we exist, if we didn't exist how could we be thinking what we're thinking now?
There HAS to be at least something?
Now imagine it as binary 1 or 0 either there is stuff or their isn't, now that seems pretty straight foward at first but then you have to think is it possible to have nothing?
Not really, if there is nothing there.

Now this will take a bit of thinking about, don't try it if your tired or something.
(It is impossible for our minds to think of nothingness, or infinity so i won't play too much on this.)
To allow for such randomness, what if everything did and didn't exist at the same time?
Cancelling its self out perfectly, there is everything, in every possible way including nothingness. This seems highly likely thinking at the most basic level, while you look around you see only an infinitley small amount of everything.
Your mind cannot proccess infinity so you would never imagine everything and never understand everything.
If space, time, matter just existed, you ask why does it exist?
If nothing existed you could not ask why it does not
If we were not conscious, if we would have not randomly been like this then we could never know.

There might be a god that created us, there might have been a big bang that we evolved from chemicals, this is not the point here.
The point is about existence, now what if it isn't a binary situation?
I.e you cannot say if there is something there or not, because it both isn't and it is at the same time.......impossible to think of, yes.....impossible, no.

Multi universes, a god that created man, evolution...........all of it happens, on an infinite scale.
The only reason we think of our closed universe is because we are conscious of it now.
If we made a mini city with a conscious creature.......what would it think?
Would it be able to think of us, it's creators, or would it think on the level we do, about our creators?
That's what we are doing now.
It stops the stupid russian doll arguments, because there is simply no end, the lack of the end is the awnser.

We happen to be on our earth either due to evolution or creation ( i think most likely evolution from chemicals that have fallen into that position)
This also rules out any arguments about probability.
Probability is useless with infinity, even a 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% chance event will happen infinite times (sorry about the 0's, i'm getting over-excited here to make a point)
With probability being meaningless, we WOULD MOST DEFINITELY exist .....and do we exist, yes we do.
(conclusive evidence of my theory)

Quite simply, anything is possible, because it is.
Otherwise there would be no reason for the moon to weigh anything.
No reason for the sun to give out "energy"
Don't try and think about it mathematically, or "spiritually" because we are held back by what we experience with our existence.
All we experience is in our brains, from our senses.
How could we even begin to detect if there was something more? it would be stupid just taking what we know as everything.

Multi universe theory helps me to understand, try to imagine infinite possibilites you would have infinite occurances, you WOULD end up with what we know, exactly.
Now you see why i think it is highly probable that this is the only theory that works?

Everything exists, cancels its self out perfectly, in an infinitley complex manor.
Everything = nothing.
Now don't go thinking "oh why can't we see it" "oh lets travel to another dimension, space time, big jam doughnut with a cherry on top, whatever" we obviously experience what we know due to our conscious thought, our minds working mechanically governed by the same physics as our planets.
This dosn't mean that everything has to.
And it all boils down to nothing, no one can argue.
Everyones happy, we can go on to find out more about how we got here on our smaller scale.

I now either sound really intelligent or COMPLETELY derranged but i hope i made you think.

I shall call the theory "infinity theory"
 
Well you wanna know my theory?It's called the Idon'tgiveadamnbecauseitdoesn'treallymakeabitofadifference theory.

The name explains it all.It doesn't make a damn bit of difference of what created us...why worry about it?Why think of the past when you should be looking to the future.What created the universe is gonna be a never ending question...We won't ever find the answer in our lifetimes so stop arguing over whose religion/belief is right because there isn't a right one...just live your lives guys.If it is possible to find the answer then we will find it one day...or we might not but it doesn't matter, because when/if we do find the answer then hey we found it!YAY!Everyone is gonna continue living their lives and more questions will keep on appearing...and will keep on searching for answers.

None of that probally made a lick of sense.Everything has a reason guys...remember that.
DeusExMachinia said:
Tr0n your a deist right?
Click to expand...
Well not really...deist believe god created the universe and set it on a certain timetable/path I think and that he doesn't interfere with it.I believe he does at times...I believe he sets us on a path that we choose.It's like what I told this girl I loved once...god is always constantly putting us through test...if we pass them or not is up to you.
 
I actually can respect some creationists. While I think they're misguided, I can understand them.

Now, it seems that theres two basic views of the universe. The first is that it is so massively complicated that people cannot hope to ever fully comprehend it in the next few millenia. It involves everything from evolution to gravitic anomalies.

The second one is that the universe is in fact very simple and its people that are complicated, and they've misinterpreted much of their information on how the cosmos works. This idea has a certain simple attractiveness, and makes a sort of over-simplified sense.

Both are slightly nuts, although at this point one seems to make more sense.
 
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