My Card!

Hectic Glenn

Hectic Glenn

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I see so many threads on this type of thing, but not on my card, well i cant find them! I own a 'Ge Force 4 MX 420' I have no idea on its abilities in conjunction with the Source engine, i was wondering if it adaquate or in need of an upgrade. remeber i said adaquate, i dont need pure brilliance. Anyone who can help me i will personally bless them for there time! thank you.
 
http://www.hl2fallout.com/articles/index.php?lang=1&skin=1&CODE=02&id=17
and to quote them:

Half-Life 2 will run on DX7 hardware and above, an example of DX7 hardware is a GeForce 2 or a GeForce 4 MX (really just a glorified GF2). It won't run very fast, though, and without any of the fancy effects. If you have hardware this old then you really do need to upgrade if you want to experience HL2's graphics anywhere near its potential. Likewise, if you have an integrated solution then you need to buy something new.
Click to expand...

so yeah, but dont expect the greatest eye-candy.

it will be functional, but other than that I wouldnt hold my breath :(
 
The Geforce 4 MX 420 is esentially a Geforce 2 in terms of speed and features. It will run HL2, however the Geforce 4 MX series does not have pixel shading and vertex shading capabilities. Those are the cool graphical features that HL2 will have. Things like shiny (and reflective) water require the use of pixel shaders. Shaders help make games much more realistic than what is possible with your graphics card. If you just want to play HL2, your graphics card will see you through just fine. However, you may not be able to play games outside of HL2 because more and more games are requiring shaders.

If you want to upgrade, a good upgrade will cost you 125 USD (for a 9600 Pro) and up. For $200 you can get a 9800 Pro which will give you awesome performance for HL2 and games in the future. Those cards will require an AGP slot. If you don't have an AGP slot, stick with what you ahve.
 
Thanks alot, you answered so many questions i have, you've been really helpful. I will look into those upgrades, the 9600 pro and 9800 pro. Im pretty sure i have AGP slots, and 1 PCI slot or something, i wish i knew how to check! But shaders would be nice, and id be investing for the future, so i guess a 9800 pro is the best in those terms. Thanks again.
 
Cheers, loadsa good info on there as well. Is a 9800 pro 128 bit sufficient though? i dont think i can stretch as far as the 256 bit version. Im hunting around for that $125 card now, but im in the UK, so i guess ill be looking at quite a nice buy if possible. Seems like alot of bother to just find out if you have an agp slot :P My pc is about a year and a half old, im pretty sure shes hiding one in there :) Looking at those results on that site, am i now to believe there are much better cards than the 9800, such as those FX cards, i had the impression ati cards were better now!?
 
the 9800 pro 128MB is fine, its what I have in one of my comps.
however make sure it is 128mb (megabyte, onboard ram) and not the cheaply made 128bit architecture.


there are better cards than the 9800pro, but price comes into play, its the best you can get for +/- $200.
 
yeah, if you get a 9800pro, make sure you get the 256-bit verison (but 128MB)

you should have 1 AGP slot (it should have a little lever at the end) and a bunch of PCI slots.

Look at this picture: http://s89737224.onlinehome.us/photo/PC lights/cleaned.JPG

the brown slot (doesn't have to be that color) with the black card in it is the AGP slot (at the top)

The other slots ( the empty ones) are PCI slots.
 
Thanks alot, that program worked a treat. Ive discovered my current card is in a AGP slot i have, so thats a good start :D Im going to check it later by opening it up and looking, now i know what they look like, thanks. So all theres left to do now it wait for my 9800 pro 128mb 256bit card to come, i think thats the one you guys said! Thanks for everyones help, theres loadsa nice people here willing to help, tis a nice place! Cheers
 
Hectic Glenn said:
Thanks alot, that program worked a treat. Ive discovered my current card is in a AGP slot i have, so thats a good start :D Im going to check it later by opening it up and looking, now i know what they look like, thanks. So all theres left to do now it wait for my 9800 pro 128mb 256bit card to come, i think thats the one you guys said! Thanks for everyones help, theres loadsa nice people here willing to help, tis a nice place! Cheers
Click to expand...

One last question. This will require you to open up the side of your case and take a look at your power supply. Your power supply will be located at the top right corner of your case. Who many Watts is your power supply? I want to make sure your computer will have enough power putting a new video card in your computer. A 300 Watt power supply is recommended for this new video card.

If you video card doesn't, a power supply upgrade is really easy and cheap to do (from $30 to $60). A brand name power supply is worth the extra cost.

$30 power supply
$60 power supply

Also, what are the rest of you system specs. Want to make sure you have a fast enough processor and enough RAM to take advantage of a new video card.
 
Right ill have a look at that then...thanks for telling me i didnt know about that power supply thing. So where exactly will it tell me my wattage? Secondly i have 512mb of RAM, and a p4 2.66ghz processor, so i think im okay in that respect, unless you see anything that isnt right. Also the power supply thing, is it difficult to install, because im not much of a hands on person with these things, will it mean i need to remove my old power supply if necessary? And do i need more cooling devices or something along those lines?
 
Hectic Glenn said:
Right ill have a look at that then...thanks for telling me i didnt know about that power supply thing. So where exactly will it tell me my wattage? Secondly i have 512mb of RAM, and a p4 2.66ghz processor, so i think im okay in that respect, unless you see anything that isnt right. Also the power supply thing, is it difficult to install, because im not much of a hands on person with these things, will it mean i need to remove my old power supply if necessary? And do i need more cooling devices or something along those lines?
Click to expand...

If you take the side off of your case, there should be a sticker on your power supply (top right corner of your case). The amount is listed in Watts. If your power supply is above 300 Watts, you should be good to go.

Replacing your power supply should be fairly easy if you case is pretty standard (read: not all Dells are standard). Basically, replacing your power supply involves turning off your computer, opening your case, unplugging all the molex power plugs, remove the power supply (it is attached to the case throw a couple of screws) and replace and plug everything back in. Turn on your computer and you are all down. Quite easy, if I must say.

I don't think you need any additional cooling devices if you get a new graphics card.
 
Well mine is a dell :( I havent checked my wattage yet, ill do it later today when i have time, but its a normal dimension 4600 if that means anything to you? I know that they dont go to any special lengths to put good power supplies in, but say if its just under the necessary requirement for a 9800 pro, would that be a problem? And do you think it will be ok anyway?
 
Hectic Glenn said:
Well mine is a dell :( I havent checked my wattage yet, ill do it later today when i have time, but its a normal dimension 4600 if that means anything to you? I know that they dont go to any special lengths to put good power supplies in, but say if its just under the necessary requirement for a 9800 pro, would that be a problem? And do you think it will be ok anyway?
Click to expand...

I've been using a 9800 PRO for almost a year on a 200W PSU, it all depends if you have a lot of gizmos running in your pc.
 
Hectic Glenn said:
Well mine is a dell :( I havent checked my wattage yet, ill do it later today when i have time, but its a normal dimension 4600 if that means anything to you? I know that they dont go to any special lengths to put good power supplies in, but say if its just under the necessary requirement for a 9800 pro, would that be a problem? And do you think it will be ok anyway?
Click to expand...

My friend has a 4600 and he's running an X800 pro on it along with a 3.0ghz P4, so I think you're ok as the 4600's will all have the same power supply. If you're wondering I found on Dell's site that it's a 250 watt power supply, but if he can run an X800 pro on it you can run a 9800 pro on it.
 
Hectic Glenn said:
Well mine is a dell :( I havent checked my wattage yet, ill do it later today when i have time, but its a normal dimension 4600 if that means anything to you? I know that they dont go to any special lengths to put good power supplies in, but say if its just under the necessary requirement for a 9800 pro, would that be a problem? And do you think it will be ok anyway?
Click to expand...

It depends. If you buy your new card and your computer starts to restart while gaming or windows loading up, you need a new power supply. Having the computer restart on you a couple of times on you will not hurt your computer, but you will need to get a better power supply.

If you don't have any restarting problems, that means your computer is fine.
 
This seems likes alot of trouble, say if i bought a 9600 pro, what power do i need for that? Because if i buy the 9800 pro, and my pc starting restarting on me, ill need to mess about with the power, and its setup in dells ive heard is really weird, so i think ill do damage to my pc, and financial strains also... I know the 9600 pro isnt as good, and im not getting the same experience, but im thinking wouldnt it be easier? Im caught between two minds now, this is a horrible thing :(

Btw whats an X800 card? is it a diff series? after or before the 9**** series?
 
Hectic Glenn said:
This seems likes alot of trouble, say if i bought a 9600 pro, what power do i need for that? Because if i buy the 9800 pro, and my pc starting restarting on me, ill need to mess about with the power, and its setup in dells ive heard is really weird, so i think ill do damage to my pc, and financial strains also... I know the 9600 pro isnt as good, and im not getting the same experience, but im thinking wouldnt it be easier? Im caught between two minds now, this is a horrible thing :(

Btw whats an X800 card? is it a diff series? after or before the 9**** series?
Click to expand...

The easiest way to check is to open up your case and take a quick peek at your power supply.

As for choosing a card, it is up to you. If you are a heavy gamer, go with the 9800 Pro. If you are a casual gamer, go with the 9600 Pro/XT. No need to spend a lot of money on something that you don't really need. The 9600 Pro/XT will make HL2 look good and do a decent job with most games in the next year or so.

The 9600 series of cards are very power efficient (and quiet as well). You will be able to put it in your computer without any problems at all (regardless of power supply).

There are a bunch of 9600 series of models. Of them all, I would recommend either the 9600 Pro or the 9600 XT. The 9600XT is the fastest of the 9600 series with the 9600 Pro behind it. The 9600 Pro will cost about 125 USD and the 9600XT will cost 150 USD. The 9600XT is roughly 10 percent faster than the 9600 Pro.

You have to be a little bit careful with the 9600 Pro as they sell 2 flavors of it. The first flavor is cheaper and the same as a normal 9600 Pro except its memory clockspeed is set to 400 MHz instead of 600 MHz. Setting its memory clockspeed to 400 MHz will slow it down. Getting the 600 MHz memory clockspeed version of the 9600 Pro is only a couple of dollars extra.

As for the 9600XT, there is only one version of it. The benefit of the 9600XT is that some of them (depending on the manufacturer) will include a free coupon for Half-Life 2. You will have to double check at the manufacturer's website to make sure if it does.

The X800 series is the newest set of graphics cards that were just released by ATI. They are out of your price range ($400 and above).
 
wow great, you really know your stuff, thanks for passing on the knowledge, i like the sound of this 9600XT version, ive heard about the free halflife voucher thing also, and how people arnt happy about the delays :) Im assuming its AGP, and is it only available in say 128mb?...as you said theres only one model. Im not an intense gamer of such, i just enjoy my halflife alot, and now its gone to the next level, i want to follow it. So im hoping this card will allow me a good experience. Im wondering its extent of power on HL2, will there be water reflections etc, and be able to support all that mist and stuff from the graveyard? I guess it will be good enough as you said, due to the amount of people who bought it! Ill look around now for the best price in the UK for this card. Ill post back on any feedback i get. My power supply i believe to be 250 watts btw. Thanks again.
 
I'd get the 9600xt if you can't get a 9800 pro, you can find Sapphire 128mb 9600xt's for $130. But all you need to do to upgrade the power supply is buy a microatx one, I have a Dell 2350. But my friend has a 4600 and he's running an X800 pro on it, so you're fine as he's running more power consuming stuff than you, including a 3.0ghz P4. So you'll be fine with a 9800 pro, and all you need is a microatx power supply if you ever need to upgrade it.
 
right, but if i get a 9600XT i dont need a power supply upgrade?

Ive just searched around for this card, and not only does it fit more nicely into my price bracket, but theres the HL2 coupon also(as you said) nice touch. this is the link (http://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.asp?sku=122900&cks=ASS&assoc=D8029637-0DDA-48DA-9BA1-03B0D58EDEA7)
I dunno if that works or not, but at the end it says 'Lite-retail' does this mean its not the proper one, and its been stripped back a bit? Any help i would be grateful. Otherwise im keen to order it :)
 
Hectic Glenn said:
right, but if i get a 9600XT i dont need a power supply upgrade?

Ive just searched around for this card, and not only does it fit more nicely into my price bracket, but theres the HL2 coupon also(as you said) nice touch. this is the link (http://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.asp?sku=122900&cks=ASS&assoc=D8029637-0DDA-48DA-9BA1-03B0D58EDEA7)
I dunno if that works or not, but at the end it says 'Lite-retail' does this mean its not the proper one, and its been stripped back a bit? Any help i would be grateful. Otherwise im keen to order it :)
Click to expand...

To answer you previous question, the 9600XT will be able to run HL2 near its maximum graphical settings at 30 frames per second. You will not need to upgrade your power supply if you go with a 9600XT. That is assuming you have a 250 Watt power supply.

The link you included doesn't include the coupon for HL2. Also, if you do get the version with HL2, it means you have to download it off of steam. Which means if you do not have a fast internet connection, you may not want to pay for a 9600XT that includes HL2.

This 9600XT includes the HL2 coupon

This 9600XT doesn't include the HL2 coupon

Lite-Retail (for Sapphire cards anyways) means that it is the retail version of the card, with a warranty and manual, but it does not come with any software (besides a driver CD).
 
Cheers again, 30 is a little disappointing. I hope theres ways to optimise this, i have a 17" TFT thats 75 hz. I guess that wont help much though. By the way whats the difference between the link i posted and the one you gave me (that doesnt include the voucher)?

I was intending to buy HL2 anyway, i want the case, manual etc for it, so its better off. I have a 512k dsl connection, so it wouldnt have been too bad, but ya know, c'est la vie.
 
Hectic Glenn said:
Cheers again, 30 is a little disappointing. I hope theres ways to optimise this, i have a 17" TFT thats 75 hz. I guess that wont help much though. By the way whats the difference between the link i posted and the one you gave me (that doesnt include the voucher)?

I was intending to buy HL2 anyway, i want the case, manual etc for it, so its better off. I have a 512k dsl connection, so it wouldnt have been too bad, but ya know, c'est la vie.
Click to expand...

30 FPS is usually good enough for fluid motion in computer games unless your eyes are really sensitive (or only play video games that have extremely high fps's).

Get this one below. It's memory is clocked 80 MHz higher than a typical 9600 XT. This means a slightly higher performance from your card than a typical 9600 XT and is 2 pounds cheaper than the sapphire one.

http://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.asp?sku=121503&cks=PRL
 
Is that the "Ultimate" one from Powercolor? But really, it's a Powercolor. They're bad.
 
bosox188 said:
Is that the "Ultimate" one from Powercolor? But really, it's a Powercolor. They're bad.
Click to expand...

Care to elaborate? Sapphire and Powercolor are about the same in terms of cooling systems.
 
blahblahblah said:
To answer you previous question, the 9600XT will be able to run HL2 near its maximum graphical settings at 30 frames per second. You will not need to upgrade your power supply if you go with a 9600XT. That is assuming you have a 250 Watt power supply.

The link you included doesn't include the coupon for HL2. Also, if you do get the version with HL2, it means you have to download it off of steam. Which means if you do not have a fast internet connection, you may not want to pay for a 9600XT that includes HL2.

This 9600XT includes the HL2 coupon

This 9600XT doesn't include the HL2 coupon

Lite-Retail (for Sapphire cards anyways) means that it is the retail version of the card, with a warranty and manual, but it does not come with any software (besides a driver CD).
Click to expand...

Not trying to contradict you here, but I thought they discontinued the HL2 vouchers a long time ago? I ask because I was contemplating that exact card. That would be a nice perk. :)
 
blahblahblah said:
Care to elaborate? Sapphire and Powercolor are about the same in terms of cooling systems.
Click to expand...

Not sure, but a lot of reviews I read suggested they were using lower quality chipsets. *shrug*
 
Beast206 said:
Not trying to contradict you here, but I thought they discontinued the HL2 vouchers a long time ago? I ask because I was contemplating that exact card. That would be a nice perk. :)
Click to expand...

Technically they did discontinue the HL2 vouchers, however it is possible with some searching to hunt down a 9600/9800XT with a HL2 voucher. However, it is not a 100% gauranteed.

Not sure, but a lot of reviews I read suggested they were using lower quality chipsets. *shrug*
Click to expand...

Haven't heard anything about that. The core chipset is produced by ATI so it can't be lower quality. That leaves the cooling system and the memory chips. This card has higher quality memory chips since it is clocked higher (it doesn't mean overclocked, it means they used a faster spec RAM chips) than a standard 9600 XT. As for cooling, Powercolor and Sapphire have the same reputation of cooling in my book, which is average.
 
Gotcha, thanks for the response. :)

As for the Powercolor issue. I wouldn't know the answer to that. As I said, it was just second hand information gleaned from other card reviewers.
 
It's just that a lot of people who've bought Powercolor cards have had problems and had to return them.
 
How many people? And what problems did they have?

(Btw, i am used to high fps games, however, im sure after a little time, i will adjust)
 
I don't know how many, but some problems were just that the card wouldn't work, or nothing came up on the screen, any card could have that happen, but Powercolors just seem ot have it happen the most. Don't worry about it too much, if it doesn't work you can always return it, but other people haven't had any problems at all and the card works great for them.
 
ok, ill take my chances then i guess. I wonder if anyone else has had bad experiences with them? Or any good things to say? I think i know all i need to know for now. Ill see how things go once im holding it in my hands :) thanks, ciao for now!
 
Here is a fairly detailed explanation on how to properly uninstall your graphics card and install your new one.

1) On the computer getting the new graphics card dowload these drivers here if you have Windows XP. Do not install these drivers just yet.
2) Time to uninstall you Nvidia card. Go to Start -> Settings -> Control Panel -> Add/Remove Programs and select Nvidia Display driver (or something along those lines). Click remove. If there is something labeled Nvidia Control Panel remove that as well (you may not have that, so don't worry if you can't find it).
3) Restart your computer
4) Download and run driver cleaner. Windows XP doesn't fully remove graphics card drivers and this will help prevent conflicts when installing a new graphics card driver.
5) Turn off your computer
6) Open up the side of your case. Touch the side of your case, this is to discharge any static electricity you may have. Remove your the graphics card from your computer and set it on a wood table (or something that isn't carpeted or fabric). Remove your new graphics card from its anti-static bag and put it in your AGP slot. A fair amount of force is required to make sure it is in its place. Put the side of your case back on and put your old graphics card in an anti-static bag (in case you ever need it again).
7) Turn on your computer
8) Do not install the drivers that are included with the box. Use the ones that you download from step 1. The ones you downloaded are more current and will provide better performance than the one's that are included on your driver CD. So if Windows wants to install your new graphics card, click cancel until it goes away. Once booted to desktop, double click the file you downloaded from step one. Let it does its thing.
9) Once the computer is restarted register your new graphics card and enjoy. You may need to change the refresh rate on your monitor. Do this by right clicking on your desktop -> properties -> Settings -> Advanced -> Monitor. Set it to whatever it was before you installed your new graphics (with the Nvidia drivers still installed).
 
Thanks again, i didnt know a few things in there, and the driver updates are great. Thanks for all your help, you've saved me so much time, and ive learnt alot from you blahahaha, and a few other guys. I'm ordering my card soon, and ill be on my way! And much to look forward to thanks you lot! I like the crowd around here :) Any problems with installation or anything ill say, cos you lot seem to know your stuff! Enjoy halflife2 guys! Keep the dreams alive! :p
 
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