Stop it!

[Sprafa]

Jmfc!

Stop trying to make mods about already established franchises like 007 or Middle Earth or AVP ( 3 examples I found in 2 seconds in this forum)

ffs, your greatest chance is to get the rights, and for that you'll have to ask. And they usually don't give them out, especially if there's already a videogame of it.

Come on, anyone can think of a great design and all they need is a team like yours, that you'll waste in freaking whining when *insert nasty corporation here* denies you the rights and threatens to sue you if you try to keep it!

I.e. - www.writingforums.com

if you check there and ask for game designs, promising to do all you can with the best, I can tell you hundreds will probably join in!

Have your own thoughts and ideas, there's no need to copy a popular franchise if you're ideas are any good.

 

[chu]

Yeah, it has become annoying. Alot of people don't have the brain cells to create there own idea so they mooch off a pre-existing ones.

 

[The Dark Elf]

Yeah, it has become annoying. Alot of people don't have the brain cells to create there own idea so they mooch off a pre-existing ones.

And then start wondering why people complain, or start quoting made up laws they heard some 12 year old on IRC say once and take it as gospel.

 

[Sprafa]

And then start wondering why people complain, or start quoting made up laws they heard some 12 year old on IRC say once and take it as gospel.

I'm really not sure if that was good or bad
:frog:

 

[Maxi]

Neither was i

 

[The Dark Elf]

Well, they come along wanting to make some mod of some film/game/book/boardgame/tvshow which is basically run around shooting but with a different name each time.

People then point out they can't do it. They reply saying everyone is being cruel etc. and then start giving out legal advice to others using what they heard from some kid on IRC as real law. Basically making it up as they go along to justify what they are doing.

It's quite simple

 

[Sprafa]

Ah. So it was good. well, someone should really try and make a sticky about this. I remember there was one.


Meh, whatever, maybe Hotsoup can make one of little "do this" announcments.

 

[The Dark Elf]

There's probably too many stickies now but we'll see how it goes.

 

[Sprafa]

I didn't mean make myne a sticky :|

 

[The Dark Elf]

Well I wasn't gonna go bothering to write another, I'd get all the hate mail.. this way you do. We all win.. except you :E hahaha naa just messin with ya

 

[chaosyndrom]

You see there are many different ways you can look at this, Vivendi or EA did not make Tolkiens LOTR universe, its like saying why didnt they make there own story instead of useing someone elses, probably because the movie was just released and they know big bucks would be made. But Im a fan and I dont want to make a mod based on anything else, I can think of my own story, but its like why? Im trying to help out the community here, you guys are coming off rude but I can see you are trying to help in your own rude way, I will try an change what I can without stressing it to much.

 

[The Dark Elf]

You see there are many different ways you can look at this, Vivendi or EA did not make Tolkiens LOTR universe, its like saying why didnt they make there own story instead of useing someone elses, probably because the movie was just released and they know big bucks would be made. But Im a fan and I dont want to make a mod based on anything else, I can think of my own story, but its like why? Im trying to help out the community here, you guys are coming off rude but I can see you are trying to help in your own rude way, I will try an change what I can without stressing it to much.

Dude, its illegal, you don't own the rights, EA got the rights to make games based on the movies. Middle Earth: Online couldn't get the rights to the movies so had to settle for other rights and are unable to look like the movies.

You are completely failing to understand the legalities here

and calling us rude is just making you look more ignorant

 

[CyberSh33p]

Dude, its illegal, you don't own the rights, EA got the rights to make games based on the movies. Middle Earth: Online couldn't get the rights to the movies so had to settle for other rights and are unable to look like the movies.

You are completely failing to understand the legalities here

and calling us rude is just making you look more ignorant

Who owns the rights to the books? I heard there was a weird thing with the games and all that rot and different people owning different rights to different things.

If the book is fair game, then a mod based on it would be also, but is it fair game?

 

[The Dark Elf]

Who owns the rights to the books? I heard there was a weird thing with the games and all that rot and different people owning different rights to different things.

If the book is fair game, then a mod based on it would be also, but is it fair game?

no, AFAIK the books aren't public domain, and even if they were there are many different rights to such things

film rights
miniseries rights
tv rights
music rights
book rights
adaption rights
game rights
distribution rights

and numerous others

The actual rights to LotR's belong with the Tolkien estate, and some others.. The film rights belong to New Line, but the Hobbit some other company has the distribution rights. Silmarillion I don't know who else owns the rights to that.

So there are many different rights, and the rights to such things are worth millions, they wouldn't be worth so much if just anyone could have them. And they've been worth a lot since before Jackson made his films.

 

[chaosyndrom]

Dude, its illegal, you don't own the rights, EA got the rights to make games based on the movies. Middle Earth: Online couldn't get the rights to the movies so had to settle for other rights and are unable to look like the movies.

You are completely failing to understand the legalities here

and calling us rude is just making you look more ignorant

I think you failed to see my point and now know the rights and said I would change yet you keep going on about its illegal.

"Waste of effort, considering you don't own any rights to it."

"Isn't us who should be worried, you don't seem to be able to grasp the intricaces of copyright law and intellectual property.

You have NO rights to use anything from LotR's."

How would you feel if your "dream" had been crushed in a matter of minutes? This is what I want to do and complete but I cant because a law, and you did not say it as if you were trying to be helpful in that you didnt think about other peoples emotions. Im not trying to start a fight, thats the last thing I would want to do. I already said Im changeing things around, and how can they say I dont have the rights for a 3d model? I mean even if its just a little off, then its off there concept, right?

 

[CyberSh33p]

no, AFAIK the books aren't public domain, and even if they were there are many different rights to such things

film rights
miniseries rights
tv rights
music rights
book rights
adaption rights
game rights
distribution rights

and numerous others

The actual rights to LotR's belong with the Tolkien estate, and some others.. The film rights belong to New Line, but the Hobbit some other company has the distribution rights. Silmarillion I don't know who else owns the rights to that.

So there are many different rights, and the rights to such things are worth millions, they wouldn't be worth so much if just anyone could have them. And they've been worth a lot since before Jackson made his films.

I see, I see.

Sort of annoying companies are so controlling over it, You'd think a non-profit mod wouldn't hurt them that bad... oh well though. one day the monetary system will come crashing down and I'll be there to grab all the phat lewt.

 

[The Dark Elf]

Film rights to Frank Herberts Dune were (maybe still are) owned by Dino Delaurentis after they purchased them from someone else, but they didn't own the miniseries rights (back in the 80's such a thing wasn't very popular so they never paid for them, which is how sci-fi and universal managed to get the rights to Dune miniseries after Delaurentis denied them the film rights.. I believe a similar thing happened with The Thing, which is how they can make a version of that.

Doesn't mean they just go ahead and do it though, they still need to purchase the rights to these things.

-

War of the Worlds is another example.. The book is public domain in the US, its owned by the wells estate in the UK, along with Jeff Wayne owning a number of rights to it, including i believe video game. The movie rights are owned by paramount, and a few other individuals/studios own adaption rights. I believe Paramount also own the TV series and miniseries rights and have recently attempted and likely successfully purchased other rights to it for the upcoming Tom Cruise remake.

So unless you have the rights to a WOTW adaption or own full rights, you can't do anything based on that neither. And you can't make a British version without running into trouble with Jeff Wayne who I hear insists his music is used, which puts a lot of people off as it becomes very limiting as to what you could do.

 

[The Dark Elf]

I see, I see.

Sort of annoying companies are so controlling over it, You'd think a non-profit mod wouldn't hurt them that bad... oh well though. one day the monetary system will come crashing down and I'll be there to grab all the phat lewt.

A mod could hurt them very badly.. You've surely seen how these mod teams like to think themselves real game developers, naming themselves whatevername studios or house or company, sticking Ltd on the end and thinking its legit... Often the quality produced is poor.

Throw in the majority of stupid people, who would go and think its a legit tie in or officially sanctioned game. Start writing to Fox or Paramount or Universal for bug fixes n such, getting no joy.

Then the fact the mod wouldn't be much good, thrown together by people who think they are fans but mess it up, making it look really bad, damaging the whole thing, defamation of godknows what.

Lastly, these companies/individuals OWN the rights, they paid for them, they are entitled to protect their property, just as your entitled to protect your identity

Think of it this way cyber.. when you joined this site, you understood that your personal details would remain personal right? What if we started letting anyone who asked have your details to use how they wanted. You'd be pretty pissed wouldn't you, i know I would. It's the same thing, its yours and you want to protect whats yours. Not let someone do what they like with it.

 

[Kon]

*nods*

i know how it feels because I've had someone steal my site design and modify it a little.. o_o

 

[chaosyndrom]

That is so different away Im not trying to steal anything its non-profit Im just a fan, geeze I cant believe you would even compare me with a thief.

 

[The Dark Elf]

That is so different away Im not trying to steal anything its non-profit Im just a fan, geeze I cant believe you would even compare me with a thief.

Your still not listening, it doesn't matter that your just a fan and its not for profit, infact its WORSE if your a fan, as your disrespecting it. I mean heck, I'm a HUGE LotR's fan, I loved all the books, I loved the Hobbit, I loved Silmarillion, the Fellowship books. Everything about it. But I don't own any rights to it, so I wont disrespect it by using any of it.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Exactly. I'm a fan of alot of things, and as tempted as I am to make a Jurassic Park mod, I still know that I could never get the rights to it.

But, at the same time, I can get my mod ideas into SW and into CAE, and I can use JP as inspiration to create something altogether new.
I, thanks to the work of teams of talented people, can invent my own research lab, and my own jungle environment.
Immitation is the greatest form of flattery. Outright copying, on the other hand, is just unoriginal.

The fact is, if you have a mod idea based on a franchise, you could remove every trace of that franchise's IP from it and it would play exactly the same, and it would be a lot less like cheap fan fiction.

 

[chaosyndrom]

Your still not listening, it doesn't matter that your just a fan and its not for profit, infact its WORSE if your a fan, as your disrespecting it. I mean heck, I'm a HUGE LotR's fan, I loved all the books, I loved the Hobbit, I loved Silmarillion, the Fellowship books. Everything about it. But I don't own any rights to it, so I wont disrespect it by using any of it.

Yeah, and thats an opinion.

 

[ductonius]

Yeah, and thats an opinion.

The last bit is, the first bit isn't.

It dosent matter if its a not for profit venture. If you dont own the rights or have the owners blessing, you can't use it.

 

[chaosyndrom]

infact its WORSE if your a fan, as your disrespecting it. I mean heck, I'm a HUGE LotR's fan, I loved all the books, I loved the Hobbit, I loved Silmarillion, the Fellowship books. Everything about it. But I don't own any rights to it, so I wont disrespect it by using any of it.

That is no fact, and look at the first word in that quote.

 

[The Dark Elf]

That is no fact, and look at the first word in that quote.

*sighs*

It's truly a shame that you have to resort to picking on someone's spelling/grammer when making a fool of yourself. So be it.

 

[mike8213]

So, lemme get this right, whenever they came out with a WC3 mod for CS, they had to get permission from whoever got the rights for it? If I wanted to come out with a CS mod set in the future, would I have to get CS to ok it?

 

[Mechagodzilla]

So, lemme get this right, whenever they came out with a WC3 mod for CS, they had to get permission from whoever got the rights for it? If I wanted to come out with a CS mod set in the future, would I have to get CS to ok it?

I'm not sure if I totally understand what you're saying, but in that first example, the mod makers would need permission from Blizzard to make a Warcraft 3 based mod.

You don't need permission to make a mod using a game engine you bought though, so you wouldn't need permission to modify CS into your own future mod (as long as the future mod isn't AVP or Star Wars or something.

 

[CyberSh33p]

A mod could hurt them very badly.. You've surely seen how these mod teams like to think themselves real game developers, naming themselves whatevername studios or house or company, sticking Ltd on the end and thinking its legit... Often the quality produced is poor.

Throw in the majority of stupid people, who would go and think its a legit tie in or officially sanctioned game. Start writing to Fox or Paramount or Universal for bug fixes n such, getting no joy.

Then the fact the mod wouldn't be much good, thrown together by people who think they are fans but mess it up, making it look really bad, damaging the whole thing, defamation of godknows what.

Lastly, these companies/individuals OWN the rights, they paid for them, they are entitled to protect their property, just as your entitled to protect your identity

Think of it this way cyber.. when you joined this site, you understood that your personal details would remain personal right? What if we started letting anyone who asked have your details to use how they wanted. You'd be pretty pissed wouldn't you, i know I would. It's the same thing, its yours and you want to protect whats yours. Not let someone do what they like with it.

yeah, you have a point. Meh, anyway, I'm for originality, was just exploring loopholes and possibilities and such. Go Edge of Justice!

I'll ask people to write to fox for bug fixes anyway >:] that'll be a laugh

 

[ductonius]

Can't the mods just close recuritment threads if its obvious that the mod is noting but a total IP rip?

Not only would it mean that we dont have to suffer through yet another X page discussion about how "no, it's not ok to use it even if it isn't making a profit.", but it would allow more legitimate threads to stay on the front page.

Just a thought.

 

[The Dark Elf]

Can't the mods just close recuritment threads if its obvious that the mod is noting but a total IP rip?

Not only would it mean that we dont have to suffer through yet another X page discussion about how "no, it's not ok to use it even if it isn't making a profit.", but it would allow more legitimate threads to stay on the front page.

Just a thought.

We tried that once, it resulted in threads being remade and the posters complaining.. which ended up with them keeping their threads at the top anyway.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

We tried that once, it resulted in threads being remade and the posters complaining.. which ended up with them keeping their threads at the top anyway.

Maybe have a sticky outlining the posting rules, pointing it out to first offenders and banning repeat posters who didn't couldn't be assed to read the sticky after having it shown to them?

 

[The Dark Elf]

Maybe have a sticky outlining the posting rules, pointing it out to first offenders and banning repeat posters who didn't couldn't be assed to read the sticky after having it shown to them?

We got that too, people still don't read em hehe

I swear, that idea someone had about a banning forum. I bet people would go post in it too, even with all the warnings lol

 

[ductonius]

We got that too, people still don't read em hehe

I swear, that idea someone had about a banning forum. I bet people would go post in it too, even with all the warnings lol

The UT2003 boards had a banning thread or a while to clear out all the idiots. If you wanted to be banned, you just had to post in it and boom, you're banned.

It actually did clear out a good number of the idiots.

 

[The Dark Elf]

The UT2003 boards had a banning thread or a while to clear out all the idiots. If you wanted to be banned, you just had to post in it and boom, you're banned.

It actually did clear out a good number of the idiots.

would be interesting to try one out some day

maybe we could just accidently call it the spam thread or arena instead though

 

[graydon20]

Ok, sorry this Thread bugs me. If someone wants to make a mod, what is stopping them from making one? It's what They want to do, there's nothing wrong with it. When's the last time a good 007 Game came out? Last i know, it was GoldenEye, and that was almost 8 years ago. Me and my Mod team are re-making it, because we feel it will bring back some old GoldenEye Fans not only to our mod, but to the Half-Life 2 community.

We're making mods for the community, not for ourselves. So don't say that it's 'annoying' because we can't think of our own ideas. And as for copying other games, if we alter small things in the game, it's techinally 'not the same game'. And i've talked to some ppl, and they're interested in our 007 Mod For example, whether or not we get allowance on the Name, who cares, we're doing this for fun. So don't put down people's Mods.

 

[Sprafa]

Ok, sorry this Thread bugs me. If someone wants to make a mod, what is stopping them from making one? It's what They want to do, there's nothing wrong with it. When's the last time a good 007 Game came out? Last i know, it was GoldenEye, and that was almost 8 years ago. Me and my Mod team are re-making it, because we feel it will bring back some old GoldenEye Fans not only to our mod, but to the Half-Life 2 community.

We're making mods for the community, not for ourselves. So don't say that it's 'annoying' because we can't think of our own ideas. And as for copying other games, if we alter small things in the game, it's techinally 'not the same game'. And i've talked to some ppl, and they're interested in our 007 Mod For example, whether or not we get allowance on the Name, who cares, we're doing this for fun. So don't put down people's Mods.

I only have one note for you - Rare made Goldeneye. Rare was bought by Microsoft's. Ever heard about Microsoft's lawyers?

And the 007 license is with EA.

I really, really hope you asked permission and they said "yes". But I really, really doubt it.

 

[graydon20]

Ok, even if i didn't ask, what's stopping me from making it another name? Nothing really. So if i don't get permission, i'll go with a different Mod name, what's the big deal?

 

[Dalamari]

Your using their characters, your using their script, so unless you make it so nobody can tell it is a 007 game, sure then it will work.

 

[graydon20]

Ok, well seeing that this is my first mod, and you guys have been around the scene longer than me, i took your advice(s), and we've changed the mod. We're still doing the same thing (FPS), but we know we have the talent to create our own concepts. Anyway, thanks for the feedback i guess .