Troops' Gravestones Have Pentagon Slogans

[CptStern]

this is pretty disgusting


ARLINGTON, Virginia - Unlike earlier wars, nearly all Arlington National Cemetery gravestones for troops killed in Iraq or Afghanistan are inscribed with the slogan-like operation names the Pentagon selected to promote public support for the conflicts.

The vast majority of military gravestones from other eras are inscribed with just the basic, required information: name, rank, military branch, date of death and, if applicable, the war and foreign country in which the person served.

Families of fallen soldiers and Marines are being told they have the option to have the government-furnished headstones engraved with "Operation Enduring Freedom" or "Operation Iraqi Freedom" at no extra charge, whether they are buried in Arlington or elsewhere. A mock-up shown to many families includes the operation names.

Families are supposed to have final approval over what goes on the tombstones. That hasn't always happened.

Nadia and Robert McCaffrey, whose son Patrick was killed in Iraq in June 2004, said "Operation Iraqi Freedom" ended up on his government-supplied headstone in Oceanside, Calif., without family approval.

"I was a little taken aback," Robert McCaffrey said, describing his reaction when he first saw the operation name on Patrick's tombstone. "They certainly didn't ask my wife; they didn't ask me." He said Patrick's widow told him she had not been asked either.

"In one way, I feel it's taking advantage to a small degree," McCaffrey said. "Patrick did not want to be there, that is a definite fact."

The owner of the company that has been making gravestones for Arlington and other national cemeteries for nearly two decades is uncomfortable, too.

"It just seems a little brazen that that's put on stones," said Jeff Martell, owner of Granite Industries of Vermont. "It seems like it might be connected to politics."

The Department of Veterans Affairs says it isn't. "The headstone is not a PR purpose. It is to let the country know and the people that visit the cemetery know who served this country and made the country free for us," VA official Steve Muro said."

 

[The Monkey]

If anything, it should be the iraqi war. With the soldier's/relatives' permission, of course.

 

[CptStern]

or:

Operation
Iraqi
Liberation

 

[The Monkey]

TBH, if I ever fought in a war, and was killed, I wouldn't mind of the war's name was on my tombstone.

 

[CptStern]

ya but why the name the US gave to promote itself?

"Operation Enduring Freedom"

is such bullshit especially in light of all that's happened since the beginning

 

[Angry Lawyer]

TBH, if I ever fought in a war, and was killed, I wouldn't mind of the war's name was on my tombstone.

I'd be too dead to notice, TBH.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Glirk Dient]

ya but why the name the US gave to promote itself?

"Operation Enduring Freedom"

is such bullshit especially in light of all that's happened since the beginning

Yeah that's a good point. The families should be allowed to decide what goes on there. Whoever made the decision to put it on without asking the families deserves to be beat.

 

[Kebean PFC]

Yeah it should be the families choice. t was wrong for them to put anything on the marker without the families OK. And if anything i should be "Iraq War" none of the Operation stuff.

Operation
Iraqi
Liberation

I really hope you are just kidding. If not, please quit being an asshole, ok?

 

[marksmanHL2 :)]

Yeah it should be the families choice. t was wrong for them to put anything on the marker without the families OK. And if anything i should be "Iraq War" none of the Operation stuff.


I really hope you are just kidding. If not, please quit being an asshole, ok?

Having an opinion does not make you an asshole. Not one based on soooo much fact anyway....



Ahem, be nice :thumbs:

 

[No Limit]

Just another case of the right using dead soldiers as political tools. This was the case with not allowing pictures of coffins being taken back home and them not allowing real body counts of American soldiers. When will you Republicans, seinfeld, Glirk, whoever stop putting up with this bullshit? Because Bush doesn't listen to people like me or Cindy Sheehan, but he will listen to you.

 

[Kebean PFC]

Because Bush doesn't listen to people like me or Cindy Sheehan, but he will listen to you.

No he wont. You are either with or against.

Just another case of the right using dead soldiers as political tools.

Just like Cindy Sheehan and her son? She is using a dead soldier (her son) to pomote her ideals, just like the pentagon is using the soldier o promote thier ideals.

 

[No Limit]

No he wont. You are either with or against.


Just like Cindy Sheehan and her son? She is using a dead soldier (her son) to pomote her ideals, just like the pentagon is using the soldier o promote thier ideals.

Cindy Sheehan is doing what she is doing because her son did not want to be in that war, and he died because of Bush. You, like others, have absolutely no right to judge her. She lost a son because of Bush, and you want her to be happy with that?

 

[Lemonking]

Bush didnt kill her son

 

[pvtbones]

no he only signed his death warrent.

 

[gh0st]

operation enduring freedom is the name of the war/military action that they were killed in. that "commondreams" article is just trying too hard. there is about the same political agenda involved in this as there is putting "operation rolling thunder" on the gravestones of american soldiers during vietnam. i agree that families should be able to furnish their family members gravestones as they please with the full support of the government. and it isnt a pentagon slogan, its pretty widely recognized that enduring freedom or iraqi liberation are the names.

 

[staticprimer]

I don't have any problem with them putting the names of the wars on the stones, I've just always had a problem with the names themselves. They just feel like blatent propaganda. There's no use crying about it though, because there's no changing the names now.

 

[No Limit]

Bush didnt kill her son

I really wonder if you would have that same feeling if you had a father that didn't want to be in that war die.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

It says the name of the Operation they died in :/.

Would you complain if WWII soldiers graves said "Operation Torch" or "Operation Overlord" on them?

They way you titled the thread it sounds like you were going to post the graves said something like "This soldier died in defense of the great an honorable Donald Rumsfeld, may he live a grand life and long live the United States Defense Department" or crap.

edit; Done without permission is not good, but I'm really, really doubting it's done to make some sort of political statement or anything. It just seems like they were wrong in putting extra stuff on it the family didn't want, they're not trying to make some sort of statement/propoganda.

 

[Kebean PFC]

Cindy Sheehan is doing what she is doing because her son did not want to be in that war, and he died because of Bush. You, like others, have absolutely no right to judge her. She lost a son because of Bush, and you want her to be happy with that?

Then dont be a hypocrit (sp?). Bush is doing what he is doing to secure support for the war, just as sheehan is doing the opposite. Please dont confuse your perception of right and wrong with sheean. She is using her son as a political icon.

Did i ever say i wanted her to be happy? I just said dont be a hypocrit. You think it is different becuase you think what she is doing is right. I dont, and i dont agree with the war, in case you were wondering, i also dont support Bush. However if you can tell me what the difference is between Sheehan using a dead soldier and the Pentagon using a dead soldier then i will listen. I dont beleive Sheehan has a document written by her son that says something like this:
"If i am killed in action in Iraq, please use me as a icon in the fight against the war. Don't be shy, dredge up all my personal info and distribute it to help destroy what i fought and died to build."
'Cuase the way i see it this is what she is doing.

What is so hard to understand about the fact that we cannot pull out now. We are in too deep. Would you like this to be another Vietnam? A socio-economic blow to the US? Basically negating any positive affect that those deaths might have had? I suppose that would make Sheehan happy right? To have us pull out and then make her sons death truley pointless.

 

[Lemonking]

I really wonder if you would have that same feeling if you had a father that didn't want to be in that war die.

yes I would

 

[CptStern]

Then dont be a hypocrit (sp?). Bush is doing what he is doing to secure support for the war, just as sheehan is doing the opposite. Please dont confuse your perception of right and wrong with sheean. She is using her son as a political icon.

Did i ever say i wanted her to be happy? I just said dont be a hypocrit. You think it is different becuase you think what she is doing is right. I dont, and i dont agree with the war, in case you were wondering, i also dont support Bush. However if you can tell me what the difference is between Sheehan using a dead soldier and the Pentagon using a dead soldier then i will listen. I dont beleive Sheehan has a document written by her son that says something like this:
"If i am killed in action in Iraq, please use me as a icon in the fight against the war. Don't be shy, dredge up all my personal info and distribute it to help destroy what i fought and died to build."
'Cuase the way i see it this is what she is doing.

oh do shut up ...you have no ****ing clue what it's like to lose a child. Losing a child for something that could have been prevented is especially traumatic ..I bet there's more than a few parents that are angry that their children died needlessly for the greed of a few

 

[No Limit]

Then dont be a hypocrit (sp?). Bush is doing what he is doing to secure support for the war, just as sheehan is doing the opposite. Please dont confuse your perception of right and wrong with sheean. She is using her son as a political icon.

Did i ever say i wanted her to be happy? I just said dont be a hypocrit. You think it is different becuase you think what she is doing is right. I dont, and i dont agree with the war, in case you were wondering, i also dont support Bush. However if you can tell me what the difference is between Sheehan using a dead soldier and the Pentagon using a dead soldier then i will listen. I dont beleive Sheehan has a document written by her son that says something like this:
"If i am killed in action in Iraq, please use me as a icon in the fight against the war. Don't be shy, dredge up all my personal info and distribute it to help destroy what i fought and died to build."
'Cuase the way i see it this is what she is doing.

What is so hard to understand about the fact that we cannot pull out now. We are in too deep. Would you like this to be another Vietnam? A socio-economic blow to the US? Basically negating any positive affect that those deaths might have had? I suppose that would make Sheehan happy right? To have us pull out and then make her sons death truley pointless.

Her son's death was already truly pointless, the entire world knows this except for the right wing in this country and a few minorities in other western countries. The right wing doesnt agree, thats fine, whatever, even if they don't have any facts to back up how there is a positive point to the Iraq war. However, what the right wing does is take a mother that lost her son because of them and they do everything to discredit her simply because she doesn't agree. I don't agree fully with what she is calling for, but I think that prick you call your president owes it to all those families camping outside of Crawford that lost their sons to at least hear what they have to say. Cindy Sheehan is not the only one, hundreds of other mothers made it out there and there are thousands more family members in the same position.

And the fact that you say she is using her sons death for political gain tells me you don't give a shit about our soldiers out there. Casey Sheehan did not want to be in that war nor did he believe in the 'noble cause' Bush always talks about. Yet, he gave his life for that 'noble cause'. She is out there trying to stop another mother from losing her son in this horrible, unjustified, war; something her son would have wanted. The pentagon is using the dead as a political tool without the parent's permission; the fact you would compare the 2 is sickening. You have never lost a son and I pray you never do, but your arrogance and insensitivity to the matter simply because Cindy Sheehan doesn't agree with your postition is disgusting.

 

[The Mullinator]

To tell you the truth I am more surprised that it looks like the tombstones are made of marble rather than granite. Marble weathers far faster and looks far worse than granite after as short a time as 25 years.

 

[No Limit]

yes I would

No, you wouldn't. So, have you enlisted yet? I'm sure you are of legal age. And if you die then oh well, it was noble cause, right?

 

[Kebean PFC]

the fact you would compare the 2 is sickening

They are one in the same. Did Casey Sheehan tell is mother to do all this stuff?

Her son's death was already truly pointless

No, not really. If we pull out now though it will be.

And the fact that you say she is using her sons death for political gain tells me you don't give a shit about our soldiers out there

WTF? I care alot about the soldiers see as how 3 of my best freinds are deployed out there now and one has already died. She is using her son as an icon, a martyr, to rally support around.

something her son would have wanted.

And we know this how? Becuase his emotionally distruaght mother says so?

insensitivity to the matter simply because Cindy Sheehan doesn't agree with your postition is disgusting.

I wouldnt care if Sheehan went and protested the war. Why i am insensitive to her is becuase she is using her son as a tool to get sympathy and support.

oh do shut up ...you have no ****ing clue what it's like to lose a child.

Nor do you, so you can shut the ****up too. Just becuase you don't agree with me doesnt give you the right to be an ass.

Losing a child for something that could have been prevented is especially traumatic

Yes. And the point is? As i said before, if we pull out now, her sons death will be truley pointless, and that is what anger me about you two. You donot realize that something good may come of this. Possibly, maybe. But if we leave than even that small chance will dissapear.

 

[CptStern]

Nor do you, so you can shut the ****up too.

yes I do so stfu

 

[Kebean PFC]

Really stern? You lost a son in the war?

 

[CptStern]

like it makes a difference where. a loss is still a loss and until you're a parent you will NEVER understand

 

[gh0st]

like it makes a difference where. a loss is still a loss and until you're a parent you will NEVER understand

i lost about 25 million knuckle children about 8 minutes ago i know how it feels.

 

[CptStern]

you're an idiot

 

[gh0st]

you're an idiot

 

[Solaris]

Yes. And the point is? As i said before, if we pull out now, her sons death will be truley pointless, and that is what anger me about you two. You donot realize that something good may come of this. Possibly, maybe. But if we leave than even that small chance will dissapear.

No, nothing good can come out of this. More Iraqi civillians will die, More mothers losing sons. The country is on the verge of civil war, and coalition troops are hardly using peacekeeping tatics.

 

[marksmanHL2 :)]

Really stern? You lost a son in the war?

Stop being such a jackass. Please?


EDIT: sorry... bit reactionary there...

 

[No Limit]

They are one in the same. Did Casey Sheehan tell is mother to do all this stuff?

Casey was against the war. Simple as that, he would have wanted the war to end.

No, not really. If we pull out now though it will be.

Yes, really. Can you name one positive thing (without mentioning Saddam) that came out of this invasion or that will come out of the invasion? They are on the verge of a civil war and insurgents are stepping up attacks each day. We will be there for decades, whatever minor advantage we have with Saddam gone will be much worse for how unstable we made the area.

WTF? I care alot about the soldiers see as how 3 of my best freinds are deployed out there now and one has already died. She is using her son as an icon, a martyr, to rally support around.

Something her son supports. Sorry about your friend, where are the other 2 deployed at?

And we know this how? Becuase his emotionally distruaght mother says so?

Yes, we know this from the mother. If you know anyone that knows her son better I'm sure she'll be happy to listen to them. And yes, she is emotionally distraught thanks to Mr. Bush.

I wouldnt care if Sheehan went and protested the war. Why i am insensitive to her is becuase she is using her son as a tool to get sympathy and support.

Again, something her son would have supported. How many times do I have to hammer in to your head he did not support the war but was forced to go?

Yes. And the point is? As i said before, if we pull out now, her sons death will be truley pointless, and that is what anger me about you two. You donot realize that something good may come of this. Possibly, maybe. But if we leave than even that small chance will dissapear.

Again, what good? A civil war, an unstable government, no security in the entire country, completely destroyed infostructure, I'm guessing 10s of thousands of sodliers dead by the time the conflict ends and hundred of thousands more of civillians and trillions of dollars spent by the time we get out of there. And you have the decency to say just maybe something good will come out of it?

 

[No Limit]

you're an idiot

+1

Apperently having a child die is humorous now.

 

[Lemonking]

No, you wouldn't. So, have you enlisted yet? I'm sure you are of legal age. And if you die then oh well, it was noble cause, right?

who are you to tell me what I would do. and what not?
If Id die in Iraq (yes Ive been thinking about joining) Im sure my mom and my dad wouldnt blame Bush

 

[No Limit]

who are you to tell me what I would do. and what not?
If Id die in Iraq (yes Ive been thinking about joining) Im sure my mom and my dad wouldnt blame Bush

You are thinking of joining? When do you plan to join, when its over? Come on, look at all the collage benefits you will get and all the money you will earn. I don't see a reason for you not to join since this is clearly a noble war and a noble cause.

Your parents shouldn't blame Bush as you volunteered on your own free will; however, Casey didn't have that option. Maybe if enough of you chickenhawks join up we can bring some of those that don't want to be there but have been there for 2-3 years now back home.

 

[Kebean PFC]

Sorry about your friend, where are the other 2 deployed at?

One is in Iraq and one is doing MP duty in Afganistan.

Again, what good? A civil war, an unstable government, no security in the entire country, completely destroyed infostructure, I'm guessing 10s of thousands of sodliers dead by the time the conflict ends and hundred of thousands more of civillians and trillions of dollars spent by the time we get out of there. And you have the decency to say just maybe something good will come out of it?

Yes i hope that the thousands of deaths will not be in vain, ok? Having someone die for nothing is probably the worst thing that could happen.I hope that somehow they will be able to set up a stable government (regardless if it is a democracy).

EDIT:

Casey didn't have that option

WTF?? He joined voluntarily didn't he? He enlisted. See as how there is no draft he had to have enlisted. He could have stated he was a concentious (sp?) objecator and got some QuarterMaster duty. I appluade Casey, he was a true soldier, and even though he didnt agree with the war, he still fought it.

Maybe if enough of you chickenhawks join up, When do you plan to join, when its over?

Again some of us are still underage. Your a fool if you dont think we will be figting over there for another couple years.

 

[No Limit]

Yes i hope that the thousands of deaths will not be in vain, ok? Having someone die for nothing is probably the worst thing that could happen.I hope that somehow they will be able to set up a stable government (regardless if it is a democracy).

But saying you hope is such as stupid thing to say (no offense), there honestly is no way in hell this could turn out to be worth it even if a tiny amount of good comes from it, which it probably wont. The problem I have you will not admit that as you seem to think that if you admit that you are somehow insulting the troops and it is your fault things aren't going well. This is the mentality the far right has installed in many. The point is this whole thing was Bush's fault and any senator's that went along with it, Democratic or Republican. The more you apologize for their actions the worse it is. The right wing, along with many in the democratic party, completely ****ed this up. It is their fault those soldiers are dying and it is there fault if nothing good comes from this. It is your duty to not support those people. Living in some fantasy that things will turn out okay after 1,800 US troops and thousands of civillians have died will not make things better. Admitting the guy you voted for is to blame for this and never voting for anyone that supported him again will make things better as those people that didn't support this are willing to admit things aren't going well there and might actually come up with some solutions to it. Having a president say things are getting better there and his vice president saying the insurgency is in its last throes will only make things worse, do you not agree?

WTF?? He joined voluntarily didn't he? He enlisted. See as how there is no draft he had to have enlisted. He could have stated he was a concentious (sp?) objecator and got some QuarterMaster duty. I appluade Casey, he was a true soldier, and even though he didnt agree with the war, he still fought it.

He fought it because he had to. He enlisted because he trusted the president not to do something like this, he was wrong. but to blame him instead of the president for the president's mistake is terribly wrong.

Again some of us are still underage. Your a fool if you dont think we will be figting over there for another couple years.

We will be there for decades. My point is some of those soldiers that have been there for 3 years now want to come home; they deserve to come home. It is your duty if you support this war to get them home, that means enlist if you have to. If you are underage and plan on joining when you turn 17 and go over there when you are 18 I will respect you; if you don't want to do this you have no right to say this war is a noble war to be fighting.

 

[baxter]

Yes i hope that the thousands of deaths will not be in vain, ok? Having someone die for nothing is probably the worst thing that could happen.I hope that somehow they will be able to set up a stable government (regardless if it is a democracy).

The death of any individual is a dreadful loss, I’m sorry do you really believe that the death of thousands is a means to an end?
Our political masters determine a course of action and we follow this course, regardless of cost, suffering and loss. We simply follow our superiors, obey orders and carry on without question.

Again some of us are still underage. Your a fool if you dont think we will be figting over there for another couple years.

Ummh.. and fighting over there for a couple of years is a good thing?

As a side issue, this is the vilest comment I have ever seen on a forum

i lost about 25 million knuckle children about 8 minutes ago i know how it feels