UK takes one step closer to 1984

[Atomic_Piggy]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7410885.stm

Plans for a super-database containing the details of all phone calls and e-mails sent in the UK have been heavily criticised by experts.

The government is considering the changes as part of its ongoing fight against serious crime and terrorism.

Assistant Information Commissioner Jonathan Bamford has warned that the UK could be "sleepwalking into a surveillance society".

Others have questioned how such a database could be made secure.

Public confidence

"While the public is "sleepwalking" into a surveillance society, the government seems to have its eyes wide open although, unfortunately, to everything except security," said Jamie Cowper, data protection expert at data protection firm PGP Corporation.

"The bottom line is - information of this nature should only be held if - and only if - it can be demonstrated that an appropriate system of checks and balances is in place and the security of the information being stored is of paramount concern," he added.

Public confidence in the governments' ability to look after data has been dented in recent months with high profile failures, including the loss of a CD carrying all the personal details of every child benefit claimant.

The latest plans being mulled by the Home Office will form part of the proposed Communications Bill, which is due to be considered by MPs later this year.

It is, said a Home Office spokesman, crucial "to ensure that public authorities have access to communications data essential for counter-terrorism and investigation of crime purposes."

Risks The more people who have access to it the more risks there would be

Chris Mayers, Citrix Systems

It would extend the powers of RIPA (the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act) which currently allows hundreds of government agencies access to communications data.

Some believe such legislation, which requires government authorities to request information from communication providers, is more than adequate for law enforcement purposes.

"The fight against terrorism doesn't require a centralised database," said Chris Mayers, chief security architect at Citrix Systems, an applications delivery firm.

"Such a database would face threats from both outside and inside. The more people who have access to it the more risks there would be," he said.

Big Brother

The Internet Service Providers' Association said it was seeking more information about the proposals.

"In particular we want to know more about the Government's intentions regarding "modifying the procedures for acquiring communications data," said a spokesman.

In the run-up to RIPA being approved by parliament, human rights campaigner Privacy International argued that such an act would be a dangerous first step towards a "Big Brother" society.

According to Gus Hosein, a senior fellow at Privacy International, the latest proposals could be even more controversial.

"The idea that ISPs need to collect data and send it en masse to central government is, without doubt, illegal," he said.

Survelliance in public areas is one thing, but wtf does the government think gives them the right to listen to my phone calls and read my emails? Christ I'll be glad when we get rid of the current government and vote in someone who has acts like they have an education.

 

[kirovman]

They introduce these laws with the guise that they are "fighting terror", but then they use these laws to spy on more mundane things.
I happened with the wiretap laws, the councils now use anti-terror laws to spy on alleged fly-tippers. Elderly gentlemen are arrested at Labour party conferences under counter-terror laws.

Hopefully it's not too late to reverse the damage that Gordon Mugabe and his Labour cronies have done.

 

[Gargantou]

Meh, I've been saying ever since I was 14 that governments would use terrorism and increasing worldwide tensions as an excuse to turn into police states.

 

[PimpinPenguin]

After all the screw ups the Government have had with our data, they actually think we will give them more. No worries anyway if they do implement it it won't be for another 20 years at least, just look at the NHS computer system it years and millions behide schedule. Our government and technology don't mix.

 

[Cormeh]

If they ever got a system like that up and running you know that the people in charge would be the most useless ****-scoffs to ever be employed. Data would go missing, your details would be exploited and all of it would be funded by taking precious funding from your payslip.

 

[PimpinPenguin]

I can just see all our details "leaked" to spam and call sale centres.
Why do you say we are taking one step closer to 1984? i don't get it.

 

[Tagaziel]

Well, 1984 took place in England (Airstrip One) after all...

 

[Mr Stabby]

David Icke was right all along.

 

[repiV]

I can just see all our details "leaked" to spam and call sale centres.
Why do you say we are taking one step closer to 1984? i don't get it.

The DVLA routinely sells details to private companies for profit.

 

[Laivasse]

I can just see all our details "leaked" to spam and call sale centres.
Why do you say we are taking one step closer to 1984? i don't get it.

He means the book 1984 by George Orwell, which describes a dystopian, authoritarian version of England.

 

[Saturos]

*snip



Survelliance in public areas is one thing, but wtf does the government think gives them the right to listen to my phone calls and read my emails? Christ I'll be glad when we get rid of the current government and vote in someone who has acts like they have an education.

Actually, I could see the slogan of future phone companies all across the world in the near future being, "You talk, we listen".

Meh, I don't care If the government(s) are watching me. As long as your not doing anything wrong, it doesn't really matter. It's the thieves, outlaws, and anarchists who should be concerned. Are you either of these things?

 

[elkaebee]

So it's 2007 in the UK now?

Whoa.

 

[Sulkdodds]

I was going to make that joke.

The DVLA routinely sells details to private companies for profit.

Everybody does this routinely; the Data Protection Act allows them to. If I wanted to live in a house next year I had to sign a contract which, under said act, allowed the housing company to use any and all of the personal details we give them for 'marketing purposes' - ie, selling them. The DPA is very deceptively named - rather than being a bulwark to protect information, it is simply patchwork of loopholes, a legal excuse for people to get their hands on other people's details.

 

[elkaebee]

I was going to make that joke.

I made it Sulkdoddus, because, I, I, am the best.

 

[repiV]

Actually, I could see the slogan of future phone companies all across the world in the near future being, "You talk, we listen".

Meh, I don't care If the government(s) are watching me. As long as your not doing anything wrong, it doesn't really matter. It's the thieves, outlaws, and anarchists who should be concerned. Are you either of these things?

So you believe that obedience to the state is more important than freedom? The state is supposed to serve the people, not control them. And every right-thinking person would value their privacy and ability to live their lives without the government spying on them.

Define "outlaw". Next time, it could be you. How about the people who got arrested for wearing "Bollocks to Blair" t-shirts? Ooh, evil outlaws. Or the family who got put under surveillance under anti-terrorism laws to check they weren't pretending to be from a different school catchment area?

The UK government now employs 20% of the UK workforce and spends 45% of the country's GDP. They're more like overlords than leaders. Twisted times we live in.

I was going to make that joke.

Everybody does this routinely; the Data Protection Act allows them to. If I wanted to live in a house next year I had to sign a contract which, under said act, allowed the housing company to use any and all of the personal details we give them for 'marketing purposes' - ie, selling them. The DPA is very deceptively named - rather than being a bulwark to protect information, it is simply patchwork of loopholes, a legal excuse for people to get their hands on other people's details.

Interesting...I didn't know that. It does piss me off when people call me up (banks, usually) and then ask me to confirm who I am for data protection purposes before even telling me what they want to talk to me about, which I won't want to talk to them about anyway.

 

[<RJMC>]

one questiong to da british,do the queen is the one who order all this?

 

[Sulkdodds]

No, RJMC, you may not assassinate the Queen.

 

[Slug Advisor]

Wait, how do four countries time travel?

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

one questiong to da british,do the queen is the one who order all this?

No, the queen is just there for looks (she also brings money in, lots, from tourism). And though I would be otherwise against monarchies she really is a lovely lady.

 

[Dan]

Think about poor Mrs.Buttle.

 

[<RJMC>]

No, the queen is just there for looks (she also brings money in, lots, from tourism). And though I would be otherwise against monarchies she really is a lovely lady.

how so?

do she sits on a throne in the streets and people take pics whit her?

 

[Tagaziel]

Queen > You

It's all about the corgis, mother****ers.

 

[clarky003]

The core of the problem is simple. We believe we have a democratic government that serves the people or should serve the people.

The reality however is much different. The government serves the bankers not the people, we keep the money in circulation that we believe to be our countries wealth. The bankers however have control over the release of that wealth, and have the ability to print extra money for nothing, which only ends up resulting in inflation, so they can clearly manipulate the system at will.

We are made to believe we are the ones in control when we are brainwashed into thinking our paper money has any value atall. The fractional reserve system the bank of england operates on is daylight robbery, and if nobody knows what fractional reserve banking is then it's time to get with it.

The bankers, by there own rule, are allowed to lend out 10 times the amount of money that they hold in valued reserves (gold/silver). This basically means they earn full interest off money that doesn't even hold 1 quarter of it's said value. To the point, your being robbed when you think their doing you a favour.

This is how the bankers make the money to buy more reserves and make extorsionate amounts of profit on the side, by sweeping up failed morgages with higher interest rates and in the process aquiring more land and wealth. These people are your government, not the figures in parliment who are just tools of the system. The banking families govern through creation, control and dominance of the currencies.

 

[repiV]

How on earth did we go from "the government are totalitarian bastards" to stupid Illuminati conspiracy theories?

PS. I'm attending a family get-together at the estate of Philip Rothschild next month. Through the corridors of power I shall have you silenced. Ph33r me.

 

[Dinkleberry]

1984 is such an important book. They should make it compulsory reading in schools.

Spoiler

;-)

 

[AJ Rimmer]

Queen > You

It's all about the corgis, mother****ers.

Actually, one of her most challenging duties is to make sure Philip shuts the **** up.

 

[nurizeko]

The core of the problem is simple. We believe we have a democratic government that serves the people or should serve the people.

The reality however is much different. The government serves the bankers not the people, we keep the money in circulation that we believe to be our countries wealth. The bankers however have control over the release of that wealth, and have the ability to print extra money for nothing, which only ends up resulting in inflation, so they can clearly manipulate the system at will.

We are made to believe we are the ones in control when we are brainwashed into thinking our paper money has any value atall. The fractional reserve system the bank of england operates on is daylight robbery, and if nobody knows what fractional reserve banking is then it's time to get with it.

The bankers, by there own rule, are allowed to lend out 10 times the amount of money that they hold in valued reserves (gold/silver). This basically means they earn full interest off money that doesn't even hold 1 quarter of it's said value. To the point, your being robbed when you think their doing you a favour.

This is how the bankers make the money to buy more reserves and make extorsionate amounts of profit on the side, by sweeping up failed morgages with higher interest rates and in the process aquiring more land and wealth. These people are your government, not the figures in parliment who are just tools of the system. The banking families govern through creation, control and dominance of the currencies.

Good post with some interesting points, but when push comes to shove, do we not have the right to make our vote in elections for politicians, and does not these votes directly effect who can and cannot take office?.


I fully agree the system can be corrupt and jerked a bit, and un-informed or just opposing votes from opposing people with opposing opinions can be irritating, but we do have a democratic system, and it functions, so far well enough for us. I think what your trying to get at is more the financial inequality and corruption, and those are valid points, but they in themselves do not make a state undemocratic.