Valve Unveils 64-Bit Source™ Technology

[-smash-]

You heard me right! Valve seems to be on a roll lately with upgrading and modifying their Source engine. A 64-bit platform from Valve has been something many, if not all fans have been craving since Half-Life 2‘s release. This achievement is a big step toward next-generation gaming, making room for more performance gains and raising the bar in the graphics department.[br]Today, Valve has released a 64-bit version of their Source engine. The first games to use this technology are native 64-bit versions of Half-Life 2 and Lost Coast.

"Bringing the Source technology to the AMD64 processor platform is an important step in the evolution of our game content and tools," said Gabe Newell, Valve’s co-founder and president. "This investment in future processing will allow us, and third party developers working with Source, to push the boundaries of the gaming experience."

This update is available to all Half-Life 2 owners via Steam. Of course, you need a 64-bit processor (AMD Athlon™ 64 FX is an example) and a 64-bit version of Windows to run the 64-bit versions of the updated titles.[br]More information on this press release can be read here! [br]

 

[Hugh_Jazz]

MY GOD YES!

...

Oh wait, I don't have Windows XP with 64 bit support.

Dang, gotta get it then. This was quite a surprise, though, and sure as hell a good one.

 

[dream431ca]

So what does this mean for graphics? Anyone got any comparisions of 32bit to 64bit?

 

[JNightshade]

DAMNIT! I want it... but I don't want Windows XP 64.

 

[Iced_Eagle]

So what does this mean for graphics? Anyone got any comparisions of 32bit to 64bit?

CPU has nothing to do with graphics It will probably just mean improved speeds/benchmarks and such (which could help with FPS and such)

 

[63]

Half-Life 2 on Nintendo 64?! SWEET!!

Too bad I don't have AMD64

 

[mezz]

Ooooh, sounds good

I'me eagerly awaiting some benchmarks, I might just make the switch to xp 64 for Aftermath

 

[Lazy_Moron]

Definetely a big Shocker. Honestly who saw this coming? Good job Valve. I like how they kept it a secret then just released it when no one saw it coming! They should do this method to Aftermath, so there is no hype!

 

[dream431ca]

CPU has nothing to do with graphics It will probably just mean improved speeds/benchmarks and such (which could help with FPS and such)

Bah! It's an ok announcement then. I don't plan on getting a 64 bit system though. I'm quite happy with my current copy of HL2.

 

[dogboy73]

Cool. I have an AMD64 Winchester .......... I don't want Windows 64 either! It's to early yet.

 

[deekey777]

I hope, VALVe will not release some "exclusive 64bit content". :x

My HL2: Lost Toast has been updated - why?

 

[hneaz]

ok, a quick n00b qns

does this apply to the regular amd 64 processor too?

 

[AgentXen]

I will wait for Windows Vista

 

[Epsi]

Lost Coast got a video stress test added.

 

[dogboy73]

does this apply to the regular amd 64 processor too?

...... Actually I was just thinking that myself. Sounds like its just the 64 FX chips that take advantage of this new technology.

 

[WritingARequiem]

How do you know if you have a 64 bit processor?

 

[armanguy]

lol wtf does this mean? i have amd 64 athlon?

 

[Asus]

To run 64bit code you also need to run a 64bit OS. AMD and Intel 64bit CPUs run in 32bit OR 64bit depending on what OS is installed. If you have Windows XP installed then only 32bit is available to you. Put a 64bit OS on there and you can then run 64Bbit code (example: Windows XP 64bit or Vista).

 

[armanguy]

oh ok , i only have xp installed i think its the 64 bit how do i find out?

 

[Asus]

oh ok , i only have xp installed i think its the 64 bit how do i find out?

Do you KNOW it is the 64bit version? Because Windows XP 64bit is not preinstalled on systems that you buy from the store.
If you had it you would know it.

 

[Krynn72]

ummm. He said that was an example. Of course it will work on regular 64bit.

edit: wow. the posts rolled in. This was to the people asking if it will work on non-fx models.

 

[ZoFreX]

If you have regular Windows XP you can trade it in with Microsoft for XP 64-bit Edition... but unless you're an enthusiast, it's probably a bit early for that.

Good news that more people are supporting 64-bit though, I might be switching to XP-64 sooner that I thought.

 

[DrDevin]

Benchmarks. NOW!

 

[Pajari]

This is a sorely misplaced optomization. How about getting rid of the BSP architecture that's been around since DOOM or getting rid of the hacky 3d skybox? Perhaps better developer tools? Maybe we could focus on rebuilding the Source engine from the ground up to be more accessible to modders and less restrictive, instead of optimizing an engine whose fundamentals are based on Quake 2.

And operating systems that make use of 64-bit processors aren't even out yet. Jeez.

 

[xrikazen]

very, very cool news.

 

[-smash-]

This is a sorely misplaced optomization. How about getting rid of the BSP architecture that's been around since DOOM or getting rid of the hacky 3d skybox? Perhaps better developer tools? Maybe we could focus on rebuilding the Source engine from the ground up to be more accessible to modders and less restrictive, instead of optimizing an engine whose fundamentals are based on Quake 2.

And operating systems that make use of 64-bit processors aren't even out yet. Jeez.

This is not misplaced.

Other technologies will be introduced to the Source engine overtime. It's only been in use publically for a year.

 

[bigburpco]

Don't have it. ;(

 

[Pajari]

This is not misplaced.

Other technologies will be introduced to the Source engine overtime. It's only been in use publically for a year.

I don't object to the concept of 64bit optomizations, they will come eventually and they'll improve a lot. But I don't see valve announcing any of the changes that I suggested, that are now industry standards and that would make the Source engine far better that any 64bit optomization could ever hope to.

They've made only superficial changes to the engine in a year's time and there's no reason to expect any more. These changes should never have been nessecary, anyway- they should have been integrated from the start. That's the reason this is all the more ridiculous.

 

[^Ben]

Arm chair developers are so fun.

 

[Kirkburn]

Pajari that is a very ignorant set of opinions you have there.

1. VALVe have stated MANY times that they will continue adding/modding the source engine. Heard of HDR?

2. 64-bit OSes DO exist and CAN be obtained. E.g. XP64 and Vista
EDIT: Also I'm a little confused at to why to insist on talking about 64bit in the future tense? Have u not noticed how many repliers on this thread have 64bit processors already?

3. You're saying that VALVe should create an engine that is 2, 3 years ahead of it's time? 64-bit hardly existed when HL2 was released, why would they bother supporting it when it would merely have meant delaying a great game further to support an extra 1000 people!
EDIT: Again, you complain that VALVe doesn't announce that they are introducing support for new industry standards ... I saw no announcement for this? Does that mean it doesn't exist, and that VALVe never worked on it?

4. And finally... 'the Source engine is restrictive to modders'. Other mods I've seen don't seem to be having trouble with totally changing Source from HL2-type games?

EDIT: I suppose I should also make my own comment Three cheers for progress!
My how I have missed posting here ...

 

[ZoFreX]

This is a sorely misplaced optomization. How about getting rid of the BSP architecture that's been around since DOOM or getting rid of the hacky 3d skybox? Perhaps better developer tools? Maybe we could focus on rebuilding the Source engine from the ground up to be more accessible to modders and less restrictive, instead of optimizing an engine whose fundamentals are based on Quake 2.

And operating systems that make use of 64-bit processors aren't even out yet. Jeez.

Actually, operating systems that make use of 64-bit processors have been out for some time. In addition, by making more software that is 64-bit, Valve are helping the 64-bit market immensely, which is a good thing - I'm about to retire a 64-bit processor having not once run 64 bit apps on it, so more software for 64 is something I've been wanting for a while now. It's not necessarily about optimisation (although I suspect, being the cpu limited game that it is, that HL2 will significantly benefit on lower spec 64-bit processors) but also about bringing the 64-bit future a little bit closer to the present.

 

[Pajari]

/\/\/\ I stand corrected as far as 64 bit operating systems go, and I did say that I don't obejct at all to 64 bit optomization. I even said it would be helpful. My point is that there are many far more important things and this is a bit strange for them to be worrying about when, IMO, there are more pressing matters.

Pajari that is a very ignorant set of opinions you have there.

1. VALVe have stated MANY times that they will continue adding/modding the source engine. Heard of HDR?

2. 64-bit OSes DO exist and CAN be obtained. E.g. XP64 and Vista
EDIT: Also I'm a little confused at to why to insist on talking about 64bit in the future tense? Have u not noticed how many repliers on this thread have 64bit processors already?

3. You're saying that VALVe should create an engine that is 2, 3 years ahead of it's time? 64-bit hardly existed when HL2 was released, why would they bother supporting it when it would merely have meant delaying a great game further to support an extra 1000 people!
EDIT: Again, you complain that VALVe doesn't announce that they are introducing support for new industry standards ... I saw no announcement for this? Does that mean it doesn't exist, and that VALVe never worked on it?

4. And finally... 'the Source engine is restrictive to modders'. Other mods I've seen don't seem to be having trouble with totally changing Source from HL2-type games?

1: I've heard of HDR. I didn't say that Valve didn't change the engine at all, I said they changed it superficially. And Valve can talk about making meaningful changes 'till they're blue in the face, but it doesn't matter because I've not seen a single thing done that was anything more than "ooh, more eye candy"

2: Yeah, Vista is in beta, so I guess you're right in that sense. If you want to run all of your games and applications on a Microsoft product in beta, be my guest. And I was talking about 64bit int he future tense because people own them, but they're not being used to anything approaching their full potential yet.

3: I'm saying Valve shouldn't create an engine years behind its time. Far Cry does all the things I talked about- eliminated BSP, eliminated the 3d skybox, created a far more effecient method of displaying insane draw distances, etc. And it came out before HL2 did. Source is not an entirely new engine, by the way. It's a souped-up Half-Life engine, and Half-Life was based on Quake. That's the main reason why BSP is still around.

4: If you'd ever tried to compile models for the Source engine or make meaningful changes to the game's code, you would know what you're talking about. It's a lot easier to mod for than, say, Call of Duty, but that still doesn't mean it's not a pain in the ass. There's a lot of unnessecary junk and hacky crap you have to wade through when modding Source.

 

[ZoFreX]

2: Yeah, Vista is in beta, so I guess you're right in that sense. If you want to run all of your games and applications on a Microsoft product in beta, be my guest. And I was talking about 64bit int he future tense because people own them, but they're not being used to anything approaching their full potential yet.

How many times do we have to say Windows XP 64-bit Edition before you manage to read it? Not to mention the amount of Linux distros that are 64-bit as well...

 

[^Ben]

Yawn, more ignorant "source is just quake 1" crap.

I tell you what, when and *if* you release your mod, i'll tell you what should of been in it, and that it's years behind it's time?

Fair deal?

And for getting stuff into source, batch scripts/3rd party tools are your freind and I have found are more powerfull for me than how some of the other engines work.

 

[CookieCuttah]

So how do I trade my current 32 bit windows for a 64 bit?

 

[BeaverMon]

I have an AMD 64 Athlon here, but using Windows 32 (AKA XP).
But I don't think I'm going to dish out $200 on a new OS to have better graphics in HL2. lol
HL2 looks good anyway. No need.

If it's anything I dish out money on, it's going to be a new video card. Maybe an ATI. Ohh, and a better sound card.

 

[Pajari]

Yawn, more ignorant "source is just quake 1" crap.

And for getting stuff into source, batch scripts/3rd party tools are your freind and I have found are more powerfull for me than how some of the other engines work.

Well, if you can prove to me that Source wasn't based on the original Half-Life engine and that the original Half-Life engine wasn't based on Quake, then go right ahead. I didn't say that source = quake 1, just that the fundamentals are the same, even if they've added far better rendering algorithms and things like physics and animation blending.

And yeah, I have to resort to 3rd party tools to get the job done. That's not exactly a good thing, having to wait for the community to make up for a developer's decision not to release decent tools. The engine may be advanced, but the tools are still in the dark ages.

EDIT: Thanks for the jest about WOTA, by the way. The community's support is always appreciated.

 

[^Ben]

I can easily prove it, look at the DLL structure of the half life 1 engine, and then look at the source DLL structure.

And then look at how the SDK code interacts with the engine on both SDK's.

Infact, I would say the ONLY code I have seen reused is some very basic stuff in BSP and there will probably be some old code in RAD floating around aswell.

Now, i'm not saying that they should keep BSP, but just randomly saying "oh source is crap just because they don't have something like farcry(what does that use again? I can't remember) or uses what UE3 uses or D3(I think they all use different techniques IIRC but don't quote me on that)

Getting rid of BSP should be the next priority, and from valves work with kdtrees it looks like they are starting to move away from ol' faithfull.

But just giving a blankment statement like "source is half life 1" is not good, and shows a lack of understanding of the engine.

 

[Pajari]

Now, i'm not saying that they should keep BSP, but just randomly saying "oh source is crap just because they don't have something like farcry(what does that use again? I can't remember) or uses what UE3 uses or D3(I think they all use different techniques IIRC but don't quote me on that)

Getting rid of BSP should be the next priority, and from valves work with kdtrees it looks like they are starting to move away from ol' faithfull.

But just giving a blankment statement like "source is half life 1" is not good, and shows a lack of understanding of the engine.

I'm not sure what Farcry's system is called, but I know it combines heightmaps and meshes with a tiny bit of bsp for the more complicated indoor areas. Most of it's heightmap-based, with meshes playing second fiddle and bsp rarely used in the levels, if at all. I know Halo is even less reliant on BSP- Halo's levels are just mesh-based and can be created all in 3ds max. Unreal 2 also relies mostly on heightmaps, too, but it includes more BSP than far cry. Perhaps I should have brought up those two as well.

Anyway, I tried to avoid making a balnket statement but perhaps I didn't express myself well enough. Source is not half life 1, but they are related, and they share some of the most antiquated features- BSP, skyboxes, etc, that should have been dropped a long time ago. I mean, BSP is a pretty major thing to carry over from hl1 to 2, and pretty crippling.

I hope Valve can move away from BSP, but its been so long and the change would be so drastic that I'm not sure if they're going to be able to do it in this incarnation of the engine. If they can do it, then more power to 'em.

 

[Asus]

Servers will run the game better in 64bit. =D