Where would humanity stand?

[Raziaar]

It's a simple question... with a complicated answer that I don't know.

Where would humanity stand if no more humans were taught how to communicate or use the tools that mankind has developed?

Let me explain a little bit. Mankind has evolved as people believe... from an ancient species. At one point in time, the very first forms of technology, and the harnessing of nature was learned, and ultimately passed down from generation from generation. These skills never needed to be learned anew. One human taught it to another human. That's basically how we have arrived as we are today... people passing on information and sharing it continously.

What i'm curious about... is if all human children, every last one... were no longer taught how to communicate in our defined languages, or to do anything that is involved with harnessing nature... such as creating fire, making tools, etc.

Would it only take one generation of this to completely revert mankind back to a primitive species, with crude forms of communication and intelligence? Is our applicable intelligence only derived from our knowledge passed on through the generations? Or have we rapidly developed instincts to interact with our world around is in ingenious ways, passed in through genes and exposing itself in the form of instinct?


Just a question i've been asking myself.

 

[Remus]

Well, I think that if you suppressed the learning proses of one generation you would revert humans to the primitive state with limited intelligence and communication skills. There are cases of children that have been raised in complete isolation and haven't been thought anything and they act like primitives.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

its tarzan theory man they find a way they can use tools just like the apes and if they can be the apes they can surpass them.

you see him he goes to england and becomes civilized just like that in like 5 minutes of movie time so what do you expect now?

 

[Raziaar]

So basically... we're only as advanced as our ability to memorize and pass on knowledge. Unlike the rest of the animal world which mostly relies on pure instinct.

its tarzan theory man they find a way they can use tools just like the apes and if they can be the apes they can surpass them.

you see him he goes to england and becomes civilized just like that in like 5 minutes of movie time so what do you expect now?

Psshaw. That's based on a writer's knowledge that a man would be able to do those things... whereas in reality it'd likely take many, many generations.

 

[Terminator]

Basically you would be left with instinct, google "feral children" kids have reverted to being "animals" after being lost out in the jungle e.t.c

Basically we havn't changed much since thousands of years ago, we've poisoned ourselves a bit using pesticides e.t.c but other than that are bodies and brains are just like they were back then.

A child requires an adult to learn skills however, so it would basically be whatever you taught it........environmental changes, could be the difference of someone studying at cambridge and someone out in the jungle beating a log against a tree to mark his area.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

which one is really happy though short recoil?

which one.

true happiness aint always a big college, sometimes its just gettin by and chilling

 

[Raziaar]

Basically you would be left with instinct, google "feral children" kids have reverted to being "animals" after being lost out in the jungle e.t.c

Basically we havn't changed much since thousands of years ago, we've poisoned ourselves a bit using pesticides e.t.c but other than that are bodies and brains are just like they were back then.

A child requires an adult to learn skills however, so it would basically be whatever you taught it........environmental changes, could be the difference of someone studying at cambridge and someone out in the jungle beating a log against a tree to mark his area.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feral_children

Thanks for pointing me in that direction.

EDIT: Beating a log takes too much energy. Why not just urinate or defecate like other animals? :-P

 

[bbson john]

I don't know whether I did misunderstand your statement, however...

The progression of humanity is not merely limited within our knowledge. In fact, our brain is physically improving, growing bigger and more complicated. Even if all our knowledge vaporized, it will take us a short time-span to re-establish what we have today, perhap a few millions years, not as long as we used to be. We must believe that we are more intelligent than we used to be. As we are losing our basic instinct, we have gained more on the other parts.

 

[Terminator]

which one is really happy though short recoil?

which one.

true happiness aint always a big college, sometimes its just gettin by and chilling

Heh, funny you should say that actually.

The closer to an animal you are, the happier (as long as you get all the basic needs...food, shelter e.t.c)

The further you are from animal, higher intelligence the more likely you are to be depressed, this being caused by thinking too much about ones existence and the point in carrying on e.t.c....if you understand why your body works the way it does and understand it's all just chemical signals telling you what to do, it becomes harder to carry on just living.

I suffer from the latter, i'm working on ways to make myself more animal like however, turning off the continous thought.

If i start speaking shit ignore me btw, it's 10:37am and i've not had any sleep.

 

[Raxxman]

yeah, to say evolution just stopped is a little silly. Evolution never stops.

Unless of course you don't believe in evolution. But that's another arguement.

 

[Raziaar]

Heh, funny you should say that actually.

The closer to an animal you are, the happier (as long as you get all the basic needs...food, shelter e.t.c)

The further you are from animal, higher intelligence the more likely you are to be depressed, this being caused by thinking too much about ones existence and the point in carrying on e.t.c....if you understand why your body works the way it does and understand it's all just chemical signals telling you what to do, it becomes harder to carry on just living.

I suffer from the latter, i'm working on ways to make myself more animal like however, turning off the continous thought.

If i start speaking shit ignore me btw, it's 10:37am and i've not had any sleep.

I disagree... You assume animals even live in a state of happiness through their lives. Sure, they may be contented... but that's nothing compared to the happiness we can achieve as highly evolved species... with so many things that can make us happy in various ways. Things that are unique to us humans.

The reality, is that animals live a very, very harsh life. All of them do. They don't all really know when the next meal will be... when they will be eaten by a predator... or all the other ways animals can come to a quick demise. Not to mention the extreme competition they have to face compared to species such as us humans who generally work together on a complete whole.

Animals don't leave easy lives, albeit having simpler lives. Humans on the other hand, live easy lives, but more complicated.

But anyways i'm rambling and I lost my point somewhere back there. <laughs>


EDIT: It's got nothing to do with evolution stopping... though some evolution theorists say humans have evolved all they can, which I disagree.

What i'm wondering... is just how fast we'd be completely reverted back to where we were hundreds of thousands of years ago... or if we'd be able to make all the same discoveries in a much shorter time, all over again. Some technologies happened as a result of sheer luck and chance... maybe those elements would never happen again in the random universe we live in?

 

[Raxxman]

Well in a way you are talking about evolution, just social evolution over genetic.

I think if you dropped humanity on Mars (just making a point to avoid past 'taint') the state of social evolution would depend entirely on needs. If food is in ready supply and no enviromental pressure (martians with death rays and the like) then social evolution would be very lax.

my view anyho

 

[Terminator]

Yeah raziaar, you missed the point i think
I was talking about the way of thinking, the state of the mind rather than the actualy physical conditions the creature is in.

 

[Dan]

Didn't you leave these forums? Like twice.

 

[Ren.182]

Didn't you leave these forums? Like twice.

Who cares?

I agree with Terminator. The closer our mental state is to that of an animals, i think we do lead happier lives.
I'm take things as they come and i'm really laid back about things. Which is pretty animal like i'd say. Though i do think deeply about things (space, life, lvoe etc etc) i don't let them get me depressed.

I think if we didn't teach a generation our knowledge? What happens would depend where they lived. If they lived in our cities (but have no education from adults or talked to by adults) Then i think they would just create their own languages and figure out how to use things by trial and error.
If we just put them in some empty place like a desert/jungle or where ever alone. Then i think they would revert back to simple beings, as long as they figured out how to survive that is.

 

[alehm]

Maybe we are already slowly limiting communication. If you study languages you'll find the older the langauge usually the more complex they are. Greek has a trememdous variety of expressiveness that does not exist in english today- or to put it another way- english may only have one word for phrase to express something that older, more 'primitive' languages expresses in more specific words and distinct meanings.

So basically, in a few thousand years we may all be walking around grunting and pointing at things. Especially if we have World War 3 and are forced to eat radioactive plants for the next few millenia.

 

[Raziaar]

Maybe we are already slowly limiting communication. If you study languages you'll find the older the langauge usually the more complex they are. Greek has a trememdous variety of expressiveness that does not exist in english today- or to put it another way- english may only have one word for phrase to express something that older, more 'primitive' languages expresses in more specific words and distinct meanings.

So basically, in a few thousand years we may all be walking around grunting and pointing at things. Especially if we have World War 3 and are forced to eat radioactive plants for the next few millenia.

What sort of expressiveness are you talking about?

I can currently express every little thing I have ever felt, using the english language, if I choose my words properly.

 

[Dan]

Maybe we are already slowly limiting communication. If you study languages you'll find the older the langauge usually the more complex they are. Greek has a trememdous variety of expressiveness that does not exist in english today- or to put it another way- english may only have one word for phrase to express something that older, more 'primitive' languages expresses in more specific words and distinct meanings.

So basically, in a few thousand years we may all be walking around grunting and pointing at things. Especially if we have World War 3 and are forced to eat radioactive plants for the next few millenia.

WTF dats deh BS I pwn Eglish langage ftw hahaha suckzors speak

 

[tehsolace]

You would have to resort to keeping those children in total isolation... the human mind is very intuitive and learns from mere observation. To keep things even as specific as languages from them would require total isolation from any form of it.

And as such, in this 'isolated world', these children would only know of this type of life and live as such. IE: A world in a box with blank walls and food daily.

Its hard to imagine how you could possibly do this to the entire world...

 

[_Z_Ryuken]

Not everyone learns through being taught. Self-motivation plays a part for a lot of people, myself included.

I was never taught to speak, but I began reading at 3 or 4 years. I started speaking around 10 or 11 out of necessity.

 

[Raziaar]

It was just a 'what-if'... like, what if something happened where all of the offspring had no contact with any of their parents or siblings who knew something of the previous life... nobody to pass down knowledge on.

It's just surprising that our languages and our entire livelihood is only based upon our ability to remember and pass along knowledge. Whereas animals are born with the instinct to survive(most all of them...), and at least communicate.

 

[_Z_Ryuken]

I imagine these people without parents would communicate through action and noises depending on how they feel about something.

Beyond that, their personalities would be the deciding factor in who lives and recreates civilization.

Someone aware of their intelligence and eager to learn might spend more time tinkering with the environment, learning about technology (albeit at a rudimentary level), aquiring great power.
A more emotional critter might spend time taking shiny objects from other kids and building a fortune.