A Public Service Announcement for the GAYS ..non gays too

[CptStern]

you seem to know a lot about me krynn. You peoples will say they're both the same, but I think wrong is too strong a word. better term would be "not what God intended" (that's not a precendent for a theist-atheist debate- I've learned my lesson already). but hey that's just me.... clearly

according to your logic your god isnt much of a God

"not what God Intended"

in other words: god is a dick for unintentionally creating a gay person. he should punish himself for not having the foresight to see he's creating something he didnt intend. following that logic god isnt much of a God because of the "omnipotent" part; as a perfect being he should know exactly what he's creating


the other conclusion is that god did indeed intend to create gay people (supported by the notion that god is perfect; nothing he does is accidental) therefore according to god; gays are a-ok in his book which in turn means christians are bigots and are going against god's plan. sinner! you should start with saying the lord's prayer 150 times and Hail mary 200 times and asking god for absolution for your sinning ways ..also wear a sackcloth and flagellate yourself with a whip of thorns; only then will you be redeemed in the eyes of the lord for daring to doubt his omnipotence

So which part of them telling teenagers not to kill themselves did you not like? Cause I'm pretty sure that's not what God intended either.

he's all for the problem fixing itself; being gay is worse than killing yourself (guarenteed you'll go to hell) due to people like blackout

 

[blackout]

So which part of them telling teenagers not to kill themselves did you not like? Cause I'm pretty sure that's not what God intended either.

that bit I liked. my dad killed himself (although he wasn't a teenager at the time, thankfully) so I empathise there; it's the general atmosphere of giving a positive view of homosexuality that I disliked.

 

[No Limit]

So you think God was wrong for creating gay people?

 

[blackout]

no, I don't believe God makes mistakes. no one made them gay, in the same way, no one made people with mental illnesses and defects, it's just the way they are.

according to your logic your god isnt much of a God

"not what God Intended"

in other words: god is a dick for unintentionally creating a gay person. he should punish himself for not having the foresight to see he's creating something he didnt intend. following that logic god isnt much of a God because of the "omnipotent" part; as a perfect being he should know exactly what he's creating

Refer to the above

the other conclusion is that god did indeed intend to create gay people (supported by the notion that god is perfect; nothing he does is accidental) therefore according to god; gays are a-ok in his book which in turn means christians are bigots and are going against god's plan. sinner! you should start with saying the lord's prayer 150 times and Hail mary 200 times and asking god for absolution for your sinning ways ..also wear a sackcloth and flagellate yourself with a whip of thorns; only then will you be redeemed in the eyes of the lord for daring to doubt his omnipotence

Stern I don't think you really care a great deal for mature, respectful debate; if you did you'd drop the use of stereotypes. on the other argument; I should say that I'm open minded enough to accept the truth that I may be wrong, which I hope you are also: I.E. yes it may be possible that God did intend homosexuality; but that's simply not my understanding (which again, may be wrong) of God, the Bible and the world, hence my views of homosexuality. in terms of the God being perfect, again refer to the above.


he's all for the problem fixing itself; being gay is worse than killing yourself (guarenteed you'll go to hell) due to people like blackout
stern, I think you know I don't believe that. like I said, my Dad killed himself, I take suicide very seriously; and I have to live with the possibility that my dad may be in hell. I don't believe you Go to heaven or hell based on your sexual preference, I think that's crazy: suicide Is far worse a sin than an unintentional deviation from God's original plan for our species.

 

[CptStern]

no, I don't believe God makes mistakes. no one made them gay, in the same way, no one made people with mental illnesses and defects, it's just the way they are.

"it's just the way they are"

so someone (god) made them that way. I dont understand how you can get around this simple logic; if god has an active hand in creating humans (which he does according to genesis) then he must have made some of them gay just like how he made some of them with blonde hair or left-handed etc

 

[blackout]

but who says that God made them with blode hair, or left/right handed? I belive that God made the soul and overall is our creator, but the Bible doesn't go into detail as to what degree God is involved in our unique characteristics. so my logic is that there is a part of the created human that God voluntarily leaves to itself (the bad part- if God didn't do this he would be ridding the world of all evil, which he wants us to do; we must take responsibility for our actions) and it is out of this that defects arise.

 

[CptStern]

"it's just the way they are"

so someone (god) made them that way. I dont understand how you can get around this simple logic; if god has an active hand in creating humans (which he does according to genesis) then he must have made some of them gay just like how he made some of them with blonde hair or left-handed etc

Stern I don't think you really care a great deal for mature, respectful debate; if you did you'd drop the use of stereotypes.

I was born into a catholic family, went to a catholic high school and studied theology; dont mistake my flippant tone for not having a valid point; the basic logic I used illustrates how the religious community ignores their own theological points when it comes to homosexuality therefore it's very easy to conclude it's based on cherry picking passages that support their own bigotry

on the other argument; I should say that I'm open minded enough to accept the truth that I may be wrong, which I hope you are also

sure, except in this case there is no doubt in my mind that I am correct

I.E. yes it may be possible that God did intend homosexuality;

it's not a possibility it's the only logical conclusion based on christian theological tenents: god is perfect; god is all knowing, god has a plan, homosexuality is not an accident; it was by design

but that's simply not my understanding (which again, may be wrong) of God, the Bible and the world, hence my views of homosexuality.

see above

in terms of the God being perfect, again refer to the above.

this is not up for debate. in order for god to be God he must be perfect

 

[CptStern]

but who says that God made them with blode hair, or left/right handed? I belive that God made the soul and overall is our creator, but the Bible doesn't go into detail as to what degree God is involved in our unique characteristics. so my logic is that there is a part of the created human that God voluntarily leaves to itself (the bad part- we must take responsability for our actions) and it is out of this that defects arise.

it doesnt matter if god wasnt directly responsible for lady gaga's hair colour; he created the possibility of her hair colour. he had to have had because that would imply that something outside of god threw in blonde hair into human's genetic makeup.

 

[blackout]

I was born into a catholic family, went to a catholic high school and studied theology; dont mistake my flippant tone for not having a valid point; the basic logic I used illustrates how the religious community ignores their own theological points when it comes to homosexuality therefore it's very easy to conclude it's based on cherry picking passages that support their own bigotry

notice my highlighting of the word 'Catholic'; theology differs among denominations (I'm not any particular church, I'm just a Chrisitan)

sure, except in this case there is no doubt in my mind that I am correct

Good for you. I don't have any doubt either, but that doesn't mean I disacknowledge the possibility that I may be wrong. just making sure we're clear on that.

it's not a possibility it's the only logical conclusion based on christian theological tenents: god is perfect; god is all knowing, god has a plan, homosexuality is not an accident; it was by design

clearly it's not the only logical conclusion- you just fail to see the logic behind my and many other's conclusions, which is fine, but it doesn't mean you've won.

this is not up for debate. in order for god to be God he must be perfect

sure I believe that, I've explained this: you adress it below.

it doesnt matter if god wasnt directly responsible for lady gaga's hair colour; he created the possibility of her hair colour. he had to have had because that would imply that something outside of god threw in blonde hair into human's genetic makeup.

so (correct me if I've misunderstood you) you're saying something outside God threw in the possibility of homosexuality? yes of course- the fall; the corruption that entered the creation which as I explained I believe, God wants us to take responsability for.

oh PS- not part of the debate but just out of curiosity and so I have a better picture of where you're coming from- do you or do you not believe in God? if yes, what religion are you.

 

[CptStern]

notice my highlighting of the word 'Catholic'; theology differs among denominations (I'm not any particular church, I'm just a Chrisitan)

it doesnt matter the logical still holds true regardless of what sect of christianity you call your own

Good for you. I don't have any doubt either, but that doesn't mean I disacknowledge the possibility that I may be wrong. just making sure we're clear on that.

ok but I'm saying there is no possibility I am wrong (in this case) god created homosexuality, logic dictates that he did

clearly it's not the only logical conclusion- you just fail to see the logic behind my and many other's conclusions, which is fine, but it doesn't mean you've won.

yes I've "won" (didnt know this was a contest) because it is the only logical conclusion UNLESS you want to support the idea that someone else slipped gay into human's dna before god created humans. there is no other logical explanation: either he created homosexuality or someone did and puit it into humans without god's knowledge

ok lets stop pretending here. you really want to say that humanity created homosexuality but you know you'd get jumped on by pretty much everyone here

so (correct me if I've misunderstood you) you're saying something outside God threw in the possibility of homosexuality? yes of course- the fall; the corruption that entered the creation which as I explained I believe, God wants us to take responsability for.

ok that would explain humanity (not really but I'll get to that later) but not the animal kingdom. so in other words animals gained homosexuality because humans ate from the forbidden fruit; this makes zero sense; why would the animal share that one human failing when they dont share other human failings like murder or deceit? this again supports my previous idea that organised religion cherry picks parts of their own religion to support bigotry

homosexuality cant be seen as something that came with the fall because it's not a choice between being gay and not being gay therefore it cant be a sin because the very state of being homosexual is not an individual choice

oh PS- not part of the debate but just out of curiosity and so I have a better picture of where you're coming from- do you or do you not believe in God?

no I dont believe in god. I'm saying this from a christian theological standpoint

 

[Escaep]

Is it just me or are there three different debates on religion occurring in three separate threads at the exact same time?

 

[No Limit]

So if God didn't create mentally retarded people who did? Did they create themselves?

 

[blackout]

it doesnt matter the logical still holds true regardless of what sect of christianity you call your own

what do you mean by this?



ok but I'm saying there is no possibility I am wrong (in this case) god created homosexuality, logic dictates that he did

yes I've "won" (didnt know this was a contest) because it is the only logical conclusion UNLESS you want to support the idea that someone else slipped gay into human's dna before god created humans. there is no other logical explanation: either he created homosexuality or someone did and puit it into humans without god's knowledge

so what you're doing is saying
'I'm factually and automatically right because logic is on my side and you're wrong because logic is against you' whereas I'm saying
'While I belive 100% that I'm correct and am trying to make a case that my point is logical, I'll have the open-mindedness to admit that I may be wrong. you on the other hand are to arrogant to do so, and not only do you not see the logic but are incapable of admiting that it may be there'. in short your greatest argument is to persist and insist that you are totally correct'

what's the word for that? oh, arrogance

ok lets stop pretending here. you really want to say that humanity created homosexuality but you know you'd get jumped on by pretty much everyone here

Ok.. dunno where this came from..... ?



ok that would explain humanity (not really but I'll get to that later) but not the animal kingdom. so in other words animals gained homosexuality because humans ate from the forbidden fruit; this makes zero sense; why would the animal share that one human failing when they dont share other human failings like murder or deceit? this again supports my previous idea that organised religion cherry picks parts of their own religion to support bigotry

I believe Humans were given responsability over animals and nature (Gen. 1:26, PS I'm not a creationist)- homosexuality in animals is just like all other defects and deveations from God's will that occur in animals- it's all the same problem. so we are responisble for such mistakes in all creation as we started them.

homosexuality cant be seen as something that came with the fall because it's not a choice between being gay and not being gay therefore it cant be a sin because the very state of being homosexual is not an individual choice

Sin just is one of many results of the fall: sin is a chosen act or state of disobedience to God's Will, there are also unchosen acts and states of being that Go against God's will, such as homosexuality. they may not be sin directly: but thay still go against God's plans and are therefore a result of the fall.

no I dont believe in god. I'm saying this from a christian theological standpoint

interesting, is this viewpoint something they taught you in Catholic school?

So if God didn't create mentally retarded people who did? Did they create themselves?

refer to the my previous dialogue with stern.

 

[Warbie]

So if God didn't create mentally retarded people who did? Did they create themselves?

And what happens when they go to heaven - are they retarded for eternity, or the person they would have been had god not created them retarded?

 

[No Limit]

refer to the my previous dialogue with stern.

I did. It doesn't make any sense. How did mental retardation come about? Someone had to create it if you believe in genesis. Who?

 

[blackout]

And what happens when they go to heaven - are they retarded for eternity, or the person they would have been had god not created them retarded?

the person they would have been were they not retarded -exept perfect in every way

I did. It doesn't make any sense. How did mental retardation come about? Someone had to create it if you believe in genesis. Who?

it happened by chance and/or the devil had a hand in it (actually shoulda said that before).

 

[CptStern]

interesting, is this viewpoint something they taught you in Catholic school?

what viewpoint? that god created homosexuality? no catholics pretend they dont exist. simple logic taught me that god created homosexuality in the christian pov

I believe Humans were given responsability over animals and nature (Gen. 1:26, PS I'm not a creationist)- homosexuality in animals is just like all other defects and deveations from God's will that occur in animals

such as? also that passage doesnt mean humans made animals get the gay gene. only god has the ability to put the gay gene into animal dna

it's all the same problem. so we are responisble for such mistakes in all creation as we started them.

so animals get homosexuality but nothing else from humanity; not greed, not lust, not virtue ..just homosexuality

cherry picking to support an agenda

Sin just is one of many results of the fall: sin is a chosen act or state of disobedience to God's Will,

hold up there homsexuality is not a choice just like heterosexuality is not a choice therefore your statement is false

there are also unchosen acts and states of being that Go against God's will, such as homosexuality. they may not be sin directly: but thay still go against God's plans and are therefore a result of the fall.

homosexuality not a choice therefore not a sin therefore not against god's will because he created it just like he created blonde hair

 

[No Limit]

the person they would have been were they not retarded -exept perfect in every way

it happened by chance and/or the devil had a hand in it (actually shoulda said that before).

So you believe that things can happen simply by chance?

Or do you take that back and now believe the devil is responsible?

Which one?

 

[blackout]

logic is logic. if god didnt create homosexuality in the genetic makeup of humanity who did? and it cant have been as a result of the fall because that doesnt accouint for animals and homosexuality is not fault of homosexuals thwerefore it is logical to conclude that homosexuality was part of god's master plan just like blonde hair and downs syndrome.

so you think defects that cause people pain and discomfort were part of the plan of a merciful God? fine. but i draw a line at you insisting that this is what Christians do/should believe, because it isnt. you seem incapable of accepting this



you dont get it. it's not whether there's a possibility that I am wrong it's a binary question: either god created homosexuality or he didnt since he's god he must have created homosexuality (because no one else had the power of creation or they'd be god) therefore it is logical to conclude that god did create homosexuality [therefore I am correct-arroagnce]. it's not arrogance it's that there is no other possible explanation (that you accept)

in short; homosexuality was not a creation of God- it either occured by chance or was created by Satan. the fact that you dissagree with a point does not make it illogical. then again, as we've seen from other threads, you're one of those atheists who claims that something is irrational, has no evidence and is illogical simply because you dissagree with it and/or the evidence/logic/explaination for it.

what viewpoint? that god created homosexuality? no catholics pretend they dont exist. simple logic taught me that god created homosexuality in the christian pov

already adressed this 100 times
such as? also that passage doesnt mean humans made animals get the gay gene. only god has the ability to put the gay gene into animal dna

as does satan, a factor which, to be fair, neither of us have taken into account.

so animals get homosexuality but nothing else from humanity; not greed, not lust, not virtue ..just homosexuality
that's not what I said- in fact I said the opposite:

homosexuality in animals is just like all other defects and deveations from God's will that occur in animals

how so?
hold up there homsexuality is not a choice just like heterosexuality is not a choice therefore your statement is false
I know, I'm saying, homosexuality is not a sin.
homosexuality not a choice therefore not a sin therefore not against god's will because he created it just like he created blonde hair
I don't believe something has to be a sin to God against Gods' will; sin is atype of going against God's will (I.E. an active choice of free will). so homosexuality is not a sin, true, but it still goes against God's will.

oh and scince you claim to argue from a christian theological viewpoint, why don't you show me a Bible passage or 2 to support your views?

So you believe that things can happen simply by chance?

Or do you take that back and now believe the devil is responsible?

Which one?

Both are possiblities. my mistake, that didn't occur to me before.

let me repeat stern, your faliure to see the logic in another's argument while easily comprehending your own does not make you automatically correct, and to say you are is what makes you arrogant. and I don't miss your point, I understand it and think it's a good point, but I simply dissagree with it and am trying to get you to understand why, that doesn't mean you have to agree with me; I'd be content if you just said 'ok , I understand what you're saying now, but i feel more compelled towards my view and so don't agree with you' which is what I've realised id the best option now. but your narrow-mindedness is preventing that- I understand if you fail to comprehend my case, that's ok- but you need to stop insisting that this makes your case correct when really, either could be correct. get it?

 

[CptStern]

so you think defects that cause people pain and discomfort were part of the plan of a merciful God? fine. but i draw a line at you insisting that this is what Christians do/should believe, because it isnt. you seem incapable of accepting this

it's not a belief. logic dictates that since god is all powerful all knowing; omnipotent if you will, he knew he would be creating pain and suffering. this is inescapable

you dont get it. it's not whether there's a possibility that I am wrong it's a binary question: either god created homosexuality or he didnt since he's god he must have created homosexuality (because no one else had the power of creation or they'd be god) therefore it is logical to conclude that god did create homosexuality [therefore I am correct-arroagnce]. it's not arrogance it's that there is no other possible explanation (that you accept)

you dont get it! it's not arrogance it's an either or question; either he did or he didnt therefore the only logical conclusion is that he did.

also could you stop editing my replies to include your own; it makes it hard to reply to

in short; homosexuality was not a creation of God- it either occured by chance

you really have no grasp of what it means to be god; nothing is by chance that would mean he's not god and even if the devil created homos the devil is still a creation of god therefore he must have foreseen what his creation would do. anyways I find it appaling that you would put the label of sin on someone simply because of what they are; it's not their choice therefore they cant possibly be sinning

or was created by Satan. the fact that you dissagree with a point does not make it illogical.

I'm not disagreeing, I'm saying it's not possible

then again, as we've seen from other threads, you're one of those atheists who claims that something is irrational, has no evidence and is illogical simply because you dissagree with it and/or the evidence/logic/explaination for it.

you mean like how religious people shut out scientific fact because they disagree without evidence?

already adressed this 100 times

yes you have and your reasoning has been dismissed as illogical

as does satan, a factor which, to be fair, neither of us have taken into account.

lol this is ridiculous. you're saying that as soon as adam and eve bit into the apple POOF all of the sudden GAY GENES in their dna. satan does not have the power of creation or else he'd be god, god being perfect is the only one with the power of creation ..or else he wouldnt be god ..see the omnipotence wiki entry

homosexuality in animals is just like all other defects and deveations from God's will that occur in animals

such as? what defects and deviations do animals have and why did they only receive one human trait (homosexuality) and nothing else?

cherry picking to support an agenda

I know, I'm saying, homosexuality is not a sin.

? ... so it's not a deviation from god's will therefore it couldnt possibly have arisen from eating the forbidden fruit because it was at this time that sin was introduced ...unless you're saying homosexuality is a disease

I don't believe something has to be a sin to God against Gods' will; sin is atype of going against God's will (I.E. an active choice of free will). so homosexuality is not a sin, true, but it still goes against God's will.

so how do you know it goes against god's will if it's not a sin and it's not a disease and it's not a choice? so far all you're doign is saying that the sate of being is prefectly ok with god except when ...this is where it falls apart

oh and scince you claim to argue from a christian theological viewpoint, why don't you show me a Bible passage or 2 to support your views?

? what part of the bible should I quote? the ones that says god created the heavens, the gays and the earth? I'll do you one better; this is the definition of omnipotence:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnipotence






Both are possiblities. my mistake, that didn't occur to me before.[/QUOTE]

 

[No Limit]

Both are possiblities. my mistake, that didn't occur to me before.

You do know that your own bible disagrees with you on this, correct? Or are you not aware of the fact that your god is all powerful and all knowing?

What I find funny based on this discussion is that you have showed a clear lack of understanding of your own religion. You even admitted that you might be misunderstanding your own religion. Aren't you a bit worried about that? The bible has a set of laws you have to live by or you will spend the rest of eternity in hell. Yet you don't seem to understand those laws. You're not worried about going to hell as a result?

 

[RidleyRockets]

the person they would have been were they not retarded -exept perfect in every way

Hopefully the same could be said for this post when it reaches messageboard heaven.

it happened by chance and/or the devil had a hand in it (actually shoulda said that before).

Seriously?

 

[blackout]

stern, you're not even listening to me, you're only insisting of your own correctness and brushing off anything that dissagrees. you clearly are a narrow-minded person who cannot accept other ideas as possiblities, or assume that something is illogical because you fail to get a grasp of it (like most arrogant atheists, thank god you're not all like that). I no longer have any desire to debate with you- you're far to stubborn and self-correct. God will be the judge of who's correct, sooner or later. and unlike you, I'm prepared to admit that I may be the one who is incorrect. I've offered you the oppourtunity to do the same- which you've turned down.

God bless you. I hope you open your eyes.

 

[No Limit]

God bless you. I hope you open your eyes.

You do understand that you have admitted in this thread that you don't fully understand your religion? So I assume you know that means you are going to hell if you don't soon figure it out, right? So you might want to thank Stern, he is trying to save you from eternal hell by trying to give you a better understanding of your religion. By ignoring him you aren't doing him any favors and are only putting your own soul in jeopardy.

 

[CptStern]

stern, you're not even listening to me, you're only insisting of your own correctness and brushing off anything that dissagrees. you clearly are a narrow-minded person who cannot accept other ideas as possiblities, or assume that something is illogical because you fail to get a grasp of it. I no longer have any desire to debate with you- you're far to stubborn and self-correct. God will be the judge of who's correct, sooner or later. and unlike you, I'm prepared to admit that I may be the one who is incorrect. I've offered you the oppourtunity to do the same- which you've turned down.

God bless you. I hope you open your eyes.

I was beginning to wonder when you were going to be pushed into a logical corner where you couldnt respond and finally snap ..guess this is it

I'm sorry that you dont grasp my meaning. I am sorry you dont grasp your own religion enough to understand my meaning. I've tried using christian theology to argue your points instead of using non religious rational and lastly I'm sorry you couldnt respect that enough to answer the tough questions instead of bailing when you cant answer them. not once did I label you as "one of those" religious nuts who see everything as black and white. cant say the same for you

 

[RidleyRockets]

Yes stern, how dare you not admit that it is possible homosexuality may be the will of an evil and dastardly fallen angel. All those throbbing penises going back and forth in countless anuses could be his secret weapon in the eternal war between good and evil. You are the definition of narrow minded not to accept this.

You can't even parody this shit. Humanity is doomed.

 

[kineaesth]

that bit I liked. my dad killed himself (although he wasn't a teenager at the time, thankfully) so I empathise there; it's the general atmosphere of giving a positive view of homosexuality that I disliked.

Those utter bastards.

You should start the It Gets Worse Project. Get a whole bunch of gay people to talk about although they live happy, well adjusted lives with their partners, when they die they will be forever tormented in the eternal fires of Satan's stronghold.

It wasn't an easy process for me. I struggled for a long time with my own sexual identity, believing although I had a great boyfriend who I loved very much that my life would still turn out okay. We've since got a civil union, and can I just say - I've never been happier, never been prouder of myself. But what helped me get through all these rough times was the knowledge that one day, after my lifelong struggle with being in a series of happy, fun, and sexy homosexual relationships, I would be cast into the lake of fire with the other sinners, sodomites and tax collectors. Really, if it wasn't for the knowledge that one day I would eternally have the flesh flayed from my bones, I don't think I would have ever made it this far in the homosexual lifestyle.

 

[PvtRyan]

This seems appropriate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPsCwPX3qoc

 

[<RJMC>]

stern, you're not even listening to me, you're only insisting of your own correctness and brushing off anything that dissagrees. you clearly are a narrow-minded person who cannot accept other ideas as possiblities, or assume that something is illogical because you fail to get a grasp of it (like most arrogant atheists, thank god you're not all like that). I no longer have any desire to debate with you- you're far to stubborn and self-correct. God will be the judge of who's correct, sooner or later. and unlike you, I'm prepared to admit that I may be the one who is incorrect. I've offered you the oppourtunity to do the same- which you've turned down.

God bless you. I hope you open your eyes.

oh shut up,everyone knows chac is the real god

CHAC!

EVERYONE MUST OBEY CHAC!

 

[kupocake]

You have some interesting ideas RJMC, I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

 

[Krynn72]

Tim Minchin is always relevant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXfmjMlPEic

 

[PvtRyan]

More valuable information relevant to my interests:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDiC5iStnc8

 

[Bad^Hat]

but who says that God made them with blode hair, or left/right handed? I belive that God made the soul and overall is our creator, but the Bible doesn't go into detail as to what degree God is involved in our unique characteristics. so my logic is that there is a part of the created human that God voluntarily leaves to itself (the bad part- if God didn't do this he would be ridding the world of all evil, which he wants us to do; we must take responsibility for our actions) and it is out of this that defects arise.

So you're content just making shit up to fill in the gaps then?

Good to know. As long as you ~believe~ in something you're totally justified to think whatever you want lol! ****ing gay people, being born like that because <404 page not found>.

I mean, sweet jesus, this is some astonishing mental arithmetic, matey. Just really top notch crazy.

stern, you're not even listening to me, you're only insisting of your own correctness and brushing off anything that dissagrees. you clearly are a narrow-minded person who cannot accept other ideas as possiblities, or assume that something is illogical because you fail to get a grasp of it (like most arrogant atheists, thank god you're not all like that). I no longer have any desire to debate with you- you're far to stubborn and self-correct. God will be the judge of who's correct, sooner or later. and unlike you, I'm prepared to admit that I may be the one who is incorrect. I've offered you the oppourtunity to do the same- which you've turned down.

God bless you. I hope you open your eyes.

Hahahahahahahahahahaha.