Americas failing school system

[Gray Fox]

This is a very good video that shows a lot of things wrong with the current US schooling system. It is a little biased and I do not wholly agree with it's conclusions or solutions. Still they are a lot better then what is currently going on, it's unions and socialism at it's worst. It should also make you rightwing wackjobs squirt in your pants, since it supports your point of view. Nonetheless everyone should really watch this. This is disturbing beyond believe.

And sorry if this has been posted before.

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfRUMmTs0ZA&eurl=[/YOUTUBE]

 

[delusional]

i saw this before, and i have to agree some of these people in school are dumb, especially in LA. There was a whole bunch of students and parents were protesting california's new high school exit exam, because so many people were failing it, but when i finally took it, it was just simple algebra and an easy literature test. If i took it in junior high i would have passed it. My school is good i think, but many schools in America are full of dumb people.

 

[theotherguy]

just stossel presenting his biased right-wing opinion again. No, there should be absolutley no school vouchers or government support for faith-based institutions. Education is a public good, and should absolutley not be provided by the private sector. If you really want to fix the system, give more government funding to the schools and teachers, teach more difficult subject material earlier, and remove standardized testing.

 

[Gray Fox]

just stossel presenting his biased right-wing opinion again. No, there should be absolutley no school vouchers or government support for faith-based institutions. Education is a public good, and should absolutley not be provided by the private sector. If you really want to fix the system, give more government funding to the schools and teachers, teach more difficult subject material earlier, and remove standardized testing.

But in the video he proved that more money is not the answer if the current system stays the same. You can see in the video that one district spent 2 billion more but actually got lower results out of their students. And the teachers union has misused it's power, their rules keep very bad teachers, and some criminals on a payrole.

 

[Sidewinder]

why the hell is a guy from Holland making a thread about american schools?
and all he has is a youtube vid....give me a break.

 

[Gray Fox]

why the hell is a guy from Holland making a thread about american schools?
and all he has is a youtube vid....give me a break.

Seeing as America is so influential in the world, the academic level of it's population is important to me. Besides that it's simply an interesting topic.

Second, what the **** does it matter that it's a youtube video.
Watching the Simpson's on youtube doesn't make it any less Simpsonian . Watching a ABC program on youtube, does not lesson it's credibility

Frankly people, it's disturbing that this topic got so many intelligent responses in the haus, and a whole discussion. While this, is all it gets here.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

why the hell is a guy from Holland making a thread about american schools?
and all he has is a youtube vid....give me a break.

lighten up. he's just made a thread. if you don't want to be offended, don't go in politics. It doesn't tkae much to figure that out. At least make a decent argument rather than complaining.

 

[tehsolace]

From wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1995-SAT-Education.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1995-SAT-Income.png

 

[Gray Fox]

Thats an interesting point. But I do not think it disproves the video. Since smarter parants usually are the same ones that make more money. Now since they are smart they will probably take good care of their child, and if the child is not learning in school enough they will tutor him/her or pay someone else to do it.
Or they will send him to private school.

This should not be so, schools by themselves are supposed to be give you enough academic education.

 

[Asus]

I'm not familiar with any terrible schools around where I live. Especially that would need to be closed. Everything about the public school I went to was really great.

Although it sure has changed since I was there. It got a lot bigger, teachers go to more meetings, more responsibilities beyond just what goes on in their class room, more committees. All the older teachers that I knew have since retired and most of the teachers there are just out of college now. Probably avg 25-26yrs old, not a lot of experience to draw from in the school as a whole. It's still a highly rated school in the area but more recently I've heard a number of frustrating things from my mom (who is an elementary teacher there).

A few teachers had pushed through a new way of grading math and I think teaching it too (in elementary school only). Although the grading is now for other subjects too. Instead of adding up scores on work and tests to determine an accurate letter grade for that subject, students are given a subjective grade which is not directly connected to scores or percentages from their work. I think it's S (Secure), D (Developing) and B (Beginning). It's harder to see where the kids stand and in what areas they need more help with this method. In one area a teacher may think a student is Secure but another might have said the student was Developing.

Funny thing is the next year those teachers that pushed that through then left the district for another and all the teachers who didn't like it were stuck with it. They only change the curriculum every 5yrs or so because of the money they invest into it with books and resources.

And the kids these days act different too. We were on task most of the time when I went through elementary school there. My mom says that many of her students disrupt the class often and more disrespect teachers. Says it has gotten worse over time. And I have seen more kids act up too when visiting. They end up having to police the kids and of course they can't lay a finger on the students.

I've never thought much about being stuck in the school zone where I lived because I did have a good school. But that does make a lot of sense if they opened it up so you could go to the public school of your choice.

 

[Dynasty]

'America's failing school system'

..........................................
they have a school system???

 

[<RJMC>]

havent watched the whole thing but I think the kids are a problem too,they dont seem to care about it

EDIT: and c'mon playing monopoly in class and the teacher dont do anything? the teacher just should put 0 on the grades and the kid get kicked out,and sure he will like it

 

[kirovman]

EDIT: and c'mon playing monopoly in class and the teacher dont do anything? the teacher just should put 0 on the grades and the kid get kicked out,and sure he will like it

You'd get an A if it was Fat-Cat class.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

WTF Monopoly? I mean, we used to play cards, but it's not like you can hide a board and a dozen hotels when the teacher walks in. RJMC, once again, you win.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Asus]

The kids in that shot don't seem to care and the teacher doesn't have a handle on the class. But it seemed to me playing monopoly was the teacher's idea, not the kids.

 

[Tyguy]

As an American, I can agree. Its pathetic. That is why Americas smartest are brought in form over seas. Find a top scientist in America named bob......

 

[<RJMC>]

if I where a teacher there I would have just started by saying how much waste of people are them and that a bunch of bird shit is more productive in life,theyr brains are a waste of oxigen and a fly is a better seat heater,and if someone responds I will put out a gun and telll them that this will be the only thing that will help them make money
and ending whit something like that the only thing they will be good will be as dummies in car crashes testings

 

[Remus]

And the kids these days act different too. We were on task most of the time when I went through elementary school there. My mom says that many of her students disrupt the class often and more disrespect teachers. Says it has gotten worse over time. And I have seen more kids act up too when visiting. They end up having to police the kids and of course they can't lay a finger on the students..

Yeah well that kind of thing isn't happening only in the US of A I'm afraid. My mom is an English teacher at a highschool in my home town and she says the kids are becoming unbearable, they simply don't care about anything. Olso it has gotten to the point that students just go to the teacher that is writing something on the board and beat the crap out of him. I saw that one on the news and it was filmed with a cell phone by one of the other students.

I've never thought much about being stuck in the school zone where I lived because I did have a good school. But that does make a lot of sense if they opened it up so you could go to the public school of your choice.

What's a school zone? When I went to school, I went there because it was my choice not because I was restricted to that specific school.

 

[Steve]

I can't be bothered to read through the thread, and the filtering software I'm under right now won't let me watch the video, so excuse me if I'm just repeating.

The number one problem I see in America's schools is this: The main focus is getting as many kids as possible to graduate, whether or not they've acually learned anything. So the standards keep getting lowered, just so these (I hesitate to say dumb) uneducated kids can have a diploma.

 

[Taboo]

Ive never heard of this voucher system before. Idk if it would be beneficial or not but it might be interesting to try.

I think most of the problems can be traced back to students behavior. It is really strange how they dont care and are completely disruptive now. I dont think the teachers can do much to help it with their limited power either. I think its just busy americans leaving their kids alone more and giving them alot more responsibility. After a while kids realize that they dont need their parents and have a certain degree of control over them. Students especially realize that they are the majority in the class room and that teachers are very limited in available punishments.

I suggest sending a psychiatrist in to assess the situation, like they did for japanese management. If they can start breeding good ol' virtues like respect psychologically from elementry school maybe that would help quell the problem.

 

[Qonfused]

The teachers don't teach in America. There is no teaching element. It's "read from the book, do the worksheet, take the test." If the class is that way, I'll never get a grade above a C. Once in a while you'll get a teacher who is still genuinely excited to teach his subject. The class, most likely, will be harder with projects and such, but I will get an A in that class.

Newer teachers think: "Decent pay and three months off!"

They need to think: "I love dealing with kids and seeing their face light up when they learn a new concept."

I hate it.

 

[VirusType2]

I watched the video yesterday but hadn't commented yet.

It's really good that some people are paying attention and trying to change things. The more attention this gets, the better.

I think they need more teachers per student, and the teachers have to be real. Let the kid know that screwing off in class everyday and they will work at McDonald's mopping floors and struggle to get by. Or they can try their best and be whatever they want, and have whatever they want.

They hit it right on in the video. School HAS to be fun. It's not a bonus. If the kids don't like it, they aren't going to do it. I don't know what the solution is, but there were some classes that I actually looked forward to. Some teachers were just brilliant. They make learning fun. The stereo-typical boring ass teacher can do things to make it fun too, if they try. For example bonus points, special class activities, an occasional joke, and studying in a way that makes things interesting.

Reading from a World History book isn't all that interesting cramming your head with dates and facts.

How about throwing a video tape in for a visual presentation. Kids these days learn from movies so much better.

When I was in school I was doing horribly. I just didn't care. I skipped at least one day a week, never did any homework, etc.

My mom paid like $10,000 a year to put my ass in military school, and instantly I was getting A's and B's. I wouldn't have graduated if not. My mom really had to make changes to pay this much, when public school was free.

Private schools are the answer for some kids, it would be great if the government tried the voucher so that kids could go to whatever school the parents wanted. I don't see how in the world that could do anything but improve the situation.

By the way, the teachers lobby scares me.

 

[kirovman]

The number one problem I see in America's schools is this: The main focus is getting as many kids as possible to graduate, whether or not they've acually learned anything. So the standards keep getting lowered, just so these (I hesitate to say dumb) uneducated kids can have a diploma.

I feel that there's the same kind of thing happening in the UK. I didn't realise the same things were happening over there.

 

[DeusExMachina]

The problem is kids don't care. This general apathy among 90% of the student population affects the teachers. Eventually, they just stop trying to teach and read out of the book.

 

[kirovman]

Aye, same here. Anti-intellectualism, fortune without effort and other Anglo-sphere cultural problems.

 

[Manc]

America has an education system? eh lolz

 

[_Z_Ryuken]

It's not the schools, it's the kids. I had what I like to believe was a top-level education but when I was little screwing around was more imoprtant than doing homework and studying. That is what caused me trouble.

I observed other troubled kids and they had similar attitudes, though I had more respect for the teachers. Almost all of my teachers were great. The problem is these kids do not realize the importance of education so they don't realize they are throwing their lives away.

 

[delusional]

I'm going to have to agree on it being partly the students fault. Since I have some honors classes and normal classes, i can see a difference. In my honors classes everyone pays attention and takes things seriously, but in normal classes theres some people always acting out and then the really dumb people that arent even worth teaching.

 

[Taboo]

Private schools are the answer for some kids, it would be great if the government tried the voucher so that kids could go to whatever school the parents wanted. I don't see how in the world that could do anything but improve the situation.

Im kind of against this solution but Im not entirely sure why.

Lets see. If it were to happen in my area I would imagine all of the kids (or atleast the majority) flocking to the single best school in the area. That school would then be completely over run with kids from all over and would have a larger student teacher ratio, which would make it a worse school. The masses of students would bring in more money to make amends, but will the school really make amends for the academic needs of the students? The most Ive ever seen my school do with money is make a giant million dollar football field. No joke. And even if they did put it to educational use, it can take months and even years to build permanent additions to schools and expand a satisfactory faculty.

Most people in my neighborhood would be extremely pissed off because they are exceptionally wealthy, shall we say, and thus pay more taxes on their propery, which leads to more cash in the local districts pocket. This is why our districts schools are exceptional, which is why alot of people (who can afford it) live in this particular area, and they would definately frown upon people paying much less than them having the same benefit of the expensive schools (they "paid for") while at the same time "contaminating it" with their non-super-yay-jesus-republican-conservative-I-make-more-in-a-week-than-you-will-in-a-year lifestyles.

Yeah, I live with a bunch of stuck up people. Anyway, I just dont think theres enough money to be made in schools for them to be buisnesses fighting over student vouchers. They need to be zoned so the schools populations can be a barable size and I think its important on the high school level because it gives areas a certain identity and pride. I dont really know too many parents, or students for that matter, that grade a school based on its teachers or test scores or anything relevant to education, just superficial things like football fields and how many times the team has been to state. If schools became buisnesses trying to attract people they would have to beef up those parts of the school to attract more students/ money, not the educational departments.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Seeing as America is so influential in the world, the academic level of it's population is important to me.

The system needs several changes as does society in general.

The whole, "Oh, not my muffy or biffy. They would'nt steal/kill/rape anyting lol", outlook from parents reguarding misbehavior and disruption during school hours has caused a lot of social pessism on the issue of schools and they're handling of problem students.

Schools also need to pay better and definately need more control. Some students are just too noisy, loud, obnoxious, and out of control. And I do blame the parents for that aswell.

 

[bbson john]

i saw this before, and i have to agree some of these people in school are dumb, especially in LA. There was a whole bunch of students and parents were protesting california's new high school exit exam, because so many people were failing it, but when i finally took it, it was just simple algebra and an easy literature test. If i took it in junior high i would have passed it. My school is good i think, but many schools in America are full of dumb people.

Can you show us some of the questions in the test as an example? I am really interested in it.