Anybody notice this?

As a side note, comparing ATi's 4XAA and nVidia's 4XAA is not fair.
ATi's 4XAA quality is superior.
 
Originally posted by Ahnteis
[points up]
fann - boi!

Both companies use "optimized drivers". Optimization isn't a bad thing.

Now, if the game looks worse after the optimization then you talk about IMAGE QUALITY.

As for benchmarks--they're a big steaming pile of headcrab poop and are only used so that morons have some way to compare graphics cards since relevant comparisons are difficult.
Click to expand...

I suggest you do some research. It's not hard to figure out. And yes, FX cards do sacrifice image quality or they drop in fps.

As for the fanboy remark. ATI was hardly a favorite of mine before the 9700 Pro came along. I stand behind companies if they have quality products and service. ATI has proved they are capable of this. Nvidia doesn't care about it's customers and uses shady business tactics.
 
The only reason Valve said that is because the Radeon 9800 pro is the best thing out there right now.
 
Did you see the benchmarks? 9700 Pro totally OWNS the 5900 in some games.
/me cuddles his 9700 Pro
 
I read a link in the 3drealms forum (of all places) where they posted a small interview some guy had with Gabe about the no AA in HL2 (i can find the link if ppl want). He (Gabe) said that AA on current hardware would look ugly BUT the 9500 and above had the capability to do AA in HL2 but a needed feature is still not released within Direct X 9 (apparently that feature has to do with Pixel Shader 3.0). That is what i read. Whether it is true or not i do not fully know but it makes no difference to me because my vid card wont do that stuff anyway.
 
Originally posted by anarchy
Screw the 9800 pro, screw the 5900 ultra.


Im getting the R360 (9900 Pro?) 400mhz/400mhz!

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=10544

That will be the fastest card for hl2 untell next year.
Click to expand...

Buy me one while you're at it...I'll pay you back...trust me.:cool:

Originally posted by A2597
in the end, price was the deciding factor for me, and the 9800 was MUCH cheaper then either the 9800 Pro or the 5900 Ultra.
Click to expand...

A2587 noticed what some of you are not...Gabe said a 9800...never said Pro in there. That's about a $100 difference (retail). Still more expensive than the two GFFX cards, but cheaper. Another thing he said was "for your setup". So maybe, in HL2, they've found that ATI's cards scale down better with the slower processors (less bottlenecking). Just a guess. And no offense, d8cam, I fall into same hardware boat. =\
Obviously, they do like ATI. Likely because of ATI's attention to and competitiveness to stay ahead in DX9 support. I'm not saying nVIDIA doesn't (not a fanboy of ATI, I've only had 3dfx and nVIDIA cards up to now)...but perhaps Valve seems to favor ATI's implementation of it.

Originally posted by Ahnteis
As for benchmarks--they're a big steaming pile of headcrab poop and are only used so that morons have some way to compare graphics cards since relevant comparisons are difficult.
Click to expand...

Not trying to flame you, but opposed to what? The genius' who read the outside of the retail box? I'll agree that BM's are irrelevant in that they ALWAYS seem to put the card on the newest chipset, with the most RAM and the fastest CPU. Not all gamers who are looking to upgrade the AGP slot have a top of the line gaming rig. But, knowledgeable (see Beyond3D, anandtech, etc) HW sites that BM a card are doing their best to give you an idea of the card can do.
 
I didn't read every single one of the posts in this thread, but am I the only one to notice that NVidia is hosting 200Mb worth of steam content servers?


>Br@d
 
its not about what you like better...nvidia or ATI....its about which is better....and being an nvidia owner myself, i must say that ati is far ahead with the 9800....but man where the heck are you all getting 300-500 dollars for it?
 
i recently just bought a Geforce FX 5600, i was gonna get the new radeon pro, but the FX was 50$ cheaper, and i dont got a job ( high school),
if only i had a job :/ , i would also save up some cash to get a 3ghz comp
*me dreams*
 
Wait a minute... If - and I say that with all the ignorance that being me requires - ATi cards are out-performing nVidia then does that mean, after killing off 3dfx and stealing its crown, nVidia is now under a similar assault from ATi?
The poor devils. No rest for the wicked.
 
The graphics card market is pretty ruthless.

I don't really have a preference of one company over another. I think that having both companies trying to sell me their cards is better then just having one. The competition between the two keeps card prices down, and card performance at a maximum. Nvidia may have fallen a bit behind in the last round, but this fall they'll be back with an extremely fast card (if the rumored specs are correct), and I'm interested to see what ATI will come up with to combat Nvidia's new line of cards.

Which is faster when both cards are released this fall will be the one I'll be buying. :)
 
ATI MAY BE THE BEST CARD FOR HL2

From the VALVe info thread about the difficulty of anti-aliasing Half-Life2 graphics:

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=52610#post52336

1) Is this a problem that can be fixed with new drivers, or would we have to buy a whole new card to recitify it? If so, are there any cards on the horizon that would offer it?

Drivers aren't likely to fix the problem, with the exception of the ATI 9500-9800. There's hope there for being able to use FSAA properly. You are out of luck on NVidia unless either NVidia or us come up with some clever way of solving this problem.

2) Is this a problem unique to hardware + Source?

It's a problem for any app that packs small textures into larger textures. The small textures will bleed into each other if you have multisample FSAA enabled. The best thing to do right now is either buy an ATI card in the hopes that it will be solved there, or wait until the next generation of cards come out.
Click to expand...

G.F.
 
Things Aren't Always As They Appear...

Make sure you check all of the reviews out there, as things aren't
always what they appear to be. :smoking:

Here are a few links to munch on:

Thread at Beyond 3D that demos how nVidia drivers are not doing
real Trilinear filtering with UnReal Tournament 2003.
-----------------------------------------------------
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6719
-----------------------------------------------------


FX 5900 Review ( June 13th )
-----------------------------------------------------
http://www.3dvelocity.com/reviews/5900u/5900u.htm
-----------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

"As of right here and now the 5900 Ultra isn't a
performance behemoth that snatches back NVIDIA's
performance crown unreservedly, it in fact does
little more than put them back in the frame.
Purely from personal observations I'd say image
quality on the 5900 Ultra and the Radeon series
cards is very, very similar in a lot of cases but
that NVIDIA have superior anistropic filtering
(significantly so in some cases) while ATi still
have superior Anti-aliasing, a situation that
shouldn't really exist considering how many 3dfx
employees NVIDIA mopped up."


FX 5900 Review ( June 16th )
-----------------------------------------------------
http://firingsquad.gamers.com/hardware/msi_geforce_fx5900-td128_review/default.asp
-----------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

"MSI has a very good graphics card on its hands
with the FX5900-TD128. The GeForce FX 5900 GPU
it’s based on offers high-end performance,
although it is by no means a RADEON 9800 PRO
killer. Each card wins its fair share of
benchmarks, and we don’t see this changing
anytime soon. As the software teams on both sides
continue to polish their drivers we only see the
battle between the two intensifying, ultimately
reaching a peak with debut of upcoming titles
like Doom 3 and Half-Life 2."


FX 5900 Review ( July 7th )
-----------------------------------------------------
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=3x5900u&page=1
-----------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

"If you have a choice between this card and the
Radeon 9800 Pro, the decision should be simple.
The Radeon 9800 Pro runs cooler, quieter, only
takes up one case slot, runs better in every
single benchmark we tested with, and to top it
all off, is less expensive as well."


FX 5900 Review ( July 17th )
-----------------------------------------------------
http://www.motherboards.org/articlesd/hardware-reviews/1257_1.html
-----------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

"but performance wise NVIDIA is still playing the
catch-up game to ATI and the 5900 Ultra which is
almost equal to the 9800 Pro is at the same price
range of the RADEON product making it still
second best in line at the same cost."


FX 5900 Review ( Commenting on driver cheats )
-----------------------------------------------------
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/gffx/gffx-16.html
-----------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

"So, if the previous tests based on the standard
demo benchmarks or games included in the standard
packets showed that the GeForce FX 5900 had a good
chance to beat the RADEON 9800 PRO, the elimination
of the cheats by replacing the standard demo benchmarks
with specially developed ones revealed that the FX 5900
is not that good."

G.F.
 
-----------------------------------------------------
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/gffx/gffx-16.html
-----------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

"So, if the previous tests based on the standard
demo benchmarks or games included in the standard
packets showed that the GeForce FX 5900 had a good
chance to beat the RADEON 9800 PRO, the elimination
of the cheats by replacing the standard demo benchmarks
with specially developed ones revealed that the FX 5900
is not that good."

G.F.


:)
 
lol, i love the endless speculation based on utter tripe u guys produce :)

FACT: The FX 5XXX does not adhere to a strict Dx9 guideline, the Ati 9700 > do. HL2 is coded on a strict Dx9 standard, its not Valves fault Nvidia chose to produce a half assed card.

Secondly, its been openly proved nvidia are placing so many optimizations in there drivers that drop image quality to the floor to increase frame rates while ATi arent (the optimizations they had, the removed and showed in a newer cat release). Once nvidias optimizations where removed, the fx9000 serious came in at about 30% slower than the 9800.

As developers pushing technology, im sure valve have found this out for themselves, hence pushing the better product for us, the gamers.

As for the lamer who said "ATI are pimping more cash out to games companies" (not exact wording :)) thats utter shit! Ati have hardly any interaction with developers (there main downfall!!), nvidia on the otherhand have tried to buy out EA, there were rumours they tried to buy out Vavle too, and by buy out, i mean persuade the developers to optimize games for there GFX cards.

Nvidia are fallen kings, anyone with a FX card, i openly laugh at u :)

SD
 
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