Beheading Retributions?

[K e r b e r o s]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/06/18/saudi.kidnap/

Dont worry. Its not spam for the beheading videos, cause well duh, its CNN. It does however contain some excellent theories about the current situation in Iraq, but also, the back firing about these beheadings.

I've watched I think two or three executions now with a load of pictures that make me sick in disbelief. I believe, without a victims mentality, that this is backfiring on militants. While they adapt based on a "Westerns Standard" to produce information on terrorist "ideals", they've not been so quick on their toes.

A mans body was found floating in the Tigris, beheaded, with an unknown nationality. His body was plump and blue, he had been dead for awhile. Noones claimed responsibility for this one.

For more beheadings, this time, Iraqis have been targets of the new Islamic Extremists. Some group calling themselves the, "Watchamacallascaryterroristgroup", claimed responsibility in the attacks on Iraqi citizens. Three people were beheaded, numbers more shot.

It appears the bid for power in Iraq is starting to backfire. People sharing Islamic backrounds or religious focuses have now condemed the beheadings. The most recent kidnappings are two US Workers, and a Briton. They were sharing power, water, and food in a street that shared Shiite and ...Sunne, or whatever, people.

It is unsure about there whereabouts, but cracks are now showing on this end of secrecy. People are becoming scared of these radicals, and are now reporting numerous accounts of people.

Some people have said this entire radicial push is in a "Phase Two" setting. It appears before "Phase Three" could crest, its falling apart. Slowly but surely.

The connections have been made to that head terrorist guy in Fallujah. At the time of making his claims, a bomb hit nearby. The videos this time seem to be coming out of Saudi Arabia, and currently, Saudi officials are going haywhire with whats in their own country.

No more then a few months back, virtually no information was held for who the beheadings were done by, and, "why". Suddenly, the Information Age, a victim of these sorts of acts, reared its ugly head and bit back.

Currently, the terrorists are being held up in Fallujah, or however you spell it. Another group of Islamic Terrorists linked to the latest of beheadings, was intercepted on its disposal of the body of "Johnson", a mechanic for an Apache Helicopter Crew. It is said the militants were dogged out into Saudi Borders and killed.

In another bit of news, the police in Iraq are fighting back. Wether or not its released, Islamic Insurgents recently connected to the beheadings and shootings of Nepalese Workers, were executed outside of a station by firing squad.

It seems as though names and places are being put with whats going on, and it seems as though the world of impunity with these actions is collasping.

Watch the three videos in that link. CNN is always good for a nice pointer.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Edit a few words and passages for corrections.

It also looks like the United States is planning a huge campaign based launch into the terrorist held cities. Cities or zones, objectively "too hostile". It is unclear on how the plan might preceed, but CNN just did a broadcast showcasing that in this calm depression, scores of movements are being focused on different cities.

With the new intelligence breaks, I'am certain this explanation is coming down to one thing on US minds.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Well, dont let this thread get too out of hand.

<crickets chirp>

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

That artical is kind of old news...

Anway your interpretation of this is that Islam is beginning to crack down on some its own radicals?

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Precisely. It seems the foundation is becoming unsetteled. Webpages that were openly recruiting for Fanatics, are being bombed by viruses.

I picked that up last night while watching CNBC, and also, a local channel. Besides that, the actual terrorist groups seem to be seperated into gangs now.

Each one relates to the higher power, but its bids are always updating to be one step more than the next. Some of these groups are even from Palestine. God, I wish I had the video for that one. National Geographic posted that.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

But, it seems that while support for the War in Iraq might still be low, the actions portrayed as in the name of "Ala" and the "Kuran", seem to be insulting both Shiite Muslims, and this Sunne group.

I guess the Tolerance has died out. One of the videos in the links I provided labeled a very good example of what I'am talking about.

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

Occasionally you'll hear the Saudi Govt. talking tough on the clerrics who are teaching violence... I don't think a lot has actaully been done but that's a pretty big step for the Royal family considering their past policies of ignoring and denying radicals.

 

[NeLi]

Iraq is a ****ing mess.

Not even Alah can fix it now.

 

[Dalamari]

Iraq is a ****ing mess.

Not even Alah can fix it now.

Why can't they all just be Jewish/Christian, make things so much easier.

 

[Rupertvdb]

I read an article recently in the Times that was quite good. It was all about how beheading is actually really frowned upon by Muslim scholars and any serious cleric does not agree with it because there was only one period (during the 10th century) when scholars felt that the Koran said it was OK. This was debunked and has never been taken seriously since, the terrorists that claim their religion supports it with talk of 'taking up the sword' etc are purposely twisted old and discounted scholarship to twist people to their own ends.

The passage i don't know exactly but it relates to what Mohammad did with a load of prisoners of war, the incorrect and bloodthirsty interpretation was that he 'despatched' of them, the educated and far more likely idea is that he let them go. There are also verses that actively discourage violence against non-combatants.

So when you see these things remember that it isn't Islam being practiced, rather a skewed and bloody interpretation of debunked part of philosophical history.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Some other stuff I gathered, is that the tide has slightly turned. Obviously the cities are going to be under "Terrorist" control, and these sites will likely have a hostile response, but it looks like the Coalition is welling themselves to either dig in, or go in.

A friend of mine who was with the US Army recently, told me that was going to be their likely move.

 

[CptStern]

so what happens to the civilians living in these cities?

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Its unclear CptStern. I dont think the operations will be focused on driving Militants out, but more so, rattling their nerves with a show of force.

When US Troops entered Baghdad, a documentary that still is running on National Geographic (least I think, I got Time Warner Cable), shows that the Convoys used the Major Highways to showcase they were capable of entering the city.

They laid down objectives in Baghdad, focusing on Saddams whereabouts. Much the same for the upcoming operations, I believe the US is going to use major roadways and secure objectives believed to be of importance. Im just speculating, but their were only two civilian losses when the Baghdad operation took place.

One tank was disabled, and one marine was killed. I think the plan is to engage enemy forces as they fire at you, too as best as possible.

I think its better than nothing--they're getting ready to go after that terrorist guy. Heres something else. The Numbers of terrorists active seems to have dropped. It was speculated that at least 20,000 were active in Iraq or still fighting, but I've heard from some people that number has been decreased significantly and seperated into these hostile zones.

Feels like a better grasp on this is coming along.

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

Some other stuff I gathered, is that the tide has slightly turned. Obviously the cities are going to be under "Terrorist" control, and these sites will likely have a hostile response, but it looks like the Coalition is welling themselves to either dig in, or go in.

A friend of mine who was with the US Army recently, told me that was going to be their likely move.

The little info I have from folks over there is that their patrols have gotten smaller... Coalition forces are now responding only to police requests for assistance. But my friends are all up north and are generally having a good time.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

The little info I have from folks over there is that their patrols have gotten smaller... Coalition forces are now responding only to police requests for assistance.

Digging in will probably be their likely choice.

Which leads to possibilities im open to:

1. 
   *US Forces Dig in, rally forces...then leave.

• *US Forces Dig in, adjust to new intelligence, group forces then move into hostile zones.

Patrols have gotten smaller. It would seem that the Police are taking some light control, but they're firefights continue. Its actually gotten less in the area's they control. Some are speculating in these area's were violence has died out, that the violence is sneaking elsewhere.

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

Digging in will probably be their likely choice.

Which leads to possibilities im open to:

1. 
   *US Forces Dig in, rally forces...then leave.

• *US Forces Dig in, adjust to new intelligence, group forces then move into hostile zones.

Patrols have gotten smaller. It would seem that the Police are taking some light control, but they're firefights continue. Its actually gotten less in the area's they control. Some are speculating in these area's were violence has died out, that the violence is sneaking elsewhere.

I think you've got the situation nailed... There are still a ton of unknowns though that can and probably will crop up. I do know that we're planning more than the normal amount of rotations in January... That'll mean there will be more troops on the ground during the elections without actually increasing the number of troops in the theater.

I can't see the terrorists and minority factions not trying to disrupt the election process. Unfortunatly that's a 'known'... What don't we know?

 

[hasan]

hmmm .. I view it a bit differently.
First, the obvious one: there are resistance groups working either together or individually ... in large or small networks, they attack american convoys and such .. like any other resistance in the world.
Then there are some unknown pro-alqaeda groups who keep kidnapping and behading people. Unfourtunatly those later groups get the most attention, especially from the western media, and I don't think that's a coincedence. They want the resistance to look like a bunch of barbarians .. so there you have it.
Falluja is full of terrorists that are terrorizing everybody (including iraqis .. oooh poor iraqis!) and the BRAVE US FORCES BLA BLA BLA are trying to bla bla bla .. protect freedom and umm .. help iraqis have a better life .. yadda yadda.
I think most people think about the situation in iraq like there are some radical islamists terrorizing everybody, killing both americans and iraqis .. etc.

umm .. no.

These stories about terrorists in Fallujah are nonsense, the only fighters in Fallujah are iraqis, residents of the city. They are some of the best people in Iraq. At least the city is now almost free of Americans (I'd guess), and it's because of the bravery of its people, not because some random terrorist warlord.

 

[CptStern]

give that man a cigar!

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

hmmm .. I view it a bit differently.
First, the obvious one: there are resistance groups working either together or individually ... in large or small networks, they attack american convoys and such .. like any other resistance in the world.
Then there are some unknown pro-alqaeda groups who keep kidnapping and behading people. Unfourtunatly those later groups get the most attention, especially from the western media, and I don't think that's a coincedence. They want the resistance to look like a bunch of barbarians .. so there you have it.
Falluja is full of terrorists that are terrorizing everybody (including iraqis .. oooh poor iraqis!) and the BRAVE US FORCES BLA BLA BLA are trying to bla bla bla .. protect freedom and umm .. help iraqis have a better life .. yadda yadda.
I think most people think about the situation in iraq like there are some radical islamists terrorizing everybody, killing both americans and iraqis .. etc.

umm .. no.

These stories about terrorists in Fallujah are nonsense, the only fighters in Fallujah are iraqis, residents of the city. They are some of the best people in Iraq. At least the city is now almost free of Americans (I'd guess), and it's because of the bravery of its people, not because some random terrorist warlord.

But more than attacks on American convoys we see them attacking Iraqi Police and civilians. Why....? And you call these the best people in Iraq??? I don't think so.

Is it because they know that in free elections their pundents wont achieve the level of power within the Government they'd like to have? And instead of participating in the election process where all the factions might be represented they resort to violence to achieve their political goals...

The people you are painting as "The best Iraq has" sound pretty close to websters definition of what a terrorist is... The people slaughtering the Police and Iraqi civilians are no better than the ones lopping heads off anyone who's not Iraqi or killing children in Russia.

Fallujah is free of coalition forces because the Iraqi Police control the city again. Should the 'Best people in Iraq" return the city to violence I'm sure coalition forces will be back.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Unfourtunatly those later groups get the most attention, especially from the western media,

Which is why they scramble to post their associations. Most of them have no association, and if they do, its very little. Most of the roadways leading from these cities are checked out by Coalition roadblocks. Information is starting to slow down, it looks like their being cut off.

They want the resistance to look like a bunch of barbarians .. so there you have it.

So beheading people then going out to blow up a Personel Carrier is something you'd like to paint as heroism? I paint the beheading as an attrocity of war. Now, if they could blow up thast Personel Carrier without beheading others, I might reguard them differently.

They're all connected, and most of the militants posting these beheadings are the ones actively kidnapping and fighting in these cities. Its no different.

Falluja is full of terrorists that are terrorizing everybody (including iraqis .. oooh poor iraqis!)

Are you being serious about this? Because wether or not you noticed it, "Hasan", they are terrorizing these people. Its partly why their network is shattering.

These Terrorists are virtually encased in these zones and cities because the Coalition is right outside of them. Obviously, these terrorists hide amungst Civilian forces because its easy to mingle, and easy to use civilian deaths as propaganda.

Its so strange, only Middle Eastern Medias clammor over a Civilian death. Much like your "opinion" about the Western Media. Which I'll quote here:

later groups get the most attention, especially from the western media, and I don't think that's a coincedence

and the BRAVE US FORCES BLA BLA BLA are trying to bla bla bla .. protect freedom and umm .. help iraqis have a better life .. yadda yadda.

and the BRAVE TERRORIST FORCES BLA BLA BLA are trying to bla bla bla .. cowardly protect and umm .. behead people that have a better life .. yadda yadda.

Those disclaimers are going to come and bite you in the butt. You do know that right?

I think most people think about the situation in iraq like there are some radical islamists terrorizing everybody, killing both americans and iraqis .. etc.

Did you miss the "news train?" brought to you in part by "the UN?"

The terrorists went even as far as India to capture Nepalese workers simply to behead and shoot them. I assume you think beheading people is right, especially for Americans and those helping them?

These stories about terrorists in Fallujah are nonsense, the only fighters in Fallujah are iraqis, residents of the city.

So then that makes Fallujah a legitimate target to be leveled. If they're residents, and they're all fighting, lets just level the place and get it over with /sarcasm

Realistically, they're are sparse groups of resistance claiming to be Al Qaeda linked. They're are others, some contained of Iraqis and Jordanians, also fighting in these zones. These beheadings have become a lesser effect, and lets face the facts.

People are getting tired of these antics. Even the Muslims. Even the Iraqis. The French have recently gotten inpatient with whats going on. That says something.

They are some of the best people in Iraq.

Kinda like the Einzatstruppen? Compromised of the best people: Lawyers, Bankers, Psychologists, Doctors. But I guess you would'nt care about the Shutzstaffeln (SS), because they kill jews right?

I think your disclaiming behavior as if these murderers are heroes basically outline your racial bigotry and hatred to those who've suffered.

 

[Alec_85]

Why can't they all just be Jewish/Christian, make things so much easier.

lol that exactly what the Muslims (or whatever religion they have over there) say if you just take out Jewish/Christian

 

[K e r b e r o s]

But more than attacks on American convoys we see them attacking Iraqi Police and civilians. Why....?

Oh he'll answer that question. Are they...traitors? Do they need beheadings too?

And you call these the best people in Iraq??? I don't think so.

Agreed. They're the worst. I think the Republican Guards in Saddams Reigme had better restraint. Which just proves morever, these people are mostly from different area's and belief systems much rather then the official Kuran, or Iraq itself.

Is it because they know that in free elections their pundents wont achieve the level of power within the Government they'd like to have?

See, they want power. They've wanted power since Saddam was in Power. Since he's not, their just pissy because they cant have what they've been fighting for. Their war is not holy, nor for Iraqs indepedence. But for Greed, and lust. Which is also why Muslims and other Iraqis are becoming impatient with these things.

Only in Kuran during the 10th century, where Scholars ever mentioning it said to bring death to men. Beheadings. This was debunked in the 11th Century, stating the Kuran has high morales in that men unarmed are not be killed or harmed during armed conflict.

These terrorists are slandering the Kuran and for all its worth.

And instead of participating in the election process where all the factions might be represented they resort to violence to achieve their political goals...

Exactly. Because their used to "taking" power, then "receiving it". Thats okay, keep them out of the elections. We dont need unintelligible brutal men in office. If that happens, we might have to, "go in again".

The people slaughtering the Police and Iraqi civilians are no better than the ones lopping heads off anyone who's not Iraqi or killing children in Russia.

Yup. Pretty discraceful to the Kuran itself. All of them are linked to some mean, but im glad those links are being severed.

But dont tell him something he already knew, and buried. He's trying to legitimize these people and their attrocious actions. Besides, Iraq does'nt even abide by the UN. So it explains their unyearning behavior to be locked in a closet again away from the rest of the world. Well, so the militants believe.

I feel sorry for the Police. If we leave, insurrection and revolution are probably going to leave their forces in shambles. But im glad some Iraqis are fighting with the Coalition. Its actually, more then those who support these groups of extremists.

Fallujah is free of coalition forces because the Iraqi Police control the city again. Should the 'Best people in Iraq" return the city to violence I'm sure coalition forces will be back.

Thats alright. Let them. We dominate in Open Ground warfare with our Tanks, Helicopters, Planes, Artillery, Bombers, Carriers...

The only weapon they have is exposing our media to their crimes. Its just proving over and over who we need to get. Its infact why so much information has grown out of the men responsible for these acts. I'll give it a matter of time before we get these guys.

 

[CptStern]

The only weapon they have is exposing our media to their crimes.

44 iraqis were killed in Fallujah today as a result of american shelling, 17 of them were children, 3 were women

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

44 iraqis were killed in Fallujah today as a result of american shelling, 17 of them were children, 3 were women

52 police officiers and civilians were killed by the terrorists today... http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&ncid=716&e=1&u=/ap/20040917/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

Your source is a bit suspect to me since we haven't used artillary since we left Kuwait... Possibly from Aircraft, but you said 'shelling'.

Anyway tell me again that the US should be putting troops into the Sudan so that when we get there, Which we will because Canada sure the hell isn't going, and someone dies I can remind you that it was your idea.

 

[hasan]

well, either you guys are funny, or I didn't explain my point well.
or maybe as some people say "american's don't understand sarcasm" but nah j/k.

I was saying this:
Thanks to the americans, Iraq is now a mess. The Americans probably wanted the mess to be there, to force people into wanting them to stay "to provide security". What they didn't imagine is that the mess they created would turn against them.
The resistance was born, (I don't think it oculd have been born like that without that mess .... because getting wepoans wouldn't be so easy).
Let me explain the resistance a little bit:
The American occupation is um ... an occupation, and naturally there will be resitance against this occupation.
What does the resistance do?
They attack american forces, plant mines and bomb them on tanks, fire rpg missles, drop helicopters, engage in street fights against the occupatoin.

This is the resistance, this is what Al-Fallujah is about .. so hear it well, I will say it again: The people of Falujah are some of the best people in Iraq. They make me proud.
The resistance started there, in Falluja. it was the first city to get liberated.

Unfourtunatly, the mess also allowed some guys with scrwed up heads to have thier ways. These are the people that always kidnap poor workers, release beheading videos of truck drivers .. etc.
What's worst, is that these groups are linked to the legitimate resistance, or actually they ar presented in the media as the main resistance groups.

Ofcourse, I am agianst those people, they have nothing to do with the resistance, they ar not in Falluja, and they are not welcome. (atleast I don't welcome them). They probably think they are helping against the occupation or something, but man, what the hell? why do you kidnap poor people from poor countries? why don't they kidnap american soldiers or something?
How do oyu compare beheading a few poor forign workers .. to standing off agianst the occupation forces and all of thier Tanks and Helicopters.

Just think about it, a group that can't do more than kidnapping a few drivers!! that's like all they do! and it's probably the best they can do! .. how can this group stand off in a real battle?!
Ofcourse they can't! It wasn't them who was fighting the American troops in Fallujah.

Thats alright. Let them. We dominate in Open Ground warfare with our Tanks, Helicopters, Planes, Artillery, Bombers, Carriers...

I wonder why the Americans couldn't take over a small city like Fallujah when they have all this might .... heh.
You see, that's why Falluja is the best .. I know they were hurt alot, but they stood firm in battle, and in the end, the Americans had to give up the fight.

But more than attacks on American convoys we see them attacking Iraqi Police and civilians. Why....? And you call these the best people in Iraq??? I don't think so.

That's because of two reasons:
1- Attacks on troops often don't happen in public areas, so usually there is not alot of media there. Terrorist attacks however, happen in public places, therefore you always hear about them.
2-The media probably likes to portray the resistance this way ..

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

Good acting there Canuck. Great AE.

 

[hasan]

Maybe you can actually reply to my post? If .. you have something to say.

 

[CptStern]

52 police officiers and civilians were killed by the terrorists today... http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&ncid=716&e=1&u=/ap/20040917/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

Your source is a bit suspect to me since we haven't used artillary since we left Kuwait... Possibly from Aircraft, but you said 'shelling'.

Anyway tell me again that the US should be putting troops into the Sudan so that when we get there, Which we will because Canada sure the hell isn't going, and someone dies I can remind you that it was your idea.

you're already in Sudan ...influencing as always

btw where were you in Rwanda? Canada was there, where was the US calvary? ..nothing to gain?

 

[K e r b e r o s]

So, I apologize for being so late.

So heres my replies. Hasan, I think my replies were a little too off kilter, so here are my opinions hopefully better conveyed:

Thanks to the americans, Iraq is now a mess.

I agree. We had our plans but quiet clearly Iraq was not involved in them. Oh heck, what am I saying, Iraq was involved in this plan but the United States judged their populace as if they were liberating San Francisco.

Some of the planning seemed to have worked, and some of the Iraqis seem to have enjoyed what came with them. Im not accusing Iraq of containing every known terrorist in the world, but it does contain an amount sufficient enough to keep the Coalition out of its cities.

Wether or not this amounts to different Nationalities and their terrorism contributing an effort, one thing does still stand, in that no side is sharing a nessecary hand in keeping restraint. I can understand Iraq, its fighting the war a way it knows best. The terrorists, know how to fight their own wars, and I respect that style.

But as one person, but I do not respect the torture exhibited in US Prisons on POW's, and to the same, the beheadings and tortures exhibited and made videos out of by these "Freedom Fighters".

Thankfully, its starting to become less of a problem, people are coping, and now, everyone is just bored with it.

The Americans probably wanted the mess to be there, to force people into wanting them to stay "to provide security".

Actually, to respond more on why we have "Mess-o-po-tamia" going on, is because Iraqs planning was pretty narrow. It only was there for a good couple of months, but those months were crucial enough for radicals and Guardsmen to rally and reform.

Their numbers are small, but I think how a US Soldier portrays security, and how an Iraqi portrays security could be two very different things. Which is my point: Our planning was a swift, and just a few mistakes with some unextended planning led to this whole mess.

Mistakes are made, but I think their is choice. If what your saying is true, then the Political Figures in our country would hold that as reason. I know US Soldiers want to stay to get the people responsible for some crimes, but part of them, unintentionally, want to go around and put their penises in every home of an Iraqi.

What they didn't imagine is that the mess they created would turn against them.

I dont think they figured that a move of terrorists or radicals would've even been possible. It seemed on the eves of the US Movements, terrorists from Jordan, Chechnya, Egypt, Paliestein (SP), and Iran came flocking.

I think that the huge numbers of diverse nationalities and devoted terrorists holding ground in Iraq, just showed how easily Iraq held such an objective to them.

Wether or not Iraq did support terrorism, its become a torch for these sorts of resistance. I think it became that torch, because Iraq, wether its government under Saddam knew it or not, harbored numerous movements commited by Terrorists.

I'm not trying to legitimate the claims of Weapons of Mass Destruction, but I just find it so odd a whole community of terrorists and resistance flocked to Iraq in under a few months. The resistance is full bare, and it is tough. The veterancy is starting to show of these fighters.

So heres my point: The Jordanian terrorists, why are they there? What are they defending?

I dont think they were defending much initially, and I believe before Iraq they had their own plans without the US Intervention.

The Terrorists from Chechnya, what were they doing? Resisting Russian Insurgentsies commited by the 5th and 19th Response forces.

The Terrorists from Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afgahnistan, all had plans, until the US came in. Its making me very curious why Iraqs their gem. I'm starting to think because we ended up landing on/surrounding one of the hugest suppliers to terrorism, and one of the hugest holders of such.

This resistance just bleeds with it. Afgahnistan fell pretty quick. Some resistance, and not much afterward. Osama Bin Laden pretty much headed east as speculation states to regroup away from US Occupation.

Everything else has just gaven up, or dissappeared. Iraq, its bringing them all back. Suprised or not, I think we really did land on the Crown Jewel of Terrorism. Or the terrorists just moved to Iraq to make a statement.

The American occupation is um ... an occupation, and naturally there will be resitance against this occupation.

Unfortunately, some of this resistance is Iraqi, and the messages conveyed between the two seemed to end pretty quick once the military campaign started.

They attack american forces, plant mines and bomb them on tanks, fire rpg missles, drop helicopters, engage in street fights against the occupatoin.

So, this is alright in my book. Its what I credited them with a very long time, and I told my parents this was how they were going to fight.

This is the resistance, this is what Al-Fallujah is about .. so hear it well, I will say it again: The people of Falujah are some of the best people in Iraq. They make me proud.
The resistance started there, in Falluja. it was the first city to get liberated.

Ah, your points clearer now. There is a huge difference between some of these radicals, and the actual "Iraqi" resistance. I have to credit you there. Its a huge difference between these radicals, and those actually fighting for Iraq.

Lets just hope they dont mingle for all of the wrong reasons.

Unfourtunatly, the mess also allowed some guys with scrwed up heads to have thier ways. These are the people that always kidnap poor workers, release beheading videos of truck drivers .. etc.
What's worst, is that these groups are linked to the legitimate resistance, or actually they ar presented in the media as the main resistance groups.

Its a very odd balance, but one of the leaders in Fallujah right now, was the man who personally beheaded Nick Berg. They dressed him up like an inmate, then beheaded him. Some of the resistance is mingeled with this mindset, and some of them seem not to care so long as they win.

Thats my problem with the resistance in Fallujah. If its still the Iraqi citizens and the Army resisting, thats cool, but its not for the moment. They've mingeled and accepted this image of themselves, and that guy I mentioned to in Fallujah, is pretty much the Boss in Fallujah.

Ofcourse, I am agianst those people, they have nothing to do with the resistance, they ar not in Falluja, and they are not welcome. (atleast I don't welcome them). They probably think they are helping against the occupation or something, but man, what the hell? why do you kidnap poor people from poor countries? why don't they kidnap american soldiers or something?

This is because US Soldiers dont just dissappear without radioing something in. I'm starting to believe some of the people kidnapped, or either volunteers, or are being profiled for an extensive amount of days proofing to see if their trying to help Middle Eastern economies or not.

Most of these people have been advisors, contractors, truck drivers, everything involved in bringing Iraqs supplies. This was the gang mentality I mentioned, some of these people are seperated in their objectives, and I dont think everyone is a united banner of fighting.

The Iraqis fighting in Fallujah probably have no idea, that a Jordanian is leading the charge. This Jordanian has also been trying to stop supplies from reaching Falujah.

For the kidnappings, one US Soldier was captured. But thats because I think he honestly went to these people, but, he was released. Want to know why? He was HUGE and he was of Middle-Eastern desent.

I'm not sure if anyone remembers though. Quiet possibly, these people going to these terrorists are either collaberators, or the unfortunate.

I'm sorry, but you cant kidnap a soldier in a US Patrol without some kind of fighting or communication on whats going down. The people recently kidnapped had no military communication, and were running pretty silent from a US/Britain eye.

How do oyu compare beheading a few poor forign workers .. to standing off agianst the occupation forces and all of thier Tanks and Helicopters.

You cant. I'm sorry, but standing off against an occupation force would to me, be much better then killing people to make a statement. That statement, aside from the new wave radicials, has made the largest message.

I wonder why the Americans couldn't take over a small city like Fallujah when they have all this might .... heh.

Well you cant exactly hit Civilian targets, because then we get people like the few we have here on the boards, that keep on referencing the numbers of civilians killed.

If the civilians all left Fallujah, and the Resistance stayed, we'd probably go in there quicker. Its the risk we dont want to take.

As for your statement, I was referencing the Iraqi military was stomped on flat, desert terrain. Its Airforce was shattered, and its standoffs quelled in just days.

But in the cities, its much harder to keep a high face. There's so many places were gunfire could come from, and its also tighter spaces, which gives tanks like the Abrams less of a zone to manuever.

Thats my point.

1- Attacks on troops often don't happen in public areas, so usually there is not alot of media there. Terrorist attacks however, happen in public places, therefore you always hear about them.

This is true.

It has distinction.

2-The media probably likes to portray the resistance this way ..

Depends what Channel and Country your in.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Canada was there, where was the US calvary?

The US Calvary happens to be there now, its just earlier, Canadas placement there was thought of as being enough.

Despite the media misinterpretations, we do have forces right alongside Canadas.

you're already in Sudan ...influencing as always

NFSS. (New Front Same Shit) I dont also think you understand the conflict in Sudan. The government was the first to support Osama Bin Laden, and even gave him a place to stay. There, Osama Bin Laden (this was in 1999) was able to help train a group of African Terrorists, and under the support of the Government.

Bill Clinton was going to go after Osama Bin Laden, but the Monica Lewinsky scandal came up, and if he decided to go with his plan, people would've thought he'd be "wagging the dog".

The Official Goverment of Sudan has maintained an awkward stance of control, but their forces are nothing short of heroics or heroism. They've killed more civilians then the Liberation army has, and plus, the UN even backed US Support and Peace Talks in Sudan.

Once the talks are reset however, the UN might be fully involved to ensure the situation does'nt cost another +50,000 people killed.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Your source is a bit suspect to me since we haven't used artillary since we left Kuwait... Possibly from Aircraft, but you said 'shelling'.

Exactly.

CptStern, the United States does'nt use Mortars on random homes. It does however, use Smart Bombs to hit targets from Jet Fighters in the air.

These, random attacks, are being perpertrated by Jordanian Terrorist Factions, and some of the resistance inside Iraq. What they'll do, and this what they've always done for recruitment, is bomb houses in a town they want volunteers from.

Then, after church ceremonies or mosk things (I know, being inspecific here), terrorists impersonating as local authorities, will request and assume control of this religious site and begin to preach about the bombs that fell.

Their is a Documentary on HBO on Demand called "Death in Gaza", it showcases this exact behavior and sites it continuing in various countries.

National Geographic no more then three weeks ago, had the same report on with the same message. All of it recorded on vidoe tape, with British Reporters.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

I'm going to edit this paragraph, and another one. I did'nt have a chance to correct them. Check the quotes for the new edits:

I agree. We had our plans but quiet clearly Iraq was not involved in them. Oh heck, what am I saying? Iraq was involved in this planning but the United States judged their populace as if they were liberating San Francisco.

Some of the planning seemed to have worked, and some of the Iraqis seem to have enjoyed what came with rewards. Its just unfortunate others, besides Iraqis, have been making a new name for themselves and a completely wrong image for the populace in Iraq.

As for your statement I'm accusing Iraq of containing every KNOWN terrorist: I'am not accusing Iraq of containing every known terrorist in the world. But, it seems now to contain a large hotbed of those numbers. Even worse, it contains such a diverse set of Nationalities for the terrorists.

Wether or not this amounts to different Nationalities and their terrorism contributing an effort, one thing does still stand, in that no side is sharing a nessecary hand in keeping moral restraint. I can understand Iraq, its fighting the war a way it knows best. The terrorists, know how to fight their own wars, and I respect that style so long as they keep to being sneaky and ambushey.

But as one person, I do not respect the torture exhibited in US Prisons on POW's. Much to the same token, the beheadings and tortures exhibited by these "Freedom Fighters" is also something I do not respect.

But, these fighters paint these beheadings as if its the whole image of the Iraqi populaces belief. I know thats not true, but it seems to be a majority thought of the fighting forces. Some of your best, even allow this behavior to go on, under the sake so long as America is repelled, they dont care.

Thankfully, its starting to become less of a problem, people are coping, and now, everyone is just bored with it.

--Second Paragraph

Actually, to respond more on why we have a "Mess-o-po-tamia" going on, is because Iraqs planning was pretty shallow. We had our objectives, and they were'nt out of reach, its just we got their too slowly.

We can pitch that for a win on the resistance. But, our planning for a government and maintained control in Iraq, was shallow. Our forces cant do it alone, we needed a police, and we needed volunteers quickly and aptly to go for these jobs and help out.

But, we had to first purge all of the old police and contractors out of these positions so the last remnants of possible sabotage or Saddams zone of influence, did'nt spark again.

Their numbers are small (Terrorists), but I think how a US Soldier portrays security, and how an Terrorist portrays security could be two very different things. Which is my point: Our planning was a swiftie, and just a few mistakes with some unextended planning led to this whole mess.

Mistakes are made, but I think their is choice. If what your saying is true, then the Political Figures in our country would hold that as reason. I know US Soldiers want to stay to get the people responsible for some crimes. But I hate when people generalize as if the single US Soldier their is just so he can commit his own terrorism in a benefact of revenge.

Its not why were over there, and our restraint has seemed to been better than that shared in Vietnam.

 

[hasan]

So heres my replies. Hasan, I think my replies were a little too off kilter, so here are my opinions hopefully better conveyed:

I was mainly talking to Sgt_Shellback, he pmed me and for some reason he refused to believe that I am an Iraqi. (what's his reason is byond me, either I didn't fit into his stereotype of iraqis, or he doesn't want to debate lest he loses his faith in America or something)

anyway ..

I guess you are referring to Zarqawi when you say "Jordanian terrorist".
Zarqawi can't be even be proven to be in Fallujah, so proving that he is actually leading the resistance is gonna be hella tough.
If you've been following news from different sources, you would realize all (or most) of the attacks and airstrikes on Fallujah in the past couple of weeks were hitting random civillian houses.
These attack are suposedly aimed at this Zarqawi guy.
The latest one being yesterday.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1307483,00.html

Infact, nobody claims that Zarqawi is in Fallujah other than the Occupation forces (The Ulooj)

The Iraqis fighting in Fallujah probably have no idea, that a Jordanian is leading the charge. This Jordanian has also been trying to stop supplies from reaching Falujah.

The people of Falluja are aware of the claims about Zarqawi being there and leading the resistance, and they've denoucned these claims more than once.
One of them was in a protest, and one of the speakers was saying something like "We don't need Zarqawi or others to defend our city. the brave people of Al-Falluja can defend themselves by themselves" then the crowds started cheering. (unfourtunatly I don't have a video of that).

This Zarqawi story lacks alot of evidence. I personally think he doesn't even exist. Why the hell didn't he show his face in that beheading video? huh? what's he afraid of? Osama bin laden never appeared in a video hiding his face. why? because his face is already known. Same for Zarqawi, if it was really him he wouldn't cover his face.
Beleive me, if Zarqaw was in Fallujah, everybody is gonna know that (I mean the citizens).
For some reason I tend to believe the normal citizenz whenever there is a contradiction between the official (occupation) story and the testimonies(sp?) of the people.

P.S.
I posted a link earlier, http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1307483,00.html
notice how the Terrorist attack is in large bold Heading, while the american attack is in a small sub-heading?

Quote:
How do oyu compare beheading a few poor forign workers .. to standing off agianst the occupation forces and all of thier Tanks and Helicopters.

You cant. I'm sorry, but standing off against an occupation force would to me, be much better then killing people to make a statement. That statement, aside from the new wave radicials, has made the largest message.

My point was: it's pretty obvious that those who kidnapp poor workers are a totally different groups than those who fight really against the occupation.
Those who fight are mainly Iraqis and probably amongst them are brothers from nighbouring countries.
Those who kidnapp and behead are probably alqaeda-mined groups. They could be Iraqis or they could be Saudis or whatever.
The point is, they are a totally different kind of fighters, and should not be mixed with the real resistance.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

This Zarqawi story lacks alot of evidence. I personally think he doesn't even exist. Why the hell didn't he show his face in that beheading video?

By showing his face, he jeopardized his abilities to infiltrate American patrol lines posing as a Civilian. He also, jeopardized his ability for suprise, in obtaining some of these contractors.

To gather information during a war, you must either deploy scouts, or see it/adapt as happens. If this Zarqwai guy showed his face in these videos, everyone would know who to look for. People would know what he looks like, and know "him" for what he did. In addition, its suites as three psycological factors to not show your face:

1. 
   *Makes people upset. They view it as cowardly, and they rant/rave about how this guys an idiot for not showing the world who he is.

1. 
   *Protects him. By hiding his face, he saves himself from being recognized, shot at, killed, or captured. From whatever side, for whatever reason, hiding his face would be imperative to continue operation.
   
   The Palestine Terrorists hid their faces while they were being videotaped by British News crew's. It is called, "Death in Gaza", and follows the engagements and troubles between Palestine and Israel.

1. 
   *Also, by hiding his face, it represents a cultural mark and a bit of Social stance as a Partisan. Its like a recognizing feature, who to know which is from whom.

This guy is smart for doing this. He does'nt dare reveal his face during the beheadings--he know people would immediately recognize him and attribute him for Nick Bergs beheading. That would really bring some hell in on him.

Same for Zarqawi, if it was really him he wouldn't cover his face.

Then theres the other theory. That he's dead, and they get an impersonator to imitate him. Wether or not he's alive, or in Fallujah does'nt matter. Theres been a huge lead on whats going on, and the resistance in Fallujah is trapped.

If he is alive, he might've used an impersonator to get the information about himself messed up. This would allow the real Zarqawi to persevre without much threat.

However, that aside, I believe he is in Fallujah. The beheadings, and the repeated random upspringing of mobs all claiming of Iraqi, Jordanian, Syrian, Chechnyian, Iranian, and Saudi backrounds leads me to believe that this event is much larger then people think.

I'm actually believing this war of attrition is calling on other terrorist groups, and so far, thats whats being reflected.

Those who kidnapp and behead are probably alqaeda-mined groups. They could be Iraqis or they could be Saudis or whatever.

Actually, most of the Majudeens or however you'd spell it, are. Which is unfortunate, because it seems the Iraqis like this picture painted of them. Course, for an Iraqi, you dont complain much.

 

[hasan]

Actually, most of the Majudeens or however you'd spell it, are. Which is unfortunate, because it seems the Iraqis like this picture painted of them. Course, for an Iraqi, you dont complain much.

Most of them are what? I don't really understand what you mean.

Are you saying most of the resistance are non-Iraqis or .. ?

Anyway, whether that's what you mean or not, it seems to me that you believe that the resistance consists mainly of Al-Qaeda, or is led by Al-Qaeda, or terrorists, or whatever. Something along those lines.

I really don't understand what makes you think so, other than the western media. The continous linking(sp?) between Al-Qeda and the Resistance is unbelievable.

You know why it's lies? look, for example:
When Americans bomb Falluja, and announce killing dozens of militiants, most western media repeat the official story like a parrot.
Few of them ever try to investigate the real story ..
just compare this ..
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/09/17/falluja.strike/
to this:
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/70C17B60-8D11-4702-9C54-34EDEB51693A.htm

Approximately 90 foreign fighters were inside the compound and were planning attacks against the Iraqi people, Iraqi Security forces and Multi-National Forces, CPIC reported.

Several strikes on the village of Zoba, some 7km south of the town of Falluja, demolished 13 houses, the sources and witnesses said early on Friday morning.
.
.
.
The US military in Iraq has persisted in its claims that it is targeting the "safe houses" of al-Zarqawi and/or his supporters.

However, Iraqi medical sources and independent journalists in Falluja say that most of those wheeled into local hospitals are civilians, often including many women and children.

This is a mere example .. I can't count how many of them are there. and no matter how you resist the brainwashing, no matter how smart you are, some of this stuff will still get to you, because this is what you hear 24/7.
It gets worse when the only channel you watch is Fox.
When you hear this stuff all the time, your subconcious mind will perceive it as true.

You hear this al the time "Zarqawi in Falluja .. Zarqawi in Falluja .. Zarqawi in Falluja .. " reminds of "Wepoans of mass destruction .... Wepoans of mass destruction .. Wepoans of mass destruction ... Links to Al-Qaeda ... Links to Al-Qaeda ... Links to Al-Qaeda ... Links to Al-Qaeda ..."
.
.
Pure lies .. mere lies. Nothing more, nothing less.

That might sound like a conspiracy theory .. but consider the WMD example.

P.S. umm .. that arabic in your sig .. is supposed to mean what? I realise it's a machine translation of something ... but what is it

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Anyway, whether that's what you mean or not, it seems to me that you believe that the resistance consists mainly of Al-Qaeda, or is led by Al-Qaeda, or terrorists, or whatever. Something along those lines.

No. What I mean is there is a thin line between the Iraqi's and the different nationales resisting. That line, is the line of attrocity.

These people were beheaded in Fallujah, and on the borders of Saudi Arabia. Nicholas Bergs crime however took place in Baghdad, as his body was found on one of its highways.

I really don't understand what makes you think so,

Because no media output, Western or Middle-Eastern, has put a bar between whats in Fallujah or not. This represents in my mind that the resistance is all collaberating on efforts, and does'nt care who does what so long as the US is driven out.

That much you cant question.

Approximately 90 foreign fighters were inside the compound and were planning attacks against the Iraqi people, Iraqi Security forces and Multi-National Forces, CPIC reported.

Even your "own" are starting to attack each other. Plus, lets underline Foreign Fighters. These Iraqi citizens trying to help out are now being targets of these Foreigners.

But this is'int my point.

My point is this:

Your sources address two different subjects.

some 7km south of the town of Falluja, demolished 13 houses, the sources and witnesses said early on Friday morning

Have any idea on how long 7km is?

7km south of Fallujah, is OUTSIDE of it. The article you cite from Al-Jazeera, and CNN, are discussing two very different events.

CNN is addressing an attack that occured inside Falujah, not outside of it by 7km. Therefore, your comparison between a Western Media and a Middle Eastern is incorrect, in that they address two different locations, at two different times, at two different dates, with two different targets or unfortunate outcomes. In short, your arguement that tries to provide an exclusive bias shared by a Western Media, is inherently flawed.

I can't count how many of them are there. and no matter how you resist the brainwashing, no matter how smart you are, some of this stuff will still get to you, because this is what you hear 24/7.

What like on Al-Jazeera? Yes that is my conclusion.

It gets worse when the only channel you watch is Fox.

I've never watched Fox. But I guess what your told over and over about Americans becomes true, as by your statement, it does prove that factor:

When you hear this stuff all the time, your subconcious mind will perceive it as true.

What like your Al-Jazeera quote?

Several strikes on the village of Zoba, some 7km south of the town of Falluja, demolished 13 houses, the sources and witnesses said early on Friday morning.



"The bodies of 30 people killed in Zoba were brought to Falluja general hospital as well as 40 wounded," Dr Ahmad Khalil said earlier in the day, adding that many of the victims were women and children.

Oh btw, you did'nt even bother to quote the whole article. Dont worry, I'll do it for you. Its no contradiction to my say.

Toll mounts in US assault on Falluja


Friday 17 September 2004, 16:00 Makka Time, 13:00 GMT


Civilians, including children, have been killed in the US air strikes



Related:
Bomb targets police base in Kirkuk
US bombing kills more Falluja civilians
Families flee US pounding of Falluja
US air raid kills Falluja civilians
Civilians killed as US bombs Falluja



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A fresh US aerial onslaught near Falluja in Anbar province has killed at least 56 people and wounded 40, according to hospital sources.


Several strikes on the village of Zoba, some 7km south of the town of Falluja, demolished 13 houses, the sources and witnesses said early on Friday morning.



"The bodies of 30 people killed in Zoba were brought to Falluja general hospital as well as 40 wounded," Dr Ahmad Khalil said earlier in the day, adding that many of the victims were women and children.



Khalil also said two Iraqi women were killed and eight other people wounded in another raid on Falluja.



The US military called the attack a "precision strike and destroyed a terrorist compound known to be used by the Abu Musab al-Zarqawi", a Jordanian suspected of heading a network linked to al-Qaida.



Other statements reported several operations in Anbar province - which includes Falluja and the other embattled town of Ramadi.


Some 13 houses were destroyed
in the latest assault on Falluja




The US military said it killed up to 60 foreign fighters in one strike targeting a "confirmed Abu Musab al-Zarqawi terrorist meeting site".



But that claim could not be verified.




The latest air strikes in Anbar province come hours after the US Department of Defence announced that three US soldiers had been killed in separate attacks throughout the province.



The US military in Iraq has persisted in its claims that it is targeting the "safe houses" of al-Zarqawi and/or his supporters.



However, Iraqi medical sources and independent journalists in Falluja say that most of those wheeled into local hospitals are civilians, often including many women and children.



Baghdad battle



Meanwhile a gun battle raged for several hours in central Baghdad on Friday.




Haifa Street has been the scene
of recent bloody street battles


A plume of grey smoke was seen rising from an unknown target near the Tigris close to Haifa Street, which has been the scene of intense clashes that left 13 people dead on 12 September.



The blast rocked the capital at around 6:15 am (0215 GMT).



Helicopters were hovering overhead but it was unclear whether the blast had been caused by an air strike.



US armour rolled towards the site of the fighting and heavy machinegun fire could be heard two hours after the blast. The whole neighbourhood was completely sealed off on Friday morning.



An Interior Ministry spokesman said US and Iraq forces were conducting a joint operation on Haifa Street but refused to give further details.

Both stories posted. I did some research and it seems Falujahs hospital happens to be located on the south-western end of the city. But if Zoba is 7km away from Falujah, why are they reporting to Falujahs medical hospital?

But this brings up something important.

Much like your claim the Western Media lies about Falujah, it seems like Al-Jazeera has its lies too. While the Westerners supposedly lie about links for that Beheading guy, your Middle-Easterners lie and try to connect Faluja to a town 7km away. 7km away, and behind US control.

Its not confusing, but it is obvious.

You hear this al the time "Zarqawi in Falluja .. Zarqawi in Falluja .. Zarqawi in Falluja .. " reminds of "Wepoans of mass destruction .... Wepoans of mass destruction .. Wepoans of mass destruction ... Links to Al-Qaeda ... Links to Al-Qaeda ... Links to Al-Qaeda ... Links to Al-Qaeda ..."

You hear this all the time, "Civilians killed in Falluja .. Civilians in Falluja .. Civilians in Faluja .. " reminds of "western slaughter and attack of destruction .... tanks rolling through our streets .. helicopters bombing our homes ... links to bush ... links to american home ... links to people trying to kill our country ... links to american soldiers ..."

Your own freedom fighters are dropping Shells, a product of which the United States stopped dropping the first day into the Campaign back in (2003, 2002?). Then they storm these cities, and claim that in the name of the Kuran, the Americans must be killed.

So what is this, the tit for tat? Are you, "fighting falujas fight" on the forums?

That might sound like a conspiracy theory .. but consider the WMD example.

The ones commiting to the beheadings are the main force fighting in Iraq, they represent a much larger body of resistance then you figure. Your Iraqis are fighting side by side along with this man, and yet you've addressed nothing that ever supports differently.

You dont care, so long as America is driven out. That much you have to admit.

That might sound like a conspiracy theory .. but consider your posts for example.

P.S. umm .. that arabic in your sig .. is supposed to mean what? I realise it's a machine translation of something ... but what is it

How about translating it for me. Go ahead.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Oh yes, go here: CNNarabic.com

Its in that other, CNN International link you posted. Whats all that gibberish say, along with no sidebar to see the rest of it?

Whats the resistance DOING in that picture?

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Attention Forum members! Read now! CptStern=Hasan, Hasan_CC

My conclusions are finalized. CptStern is Hasan, Hasan is CptStern, read on.

The biggest bullshit CptStern had with people, is if they dissed the french. It appears Hasan has the same issue.

Why do you hate the french like so?

This would be Hasans quote, CptSterns alter ego. But, before I jump the gun, lets compare
personalities and what those personalities believe.

So to study, does CptStern usually punctuate his items? No. Its not normal for him.

He is capable of doing it, but before this thread, he was wrighting like his usual CptHasan
self!

Observe, this thread post:

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=445983#post445983

no, alyx's mother died, we were told that in last year's E3.

=============================================

Cpt Stern Revealed!

=============================================

This caught my eye, and actually, all of the below will catch yours too. Whats an Iraqi citizen doing wrighting the following? Whats this lingo, doing in this heartfelt man dwindeling over his heroes in Falluja?

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=37590

lool, dude, the google ads display an ad to buy a CD of the Stolen Leak or something ..

What Iraqi says, dood?

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=740741#post740741

I've had some uh, debate or -rather a flamewar- with some people about the US Military. Most of them agreed that alot of the people who go to the military aren't patriots or anything, they just go thier to pay thier post-secondary education and get other benefits.

?? But wait a moment... how would you know that about their patriosm, and their post-secondary objectives? I thought you were busy idolizing your heroes? Seems like you have a new found respect and knowledge about the US Soldier.

Much like CptStern, Hasan shares the exact opinions. Almost, too sickeningly exact.

There is simply no way to count every single Iraqi killed. These numbers are collected from the news, but the news doesn't know about every single death that happens over there.

No wait, stop. Were'nt you on a roll, CptAl-Jazeera? What happened to that, irrefutable lie the Westerners were telling?

I guess the tale of tragedy died out when Hasan felt it was safe to barter his position. I knew something was wrong, but I could'nt connect the dots. But heres where I start too, and compare this to CptStern:

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=674121#post674121

flamewar. anywaz.

CptStern...? Where would I get this? Well! Check the link, Hasan knows!

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=678763#post678763

while every other site said the mail was fake, they were the only ones insisting on it

<-- CptSterns trademark reply. Check every one of his replies where he believed a topic or opinion cased a hint of irony.

Same. Damn. Thing.

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/search.php?searchid=115967&pp=25&page=7

hmm thigs I would hate to see:
pron
gayness (I don't mean bullshit stuff .. I mean gayness .. homosexuality)
lame romance between gordon and alyx. (unless they let you choose what you feel towards...

CptStern, are you feeling alright? Surely Hasan feels this way, but CptStern, argueing a champions right for freedom...saying this? Looks like, you've put up another..you. And it comes in the form of Hasan.

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=647335#post647335

lol if a nub can program it then he is not a nub anymore

Yep, nubness. From Iraq. I guess Nick Berg got beheaded for calling Zarqwai a "nub"

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=31445

I once had stupid name I thought was unique .. then I saw someone using it and I told him to change it cuz it's my name ..

lol

lol -_-; ... I guess it would make sense. After all...Hasan=CptStern. He'd need to make another name. Nothing would go over well with, CptStern_CC. ...would it?

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=639287#post639287

the link I posted is for alberta .. which is in Canada ..

here is all canada:
http://www.steampowered.com/?area=cafe_directory&country=CA

Seems like someone is being a little inconsistent...but its not like it gets any better. Look below!

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=639115#post639115

Dunno .. depends on the cafe in your area ..
I went to this one:
http://www.steampowered.com/?area=cafe_directory&country=CA&state=AB
second one .. under Calgary ..

The guys over there don't even...

Calgary. Canada. I wonder why on the steampowered forums he was looking up an area cafe specially to Canada and Calgary...NOT LIKE ANYONE ASKED FOR IT IN THE THREAD!

i might have been playin with you i was "kp" .

Theres a reply he gets from a local "Canadian".

But lets scroll up to what he says!

hope you enjoy .. my time in the CC is almost up ..\
ill try to upload as much as I can ..

Theirs a CyberCafe in Baghdad? (CC=CyberCafe)

http://www.steampowered.com/?area=cafe_directory

Lets have a look!

Argentina

Australia

Belgium

Bolivia

Brazil

Brunei Darussalam

Bulgaria

Canada

Colombia

Czech Republic

Denmark

Estonia

Finland

France

Germany

Greece

Hungary

Ireland

Italy

Japan

Korea, Republic Of

Malaysia

Mongolia

Morocco

Netherlands

New Zealand

Nigeria

Norway

Philippines

Poland

Portugal

Russian Federation

Singapore

Slovakia

South Africa

Spain

Sweden

Switzerland

United Kingdom

United States

Uruguay

!! Oh damn. -_- wheres Iraq? Nowhere. ...but I DO see a Canada...
But wait...!! Look into Hasans profile!

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=31399&page=1&pp=40

is there any of these cyber cafes with cs:s in canada?

Asks a forum member.

the link I posted is for alberta .. which is in Canada ..

here is all canada:
http://www.steampowered.com/?area=c...tory&country=CA

Does'nt this ever get redundant?

the link I posted is for alberta .. which is in Canada ../impression

No better than this one!

I think I will go again tomorrow .. might take a few more screens if you guys want .. with good quality (if I could figure out how to do it)

Yes, tomorrow, he will stroll out of his house (in Canada), and goto a CyberCafe (in Calgary) << (which is in .. "Canada"), and play in this CyberCafe (also .. in Canada).

LOL im laughing so hard right now!

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=31399&page=2&pp=40

If you mean how many people in the cyber .. well ..
The cafe I went to was empty .. it's like nobody else in Calgary cares about CS:S

OMG XD!! This puts the icing on the cake! Great work CptHasan, you've been flushed out!

...but im not finished yet!

which is a good thing in a way, because I don't have to wait for a slot .. for somebody to leave so I can sit in his place. but It's bad in other ways, cuz CS:S wasn't preloaded!!!!
So unless today I use the same computer, I'm gonna have to preload it again -- which takes/wastes an hour.

Yea, I guess its bad waiting while Osama Bin Laden and the flying corpses from Falluja are taking your next slot, eh old chap?

Hope you get the same computer! Slots are going! ^^

But wait! Hasan has a twin! Hasan_CC! Which just registered in August, and both post in the same thread!

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=640495#post640495

Heres something else! OMG, I cant believe im finding this crap...

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=639319#post639319

yeah, and in the cyber cafe I was at ..

Remember folks, and remember! IN. CALGARY. ^^ But keep following, look below!

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=638476#post638476

just give us the time in GMT plz

Yea, cause we all know! Thats Baghdad time.

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=634566#post634566

There is one in calgary .. and it's so close it's like less than 1km away ^_^

I just hope it's not costy o_o

!! Okay, enough with the gig. You've been caught, CptStern. This was your alter ego.
This should be more then enough proof that you are CptStern, and if you resist, it should put out of contexts that you live legitimately in Iraq. I'd like to congradulate you, dumbass, on fibbing through your teeth. Hasan_CC, is also yours. Its the name you use at the CyberCafe in Calgary. How do I know? ...I've seen you using that name... I visted the Cafe just a time ago, and lone'and'behold, its you... I did'nt bother saying anything in August, but I guessed I should say something now, as Sgt. Shellback gave me the heads up.

CC? CyberCafe. In Calgary. It also means, Calgary "Cybercafe".

Furthermore, your mannerisms are exactly CptSterns, and CptStern did'nt live in the middle east. For his opinions, he hardly capitalized. Unless he has to, much like you've needed to now. That was for the maintenence if someone did detect a difference, that they could'nt compare. Too bad, I did. Also, whats even more disturbing...is you've got the same IP Address he does.

Much to the same, you've not commited yourself to this "new you", until recently when your gimmick was exposed. In numerous threads, you bounce between living around Calgary, to being in Iraq. Your prejudice was also CptStern's, as you both share a "WTF is your problem with the french" attitude. You even joked about it in a thread that I quoted here. In that same pattern, you addressed me I think a week ago during the North Korea thread.

Your swift change in puncuation between the General Gaming forum and the Off Topic forum is what prompted me to investigate this fully. Its not like you to correct yourself as often. Yes, I noticed something that small. I just needed to write some more to expose your gimmick.

Your General Gaming attitude compared to the Off-Topic attitude is hilarious! Your General Gaming attitude is: "heehee, calgary, 1km away! omg cs". Your Off-Topic attitude however is, "I live in Iraq <throw in x opinion here>".

You've used lie to barter your opinions, and a falsehood through the manipulation of powering another name behind which its Residence is not its profiles stated country. You honestly thought we'd all buy it as some tacky excerpt from, "someone who was there". Well your not. CptSterns attitudes recently have also changed. His responses are shorter, and "Hasans" are longer.

Some other observations:

This Iraq gimmick came up specifically so you could have a replacement for CptStern, and another name to barter your opinions with. This is just sick, and you've been living a lie. Whats even better, is half of the threads "Hasan" posts too, at most, if any, CptStern only has one or two replies, and thats if its a big thread. If its small, expect to not CptStern maybe once.

In addition, the times you guys appear is almost always similiar. Differences between minutes. Minutes. Only recently was it an hour...where you out on the town that time in Calgary?

Whats even better, is you both express the same opinions, to which in one thread you basically copied yourself. Exactly to the word. Hasan, without quoting, wrote and expressed the same viewpoint with the same personalty traits that CptStern had. You've just sunk to a new low, Congradulations, CptStern, on your wonderful, two day LIE.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Something else to note, "Hasan" checks his mail at this CyberCafe, and has even made a few posts from there. Thought I'd say that much...

Is your computer working at home?

Something else, and I forgot to add. While im certain it was you in that CyberCafe, im not entirely sure if the name belonged to you, or how long you've kept it.

Hasan_CC is also just a social name you've been using for the forums, to show Hasan is "CyberCafe" certified. /cynicsm

Next time, dont lie CptStern. You've just lost all credibility for this thread. A lot of other people knew what you were doing, and thanks for a few other e-mails pointing it out, this is really just coming to light.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

BTW, its a little obvious that I used a translation program. But, which one did you use CptStern, and when? :smoking: