casting shadows on your p_models

BabyHeadCrab

BabyHeadCrab

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erm.. whatever the first person models are

I was playing frag-ops (gorgeous ut2k4 mod with some of the best maps/lighting I have ever seen) and I went by a light and to my startling delight my arm had lighting/shadowing on it for instance in a dark room if I walk by a light I can see the shadowy/lighted parts of my arm/gun model

Will half-life 2 support this? I dont know much about lighting in games but I know HL2's lighting gets talked about alot and I heard there isint moving dynamic multiple shadow overlaping or some jibba-jabba. So can you get gorgeous effects like this?
 
It isn't a dynamic shadow effect per se. Its more of a shadow map, well i'm not entirely sure. I'm not good at explaining how it works but it works similar to the way Far Cry does.

The one thing i do now though is that its nothing to do with dynamic shadows like Doom 3.

As For HL2 having it, i'm not sure you'd have to email someone at Valve. Source should be entirely capable of it
 
Probably, Far Cry incorporates this feature on the higher detail settings.
 
The Source engine is perfectly capable of creating this kind of shadowing effect. You can see something similiar in the 2004 e3 videos when the player is following Father Gregory (or whatever his name is).

And it's my understanding that Source can also generate a limited number of "dynamic shadows" (think Doom 3), but Valve is sticking primarily to shadow maps for performance reasons.
 
You know, half-life had a very simple version of this effect, so I don't see why it won't be in HL2.
 
I assume so, you can see a similar effect in the gregori/ravenholm video. I think there was some extend of dynamic shadows also (which changed with the light source) was present - but then only two people were present on screen (before they get off the fence and fought the headcrabed zombie dogs). I'm not certain, though.

Although that was the only video that proved that the shadowing was improving - so hopefully we see it through the full game.
 
On the topic of P_Models and V_models, ive always wondered if they would ever be able to have true interaction between them.

Say for example, the bayonett in day of defeat. You dont actually hit the person, you swipe the bayonett at them and it counts as a hit. Would it be possible to ever have your first person model interact with the target player model, like actually stab into him and see it penitrate into the model.

Ive thought that you could do it by making both the first person model and the 3rd person model v_models, but there is always a degridation of quality on 3rd person models. Its something i think that is need to be advanced when talking about realism. Things like running up to a wall with a massive long gun, and you can clip right through the wall.
 
well, in HL2 the crowbar will be a physical object in the game world. so you could just push it into a table and the table would move, and people could bonk their heads on the crowbar or something.

3d object ;)
 
urseus said:
...Say for example, the bayonett in day of defeat. You dont actually hit the person, you swipe the bayonett at them and it counts as a hit. Would it be possible to ever have your first person model interact with the target player model, like actually stab into him and see it penitrate into the model...Things like running up to a wall with a massive long gun, and you can clip right through the wall.
Click to expand...

They had a sort of simple version of this in Infiltration for the original UT. Long rifles and Carbines would hit walls when you were inside much more easily than submachine guns would. I think that was the first game where there was much of a reason to have a submachine gun beyond the reduced recoil. Some realism mods could really benefit from that idea, it's a good one. :bounce:

EDIT: Something else I thought of: if the crowbar is physically simulated, will something thrown at you hit the crowbar instead? If you walk into a wall, will it actually smack into it? If you walk into people, will it smack them? All leading up to - can you block bullets? :E
 
that would be sweet but the bullets arent physically simulated. Mod anyone?
 
slider3005 said:
that would be sweet but the bullets arent physically simulated. Mod anyone?
Click to expand...
im sure someone will. valve didnt do it b/c they said it didnt add anything to the gameplay, and for a game like HL2 i agree.
 
also it would be too resource consuming to physically simulte bullets.

and yeah, you can block things with your crowbar.

in fact, there is a HL2 mod based on a medival theme that uses swords. and you can block with your sword 'cause it will e physically simulated as well.
 
It might not work that well, like if you stabbed somone, as their body slumped to the floor it would jerk your view around if the knife was still in them.

Something i am unhappy about is that HL2 still uses hitboxes, where as doom3 uses per poly hit detection.
 
The hitboxes in HL2 are not all rectangular prisms like HL. They fit the models much better without being as much of a burden on the CPU as per-poly hit detection.
 
OCybrManO said:
The hitboxes in HL2 are not all rectangular prisms like HL. They fit the models much better without being as much of a burden on the CPU as per-poly hit detection.
Click to expand...

I think you mean per-pixel.


HL2s is actaully pretty close to per-poly from what i have read..
 
No, I don't think so.

They have per-pixel lighting and per-poly collision / hit detection. There is no need for per-pixel hit detection. It doesn't offer any extra precision in terms of whether or not the shots hit, you don't need it to put decals in the proper places, and it uses more resources.
 
OCybrManO said:
No, I don't think so.

They have per-pixel lighting and per-poly collision / hit detection. There is no need for per-pixel hit detection. It doesn't offer any extra precision in terms of whether or not the shots hit, you don't need it to put decals in the proper places, and it uses more resources.
Click to expand...

Doom 3 uses per pixel.
 
http://www.planetdoom.com/doom3/faq/
PlanetDoom.com said:
How will DOOM 3 be handling the Per-Poly collision detection?
The Per Poly hit detection gives great feed back on where someone is hit it removes the square bony boxes used in the past. It helps make things more believable and adds to a richer environment. When something is shot, the marks will appear exactly where the object would have been hit.
Click to expand...

http://www.gaminginvasion.com/index.php?article=68
(same quote in the PlanetDoom FAQ, but this time we know it came from Tim Willits)


http://www.computerandvideogames.co...deogames.com/news/news_story.php(que)id=95176
ComputerandVideoGames.com said:
Presumably because of the per-poly hit detection, characters in multiplayer will all be of a very similar size, otherwise it just wouldn't be fair. Hence we can't imagine they'll have too many crazy player models.
Click to expand...

http://games.bigpond.com/pc/features/idsoftware.php
BigPond.com said:
GameArena: What was the reaction to the per-poly hit detection?

Todd Hollenshead: You know, I didn't have an opportunity to talk in-depth with people about "like it, don't like it", but I think everybody noticed it. That was definitely one of the things internally at id that I guess snuck up on us a little bit, because we knew it was in and we'd had it in the single player game for over a year, but when we started playing multiplayer and running around and testing it, it was like - what the hell's wrong? Is the damage on the weapons not turned up enough? Some bug in the armour? People have a thousand health? You bastard, you're in god mode. Especially if you're playing Fred [Nilsson], who's far too good.

We finally just realised that we just were missing one another, and it took a little bit of adjustment to realise that you need to be doing some things just from a technique standpoint a little differently.
Click to expand...

... is that enough for you?
 
I have always wanted to crouch with a crowbar or with a gun and hold the weapon under a table and then stand up and aim up and then see the table go flying :cheers: :p
 
I seriously doubt you'd see your arms getting shadowed... You never see them anyway. But the gun you're holding, no doubt.
 
This was in all the way back in 2003. Just watch the manipulator at the start of the traptown video: static shadows slide over it just like they do regular world models.
 
When will people understand that there is essentially no such thing as per-pixel hit "detection" that refers to the ability to place a bullet throughout any pixel.. nothing is detected by the pixels which differ depending on specs/monitor and gfx quality only the polys which can determine damage / physics calculations "detect" the bullet collision.
 
wouldnt hit boxes be better in some cases? like for instance a character who wears really baggy clothes? That way you cant shoot the edge of say some pants and inflict damage.
 
No youd just define what parts of the pants count as a hit. What your describing is what would happen with hitboxes, not per poly.

Like say you were shooting MCHammer. Youd set the outside of his parashoot pants to no hit vaule, and the center where the leg would be under the pants to leg hit value. Hitbox would just be the whole leg counts as leg hit.
 
i think there should be different sized models....the best model in goldeneye for multiplayer was odd job and everyone cursed you for using it.

makes things more interesting imo
 
urseus said:
No youd just define what parts of the pants count as a hit. What your describing is what would happen with hitboxes, not per poly.

Like say you were shooting MCHammer. Youd set the outside of his parashoot pants to no hit vaule, and the center where the leg would be under the pants to leg hit value. Hitbox would just be the whole leg counts as leg hit.
Click to expand...

I think it would be the other way around. Can't you make the hit box smaller than the actual model's pants? With per-poly, it would count the pants as part of the model since its reading the polys from the actual model, and not from a hit-box.

I just guessing so I may be wrong...
 
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