CERN: Proof of Extra Dimensions Possible Next Year

[No Limit]

GENEVA (Reuters) - Scientists at the CERN research center say their "Big Bang" project is going beyond all expectations and the first proof of the existence of dimensions beyond the known four could emerge next year.

In surveys of results of nearly 8 months of experiments in their Large Hadron Collider (LHC), they also say they may be able to determine by the end of 2011 whether the mystery Higgs particle, or boson, exists.

Guido Tonelli, spokesman for one of the CERN specialist teams monitoring operations in the vast, subterranean LHC, said probing for extra dimensions -- besides length, breadth, height and time -- would become easier as the energy of the proton collisions in it is increased in 2011.

Other CERN physicists say the success so far of the world's largest scientific project suggests that some great enigmas of the universe they have in their sights could be at least partly resolved much sooner than they thought.

Full Article: http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wirestory?id=12152908&page=1

A ballsy prediction to make on their part. But I hope it turns out to be true. If by the end of next year they have evidance of additional dimensions and of the higgs boson that would be a huge step for physics.

However, I'm not going to hold my breath, hard for them to make predictions like that and in some ways I think this is meant to get more publicity. If they don't get evidance of this by the end of the next year the accelerator will be shut down until 2013 so we will have to wait quite a bit longer.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

That guy has the worst first name.

 

[Chrash]

Stupid names aside, that's some crazy stuff, more dimensions and stuff?



I'm calling Voodoo on this...

 

[Warped]

its a portal to the Nether! we need to try this shit on Mars first not here imo. I'd hate to see the world sink into darkness in our neck of the woods

 

[MJ12]

Guido Tonelli, spokesman for one of the CERN specialist teams

​

 

[AKIRA]

its a portal to the Nether! we need to try this shit on Mars first not here imo. I'd hate to see the world sink into darkness in our neck of the woods

I think they already established that there is an insanely small probability that one of the black holes that the LHC creates would be alive long enough to grow and to swallow anything.

 

[Warped]

not black holes, the hell dimension, bro

 

[No Limit]

I doubt you guys are serious but there is absolutely no way this thing could destroy the planet. The amount of energy/mass that would be required to create a blackhole that could suck in a gram of matter is unimaginable to us, let alone something that would suck in an entire planet.

 

[Remus]

not black holes, the hell dimension, bro

Quit spouting nonsense, kthxbye.


According to the latest theories in physics there are 10 spatial dimensions + time

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkxieS-6WuA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySBaYMESb8o&feature=channel

 

[<RJMC>]

 

[Stigmata]

Time is a spatial dimension too!

 

[Eejit]

Quit spouting nonsense, kthxbye.


According to the latest theories in physics there are 10 spatial dimensions + time

I've heard 16 including time :arms:

 

[Shakermaker]

This made me chuckle:

On December 6, the LHC will be shut down for servicing and to avoid draining electricity in the depths of winter from the energy networks of France and Switzerland along whose border CERN lies.

Does anybody know roughly how many watts the LHC uses?

 

[Dodo]

apperantly this is what 11 dimensions look like...

 

[Remus]

I've heard 16 including time :arms:

Source or it didn't happen. *arms*

 

[PvtRyan]

10 bucks says that the scientist's original claim was much more nuanced than how it was reported.

 

[No Limit]

This made me chuckle:



Does anybody know roughly how many watts the LHC uses?

Depends on the time of year and other factors but with all the experimental sites and the actual beam it's around 120MW/hr. If you assume an average home uses 2kW/hr that means you could power 60,000 homes with that kind of energy. I'm guessing that's enough to power a city of a few hundred thousand people.

http://lhc-machine-outreach.web.cern.ch/lhc-machine-outreach/faq/lhc-energy-consumption.htm

 

[StarBob]

Seems like every few months Cern comes along and says "We're gonna prove something in the next year." I'm waiting for anything really groundbreaking to come from this big ass LHC project despite the fact that I have absolutely no tangible or intangible investments in it whatsoever.

 

[Shakermaker]

Enough electricity to power a small city. I love science.

 

[Eejit]

Source or it didn't happen. *arms*

Google a bit. It's one of the many as-yet unproven theories /shrug

 

[The Monkey]

 

[Remus]

Yeah, we're pretty much ****ED!

 

[Stigmata]

apperantly this is what 11 dimensions look like...

You know, I've seen that shape several times in my mind. Mostly it pops up when I'm extremely high, depressed, introspective, or a combination thereof. So I'm tempted to belive that this is a three-dimensional representation of eleven dimensions.

 

[Raziaar]

apperantly this is what 11 dimensions look like...

You don't say...

 

[Stigmata]

Raz... that can't be unseen. I mean, it kind of can, but without the lines it just looks like an even happier face.

 

[Warped]

it looks like a flour puff thingy to me

 

[VirusType2]

looks like a vagina

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

Looks like yalls mamas.

 

[Wanted Bob]

CERN is the Peter Molyneux of science.

Also that 10 dimensions video was pretty cool.

 

[Avoidist]

The interactions they're doing have been ridiculously surpassed by cosmic rays interacting with the atmosphere which happens incredibly frequently at their energies of 500TeV (5*10^14 eV). The Pierre-Auger Observatory alone has detected 30 particles with energies above 50EeV (5*10^19 eV), that's 100,000 times more energetic (and about that cubed rarer), during its few years in operation.

The difference is you can't just have a massive device like ALICE suspended at the top of the atmosphere tracking all the secondary particles and hope for the best. What they're doing isn't something outlandish and extraordinary in nature, it's just the best we've been able to do ourselves in order to control and measure the reaction. So no, there's no black holes incoming. But you guys know this anyway, so I don't really know why I'm typing this. Oh well.

 

[Stigmata]

I appreciated it.

 

[bbson john]

The extra dimension will be so twisted that we cannot possibly travel in to it. :|

 

[DEATH eVADER]

So Xen is within our grasp?

 

[Solaris]

Quit spouting nonsense, kthxbye.


According to the latest theories in physics there are 10 spatial dimensions + time

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkxieS-6WuA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySBaYMESb8o&feature=channel

Sorry to burst your bubble, but those videos are absolute bullshit.

Clarky used to pretend to know a lot about physics and posted those videos years back and got called out on it. Those videos are explaining a totally out there idea of concepts that have nothing to do with spacial dimensions. What the videos are talking about are complete nonsense, they are not what is meant by 10 spacial dimensions, not remotely.

I ****ing hate those videos so much, becuase they spread so much misunderstanding about this whole concept and people post them all over the internet thinking that's what modern physics is talking about. It isn't. Those videos couldn't be more wrong.

 

[Avoidist]

Yeah, the way they even describe the 4 dimensions of space and time is complete bull as well, curvature is intrinsic property of the 4 dimensions, rather than representing a deformed surface in 5. Though I'm not sure if string theory has anything more to say about that, since M theory suggests the universe could be a Brane floating within an extra-dimensional space, and the 6 other dimensions are finite in extent, somehow curled up at an impossibly small scale such that we are unable to observe their effects. The brane would have presumably have curvature which might be associated with general relativity, but to be honest my knowledge of string theory is basically just what I've learned from "The Elegant Universe", it's not something they go into extensively at undergraduate level.

Now to go back to my suspiciously relevant general relativity assignment: evaluating many, many Christoffel connection coefficients.

 

[bbson john]

Yeah, the way they even describe the 4 dimensions of space and time is complete bull as well, curvature is intrinsic property of the 4 dimensions, rather than representing a deformed surface in 5. Though I'm not sure if string theory has anything more to say about that, since M theory suggests the universe could be a Brane floating within an extra-dimensional space, and the 6 other dimensions are finite in extent, somehow curled up at an impossibly small scale such that we are unable to observe their effects. The brane would have presumably have curvature which might be associated with general relativity, but to be honest my knowledge of string theory is basically just what I've learned from "The Elegant Universe", it's not something they go into extensively at undergraduate level.

As if someone on the internet could understand Calabi-Yau manifold.

 

[Avoidist]

Ugh, I know. I sound like a post-doc.

Spoiler

Or at least, I wished I sounded like a post-doc. Those guys are freaking smart.

 

[Remus]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but those videos are absolute bullshit.

Clarky used to pretend to know a lot about physics and posted those videos years back and got called out on it.

Sorry to burst your misconceptions, but I don't pretend to know any more about physics than avarage. If you can recommend some reading material that is factual on the subject of extra dimensions, that would be apreciated.

 

[Solaris]

Sorry to burst your misconceptions, but I don't pretend to know any more about physics than avarage. If you can recommend some reading material that is factual on the subject of extra dimensions, that would be apreciated.

Sorry I came across as a dick there, I just really hate that video.

All you really need to do is think about how 3D relates to 2D. It's an extra spacial dimension. 4D is like that, incomprehensibly to us 3D beings, but it is spacial, that video makes it out to be pseudo-quantam mechanical nonsense.

I'd highly reccomend this enjoyable, short and pleasant book: Flatland
http://www.geom.uiuc.edu/~banchoff/Flatland/

 

[Remus]

Thanks.

Well I just did some research on who made those videos. As it turns out the guy that made them, Rob Bryanton, also wrote a book on the subject called "Imagining the tenth dimension". I have looked for info on this guy, and he has no background in physics whatsoever, he's just a writer/artist.

And here's a review of the book on Amazon:

Spoiler

"Bryanton doesn't understand what a dimension is, so unfortunately this book is a waste of trees. His exposition contains the logical flaw where the dimension 5 to 7 are a subset of the dimension 7 to 9 (he doesn't actually come up with a tenth dimension), that is he defines dimension 5-7 in anthropomorphic terms (ie related to personal lives) and defines them as orthogonal to all universes' probability spaces. As we are part of the universe our time lines are segments of, within and part of all universes' time-lines, so are obviously not orthogonal and independent, otherwise you would have to consider histories of planets and atoms as separate dimension to be logically consistent.

Bryanton is adept in the art of the pseudoscience, throwing in plenty of references to actual science that he obviously only understands superficially (else his book would not have these obvious flaws). The book is mainly full of "new-age" feel good philosophy and is accompanied by a very slick website - don't waste your dimensions ."

So it seems this guy is the equivalent of Ray Comfort on the subject of theoretical physics. The problem is most people don't bother to verify if this kind of information is real or not, and just take it as fact. So, Solaris, expect to see this video referenced many more times in the future... :/