Combine Advisor questions *EP 2 SPOILERS*

[GTGear]

Alright,

Just finished Half Life Episode 2, on the X360. Awesome experience, one of the best games I've played. But now, I have couple of questions to ask, mostly about the Combine Advisors.

1. Are the Combine Advisors the leaders of the Combine Empire? or do they just have a high position in the Combine hierarchy? Where do they exactly rank? They seem to order the overwatch forces around, so I'm guessing they are leadership of some sort, but why would their be so many on Earth?

2. So, the Advisors we see are Larva? The Vortigaunt said, we had to stop them before they hatched. Or do Advisors remain the same, and they just show maturity, by the number of mechanical enchancements they have, such as limbs? The Advisor we saw in the life support chamber, in the shack, seemed to be young, and he didn't have the mechanical limbs, the larger ones had, in the end.

 

[Russian Mafia]

1. As far as we know, the Advisers are the highest ranking officials, most likely there is something higher than them. The Advisers could be the highest ranker on Earth though.

2. This is something to maybe see in Episode 3.

 

[Logic]

What we do know is that the advisors are members of the actual combine species. They are therefore almost certainly leaders in relation to the combine troops, but we know nothing about the hierarchy within the species itself, or whether there even is a hierarchy. There may be greater or more powerful beings behind the operation still located on the combine home world, or even elsewhere on earth. Alternatively, they may operate as a singular, collective consciousness.

The combine appear to be well versed in telekinesis and telepathy, so they presumably share their knowledge with each other telepathically (regardless of whether they retain individuality or operate as a collective consciousness). So while these particular advisors may be new, young creatures "hatching", they are probably already imbued with all existing combine knowledge and intention, and are therefore just as likely to be in positions of leadership.

 

[A Big Fat CoW]

I'm pretty sure they meant "hatch" as in hatching from the escape pods. That's the impression I got.


In any case, I strongly disagree with the notion that the Combine has a "species". The Combine is an amalgam of races that their government has conquered and adapted. The Advisors are just one of many. Calling the Advisors the "Combine species" would be like calling Nihilanth the "Xen species". They're just one race (of many) that have been assigned to coordinate the Combine on earth. Hell, I'm willing to bet that they're just glorified middle-management.

 

[Logic]

In any case, I strongly disagree with the notion that the Combine has a "species". The Combine is an amalgam of races that their government has conquered and adapted.

Whose government? See, there has to be a species of origin, and it makes sense that this species would need to stay in control, in order for the collective combine forces to work in coordination towards singular objectives (which clearly do not serve the purposes of the various species within the collective forces). It also makes sense that this original species would have some ability to exert power and control over other species, in order for the process of taking over and absorbing races and technologies to begin in the first place.

It doesn't seem coincidental to me that the combine advisors have strong telekinetic and telepathic abilities. Their design also demonstrates them to be incredibly evolved and advanced creatures. Ted Backman had this to say in Raising the Bar:

In designing [the Combine Advisor] we wanted to suppose that an organism, not unlike humans, began to depend on the technology that was originally created to improve it's quality of life. Over the course of its evolution, it became grublike, with limbs no longer able to support its own weight, eyes too feeble to see without aid, a body now incapable of movement, fully dependent on the technology that it created. It was, however, incredibly evolved in its ability to reason, invent, and dominate the minds and cultures of other beings.

A species this intellectually evolved doesn't sound like one that is likely to fall under control of another species, but rather, the one which is exerting control over others. It seems too coincidental that a species would exist in the Half-Life universe, known for it's ability to "dominate the minds and cultures of other beings" without it being the species which is doing exactly that in the plot. It seems to me that the species of which the advisors are a part, are using their highly developed intelligence and technology to further expand and develop their technology and power. Dependency is a weakness, and what does anyone with a dependency want? More more more. They are compensating for their weakness by exerting control in every way they can.

I take your point though and I'm open to the possibility that they're not the controlling species. I just don't think it's a particularly likely possibility.

 

[Asknoone]

I'm not sure where they rank, and I'm a little confused about the hatching/maturity process too. Considering they started off as a race that grew far too dependent on the technology it had created to improve its quality of life (to the point of being unable to survive without it), - forced evolution/immortality etc - I find it hard to understand why they wouldn't - in all stages - be in the form we see them toward the end of EP2.

They definitely have absolute control, though. It's possible they were on Earth before the uprising, but they could used the Dark Fusion reactor to teleport in around the time of Nova Prospekt's demise. Breen is managing the transformation process, so I'm not sure what role they'd play other than governing him. Unless they remain in some kind of incubation within the Citadel for the duration of the humantity-Combine transformation stage.

 

[Laivasse]

I think they are active mentally and in a governing capacity while they are in the citadel. You see them watching you on monitors in Ep1 followed by Combine assaults shortly after, which suggests they have a large degree of control over the deployment and direction of troops.

However, it could be that they are in a kind of physical stasis while they are in the citadel, and that it takes a short period before they can 'hatch' out of their equipment/the escape pods and be ready for physical movement, etc. Perhaps this hatching period would be for such things as their mechanical arms (which would be of little use while cooped up within a tight pod) becoming equipped, and so forth.

 

[Asknoone]

Well, Breen was supposed to be commanding the Overwatch, but as he's out of the picture now the Advisors are taking a more active role. Interesting, though, that most of the C17 Overwatch has been crippled. I'd say this means the post-humans have failed the test, and won't be augmented into the Combine.

 

[Laivasse]

I'd say this means the post-humans have failed the test, and won't be augmented into the Combine.

Funny that. The advisors may well hate the Transhuman Overwatch and think that they stink, but for the meantime they have no choice but to use them to ensure their own survival.

 

[Absinthe]

I'm not sure if it humanity could be considered a "failure". After all, who are the ones that are continuing to be a consistent problem, messing with the Combine's plans?

I think human ability has certainly been demonstrated. But I wouldn't be surprised if - after the failure to totally enslave the species - they'd find it more convenient to simply wipe us out of the universe.

 

[A Big Fat CoW]

Whose government? See, there has to be a species of origin, and it makes sense that this species would need to stay in control, in order for the collective combine forces to work in coordination towards singular objectives (which clearly do not serve the purposes of the various species within the collective forces). It also makes sense that this original species would have some ability to exert power and control over other species, in order for the process of taking over and absorbing races and technologies to begin in the first place.

None of which I disagree with; I'm just pointing out that this particular role might not be filled by the Advisors. Again, I propose the idea of middle-management: The Advisors are in charge of operations on Earth (and perhaps more) but are ultimately lower on the foodchain than whatever is in charge of the Combine as a whole (after all, why would they send their leaders to one measly little planet? Breen made it sound like they've conquered whole galaxies.)

As for the species of origin, we still have no idea what formed the Combine. We know it's a form of government, but that's it. To suggest that it was formed by a single species that conquered other species is a bit closed-minded, IMO; for all we know it could have been an alliance among several governments (and species). In any case, calling one species "The Combine species" would be like calling the founding fathers "The American species". Governments are, by nature, larger than the people who create them.

It doesn't seem coincidental to me that the combine advisors have strong telekinetic and telepathic abilities. Their design also demonstrates them to be incredibly evolved and advanced creatures. Ted Backman had this to say in Raising the Bar:



A species this intellectually evolved doesn't sound like one that is likely to fall under control of another species, but rather, the one which is exerting control over others. It seems too coincidental that a species would exist in the Half-Life universe, known for it's ability to "dominate the minds and cultures of other beings" without it being the species which is doing exactly that in the plot. It seems to me that the species of which the advisors are a part, are using their highly developed intelligence and technology to further expand and develop their technology and power. Dependency is a weakness, and what does anyone with a dependency want? More more more. They are compensating for their weakness by exerting control in every way they can.

I take your point though and I'm open to the possibility that they're not the controlling species. I just don't think it's a particularly likely possibility.

Again, all good and true, but it doesn't automatically equate into Advisors being the guys in charge of everything. We already know that there's stronger telepaths in the HL2 universe; Nihilanth could open inter-dimensional portals with his mind. The Advisors would seem to be unable to do that (else we'd see a lot more Combine teleporting around, not relying on things like the Citadel and Nova Prospekt). So we know the possibility is already out there.

Also, we have yet to see the Advisors use their telepathy at a range longer than maybe a few hundred yards. If they were powerful enough to be in control of the Combine, couldn't they do the mind rape thing on Gordon from anywhere on earth?

Just throwing out food for thought. I find being skeptical about things leads to more defined answers in the end.

 

[Solver]

I'm not sure if it humanity could be considered a "failure". After all, who are the ones that are continuing to be a consistent problem, messing with the Combine's plans?

I think human ability has certainly been demonstrated. But I wouldn't be surprised if - after the failure to totally enslave the species - they'd find it more convenient to simply wipe us out of the universe.

I think the Combine had already decided to wipe humanity out. Their attempts to open the superportal were probably about it. Bring in the real Combine forces, this time, with the goal of wiping all people out. I just don't think the Combine would have tried to restore control over Earth, getting themselves back into the pre-Freeman situation.

 

[chimpmunk]

Nihilanth could open inter-dimensional portals with his mind. The Advisors would seem to be unable to do that (else we'd see a lot more Combine teleporting around, not relying on things like the Citadel and Nova Prospekt). So we know the possibility is already out there.

Actually Nihilianth KEPT THE PORTAL OPEN between earth and Xen during the resonance cascade but was not the one behind the creation of the portal.

 

[Logic]

....
Just throwing out food for thought. I find being skeptical about things leads to more defined answers in the end.

Other than what chimpmunk pointed out, all very good points, and it makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside that there are people like you on here engaging in rational, thought out discussion :thumbs:

 

[A Big Fat CoW]

Actually Nihilianth KEPT THE PORTAL OPEN between earth and Xen during the resonance cascade but was not the one behind the creation of the portal.

I stand corrected. But I did get the distinct impression that Nihilanth was able to teleport things over himself once the "dimensional tear" was opened. After all, there's several instances of vortigaunts/agrunts/controllers/etc being teleported in around you (usually way too organized for it to be a random teleportation)

Either Nihilanth created those smaller portals himself or manipulated the larger one to achieve the effect, in either case I think he still shows stronger telepathic power than any of the Advisors have so far.

Other than what chimpmunk pointed out, all very good points, and it makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside that there are people like you on here engaging in rational, thought out discussion :thumbs:

And thanks for hearing me out. I stopped participating in these discussions a while ago because it always seemed people would beat me down if I expressed a theory or idea contrary to what the mainstream was. Glad to see things have changed.

 

[kupocake]

An advisor question I'll tag on to this thread: Is 'Shu'ulathoi' a Vortiguant name for the advisors, or specifically the name of the one of the bridge:

"ep_02.vort_canyon_podparade01" "<clr:188,241,174>Yes, and they carry Shu'ulathoi. Advisors, still in incubation pods."

 

[Laivasse]

I got the impression it was a term for Advisors as a whole, since he uses the plural when explaining the term.

 

[kupocake]

In which case, it suggests that Vortikind have met them before...

 

[Narvi]

Well, yeah.

Considering the Nihilanth was running from them.

 

[Asknoone]

Shu'ulathoi is so very Lovecraft and wonderful.

 

[Great Grizzly]

Or the vorts can steal information from the advisors. Since they share the same area where the vorts collective concience exist. The vorts said they are out to hunt the advisors. So this implies that they somehow know where these advisors are located.

I think the vorts and the advisors both psycic abilities which requires the use of another subdimension. One that is also shared by other psycic creatures. So each species can listen in on psycic chatter of any other species that use this "chatroom" so to speak. THat also explains why when the vorts rescued alyx from the ant lion, they yelled for help. THey didnt want advisors listening in and finding out that one of the high profile human resistance figures was vulnerable to attack.

The Gman might also be able to use this same dimension. Only he was able to physically exist there, and was the only one that could do that, untill the vortiguants figured out how to, which threw a wrench in his plans. Now he has competition and his plans arent going how he wanted.

 

[venom404]

Or the vorts can steal information from the advisors. Since they share the same area where the vorts collective concience exist. The vorts said they are out to hunt the advisors. So this implies that they somehow know where these advisors are located.

I think the vorts and the advisors both psycic abilities which requires the use of another subdimension. One that is also shared by other psycic creatures. So each species can listen in on psycic chatter of any other species that use this "chatroom" so to speak. THat also explains why when the vorts rescued alyx from the ant lion, they yelled for help. THey didnt want advisors listening in and finding out that one of the high profile human resistance figures was vulnerable to attack.

The Gman might also be able to use this same dimension. Only he was able to physically exist there, and was the only one that could do that, untill the vortiguants figured out how to, which threw a wrench in his plans. Now he has competition and his plans arent going how he wanted.

Great theory here. This sort of ties into what I was thinking since the end of Half Life 1. Remember what the G-Man says at the end of the Half Life 1? He claims that Xen is now under his control. Could it be that the Combine, Vorts, and the G-man all use Xen somehow? The Vorts inhabited Xen, the Combine could have stumbled upon it during their invasion of Earth (remember..it's a border world), and the G-man had to go there to obtain the sample to start the Resonance Cascade.

 

[Is This Tea]

Shu'ulathoi is so very Lovecraft and wonderful.

:thumbs:
I must second that statement. That was a highlight moment of the game for me.

Watching the personnel of that posthuman hive pull Shu'ulathoi, a powerful and malevolent alien intelligence, across that bridge while hearing:

"All autonomous units accept mandatory sector assimilation. Coordinated constriction underway, debride and cauterize. Entering phase 9-enhanced compliance. Deploy advisory control and oversight. Submit and be subsumed."

pleased me to no end.

"They gather and unite the scattered combine forces."

:E

 

[Asknoone]

:thumbs:
I must second that statement. That was a highlight moment of the game for me.

Watching the personnel of that posthuman hive pull Shu'ulathoi, a powerful and malevolent alien intelligence, across that bridge while hearing:

"All autonomous units accept mandatory sector assimilation. Coordinated constriction underway, debride and cauterize. Entering phase 9-enhanced compliance. Deploy advisory control and oversight. Submit and be subsumed."

pleased me to no end.

"They gather and unite the scattered combine forces."

:E

I couldn't agree more.

 

[GTGear]

:thumbs:
I must second that statement. That was a highlight moment of the game for me.

Watching the personnel of that posthuman hive pull Shu'ulathoi, a powerful and malevolent alien intelligence, across that bridge while hearing:

"All autonomous units accept mandatory sector assimilation. Coordinated constriction underway, debride and cauterize. Entering phase 9-enhanced compliance. Deploy advisory control and oversight. Submit and be subsumed."

pleased me to no end.

"They gather and unite the scattered combine forces."

:E

I agree, that part was just awesome.

And does anyone have a transcript of what the Combine PA system says in Episode 2? I have the X360 persion, therefore, I can't access the GCF files.

 

[Dr_Crowbar]

"VITAL ALERT. AUTONOMOUS UNITS SUBSUMED. MANDATORY COMPLIANCE WITH ALL TENENTS OF ADVISORIAL ASSISTANCE ACT. THREAT LEVEL ADJUSTMENT. PROBE. EXPUNGE."

"ONGOING SECTOR SWEEP. BIOTICS CONFIRMED. CONTINUE SURFACE SECTOR SWEEP. REMOTE COMPLIANCE. EXTERMINATE. SEEK PASSIVE SIGNATURE IMPRINT. MANDATE SUBLEVEL RESTRICTIONS."

"ALERT. ANTICITIZEN ONE ENGAGED. VANCE SUBPRIME ENGAGED. EXPUNGE. MANDATE REMOVAL OF ACTIVE SIGNATURE IMPRINT. CAUTERIZE AND EXPUNGE."

"ALL AUTONOMOUS UNITS: ACCEPT MANDATORY SECTOR ASSIMILATION. COORDINATED CONSTRICTION UNDERWAY. DEBRIDE AND CAUTERIZE. ENTERING PHASE NINE, ENHANCED COMPLIANCE. DEPLOY ADVISORY CONTROL AND OVERSIGHT. SUBMIT AND BE SUBSUMED."

That's all they say in Ep2. Interesting how they call Alyx - VANCE SUBPRIME. Maybe Eli is VANCE PRIME, lol?

 

[flyprdu]

"VITAL ALERT. AUTONOMOUS UNITS SUBSUMED. MANDATORY COMPLIANCE WITH ALL TENENTS OF ADVISORIAL ASSISTANCE ACT. THREAT LEVEL ADJUSTMENT. PROBE. EXPUNGE."

"ONGOING SECTOR SWEEP. BIOTICS CONFIRMED. CONTINUE SURFACE SECTOR SWEEP. REMOTE COMPLIANCE. EXTERMINATE. SEEK PASSIVE SIGNATURE IMPRINT. MANDATE SUBLEVEL RESTRICTIONS."

"ALERT. ANTICITIZEN ONE ENGAGED. VANCE SUBPRIME ENGAGED. EXPUNGE. MANDATE REMOVAL OF ACTIVE SIGNATURE IMPRINT. CAUTERIZE AND EXPUNGE."

"ALL AUTONOMOUS UNITS: ACCEPT MANDATORY SECTOR ASSIMILATION. COORDINATED CONSTRICTION UNDERWAY. DEBRIDE AND CAUTERIZE. ENTERING PHASE NINE, ENHANCED COMPLIANCE. DEPLOY ADVISORY CONTROL AND OVERSIGHT. SUBMIT AND BE SUBSUMED."

That's all they say in Ep2. Interesting how they call Alyx - VANCE SUBPRIME. Maybe Eli is VANCE PRIME, lol?

Gives me chills... it's still an uphill battle.

 

[Aldenhelm]

Mabye they're geneticly engineered as a sort of go between for the combine and the terrestrial leaders, so that the "greater masters" don't have to trouble themselves with such an insignificant universe. Some have said that the combine was a galactic union turned totalitarian, and this makes sense, and would likly mean that they are ruled by sort of council stationed in one location, witch could be were Gordon eventualy ends up at the end of the seiries. Still, I've always pictured their ruler as some sort of "Mother Brain" styled creature.

 

[Psychanalysis05%]

'CAUTERIZE AND EXPUNGE'

'DEBRIDE AND CAUTERIZE'

sounds hot. And not the good kind.

 

[Rapstah]

Maybe the Overwatch voice is controlled by Advisors? All the time?

 

[Psychanalysis05%]

Question, where in the GCFs can I find that overwatch blurb? I'm looking through the ep2 content but I can't find it.

 

[Horizord]

It's possible they were on Earth before the uprising, but they could used the Dark Fusion reactor to teleport in around the time of Nova Prospekt's demise.

No, you can see an advisor at the start of Half-Life 2, when you're teleported into Breen's office for the second time. Look on the screens.

 

[Sneaki]

There seems to be a bumping problem in this forum at the moment. If the thread was last posted in a year ago, it should be left alone...