D3 expansion...the fall of id?

[Vorac1ous]

And Havok2 didn't?

 

[Brassm0nkey]

A gravity gun is a natural extension of a physics engine. Doom3 is certainly not ripping off Valve, and if they are then Valve was ripping off those that came before HL2. But they weren't, because a gravity gun is just a practical tool that id or any number of other developers would have implimented into their game once they put physics engines in. Games progress, and a gravity gun is a natural part of that progression. It isn't some super creative idea that belongs to valve. HL2 is just a single example of this progression, not the creator of it.

 

[Rico]

I don't think you people understand, the issue isn't the fact that Doom 3 is using physics in their gameplay, it's the fact that they blatantly took HL2's gravity gun and called it a "grabber" to cash in on HL2's success.

They could have done it with Doom 3. If a "gravity gun is the next logical step" then why didn't they implement it from the beginning into D3? D3 was announced way before HL2 yet they only started to implement physics when HL2 started doing it. Now we see the exact same thing, HL2 does something, D3 rips it off. Even Carmack said he didn't want to implement physics into the game... logical extension my ass, they only added it to sell more copies.

 

[kupocake]

They could have done it with Doom 3. If a "gravity gun is the next logical step" then why didn't they implement it from the beginning into D3? D3 was announced way before HL2 yet they only started to implement physics when HL2 started doing it. Now we see the exact same thing, HL2 does something, D3 rips it off.

But we knew about HL2 Physics and HL2's Gravity Gun at exactly the same time, and I don't think you can credit HL2 with inspiring Doom 3 to use physics (It was a trend that was emerging long before either game took it up). The reason that they didn't implement it from the beginning is surely that if they had, the "OMG! Rip-Off" response would be twice as bad.

 

[KagePrototype]

I don't think you people understand, the issue isn't the fact that Doom 3 is using physics in their gameplay, it's the fact that they blatantly took HL2's gravity gun and called it a "grabber" to cash in on HL2's success.

They could have done it with Doom 3. If a "gravity gun is the next logical step" then why didn't they implement it from the beginning into D3? D3 was announced way before HL2 yet they only started to implement physics when HL2 started doing it. Now we see the exact same thing, HL2 does something, D3 rips it off. Even Carmack said he didn't want to implement physics into the game... logical extension my ass, they only added it to sell more copies.

Because adding features like that mid-way through development can throw off the game balancing and level design greatly, and a lot of planning, designing and money could have gone to waste. Half-Life 2 was announced in 2003, and Doom 3 had been in development for years prior. id sees the potential, but instead of risking Doom 3 taking another year to balance (and a whole lot more money), they decide to release it in an expansion pack.

 

[Ames]

But you know what I think, then every game is a copy. According to myself, any game that has Pistols, Shotguns, SMGs, Machine Guns, Sniper Rifles, & Rocket Launchers, are copies of other games. Yeah. Whatever, good for all of you then.

Those weapons exist in real life.

We can't copy real life....?

 

[Agent.M]

Yeah i agree this is pretty lame....but then again i thought doom3 was lame to begin with, so now they try and copy hl2 and the straight out lie saying that "youve never been able to do this before" I dont know id must think that we are all a bunch of idiots that dont know any better.

 

[destrukt]

Yeah i agree this is pretty lame....but then again i thought doom3 was lame to begin with, so now they try and copy hl2 and the straight out lie saying that "youve never been able to do this before" I dont know id must think that we are all a bunch of idiots that dont know any better.

yes, everything in hl2 was created by valve, they didn't copy any concepts from anywhere else.

you fanboys never learn, but i guess that's why your a fanboy.

 

[Vorac1ous]

Those weapons exist in real life.

We can't copy real life....?

Doesn't matter whether they are real weapons are not. Technically they are copying other games. That's the theory behind what most of these whiny asses think D3 is copying off HL2, in my mind. Soo, there is no game that isn't copying another.

So for these blatant fanboys, no, we can't copy real life.

 

[Styloid]

Valve did not suddenly invent the idea of a physics gun but they certainly developed the idea into something years ahead of anything that has been attempted. You cannot try to take credit away from Valve for achieving that.

The D3 add-on is taking that idea and are putting it into the game (though I hope they add something new to it) to make a game that people will enjoy. You cannot take credit away from Id for doing that.

Making good games (or anything creative in general) is not only about being original, it's about developing the experience as a whole. The only time I find criticism of 'ripping off' something is when someone attacks something they don't like.

 

[satch919]

I think everyone is going to be surprised by the expansion. Im guessing that they learned from their mistakes and are working hard with the developers of the expansion to deliver a more enjoyable product. For example, they've already added the light to your suit because so many people didn't like the idea of having to switch from your weapon to the flashlight.

 

[el Chi]

Switching from your weapon to use your flashlight was a fantastic idea - people who complain are cowards. COWARDS.

I really don't think it's such a big deal if Nerve want to incorporate a grav gun into D3's expansion. It's a great idea, it's wonderful fun. Did people really expect it to be exclusive to the Half-Life series forever-and-ever-amen? Maybe it's a little annoying, but so what? If D3 does it better then fair play to Nerve. If not, well then maybe few other people will try it and the HL series will be able to keep its precious all to itself.
Either way, HL2 will go down as the innovator and pioneer of the concept of the grav gun. Now stop whining.

 

[satch919]

Switching from your weapon to use your flashlight was a fantastic idea - people who complain are cowards. COWARDS.

I really don't think it's such a big deal if Nerve want to incorporate a grav gun into D3's expansion. It's a great idea, it's wonderful fun. Did people really expect it to be exclusive to the Half-Life series forever-and-ever-amen? Maybe it's a little annoying, but so what? If D3 does it better then fair play to Nerve. If not, well then maybe few other people will try it and the HL series will be able to keep its precious all to itself.
Either way, HL2 will go down as the innovator and pioneer of the concept of the grav gun. Now stop whining.

I agree 100% with everything you said. :cheers:

 

[Agent.M]

yes, everything in hl2 was created by valve, they didn't copy any concepts from anywhere else.

you fanboys never learn, but i guess that's why your a fanboy.

You obviously have no idea what your talking about cause pal Im not a HL2 fanboy by any means I was actually a lil dissapointed in HL2 I just dont like id's tricks, I loved all the previous doom games they are waht got me into computer gaming in the first place so watch what you say and ignorantly accuse.

 

[destrukt]

Speaking of ignorantly accusing:

Yeah i agree this is pretty lame....but then again i thought doom3 was lame to begin with, so now they try and copy hl2 and the straight out lie saying that "youve never been able to do this before" I dont know id must think that we are all a bunch of idiots that dont know any better.

 

[Kschreck]

Yes, we already have, and not to be an asshole, but this is old.

And it's not made by id, it's made by Nerve software.

So what if they used a gravity gun, it's all good if the game is good.

AGREED!!! People, if the game is good then the game is good. I'm sorry but thats almost like saying a game is dumb just for using 3D graphics like Wolfenstein 3D. Are you going to say they are cheap and copied off of that? No and this game should be no different. This game will probably be a good expansion to a decent game.

 

[Agent.M]

Speaking of ignorantly accusing:

OMG like i said you obviously have no idea what your talking about your either a kid or not a bright adult and your not understanding my point at all so STFU I have better things to do then argue with your stupid a$$!


Kschreck I agree with you on that point if the expansion is good than its good Im not gonna look down on it for that, I just look down on id;s approach and marketing that ticks me. If there is one thing I picked up in business ethics class when I was in college was how bad false advertising is :\

 

[Crushenator 500]

Agent.M, calm down... :|

 

[ComradeBadger]

I bow before your awesome Buisness Ethics knowledge. Oh wait.

And I'm yet to see this 'It's never been done before' quote no link, nothing. Also, he said you'll be able to do some things never done in a game before: did he say what these were? No.

Did you do reading comprehension in college too?

 

[brink's]

It's beyond me why you guys even give a f@ck, big deal. We'd still be playing Pong if no one took advantage of the ideas of other developers and the fact that some of you are offended that id( or who ever) doing so is really kind of sad. In a few years every fps will have a gravitygun and valve will be able say they set the standard for the current fps. Who loses here?? People who care so much!

 

[Shakermaker]

I dont know if somebody already wrote this but

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

 

[Fishlore]

OMG like i said you obviously have no idea what your talking about your either a kid or not a bright adult and your not understanding my point at all so STFU I have better things to do then argue with your stupid a$$!

Quoted for ignorance. I learned about contractions back in second grade but in case you forgot...

you are = you're

If you weren't knocking someone else's intelligence I wouldn't have bothered.

If there is one thing I picked up in business ethics class when I was in college was how bad false advertising is :\

Quoted for sheer humor.

I want to see the link that says the "Grabber" gun has never been seen before in any game.

 

[PvtRyan]

Like I said in the other thread: I'm sure it will make the game more fun, but so quickly after the release of a succesful game using the exact same concept proves that you've got no creativity and are just hitchhiking on another game's success..

There's so many more concepts to explore with physics and ways to improve on the gravity gun, it's a huge missed oppurtunity and a quick cash in.

 

[Agent.M]

Quoted for ignorance. I learned about contractions back in second grade but in case you forgot...

you are = you're

If you weren't knocking someone else's intelligence I wouldn't have bothered.

Ok you can STFU also you rnot helping at all and your not getting my point either, and yes thank you for pointing out my bad grammer thank you so much omg i had no idea you have shown me the light so you can blow it out your a$$ also its a little hard to worry about grammer when im sitting here with my 1 year old and trying to type at the same time,some of you kids need to seriously grow up and watch what you say!!!

 

[Agent.M]

Like I said in the other thread: I'm sure it will make the game more fun, but so quickly after the release of a succesful game using the exact same concept proves that you've got no creativity and are just hitchhiking on another game's success..

There's so many more concepts to explore with physics and ways to improve on the gravity gun, it's a huge missed oppurtunity and a quick cash in.

Thank You!!!!!!! :thumbs:

 

[ComradeBadger]

Seriously Agent.M please cool off.

 

[Alig]

yes, everything in hl2 was created by valve, they didn't copy any concepts from anywhere else.

you fanboys never learn, but i guess that's why your a fanboy.

I completely agree that HL2 never copied or even slightly got their idea's elsewhere, honestly...

http://www.ncxri.com/bug2.jpg

Ok you can STFU also you rnot helping at all and your not getting my point either, and yes thank you for pointing out my bad grammer thank you so much omg i had no idea you have shown me the light so you can blow it out your a$$ also its a little hard to worry about grammer when im sitting here with my 1 year old and trying to type at the same time,some of you kids need to seriously grow up and watch what you say!!!

You're the only person who is acting like a kid in this thread dude!. Don't get so angry over something that has absolutely jack shit to do with you or any other gamer on this board, it's no skin of your nose!. Yeah, having a civialised conversation is good but throwing the "STFU" word around is just childish.

 

[Agent.M]

You're the only person who is acting like a kid in this thread dude!. Don't get so angry over something that has absolutely jack shit to do with you or any other gamer on this board, it's no skin of your nose!. Yeah, having a civialised conversation is good but throwing the "STFU" word around is just childish.

Dude how old are you?? and did you even read what I was arguin about in the first place?? Ive been on these forums for a while now and I have acted accordingly but when I simply state my opinion and then get flamed because someone doesnt agree with me then get flamed by a dam grammer natzi yeah that pissed me off, I ll stop because I have respect for chris D but some of you other admins are total wastes why dont you warn the the people that started this in the first place. :angry:

 

[Tr0n]

Making fun of the other admins ain't gonna help you.

GJ! :thumbs:

 

[satch919]

Well, the expansion pack was pushed back today. Why am I not surprised? :hmph: http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/02/07/news_6118096.html

 

[ComradeBadger]

Dude how old are you?? and did you even read what I was arguin about in the first place?? Ive been on these forums for a while now and I have acted accordingly but when I simply state my opinion and then get flamed because someone doesnt agree with me then get flamed by a dam grammer natzi yeah that pissed me off, I ll stop because I have respect for chris D but some of you other admins are total wastes why dont you warn the the people that started this in the first place. :angry:

By some of the other admins, I take it you are referring to me.

Anyway. Let's look at your first post in this thread:

Yeah i agree this is pretty lame....but then again i thought doom3 was lame to begin with, so now they try and copy hl2 and the straight out lie saying that "youve never been able to do this before" I dont know id must think that we are all a bunch of idiots that dont know any better.

Now, that is an opinion, and you are entitled to it. No problems here. This is where it all went horribly wrong:

OMG like i said you obviously have no idea what your talking about your either a kid or not a bright adult and your not understanding my point at all so STFU I have better things to do then argue with your stupid a$$!

Now, I can understand if you take fanboy as an insult, but I can't understand this type of response. You, having insulted someone else's intelligence, were picked on by someone else due to spelling/grammar. You responded thusly:

Ok you can STFU also you rnot helping at all and your not getting my point either, and yes thank you for pointing out my bad grammer thank you so much omg i had no idea you have shown me the light so you can blow it out your a$$ also its a little hard to worry about grammer when im sitting here with my 1 year old and trying to type at the same time,some of you kids need to seriously grow up and watch what you say!!!

This is after having being told to calm down. Hence my actions.

Happy posting.

 

[Tr0n]

I don't see any warnings. :|

 

[ComradeBadger]

Not merited yet.

 

[Vorac1ous]

Funny, I don't have any warnings yet either, I'd expect I'd be up to like Level 4 by now :smoking:

Agent M does need to calm down though. ALOT.

 

[<RJMC>]

why everyone care so much about that?

IMO if valve dont react or sue tha company is not problem whit that

anyway in HL1 there was teleporters and in quake1 there was teleporters too so why you dont cry about that

that reminds me the first time I played ninja gaiden and it was very similiar gameplay to devil may cry and I was like you all thinking that they hav rip-of DMC but time after the game was nice and I end up liking it and in the end it was not soo similar,but I didnt played it too much

but on-topic

I dont understand why everybody is so angry whit this
did you all create half-life2 and it grav gun ot what?

 

[Agent.M]

By some of the other admins, I take it you are referring to me.

No I wasnt referring to you at all, blah im done with this thread anyways, warn me ban me do whatever this is just the website I visit the most for news and such, well used to be.