e-sports discussion! (btw Koreans are srs about Starcraft)

[Iced_Eagle]

I think a lot of people are confusing what type of sports stars these are being compared to. They are not in the same league as Football or Basketball or whatever. E-Sports is a lot more related to Chess.

I'm sure a lot of people have also heard of Gary Kasparov, the former chess champion of the world. Sure probably not a whole lot of people could recognize him on the streets where we are, but in some countries he probably would be a celebrity. For Korea, the e-sports are treated as being more celebrity like.

So honestly, right now it's almost weird to think of E-Sports as being an official "sport" in some sense, but I totally understand it. I don't think it will be too long before other countries start taking baby steps on the way there, and the first steps will be eliminating the fact that gamers are their own breed (well, we are but you know what I mean).

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

lol, I think inside we all agree with Fishlore really, no matter how much skill it takes, or how cool you think you are with your ninja mouse reactions, or even showing dedication and commitment for those prolonged sessions such as investing in a pee pouch, mental athelete maybe, but proper athelete status not granted.

that's true I guess, it's not 'athletic' in any sense of the word.

 

[Leviticus]

These kinds of discussions never seem to go anywhere. Westerners can't get over the culturally charged implications of the word "Sport". "Sports" are what sons do to make their fathers proud here. An American athlete is a hero, associated with qualities like bravery and honor and your typical American young man has an almost spiritual reverence for his favorite sports stars.

Now, the reality of things is that sports stars deserve no such reverence. Athletes are not heroes. They aren't changing the world, or inventing anything, or helping anyone. They are entertainers who entertain by investing themselves into a hobby and show remarkable skill in doing so. If we could get past words like "Athlete" and "Sport", it would be easier for people to see that competitive gaming is just as legitimate, and just as ultimately menial, as anything competitive.

Partly, I think it has something to do with the remnants of a high-school animosity towards nerds, geeks, and the physically unfit. We still want to disassociate ourselves from the guys who don't sit at the right table. Hence the "Look where we have come as a society" posts, expressing utter rage at the idea of calling a nerd an athlete.

 

[smwScott]

I think a lot of people are confusing what type of sports stars these are being compared to. They are not in the same league as Football or Basketball or whatever. E-Sports is a lot more related to Chess.

I'm sure a lot of people have also heard of Gary Kasparov, the former chess champion of the world. Sure probably not a whole lot of people could recognize him on the streets where we are, but in some countries he probably would be a celebrity. For Korea, the e-sports are treated as being more celebrity like.

So honestly, right now it's almost weird to think of E-Sports as being an official "sport" in some sense, but I totally understand it. I don't think it will be too long before other countries start taking baby steps on the way there, and the first steps will be eliminating the fact that gamers are their own breed (well, we are but you know what I mean).

They can't be considered athletes by chess standards either. I'm sorry, but playing CS and StarCraft with a bunch of other nerds over a LAN doesn't make you an athlete, nor does it require the same sort of dedication that a real sport offers. And no, the mental faculties required to "kekekekekekeke pwn" people in SC can not be compared to professional chess players.

Forcing yourself to strive and train to get in shape and perfect a sport is a LOT different than sitting at a computer playing video games and growing better through repetition and experience. There's no real sacrifice made here. Let's face it ... the reason most of these people got so good at these games is because they didn't have anything else to do with their time. To call these people athletes is laughable. Sitting in chairs and spending inordinate amounts of time playing video games is the opposite of athletic. Professional Monopoly players deserve more respect.

And is it just me or has South Korea begun cloning nerds for use in StarCraft competitions? Not trying to be racist, but there's no way I could pick a specific one of those "athletes" out of a lineup.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

Vid almost makes me wish I was in korea...too bad I don't give a **** about SC.

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

They can't be considered athletes by chess standards either. I'm sorry, but playing CS and StarCraft with a bunch of other nerds over a LAN doesn't make you an athlete, nor does it require the same sort of dedication that a real sport offers. And no, the mental faculties required to "kekekekekekeke pwn" people in SC can not be compared to professional chess players.

Forcing yourself to strive and train to get in shape and perfect a sport is a LOT different than sitting at a computer playing video games and growing better through repetition and experience. There's no real sacrifice made here. Let's face it ... the reason most of these people got so good at these games is because they didn't have anything else to do with their time. To call these people athletes is laughable. Sitting in chairs and spending inordinate amounts of time playing video games is the opposite of athletic. Professional Monopoly players deserve more respect.

And is it just me or has South Korea begun cloning nerds for use in StarCraft competitions? Not trying to be racist, but there's no way I could pick a specific one of those "athletes" out of a lineup.

It's slightly ignorant to say that certain games don't take intelligence and coordination, especially in the RTS genre. You are aware that chess involves sitting in a chair making minute hand movements too? Also your comments about Koreans all looking alike serve to take away any legitimacy your post may have held.

They can't be considered athletes by chess standards either. I'm sorry, but playing CS and StarCraft with a bunch of other nerds over a LAN doesn't make you an athlete, nor does it require the same sort of dedication that a real sport offers. And no, the mental faculties required to "kekekekekekeke pwn" people in SC can not be compared to professional chess players.

Just because you label one activity as involving "nerds over a LAN" doesn't mean one takes any more skill than the other, you didn't prove anything, at least have contextual evidence to back up your outlandish claims.

 

[Fishlore]

Your pathetic and sad, ****ing low life.

E-Spots involves INSANE amounts of strategy, reflex, concentration and talent + skill. Just as much and more then some "real" sports out there. Don't know what your talking about kid.

LOL, yeah I'm the low life. That's funny coming from this thread.

They might be the most taleneted video game players on earth. That doesn't mean they're athletic or they are anything more than people sitting in a chair playing video games. You take your hobby entirely too seriously. Next up, drawing a picture, the newest sports craze. Afterall being artistic requires concentration, talent and skill.

Oh and I'm 30... kid.

 

[Solaris]

A guy I used to know ran the UK division of the Electronic Sports League. He's in jail now for trying to rape a 12 year old.

 

[CyberPitz]

LOL, yeah I'm the low life. That's funny coming from this thread.

They might be the most taleneted video game players on earth. That doesn't mean they're athletic or they are anything more than people sitting in a chair playing video games. You take your hobby entirely too seriously. Next up, drawing a picture, the newest sports craze. Afterall being artistic requires concentration, talent and skill.

Oh and I'm 30... kid.

So you're saying people taking their hobby to their peak and creating entertainment for people isn't a sport? What's Football/baseball/soccer? I guess people who play Football professionally never thought of the game as a hobby...

 

[jverne]

you know how Koreans name their sons?

they throw a cooking pan down the stairs, and listen to the voices it makes
"Kim, Chin, Lin,... "

sorry numbers, i couldn't resist :cheers:

 

[L3adCannon]

Don't forget the insane amount of girls they have sex with after they win.

Well, the sad thing is they prolly do, atleast in Korea. For an example, the best starcraft player out there, Boxer slayerS or something like that, gets mad ass after public matches. Damn, those crazy b*tches even run after him.
Seen it on vids.

 

[smwScott]

It's slightly ignorant to say that certain games don't take intelligence and coordination, especially in the RTS genre. You are aware that chess involves sitting in a chair making minute hand movements too? Also your comments about Koreans all looking alike serve to take away any legitimacy your post may have held.

Sure they take some degree of skill and intelligence, that's a given. Although it's more repetition and memorization than true strategy. It comes down to a match of who has played the game longer than a match of wits and strategy.

And for the record I wasn't stating that all Koreans or Asians look alike. But all the ones in that picture looked pretty ****in similar. I'm going to assume that this is because they fit into the same little sub-culture and therefore make a conscious effort to look like clones. As a side note I find it absolutely hilarious how seriously Koreans take their StarCraft.

Just because you label one activity as involving "nerds over a LAN" doesn't mean one takes any more skill than the other, you didn't prove anything, at least have contextual evidence to back up your outlandish claims.

Well, first of all, let's clarify your position. Are you suggesting that a bunch of nerds sitting at computers playing StarCraft is comparable to the level of mental acuity required to engage in a professional chess match? If so ... well that's hilarious.

If not, but you still think it should be considered a legitimate sport, then there's a lot of room for debate. In my opinion skill at "gaming" comes from serious amounts of repitition and a lack of better things to do. The level of skill, dedication, training, and pure willpower to become truly competitive at a real sport is on a totally different level.

I want to make it clear that I'm not setting out to demean or make fun of these people. To be honest I find the whole concept pretty funny, but if they enjoy it and are able to gain fame/money from it then that's great. The only thing that annoys me, and the only reason I would even bother responding, is the sense of self-righteousness they seem to be developing. The truth is that they simply do not deserve the same level of respect or adulation given to true athletes.

 

[CyberPitz]

you know how Koreans name their sons?

they throw a cooking pan down the stairs, and listen to the voices it makes
"Kim, Chin, Lin,... "

sorry numbers, i couldn't resist :cheers:

I heard that joke a bit different

"How do the chinese name their kids? Throwing silverware on the ground and name them off the sounds, Ching Chang Chong"

But your way works too.

 

[Combine Hybrid]

you know how Koreans name their sons?

they throw a cooking pan down the stairs, and listen to the voices it makes
"Kim, Chin, Lin,... "

sorry numbers, i couldn't resist :cheers:

There is no korean last names composed of "chin and lin".

PWned.

 

[jverne]

There is no korean last names composed of "chin and lin".

PWned.

uhh, ohh...i guess then there are only variations of Kim. creepy

Kim, kIm, mik, kmi,...

ahh...never mind i'm not good at racial jokes, anyway. :|

 

[Kyorisu]

Sure they take some degree of skill and intelligence, that's a given. Although it's more repetition and memorization than true strategy. It comes down to a match of who has played the game longer than a match of wits and strategy.

The same can be said for Chess you memorize a set of moves to counter what you think your opponent will do. Chess players tend to study their opponent closely before a match and the same is done with RTS players.

 

[Asuka]

LOL, yeah I'm the low life. That's funny coming from this thread.

They might be the most taleneted video game players on earth. That doesn't mean they're athletic or they are anything more than people sitting in a chair playing video games. You take your hobby entirely too seriously. Next up, drawing a picture, the newest sports craze. Afterall being artistic requires concentration, talent and skill.

Oh and I'm 30... kid.

Just because your 30 doesn't mean your not a dumb ass. Your just a 30 year old loser who has a mind of a 12 year old that's all. Don't worry someday you might understand.

 

[Combine Hybrid]

ahh...never mind i'm not good at racial jokes, anyway. :|

yeah you suck at it. should have stopped from the first.

 

[15357]

Eh, wasn't that joke about the Chinese? Cause I remember that joke from 3rd grade, back in the US.

No offense taken, mostly because of its inaccuracy.

 

[-Psy-]

E-Sports is the reason CS:S is full of 90% intelligent deficient people.

You have your "pros". "Lolz! **** off you ****ing noob. You ****ing suck. WE ARE IN TEH CPL!!!111! Now GET OFF OUR SERVER!"

And you have your "just plain retards". "Lolz! **** off you ****ing noob. You ****ing suck."

 

[15357]

why does all Korean youth look like nerd-ish emos?
what's with the hair? is that some kind of national pride thing?

I hate the hair too. If it were up to me, I'd do the same thing as the 70s.


Have the police/military cut people's hair in the streets, if it's too long.

 

[Fishlore]

Just because you're, 30 doesn't mean you're not a dumb ass. you're just a 30 year old loser who has a mind of a 12 year old that's all. Don't worry someday you might understand.

LOL. The sign of a kid with no intelligence... name calling. Really, is that all you have? Very hurtful words there. At least a 12 year old knows the difference between your and you're. So seriously, why the anger? Are you a "cyber-athelete?" Did I hurt your feelings?

So you're saying people taking their hobby to their peak and creating entertainment for people isn't a sport? What's Football/baseball/soccer? I guess people who play Football professionally never thought of the game as a hobby...

No, I'm saying you're not an athelete when you're sitting in a chair playing a video game.

 

[15357]

No, I'm saying you're not an athelete when you're sitting in a chair playing a video game.

Amen to that.

 

[sinkoman]

These kinds of discussions never seem to go anywhere. Westerners can't get over the culturally charged implications of the word "Sport". "Sports" are what sons do to make their fathers proud here. An American athlete is a hero, associated with qualities like bravery and honor and your typical American young man has an almost spiritual reverence for his favorite sports stars.

Now, the reality of things is that sports stars deserve no such reverence. Athletes are not heroes. They aren't changing the world, or inventing anything, or helping anyone. They are entertainers who entertain by investing themselves into a hobby and show remarkable skill in doing so. If we could get past words like "Athlete" and "Sport", it would be easier for people to see that competitive gaming is just as legitimate, and just as ultimately menial, as anything competitive.

Partly, I think it has something to do with the remnants of a high-school animosity towards nerds, geeks, and the physically unfit. We still want to disassociate ourselves from the guys who don't sit at the right table. Hence the "Look where we have come as a society" posts, expressing utter rage at the idea of calling a nerd an athlete.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

I'm all for competitive gaming tourneys. Hell, I could see myself joining a few.

But video games, or competitive tournaments involving them, are NOT sports. They both take skill, and are competitive, and that's where the similarities end.

FFS, when I got ready for a Wrestling match, I spent hours stretching, warming up, drilling, jogging, and getting mentally prepared. When I play a video game, I grab something to drink, sit down, and maybe spend 10 minutes per match. Video games take absolutely NO dedication, unless you completely and utterly SUCK at them.

And STILL, I'd hardly consider it dedication to go and play "starcraft" to help your team. Dedication is when you're dehydrated and have thrown up, but your team is down 3 points, so you step up, take a sip of your energy drink, wipe the blood off your forehead, and step onto the mat. It's when you really would rather be spending your weekend at the movies and eating popcorn, but you instead skip breakfast lunch and dinner, grab your sweats, and head down to the track to cut weight the day before the tournament.

Dedication is NOT going to a VIDEO GAME tournament, something that's 100% fun (unless you're losing ), and enjoying yourself in tense and entertaining e-competition. It's NOT sitting down and having at a few rounds of Counter Strike the day before a clan match.

FFS, when you see women running down to the field and tackling soccer players after a game, they are ****ing DEAD TIRED. They've probably spent their ENTIRE WEEK preparing for this single event, and are probably drained of every last bit of energy they had. When women run to greet a "cyber-athlete", he's been sitting in front of a computer, in an air conditioned room, probably listening to his favorite music for the past 2 or 3 hours.

I'd say that if Competitive Gaming is to ever take off, the players and fans need to drop the notion of "e-sports", and realize that attempting to organize events and leagues in the same fashion as traditional sports, will ultimately fail.

Keeping these gaming tournaments online, and then advertising them in real life via television and radio commercials, would be the best way to gain support.

LOL, yeah I'm the low life. That's funny coming from this thread.

They might be the most taleneted video game players on earth. That doesn't mean they're athletic or they are anything more than people sitting in a chair playing video games. You take your hobby entirely too seriously. Next up, drawing a picture, the newest sports craze. Afterall being artistic requires concentration, talent and skill.

Oh and I'm 30... kid.

No, I'm saying you're not an athelete when you're sitting in a chair playing a video game.

QUOTED FOR MOTHER ****ING TRUTH

 

[The Brick]

I think you guys are missing the e in e-athlete.

 

[Kyorisu]

FFS, when I got ready for a Wrestling match, I spent hours stretching, warming up, drilling, jogging, and getting mentally prepared. When I play a video game, I grab something to drink, sit down, and maybe spend 10 minutes per match. Video games take absolutely NO dedication, unless you completely and utterly SUCK at them.

Oh wow you don't mean that do you? Have you seen the schedules of the top SC players? I find it funny how you seem to find yourself as some sort of authority on the subject. Games take no dedication? My arse if you want to be #1 it takes a lot of spare time and dedication.

You people are stupid I don't think any gamer would call themselves an Athlete a Cyber-Athlete maybe, do note how it's an entirely different word. No gamer in their right mind would compare themselves to an athlete, I'm a gamer and I also play Tennis theres a huge ****ing difference and would like to believe everyone knows that. I think some people who play sports take the e-sport motion as an insult when they shouldn't and need to get over themselves.

I'd say that if Competitive Gaming is to ever take off, the players and fans need to drop the notion of "e-sports", and realize that attempting to organize events and leagues in the same fashion as traditional sports, will ultimately fail.

Funny how neither of those things will happen.

LOL. The sign of a kid with no intelligence... name calling. Really, is that all you have? Very hurtful words there. At least a 12 year old knows the difference between your and you're. So seriously, why the anger? Are you a "cyber-athelete?" Did I hurt your feelings?

Wow that post was pure flame bait and I realize this is too but a mature person would let the thing go. Let the kiddies have their way what harm does it do you?

E-Sports is the reason CS:S is full of 90% intelligent deficient people.

You have your "pros". "Lolz! **** off you ****ing noob. You ****ing suck. WE ARE IN TEH CPL!!!111! Now GET OFF OUR SERVER!"

And you have your "just plain retards". "Lolz! **** off you ****ing noob. You ****ing suck."

No that's just the internet for you. I'd bet none of these morons would dare say anything like that to my face, on the internet they will because I can't reach them. You should realize that in an environment where you cannot physically see your opponent some people find the need to harass others for no apparent reason.

 

[sinkoman]

Oh wow you don't mean that do you? Have you seen the schedules of the top SC players? I find it funny how you seem to find yourself as some sort of authority on the subject. Games take no dedication? My arse if you want to be #1 it takes a lot of spare time and dedication.

You people are stupid I don't think any gamer would call themselves an Athlete a Cyber-Athlete maybe, do note how it's an entirely different word. No gamer in their right mind would compare themselves to an athlete, I'm a gamer and I also play Tennis theres a huge ****ing difference and would like to believe everyone knows that. I think some people who play sports take the e-sport motion as an insult when they shouldn't and need to get over themselves.



Funny how neither of those things will happen.

I don't take myself an authority on the subject matter at all, but I can tell tell you, for sure, that sitting in front of your computer and "training" in starcraft for weeks is a hell of a lot more fun than say starving yourself for weeks, or doing sprints for weeks.

And I don't think that conducting competitive gaming events in the same manner as sporting events will necessarily lead to the "demise" of the "e-sport" movement, but i'm saying that if you try to emulate traditional sporting leagues, then the movement will likely remain a "nerdfest" in the eyes of the general public.

And I still fail to see how playing starcraft for weeks on end is anywhere near the same dedication as sweating to your bones for weeks on end.

I have no bane against this whole competitive gaming movement at all, I just think it's really dumb to try to emulate sports in the manner that the movement currently is. Why does it have to be the same way as normal sports? Why can't you do things differently?

I really doubt anybody wants to come to a stadium and sit and watch people sitting infront of a computer for hours. That in my mind, is a gigantic ****ing waste of time.

But I WOULD like to sit at home, infront of my computer, watching an competition take place whilst in spectator mode.

 

[Kyorisu]

Your still using physical exertion as your argument. Fail!

then the movement will likely remain a "nerdfest" in the eyes of the general public.

Not to generalize (yeah right) but that is true and even with different approaches that view won't change.

And I still fail to see how playing starcraft for weeks on end is anywhere near the same dedication as sweating to your bones for weeks on end.

Both require the same amount of time that could be spent doing another things. Time spent doing activity = dedication. You wake up at 4am everyday and train before going to work or school, that's dedication. You spend every other hour getting better at a video game that too is dedication. Don't try and make a word only relate to one thing the English language does not work that way. Dedication isn't some magic thing that only people who play sports can muster.

I spend my mornings getting thrashed in Tennis playing people who are quite better than myself, Hey I loose a lot but I want to get better at what I do, from your point of view that is dedication. Yet spending a large sum of time playing people in an RTS that are better than you to get more skilled at it isn't? Oh no you have fun it doesn't count, sorry what? I have fun getting slaughtered in Tennis too, and I'm dead tired after playing a few games.

I really doubt anybody wants to come to a stadium and sit and watch people sitting infront of a computer for hours. That in my mind, is a gigantic ****ing waste of time.

Why the hell would you use a stadium? Yes the league system that sports use is also being used for gaming, that doesn't mean they're trying to emulate the whole damn thing. What's next Olympic gaming? Of course it's a giant waste of time, also note how no one is stupid enough to run an event like that?

As I said it's not a 100% emulation of how sports work. Heck e-sports aren't trying to emulate sports at all, the idea is just borrowing some concepts.

Sports players are bitching because another group is using the word sport for something they think isn't. Why do you care? You and I know it won't at least for awhile get anywhere near the scale of certain mainstream sports.

According to Dr Richard Parrish, author of 'Sports law and policy in the European Union', a common definition of sport stresses:

* physical skills, physical effort, and physical challenge
* whether the activity is unique, accessible
* whether it has established rules and organised competition
* whether these rules allow for strategy and tactics as elements for success
* whether it is relatively widely practiced and is widely recognised as a sport

Parrish says this “should take many activities outside the definition of sport such as street fighting or indeed chess”

Now you can easily throw competitive gaming into the mix.

 

[sinkoman]

Your still using physical exertion as your argument. Fail!



Not to generalize (yeah right) but that is true and even with different approaches that view won't change.



Both require the same amount of time that could be spent doing another things. Time spent doing activity = dedication. You wake up at 4am everyday and train before going to work or school, that's dedication. You spend every other hour getting better at a video game that too is dedication. Don't try and make a word only relate to one thing the English language does not work that way. Dedication isn't some magic thing that only people who play sports can muster.

I spend my mornings getting thrashed in Tennis playing people who are quite better than myself, Hey I loose a lot but I want to get better at what I do, from your point of view that is dedication. Yet spending a large sum of time playing people in an RTS that are better than you to get more skilled at it isn't? Oh no you have fun it doesn't count, sorry what? I have fun getting slaughtered in Tennis too, and I'm dead tired after playing a few games.



Why the hell would you use a stadium? Yes the league system that sports use is also being used for gaming, that doesn't mean they're trying to emulate the whole damn thing. What's next Olympic gaming? Of course it's a giant waste of time, also note how no one is stupid enough to run an event like that?

As I said it's not a 100% emulation of how sports work. Heck e-sports aren't trying to emulate sports at all, the idea is just borrowing some concepts.

Sports players are bitching because another group is using the word sport for something they think isn't. Why do you care? You and I know it won't at least for awhile get anywhere near the scale of certain mainstream sports.





Now you can easily throw competitive gaming into the mix.

GET OVER YOURSELF. Jesus, I don't hate E-Sports at all, I don't hate them being called E-Sports, I just think it's SILLY to call them E-Sports.

I've seen pictures and videos of "e-sporting" events in live settings. That's what I think is stupid, having people go down and watch people infront of computers, live. Don't be a nit****.

I don't hate e-sports at all, stop trying to pretend that I do. I'm giving my two cents, and that's that the whole movement needs to take a different direction.

And I can't believe that you can't see the difference between playing CS for two hours, and running around a track for two hours.

And why do I "fail" for using physical exertion for my argument? It's entirely valid. Sitting down in an air conditioned room, with a hot meal, and a game of starcraft going, is a shit-tone less dedicated than, let's use your point of view, playing tennis against somebody much better than you till your knuckles bleed, you run out of breath, and your feet turn pink.

I just think that this whole "taking it mainstream" movement is really dumb. Keep it underground imo.

 

[Baal]

Great, now I want to go play tennis :|

Anyone wanna play?

 

[Kyorisu]

GET OVER YOURSELF. Jesus, I don't hate E-Sports at all, I don't hate them being called E-Sports, I just think it's SILLY to call them E-Sports.

Alright that's fine, but imo they can call it whatever the heck they want, it doesn't change much. It falls into the Chess debate really, people want Chess to be called a sport. Others want games to be considered e-sports I don't see anything wrong about that. It sounds silly when saying it though.

I've seen pictures and videos of "e-sporting" events in live settings. That's what I think is stupid, having people go down and watch people infront of computers, live. Don't be a nit****.

Of course it's stupid, such things should be contained to lans/lan centres, and game expos.

I don't hate e-sports at all, stop trying to pretend that I do. I'm giving my two cents, and that's that the whole movement needs to take a different direction.

Well there are some people that do that's all I meant to get across.

And I can't believe that you can't see the difference between playing CS for two hours, and running around a track for two hours.

I can, All I meant is just because one task requires more effort than another doesn't mean a person isn't as dedicated as another.

And why do I "fail" for using physical exertion for my argument? It's entirely valid. Sitting down in an air conditioned room, with a hot meal, and a game of starcraft going, is a shit-tone less dedicated than, let's use your point of view, playing tennis against somebody much better than you till your knuckles bleed, you run out of breath, and your feet turn pink.

See above. Although I agree with you to an extent here, if someone gloated about being awesome at Starcraft whilst I was playing Tennis I'd punch them in the face, Then hurl balls at them.

I just think that this whole "taking it mainstream" movement is really dumb. Keep it underground imo.

Blame CPL.

What where we bitching about again?

But video games, or competitive tournaments involving them, are NOT sports.

If Chess can be considered a sport and hey it fits the criteria why not RTS games?

Great, now I want to go play tennis :|

Anyone wanna play?

I'll get you started.
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[sinkoman]

I suppose that when it comes down to it, this whole argument is really just about the naming, a stupid argument at best.

Agree to disagree?