Excellent Tactic by Valve

[Peabody McFee]

If you've read the news you will see that Valve are releasing CS:S next week; this means two things: 1) CS:S and possibly HL2 has gone Gold 2) Valve are forcing VU's hand.

To get CS:S next week you have to pay the full cost of the HL2 package. This means that you are forced to purchase over Steam -- therefore Valve get the full payment to themselves. The longer VU hold back HL2 the more people will purchase over Steam, this means that VU lose money the longer they hold onto HL2.

It's a brilliant move by Valve, it means that it's now in VU's interest to release HL2 ASAP!

 

[lemmingzappa]

hmm i hope it works like that

 

[The Monkey]

It's a brilliant move by Valve, it means that it's now in VU's interest to release HL2 ASAP!

They have always been...

 

[Peabody McFee]

They have always been...

They have always been, what?

 

[Tork]

What a sneaky move by Valve, I love it

 

[UKchaos2]

I think he means its always been in VU's interested to release early.

 

[PvtRyan]

VUG gonna get raped!

Yeah, it's a good move, but maybe for that courthearing it's not so good, you'd think they would slow down a bit with the Steam stuff, but now they announced two Steam packages that are superior to the retail CE and they're also releasing a game before the retail release. Hope it doesn't turn around and bite Valve in the ass.

 

[pixartist]

well, VUG tried to blackmail valve by holding hl2 back! they did that because valve wanted to sue VUG for some other legal things...but now valve just uses steam as their selling method so that VUG can't hold hl2 back anymore

 

[Spiffae]

i think this strengthens valve's position in a way. if they make a large number of sales and commitments to deliver HL2 via steam, then they have built up a customer base that is loyal to steam.

That makes steam seem like more of a part of Valve's business and less an interesting idea.

 

[Spiffae]

This is right on the money:

You've probably heard of the legal issues between Vivendi Universal and Valve, and if your experience was anything like mine, everything but the portion dealing with a possible delay of the release appeared as indecipherable dog language. This is the kind of he said/she said dirty laundry bullshit that I find extremely tiresome. At any rate, this is what it boils down to, tactically: Vivendi Universal is absolutely welcome to delay the release out of spite or whimsy or whatever else. Maybe they're right, maybe they're wrong. Vivendi wouldn't be the first aggressive, overbearing publisher and Valve wouldn't be the first artist willing to bilk their patron: I don't care, and it's not relevant to the matter at hand. Immediate access to the new Counter-Strike is an extremely powerful incentive to try Steam. Every moment the release is held back, you have to picture one more person thinking, well, you know... I would prefer to buy at retail, but I could be playing Counter-Strike: Source right now...

Digital delivery, man. It just freaks these people out.

Imagine that you had to go to a well every time you wanted water. Then, somebody figured out a way to get the water to come out right inside your house! I don't blame them for being scared. Progress is a bitch.

 

[CombineHarvester]

It's a brilliant move by Valve, it means that it's now in VU's interest to release HL2 ASAP!

Yep, but an ever better one would have been to release HL:Source. The queue would have been around the block!

Sadly this would never happen as I suspect this would give VU grounds to sue.

 

[NuTTeR]

Just because Valve have announced the Steam packages with CS:S supposedly available next week, that will not absolve Valve in any way of fufilling their responsabilities under their agreement with VU. ie: trying to get sneaky HL2 orders through Steam prior to the release of HL2 to retail stores.

If Valve does not have the legal rights to distribute HL2 over Steam on a date of their choosing prior to the retail store copy, but they still go ahead and release on Steam prior to retail you can bet VU will be filing for breach of contract and loss of revenue.

 

[jimbones]

HAHA nice one =)

 

[HeAdAcHe_BR]

If you've read the news you will see that Valve are releasing CS:S next week; this means two things: 1) CS:S and possibly HL2 has gone Gold 2) Valve are forcing VU's hand.

To get CS:S next week you have to pay the full cost of the HL2 package. This means that you are forced to purchase over Steam -- therefore Valve get the full payment to themselves. The longer VU hold back HL2 the more people will purchase over Steam, this means that VU lose money the longer they hold onto HL2.

It's a brilliant move by Valve, it means that it's now in VU's interest to release HL2 ASAP!

so true, and i think they are doing the right thing!
screw VU!

 

[clarky003]

I think there being sneaky about HL2 too, I still dont believe chuck played the full retail, I honestly think valve are keeping the HL2 DM a secret till the release , afterall if it is there it will be a component of HL2, (eg. not seperate).

please say you are Gabe, I saw you hint at it

 

[Peabody McFee]

Just because Valve have announced the Steam packages with CS:S supposedly available next week, that will not absolve Valve in any way of fufilling their responsabilities under their agreement with VU. ie: trying to get sneaky HL2 orders through Steam prior to the release of HL2 to retail stores.

If Valve does not have the legal rights to distribute HL2 over Steam on a date of their choosing prior to the retail store copy, but they still go ahead and release on Steam prior to retail you can bet VU will be filing for breach of contract and loss of revenue.

Valve have already distributed HL2 in the preloads, how is this any different?

 

[Democritus]

What I didn't realize before is that this means that CS:S was NOT part of the contract with Vivendi and that it can't technically be called "HL2's Multiplayer component." In order for them to release it early, it has to be it's own game. If it fell under HL2, then it would have to await retail distribution with HL2.

 

[Democritus]

Valve have already distributed HL2 in the preloads, how is this any different?

Distribution is not complete until the game is playable on your machine. If Valve can't let you unlock it, then all those files will do you no good and you'll just have to delete them. Vivendi doesn't care if thousands of people have a bunch of preloads as long as they can't buy hl2 via Steam and have to go to the store to get a working copy.

 

[DrPowers]

to quote the little worms of "Worms: Armageddon"

WAR IS HELL.

In responce: It was always in the interest of VUG to release the game but not its best interest. Its my opinion that they were holding out because they didnt want to compete with steam. But now that there is a clear advantage to buy the game through steam over the boxed copy its even more in VUG's interest to release the game ASAP. If people get a hint that its not comming out for a while they will satisfy their hunger with playing CS:S untill it comes out.

I salute you Valve! You guys will always have my support for whatever game you create and get screwed on. lol

 

[DrPowers]

Distribution is not complete until the game is playable on your machine. If Valve can't let you unlock it, then all those files will do you no good and you'll just have to delete them. Vivendi doesn't care if thousands of people have a bunch of preloads as long as they can't buy hl2 via Steam and have to go to the store to get a working copy.

no body cares untill money is involved any way. And so far the preloads arent anythng to us except 0s and 1s untill we pay for the encryption key.

 

[Peabody McFee]

Distribution is not complete until the game is playable on your machine. If Valve can't let you unlock it, then all those files will do you no good and you'll just have to delete them. Vivendi doesn't care if thousands of people have a bunch of preloads as long as they can't buy hl2 via Steam and have to go to the store to get a working copy.

So what was your original point?

 

[Absinthe]

I think there being sneaky about HL2 too, I still dont believe chuck played the full retail, I honestly think valve are keeping the HL2 DM a secret till the release , afterall if it is there it will be a component of HL2, (eg. not seperate).

please say you are Gabe, I saw you hint at it

You put way too much faith in Valve.

 

[Icarusintel]

I'm just glad Valve is finally sticking up and showing VU they're not gonna take it anymore

 

[fluX]

If you've read the news you will see that Valve are releasing CS:S next week; this means two things: 1) CS:S and possibly HL2 has gone Gold 2) Valve are forcing VU's hand.

To get CS:S next week you have to pay the full cost of the HL2 package. This means that you are forced to purchase over Steam -- therefore Valve get the full payment to themselves. The longer VU hold back HL2 the more people will purchase over Steam, this means that VU lose money the longer they hold onto HL2.

It's a brilliant move by Valve, it means that it's now in VU's interest to release HL2 ASAP!

Is has alwasy been VUs' best interest. The point is that Valve puts pressure on Vivendi by that move but it also raises the stakes. If the court decision indicates that the usage of STEAM for HL2 distribution is not allowed (for whatever reason), both the buyers and Valve are somewhat deep in sh... So, yes it's a nice move, but maybe somewhat risky for the customer.

 

[A.I.]

Another great strike from VALVe Vivendi would be what Green Day did not so far ago. They started selling empty CD-Rs but in a jewel box and the artwork that comes in a normal CD so that the buyers could burn the piratised music of Green Day. And it works!

Now imagine if VALVe would start selling boxes with empty CD-Rs and DVDs to burn your Steam version on them (there could be even a nice feature in the Steam application "Burn a backup", so the users could easily burn a hardcopy)

 

[Tlaloc]

now vivendi has no reason to hold back hl2 from going gold

 

[piggy]

hey lets infiltrate valve with a flamethower and get tem to release the game! weeee

 

[Demonmerc]

now vivendi has no reason to hold back hl2 from going gold

Why does everyone think this? Let me clue you in to the legal system:

Vivendi has until 12/31/04 to make their case against Valve. If VU is found in favor, Valve will have to cough up all the money earned through HL2 on steam. Oh yeah, and HL2 still wouldn't be released until the 6 month deadline, march 2005.

Sounds like a case to keep HL2 off store shelves.

 

[fragShader]

I think there being sneaky about HL2 too, I still dont believe chuck played the full retail, I honestly think valve are keeping the HL2 DM a secret till the release , afterall if it is there it will be a component of HL2, (eg. not seperate).

please say you are Gabe, I saw you hint at it

(off topic)

ffs clarky003 just ACCEPT IT.
the signs were there and u chose not to read them

but anyway developers always talk hype-laden crap during a games' development. if what John Romero said about Quake1 b4 it was released was true, you would have played Q1 with a Virtual Reality helmet and enjoyed ragdoll physics!

 

[Epsi]

But, if Valve win, which I think is more likely, really, Vivendi's complaints just sound like sour grapes... "oh, we gave them online distribution rights, but never expected they'd actually use them..." Pfft.

In the even Valve win, then VU get screwed by the number of people who've bought over Steam to get CS:S early.

This means: it's in VU's best interests to get HL2 out retail ASAP no matter if they think they'll win or lose. If they lose, they can still save some sales, and if they win, then they've just hedged their bets.

 

[Concept]

Just because Valve have announced the Steam packages with CS:S supposedly available next week, that will not absolve Valve in any way of fufilling their responsabilities under their agreement with VU. ie: trying to get sneaky HL2 orders through Steam prior to the release of HL2 to retail stores.

If Valve does not have the legal rights to distribute HL2 over Steam on a date of their choosing prior to the retail store copy, but they still go ahead and release on Steam prior to retail you can bet VU will be filing for breach of contract and loss of revenue.

All very true. But the key thing here is Valve happens to be allowing people to buy early, with some very enticing options to choose from. Which means the game doesn't need to be released for VUG to lose potential sales. The more they delay, the greater the risk is of them losing potential consumers to Valve.

As Peabody McFee pointed out in the initial post of this thread, it's a very clever move. The pressure is all on VUG now, both commercially and psychologically. If they delay for months in retaliation, then they risk an almost inevitable hostile reception from both the media and fans which risks their sales at retail because of Steam...

It's in their best interests to counter this by making sure once Half-Life 2's release candidate state is approved for gold status, to release the game as soon as they can.

 

[Dr. Freeman]

This is right on the money:

heheh yeah Spiffae indeed its on the money.
one thing tho...and that is this battle between VU and Valve is really giving the shaft to fans if u think of it.

i remember a thread here 2 months ago on whether u would purchase the retail version or the steam version and the main reason for pple choosing the retail version was for the CD/DVD, box and manuels...now factor in the hopes pple had for the CE and u can see why retail was such a popular choice.

it seems us fans/gamers are the ones getting caught in this ugly battle because now we are forced to choose between getting it via retail or via Steam, the latter being most likely no CD/DVDs, no box, no manuels

yeah.. the most important pple are getting overlooked ;(

 

[Concept]

I'd disagree.

I would say the options Valve have offered over Steam for purchase are fantastic. They've got something for everyone, depending on what you want from price and range... It's an excellent demonstration of the flexibility and choice possibly available over online content delivery. And as Penny Arcade pointed out, the potential implications of this for publishers must be terrifying.

And as for the lack of physical presence for online purchase of Half-Life 2... The Gold edition offers a strong mix of both worlds.

Yes, the delay and legal wranglings are unfortunate for the fans, but the demonstration of Half-Life 2's purchasing choice availability over Steam is impressive in my opinion.

 

[Ahnteis]

we are forced to choose between getting it via retail or via Steam, the latter being most likely no CD/DVDs, no box, no manuels

Try 100% sure no CD/DVD, no box, and electronic manual. You want a CD/DVD, burn your steam apps directory and the steam installer. You want a box, buy some cardboard.

 

[Dr. Freeman]

I'd disagree.

I would say the options Valve have offered over Steam for purchase are fantastic. They've got something for everyone, depending on what you want from price and range... It's an excellent demonstration of the flexibility and choice possibly available over online content delivery. And as Penny Arcade pointed out, the potential implications of this for publishers must be terrifying.

And as for the lack of physical presence for online purchase of Half-Life 2... The Gold edition offers a strong mix of both worlds.

Yes, the delay and legal wranglings are unfortunate for the fans, but the demonstration of Half-Life 2's purchasing choice availability over Steam is impressive in my opinion.

what about those of us who were expecting the CE to have all the types of things the Gold package has.. plus the thought of having our CD/DVDs, box art and manuels?
hey maybe u weren't here when many pple here were voting for the retail/CE option in threads... /me shrugs

its still pathetic that us fans are forced to choose one or the other :frown:

edit: Ahnteis yeah.. thanks for understand

 

[Mountain Man]

It's a brilliant move by Valve, it means that it's now in VU's interest to release HL2 ASAP!

Or Vivendi gets an emergency injuction against Valve to stop them from releasing content over Steam then procedes to sue Gabe's ass off.

 

[Ahnteis]

Gabe is an old Microsoft man. I'm sure he can handle lawyers' reins as well as Viv.

 

[Xcellere]

No one can defeat this hulk of a he-man:

Click.

 

[ferd]

didn't think of it that way...

it looks like a smart move indeed, I just hope that if VU wins the lawsuit, Valve wont have to cough up all their profits

 

[Concept]

what about those of us who were expecting the CE to have all the types of things the Gold package has.. plus the thought of having our CD/DVDs, box art and manuels?
hey maybe u weren't here when many pple here were voting for the retail/CE option in threads... /me shrugs

its still pathetic that us fans are forced to choose one or the other :frown:

edit: Ahnteis yeah.. thanks for understand

Yes, I can understand that if you had to pay a deposit on the pre-order, but what stops you from cancelling the Collector's Edition pre-order and buying from over Steam if you didn't?

I think ATI Voucher holders and people who are using a 56k connection have every right to be angry. But the rest of us? What's stopping Collector's Edition pre-orderers from simply switching over to Steam?