Gabe claimed the X800 is 40% faster than

Abom said:
Two (maybe three? I don't know if X:2 is) of those games being OpenGL, so they're obviously going to do better. Also, perhaps you didn't notice, but in all the other games the x800XT was superior. Hmm.
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Yes, I did notice. My point was to refute the claim that the X800XT is the "hands down champion in every game that supports 1600x1200 with AA and AF". That is clearly not the case.
 
CoreyGH said:
Yes, I did notice. My point was to refute the claim that the X800XT is the "hands down champion in every game that supports 1600x1200 with AA and AF". That is clearly not the case.
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Maybe not hands down, but it's still a significant lead, and that's not going to help the 6800u one bit.
 
Abom said:
Two (maybe three? I don't know if X:2 is) of those games being OpenGL, so they're obviously going to do better. Also, perhaps you didn't notice, but in all the other games the x800XT was superior. Hmm.
Click to expand...


If you look at the benchmarks from the different reviews, mostly they are about level, some the 6800 wins, others the x800xt wins.

The x800xt only draws out any sort of proper lead when it is run at 1600x1200 with 4xfsaa and 8xanisotropic filtering.

The x800xt is looking the better card, mainly to having the better anti-aliasing+anisotropic filtering performance and only requiring about 130watts of power.

Nvidia, also, from what a lot of sources are saying at Beyond3d, might still have a lot of power left in the card to be unleashed with the new drivers coming out over the next couple of months.
 
Abom said:
Two (maybe three? I don't know if X:2 is) of those games being OpenGL, so they're obviously going to do better.
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Just because the engine is OpenGL doesn't mean the NVidia hardware is going to do better. Homeworld 2 is OpenGL and the X800XT smokes the 6800.
 
CoreyGH said:
Just because the engine is OpenGL doesn't mean the NVidia hardware is going to do better. Homeworld 2 is OpenGL and the X800XT smokes the 6800.
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I was quite suprised at seeing that, last time I saw benchmarks for HW2 ATi wasn't doing too well.
 
Razor said:
If you look at the benchmarks from the different reviews, mostly they are about level, some the 6800 wins, others the x800xt wins.

The x800xt only draws out any sort of proper lead when it is run at 1600x1200 with 4xfsaa and 8xanisotropic filtering.

The x800xt is looking the better card, mainly to having the better anti-aliasing+anisotropic filtering performance and only requiring about 130watts of power.

Nvidia, also, from what a lot of sources are saying at Beyond3d, might still have a lot of power left in the card to be unleashed with the new drivers coming out over the next couple of months.
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There's unfortunately a lot of variation of performance in the different reviews. HardOCP's review shows the x800XT absolutely smoking the 6800U, while something like anand's review shows a minor victory from the x800XT. To be honest, at this time I actually trust the HardOCP review the most. They go into much deeper detail on the architecture, features etc. than any of the other reviews.

But yeah, I agree with your last point. Both cards are running on uncertified, beta drivers... I'd like to see a rematch with officially released drivers when they get released.
 
So many new decisions. Should I go for the 9800 pro .. xt ... or the x800 pro...
(no 6800 for powersupply reasons).

Lousey timing of a game release with a new graphics card. I want it so bad now.

They're so smart!


edit: anyone know if the x800 will have a free copy of hl2 with it?
 
Abom said:
There's unfortunately a lot of variation of performance in the different reviews. HardOCP's review shows the x800XT absolutely smoking the 6800U, while something like anand's review shows a minor victory from the x800XT. To be honest, at this time I actually trust the HardOCP review the most. They go into much deeper detail on the architecture, features etc. than any of the other reviews.

But yeah, I agree with your last point. Both cards are running on uncertified, beta drivers... I'd like to see a rematch with officially released drivers when they get released.
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Anandtech and Hardocp really aren't websites to be trusted, in my opinion.

The Beyond3d one was very good but doesn't offer any performance figures compared to the 6800 Ultra, www.firingsquad.com also offer a very good unbiased review. All reviews do pretty much say the same thing, very similar performance but the x800xt has the edge at high resolutions with fsaa and af, and also the edge with how much smaller it is and the power consumption as well.

I am quite happy with my 5900Ultra, so i am going to wait till the nv45.
 
I have a 9700 pro, cannot be arsed to upgrade to anything higher for a while, im not a hardcore Overclocker, should be fine for a year though.
 
If 2.4 ghz is enough to keep you from having a bottleneck processor if you buy a x800 card, what would be the bottleneck limit for a 9800pro. I currently have a 1.8 ghz:er & I can't say my experience have gone up that much since I upgraded my Geforce 3 ti500 to a 980pro from Hercules. I hope it's the processor :)
 
With Pixel Shader 3.0 support, Geforce 6800 Ultra is better than x800.
 
LathspeLL said:
With Pixel Shader 3.0 support, Geforce 6800 Ultra is better than x800.
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One engine supports PS3.0, and that isn't out for years. The only other game in the imminent future is Far Cry, and that's just one game. It isn't a huge advantage right now.
 
Lobster said:
I have a 9700 pro, cannot be arsed to upgrade to anything higher for a while, im not a hardcore Overclocker, should be fine for a year though.
Click to expand...


Same here...(although OCed a tiny bit). Until games become unplayable with this card I not investing in something else.


And I'm rather sick of the "this card runs 40% than ____" or "this card is 7 times faster than ____" bah humbug. All of those tests are on specific things (as people are mentioning)....some cards run X better, while other cards will run Y better. It's a matter of opinion and choice at this point. Pro-Ati people point to certain benchmarks, and Pro-Nvidia point to others....

bah ;)

Get what card you want based on what you can afford and what feature you like....makes it a lot easier. Personally for me it's a matter of features vs cost and not name...whatever I can afford at the time and who has the most features will be the winner for me. I would gladly buy either ATI or Nvidia (and have) when the next time comes.
 
Reviews I saw had the 6800 ahead of the x800 in a few cases UNTIL they turned on AA and AF. And honestly, if you pay $400 for a video card and then turn OFF AF/AA, what is the point?!
 
LathspeLL said:
With Pixel Shader 3.0 support, Geforce 6800 Ultra is better than x800.
Click to expand...

When it comes to making apple juice, apples are WAY better than oranges!
 
Ahnteis said:
Reviews I saw had the 6800 ahead of the x800 in a few cases UNTIL they turned on AA and AF. And honestly, if you pay $400 for a video card and then turn OFF AF/AA, what is the point?!
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Go read the first page of this thread and you'll see that Anandtech proves that this is not the case for several games.
 
I'm confused, is the 3 mins long movie already downloadable or what?
 
it wouldn't surprise me if the x800 WAS 40% faster in HL2. HL2 = DX9. ATI OWNS the DX9 area.

NVidia, however, wipes the floor with Open GL...

so in the end, it's Radeon HL2 vs NVidia Doom3
 
I have an alienware system that is getitng this video card update. The ATI has blown away the GeForce, and I am a long time Nvidia groupie. So I was shocked. But now I am an ATI groupie, so ATI all the way!
 
The most benchmarks atm cant be trusted, since they nobody has the final versions of the card yet, benchmark cheating is still very likely (i know it happened with the Nvidia card), and noone ever had the chance to test the cards with HL2.

So why the disbelieve? If Gabe says so, it's got to be true.
 
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/index.html

Read the review. After reading it I am not so sure how much greater ATI is. That isn't to say it isn't faster I am just saying that in some cases it is. Who knows what the Ultra line from Nvidia will bring.

It is a good time to be a consumer with so many performance leaps in video cards!
 
damn it. i bet this new movie gets released while im at work. so ill have to come back to everyone talking about how cool it is and ill have to play catch-up.
 
TheWart said:
I think you may be confusing the X800Pro and the X800XT. The pro is the 399 version that is roughly equal, if not better, than the 6800Ultra. The X800XT is 499, and is hands down the champion, with *every* game that supported 1600x1200 playable at 1600x1200 *with* AA and AF.

See this if you don't believe me
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no actually, i wasnt. yes i know the diff between the pro and xt.
and the XT was about the same as the 6800 pro in most cases, losing in some benchmarks and winning in others.

I'd probably pick ati though because it did seem like a lot of times the x800xt performed better with fsaa and af
 
when will it be released? aproximatelly?
 
The x800pro can be purchased now in America, the Xt will be a few more weeks. The 6800 will also be a few more weeks.
 
A2597 said:
it wouldn't surprise me if the x800 WAS 40% faster in HL2. HL2 = DX9. ATI OWNS the DX9 area.

NVidia, however, wipes the floor with Open GL...

so in the end, it's Radeon HL2 vs NVidia Doom3
Click to expand...

I must stress that these blanket statements without any qualifing facts don't help anyone. EXPECIALLY since all the reviews we've seen have been on BETA drivers. ATI doesn't "own" DX9 and more than Nvidia owns OpenGL. Check the stats for Aquamark 3 (DX9 but Nvidia wins the standard test) and Homeworld 2 (OpenGL but ATI smokes Nvidia).
 
don't forget that the FX6800 has TWO molex power connectors and requires a 500w power supply minimum... it can draw 100w of power!

the X800 draws less power than a 9800 Pro, and less power = less heat = quieter cooling.

and it's only one slot, vs. 2 for the 6800 ultra.
 
I wouldn't trust any review that uses three Q3 engine games (ie. ET, CoD, Jedi etc) running the equivilent of DX8-8.1 just to make the 6800 look better. We all know Nvidia has better Open GL performance and we all know that the Q3 engine was developed with Nvidia's hardware in mind, but trying to exaggerate the significance of that advantage at this stage of the game is pretty piss-poor. It means almost nothing until D3 comes out and we have the numbers.....

Both the XT800 generation and the 6800 smoke Q3 engine games regardless of the resolution, so trying to call it a significant victory for the 6800 is absurd.... The real emphasis should be put on sustantial wins in Far Cry, UT2003 as well as a fair cross section of older games which use SEPARATE engine bases... If you use that sensible logic then clearly a R420 is a better buy in performance atm though not necessarily in terms of feature-set....
 
Yeah, but they are going to be continually update source arent they. (And you can supposedly write your own Shaders for it) So surely its going to support DX 9.0c in the near future, I mean Valve wouldnt hold back on that just because ATi can't run it, would they???? :)

To the Email! (dont anyone else ask).
 
Actually that quote from Gabe was incomplete. He said that the X800XT runs about 40% faster than the pro but the 6800 Ultra runs about 10-15% faster than the X800XT in HL2. As soon as find a reliable link I'll post it here.
 
and where did you find that little snippet of info, or was it a joke (This is far too serious to be making jokes about :) ).
 
Wolf said:
I wouldn't trust any review that uses three Q3 engine games (ie. ET, CoD, Jedi etc) running the equivilent of DX8-8.1 just to make the 6800 look better. We all know Nvidia has better Open GL performance and we all know that the Q3 engine was developed with Nvidia's hardware in mind, but trying to exaggerate the significance of that advantage at this stage of the game is pretty piss-poor. It means almost nothing until D3 comes out and we have the numbers.....

Both the XT800 generation and the 6800 smoke Q3 engine games regardless of the resolution, so trying to call it a significant victory for the 6800 is absurd.... The real emphasis should be put on sustantial wins in Far Cry, UT2003 as well as a fair cross section of older games which use SEPARATE engine bases... If you use that sensible logic then clearly a R420 is a better buy in performance atm though not necessarily in terms of feature-set....
Click to expand...

No one said anything about the recent benchmarks being "a significant victory for the 6800". There have, however, been several comments about the X800XT being the absolute best at everything which is simply not true.

And as for "not trusting" the Anandtech review simply because it tests a larger number of games than the others reveiw; I submit that THAT is absurd. Anandtech was one of (if not THE) first sites to point out Nvidia's poor AA and AF quality back in the early 9700 days. Their reveiws are highly informative, technical, and non-biased.
 
darkmistx said:
Actually that quote from Gabe was incomplete. He said that the X800XT runs about 40% faster than the pro but the 6800 Ultra runs about 10-15% faster than the X800XT in HL2. As soon as find a reliable link I'll post it here.
Click to expand...

Not true, he stated the X800XT was 40% faster than any other upcoming card, this would logically include the new geforce.

edit: I remember reading this somewhere, not in the neowin blog. The blog specifically says he mentioned the 6800, the page I read didn't. I'll try to find it.
 
Anyone have any guesses of what the price tag of this card will be like?
 
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