Gabe Newell: We've Moved Beyond the Episodic Model

[Deleted member 56031]

Newell: We've moved beyond the episodic model

In an interview with Develop Magazine this month, Gabe talked about Valve's approach to developing games and how it has changed.

"We went through the episodes phase, and now we’re going towards shorter and even shorter cycles. The ‘games as a service’ credo is to create games that are platforms in themselves; content that can be rapidly reconstructed through a series of updates."[br]“For me, ‘entertainment as a service’ is a clear distillation of the episodic content model"

Gabe also cites that the TF2 development model is something they are proud and although the shortened development cycles of the episodic model seemed initially better for the Half-life series, it isn't going to be sticking around.[br]It seems like we should start thinking about a Half-life 3 rather than an episode 3 from now on?

 

[DEATHMASTER]

Thank **** for that too! It's been 4 years, like hell I was still expecting an episode.

 

[Remus]

so what is going to happen to episode 3??

Episode 3 will be Half Life 3, duh.

 

[Barnz]

Great news! I hated Episode One.

 

[StarBob]

I don't get it really. They tried it out for two episodes. Did they not sell well? I thought they were reasonable considering the price and the graphical updates associated with them. I'd rather progress the story in a timely manner with entertaining gameplay than wait valve time for something that will probably be a few hours longer with a similar setup...

Of course no matter what happens it's going to be another 10 years before we know what happens with Gordon, Alyx, and that helicopter.

 

[Escaep]

If Gabe was wearing lipstick in that picture he'd look like a fat woman.

 

[Remus]

I don't get it really. They tried it out for two episodes. Did they not sell well? I thought they were reasonable considering the price and the graphical updates associated with them. I'd rather progress the story in a timely manner with entertaining gameplay than wait valve time for something that will probably be a few hours longer with a similar setup...

Of course no matter what happens it's going to be another 10 years before we know what happens with Gordon, Alyx, and that helicopter.

The thing is it was nowhere near "timely". If they had released one episode every year I would've been fine with it, but their development time for one episode was quite frankly ridiculous. In the time they spent making an "episode" another company would've made an entire game from scratch. Sure you might say they were taking their time to produce a polished product, but come on!

 

[Stigmata]

Team Fortress 2 is the fastest frequency we work on with comparatively fast updates. Er, Half-Life is apparently the slowest! [Laughs] Although, from the outside world, we have no evidence that Half-Life is working on any frequency at all. [Laughs]

So that's pretty much confirmation that HL3 is in active development. Too many weasel words, too much forced laughter, for it to be anything else.

 

[Escaep]

So that's pretty much confirmation that HL3 is in active development. Too many weasel words, too much forced laughter, for it to be anything else.

I'd hope at least something is in development.

 

[StarBob]

The thing is it was nowhere near "timely". If they had released one episode every year I would've been fine with it, but their development time for one episode was quite frankly ridiculous. In the time they spent making an "episode" another company would've made an entire game from scratch. Sure you might say they were taking their time to produce a polished product, but come on!

This isn't about anyone but Valve though. It's relativity that we're considering. All things considered the length of time between the Episodes actually in development was loads faster than the history of Valve's eternal game development. Granted it was still as slow as anyone could possibly bear, it wasn't six years. Granted recently they've become a bit faster in producing sequels, but that seems to be in another dimension compared to Half Life. So yeah I was enjoying the relatively fast release of the Episodes when they were releasing.

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

This is old news, right? Gabe said it didn't work quite a while ago because they just ended up wanting to tack more and more onto episodes making for unrealistic dev cycles.

Maybe this will hush the LOLWHUREPISODE3DERP posts though. Remember children, Valve is a predictable animal these days. Soon, we'll all be defending ancients!

 

[Asknoone]

Gabe's such an entertainment radical. I love him so.

 

[Paulaner]

This is old news, right? Gabe said it didn't work quite a while ago because they just ended up wanting to tack more and more onto episodes making for unrealistic dev cycles.

Yes, not big news. No one was really expecting Episode 3 after 4 years. Also, in my humble opinion, Ep1 and Ep2 were enjoyable but subpar compared to other contemporary shooters. They were short and they used the same gameplay, the same (slightly improved) engine and the same assets. In other words: the same old thing over and over again.
The real question is: where is the Half-Life franchise going? Competition has grown very strong and Valve will need a super duper engine and a totally improved gameplay. Also: what about that "we are not going to make singleplayer games anymore" thing, or whatever Valve was trying to say?
Mr. Newell, please, answer some real question.

EDIT: And, no more Antlions, please.

 

[Combine Hybrid]

Fat bastard, just work and focus on Half Life 3 and **** all other sequels.

 

[StardogChampion]

HL3 will come on a brand new engine. They have enough money from Steam to start from scratch.

 

[Mogi67]

I doubt any sort of Half-Life installment is in development

 

[Shakermaker]

If anything I'd like to know more about the F-Stop game mechanic mentioned in Geoff Keighley's iPad thingy. And if it is cool they can put that in any game they want, either HL-related or new IP.

 

[Naph]

Too bad these won't appease the lurkers. Great news to get excited about.

 

[Warped]

Portal 3 and Left4Dead3 have a better chance of being in your hands before HL3...but then again theres always E3 this year and a teaser would make everyone's trousers rise

 

[MaximusPM]

They gotta finish that story arc, and that would be better with a HL2: Episode Three, before starting a Half-Life 3 story arc...
But, whichever is their solution to this, just show us something pleaseee...

 

[MuToiD_MaN]

First they gotta ship ... Portal 2...
Then they gotta ship ... DOTA 2 ...

Nah. Nahhhaahhhnahn.

 

[Krynn72]

First they gotta ship ... Portal 2...
Then they gotta ship ... DOTA 2 ...

Nah. Nahhhaahhhnahn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSr2FgbvUkE

 

[MuToiD_MaN]

Remix was definitely in my head when I posted it

 

[Cunni]

I hope we don't have to wait another 2 years for it.....but a full fledged game will make me really happy as I found the episodes way too short, especially with how long they took to come out. I dunno, I'm just a fan of the big, long, epic game. I bought my current computer when Half Life 2 came out, and I couldn't think of a better reason to buy my next one than when Half Life 3 gets released!

 

[GreatEmperor]

I don't get it really. They tried it out for two episodes. Did they not sell well? I thought they were reasonable considering the price and the graphical updates associated with them. I'd rather progress the story in a timely manner with entertaining gameplay than wait valve time for something that will probably be a few hours longer with a similar setup...

Of course no matter what happens it's going to be another 10 years before we know what happens with Gordon, Alyx, and that helicopter.

I think they realized they just do NOT have their shit together enough to release even episodes in a timely fashion. What I hope happens is they announce 3 now then give a few pieces of concept art just to start the new cycle of waiting, this time for something larger

 

[MultiVaC]

Also: what about that "we are not going to make singleplayer games anymore" thing, or whatever Valve was trying to say?

He clarified that statement a lot here:
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/05/09/valve-not-giving-up-on-single-player-at-all/#more-58821

"So, it’s not about giving up on single player at all, it’s like saying, we actually think that there’s a bunch of features and capabilities that we need to add into our single player games to recognize the socially connected gamer"

 

[Paulaner]

we actually think that there’s a bunch of features and capabilities that we need to add into our single player games to recognize the socially connected gamer

OK, thank you. Still cryptic as hell, but it's good to hear they are not giving up on singleplayer games at all. By the way, what is a socially connected gamer? And how will this thing relate to singleplayer games?

 

[function9]

Yeah, I hope it doesn't mean they'll try something like making random chapters co-op or along those lines. Personally I've never touched myspace, facebook, and whatever else there is. I have no need or desire for any type of IM apps, I have all friends stuff turned off in steam. It's as bad as cell phones now, it's why I usually have my cell off 90% or more of the time. Don't rape my SP experience with forced "social" features please, thanks.

 

[Paulaner]

Don't rape my SP experience with forced "social" features please, thanks.

^ This

 

[Acepilotf14]

Yeah, I hope it doesn't mean they'll try something like making random chapters co-op or along those lines. Personally I've never touched myspace, facebook, and whatever else there is. I have no need or desire for any type of IM apps, I have all friends stuff turned off in steam. It's as bad as cell phones now, it's why I usually have my cell off 90% or more of the time. Don't rape my SP experience with forced "social" features please, thanks.

You sound like a very lonely person.

 

[Paulaner]

You sound like a very lonely person.

Maybe he likes to meet people in real life. When it comes to SP games I am with him: I don't want fancy social features, I just want to turn on my PC and play at once, according to my pace and my mood. Just 5 minutes or 2 full hours, I decide. All that "social" stuff, at least keep it optional and don't force it into gameplay.

 

[sharkyshu]

Maybe he likes to meet people in real life. When it comes to SP games I am with him: I don't want fancy social features, I just want to turn on my PC and play at once, according to my pace and my mood. Just 5 minutes or 2 full hours, I decide. All that "social" stuff, at least keep it optional and don't force it into gameplay.

I agree . It would be a huge mistake if Valve force all their "social" stuff into gamers .

 

[hool10]

From what I have taken away from co-op is the huge rush fest that is in L4D. At first it was fun playing L4D because it was new and you didn't know how to play it. Now you got people who rush to the safehouse like the devil is on their heels. Seriously, I want to soak in the atmosphere that Valve has put into their game for the past 5 years and not rush. It's comparable to a work of art. You wouldn't rush through a museum and you wouldn't rush through a game you payed $50 for. Portal 2 did it right in my opinion though (I had a non-rushing friend) and Valve frankly are capable of pulling off just about anything. However I liked HL and HL2 because it was you against some alien or an alien with a gun. When they started putting you with Alyx who never took her gaze off you, it got creepy. Then it got to the point that she started walking backwards to maintain eye contact. Then it got even more awkward when there was no scripted lines to say and she walked backwards with her eyes rolling up. Valve mentions this was intentional to keep eye contact with the character and lead them but it's a failure in my opinion in story progression. If they make her as a co-op character I'm ok with that initially but it will suffer the L4D fate. Maybe they can do something with 2 rebels or Gordon and Chell. Whatever it is, Valve will pull it off like they usually do.

Another thing off topic but I'll make it short. The game completion time. I don't want to hear how fast you solved the puzzles or how short the game was. Don't play the game for 4+ hours straight then complain how short the game was. Go get a job/life and play the game. You will find out that Portal 2 was indeed a 8+ hour game and that was just the SP portion.

Anyways something tells me that Portal 2 was the second largest game being made at Valve. After the OB was made they took a break and had fun with ideas like F-STOP. I think the L4D games are irrelevant to what Valve is currently making in type of scale. Sure they had some development time on L4D but I think at the same time they were making a Source engine 2. I also think they have been making HL3 with a Source engine update since HL2 and really started production after the OB. DOTA 2 I think is the last Source based game. The Source engine can't handle DX10 I don't think because DX10 coding is much different than DX9 which is what Source currently uses.

As for Counter-Strike 2, no doubt it will come with HL3. Only that it won't play like CS but will still have that classic feel. It will also have that paid item model like $5 for a Leet skin, etc.

 

[Mogi67]

I have all friends stuff turned off in steam. It's as bad as cell phones now, it's why I usually have my cell off 90% or more of the time. .

So you don't have any friends IRL? I hope you at least have some pets, maybe a hermit crab?

 

[Cuthbert]

Call me naive, I still expect an Episode 3. Them including the Borealis achievement in Portal2 tells me they are not done or retconning the whole Borealis thing, and I also don't think Half Life 3 would be about the continuation of same story arc. Do I have any sources? No. But my gut tells me, Half Life 3 would have a new story arc, a whole new book from the Half Life Bible Mr. Laidlaw appeerantly already planned ahead. So, I expect closure to current "Resistance of Earth" storyline and Borealis. The thing that makes most sense to me is announcing Half Life 3 after we are done with Ep3. Wishful thinking has always been my weakness though.

 

[Godron]

^^ This.

For the naming to be consistent, HL3 should be to HL2 as HL2 was to HL1. That means there should be massive changes, chief among them a new story arc. Which they can't do until they've finished the current one, which is what episode 3 was planned to do and what I'm sure it will do. Sure, I expect it'll be way longer than episode 2, hopefully somewhere around 16+ hours, but I don't think it'll be able to justify being named HL3. Just think how different HL2 was to HL1: new engine, addition of physics, addition of characters, and much more emphasis on story. HL3 needs to have something really new, which does not mean a couple of new NPCs, a few engine changes and a new trick gravity gun.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

If it's going to be that long, it can't really be called an episode.

 

[ríomhaire]

So you don't have any friends IRL? I hope you at least have some pets, maybe a hermit crab?

Oh no someone likes playing a game in a different way to me I must insult bad belittle him immediately. I also disabled the overlay when I was playing Portal 2. I would do the same for any atmosphere rich game like STALKER or whenever the next HL comes out.

 

[Mogi67]

Oh no someone likes playing a game in a different way to me I must insult bad belittle him immediately.

I don't play video games, no one does.

 

[function9]

You sound like a very lonely person.

I would think if I was a lonely person I would seek out any kind of contact with people I could get. But I don't.

So you don't have any friends IRL? I hope you at least have some pets, maybe a hermit crab?

I have friends yes. What I don't need or want is to constantly be bombarded with IM's, text messages, calls, whatever else there is.

Anyways, I really don't care if you're someone that needs to be chatting with people 24/7 or what. I just hope that Valve doesn't think that's the only kind of person out there playing their games. As long as there's options to disable features and they don't go and make the next HL installment co-op (whole or partially) I don't have any complaints. But these last couple interviews I've read make me wonder.