good morning world, time for your dose of xenopobia

[CptStern]

I can just see it now, islam will become the official religion of every country in the world..

even the vatican!!!


facepalm @ stupidity in this thread

 

[redsunlee]

I was registered at your forum. I have printed the test message. Do not delete, please.



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[xdrive]

even the vatican!!!


facepalm @ stupidity in this thread

Use your imagination. Would the vatican still be around if islam swept the world? no.

 

[nurizeko]

Just in case anyone's interested I read in the Times Yesterday that population growth this year or something is dominated more by births/deaths then immigration.

Fun facts!.

 

[Sulkdodds]

It may be sensationalist xenophobia but look at historic societies of with mass immigration, Rome, Australia and the Americas. In every case the new culture took over.

Is it just me or are you confusing 'immigration into an already established strong nation-state' with 'colonial and military expansion into a new territory'?

 

[Tyguy]

video lost all credibility at the end.

 

[Docho]

"Across the entire European Union of 31 countries".

They can't even get the number of member states of the EU right (come on, you can look that up everywhere!), so I doubt they really know something about the EU member states and the impact of demographics on history.

Personal opinion: I do think we should only let small amounts of immigrants inside our borders and see that they integrate well.

 

[David.Seth2]

how much of it is true or how much of it will or won't happen?

this might get interesting...since i've got some more juicy stuff if needed be

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/demographics.asp

from the article (which they determined to be mostly false):

# Currently in Belgium, 25% of the population and 50% of all newborns are Muslim.

Muslims are the second-largest religious group in Belgium, but they still only account for about 4%-5% of the population. And, as noted above, for that small a segment of the population to be accounting for "50% of all newborns" in the country, Muslim women would have to be giving birth to incredibly large numbers of children each.

# The German government, the first to talk about this publicly, recently released a statement saying: "The fall in the German population can no longer be stopped. Its downward spiral is no longer reversible. It will be a Muslim state by the year 2050."

The quoted statement was made by Walter Radermacher, the vice-president of the Germany's Federal Statistical Office. However, he was speaking only of German population trends in general; the final sentence (about Germany's becoming a "Muslim state") is someone else's words, as he affirmed to the BBC:
The quotation which reads as if the German government believed that Germany will become a Muslim state is simply not true. There is no source which can be quoted that the German government has published such an expression or opinion.

# "There are currently 52 million Muslims in Europe. The German government said that number is expected to double in the next 20 years.

The 52 million figure is a reasonable estimate for the number of Muslims in Europe. However, as the last part (about the Muslim population's doubling in the next two decades), Walter Radermacher said:
That is not true. The German government does not believe that the Muslim population will double in [even] the next 40 or 50 years. There are no reliable sources that give a proof for that assumption.

As we observed above, the assumption that current demographic trends will remain static — even in the face of future political, economic or social changes — is an especially important (and precarious) one, as even small changes in fertility rates can have a significant impact on the future size and nature of populations. Or, as Martin Walker noted a Spring 2009 Wilson Quarterly on the subject, "the detailed work of demographers tends to seep out to the general public in crude form, and sensationalist headlines so become common wisdom."

Particularly, Walker wrote, as the result of this seepage of crude information is that "three deeply misleading assumptions about demographic trends have become lodged in the public mind":
The first is that mass migration into Europe, legal and illegal, combined with an eroding native population base, is transforming the ethnic, cultural, and religious identity of the continent. The second assumption, which is related to the first, is that Europe's native population is in steady and serious decline from a falling birthrate ... The third is that population growth in the developing world will continue at a high rate.
In regards to specific claims about Muslim immigrants supplanting native-born populations in Europe due to the former's much higher fertility rates, Walker observed:
One fact that gets lost among distractions ... is that the birthrates of Muslim women in Europe — and around the world — have been falling significantly for some time.

harp reductions in fertility among Muslim immigrants reflect important cultural shifts, which include universal female education, rising living standards, the inculcation of local mores, and widespread availability of contraception. Broadly speaking, birthrates among immigrants tend to rise or fall to the local statistical norm within two generations.

The decline of Muslim birthrates is a global phenomenon. Most analysts have focused on the remarkably high proportion of people under age 25 in the Arab countries, which has inspired some crude forecasts about what this implies for the future. Yet recent UN data suggest that Arab birthrates are falling fast, and that the number of births among women under the age of 20 is dropping even more sharply.

The falling fertility rates in large segments of the Islamic world have been matched by another significant shift: Across northern and western Europe, women have suddenly started having more babies ... Immigrant mothers account for part of the fertility increase throughout Europe, but only part. And, significantly, many of the immigrants are arrivals from elsewhere in Europe, especially the eastern European countries admitted to the European Union in recent years.
In short, the best demographers can do is make broad guesses about population trends based on current conditions and assumptions about how (and how much) those trends might be influenced by societal changes. Or, as summarized by Walker:
The human habit is simply to project current trends into the future. Demographic realities are seldom kind to the predictions that result. The decision to have a child depends on innumerable personal considerations and large, unaccountable societal factors that are in constant flux. Yet even knowing this, demographers themselves are often flummoxed. Projections of birthrates and population totals are often embarrassingly at odds with eventual reality.
Last updated: 10 August 2009


Sources:

BBC News. "Muslims in Europe: Country Guide."
23 December 2005.

Foreign Policy. "The List: The World’s Fastest-Growing Religions."
May 2007.

Hellen, Nicholas and Christopher Morgan. "Muslims Outpace Anglicans in UK."
The Times. 25 Janaury 2004.

Hull, Jonah. "Russia Sees Muslim Population Boom."
Al Jazeera. 13 Janaury 2007.

Knight, Richard. "Debunking a YouTube Hit."
BBC News. 7 August 2009.

Muenz, Rainer. "Europe: Population and Migration in 2005."
Migration Policy Institute. June 2006.

Travis, Alan. "Officials Think UK's Muslim Population Has Risen to 2M."
The Guardian. 8 April 2008.

Walker, Martin. "The World's New Numbers."
The Wilson Quarterly. Spring 2009 (pp. 24-31).