Green Ammo Crates: A Bad Idea?

[A True Canadian]

After browsing the Strider thread in General Discussion, I began thinking about these crates and how they are in every difficult spot in Half-Life 2. You know the crates I'm talking about, right? They're the big green boxes that open via a lid on the top, and inside is an endless supply of ammo.

Was the idea to include these crates a bad one?

These things give you the opportunity to refill, and essentially max out your ammo for a certain weapon. And because these things are in nearly every difficult firefight throughout the game, it certainly is one of the reasons why Half-Life 2 is percieved to be too easy. :E

I think you first see these things in Route Kanal, prior to the small section before you locate the mudskipper. The result? Maxed out machinegun and pistol ammo before you duke it out with some headcrabs. The problem? The battle becomes too easy. Instead of desperation (such as having to resort to your crowbar to deal with the zombies/headcrabs), the player is confident because they have enough ammo to blast their way through the zombie/headcrab horde, and then some.

Another moment is on the bridge when the gunship arrives. The endless supply of rockets make it a mild encounter at best. If you were to remove the rocket crate and make the player search for stray rockets instead, the sequence would become more challenging and rewarding in the end.

Strider battles would require more movement in search of explosives, instead of just camping next to these bottomless ammo feeders until the threat is down. Every single Strider battle had one of these green crates somewhere close by (save for the one in the Citadel that required orbs and the manipulator to take it down). :sniper:

Remember in Half-Life when you would need to use your ammo sparingly? In Blast Pit I was usually down to only my shotgun having sufficient ammo. What would have happened if Valve put one of these ammo crates in the chapter? It would become super easy, and probably less fun.

Anyway, what do you guys think about these things? Would removing these from the game make things better or worse?

 

[sinkoman]

NO! They made the game all around more enjoyable, because they gave you something to fight for, and a fake base of operations in certain levels.

I remember having loads of fun running to the crates, and setting up base at them. Moving barrels and crates here and there to create little shields, good fun.

But if you ask me, this is a stupid question. No offense

EDIT: Oh and yeah, some portions of the game would be impossible without them. I can think of a million times where killing something was your main objective, and without one of those things nearby, you would've either not had enough ammo, or there was the possibility that the player'd waste all the ammo, because they didn't have a very good shot.

 

[Sulkdodds]

I think you make a good point, but there'd need to be some mechanism to respawn 'stray rockets' while you weren't looking. The green ammo crates are good and work in some areas, but the example of the Bridge is a very good one.

 

[hi_ted]

I found that the green ammo boxes were at the hardest parts of the game anyway. Yes, they could have been absent from some battles, but with things like striders and dropships that can only be destroyed by rockets, how else can you defeat them if you run out?

 

[Cormeh]

Without one in the courtyard at the very beginning of Nova Prospekt, I would've been knackered.

 

[Asknoone]

They are a fine idea, but some places really didn't need them. You couldn't go back to it in Route Kanal though (the headcrab/shanty town area) to get more, but yes you were pretty sorted for the entire sequence.

 

[Cyan Leader]

It is simple. Valve created them in areas wherte you need them to finish the enemy on a certain area. Lets say that brige example you gave, on the gunship. You have 3 rockets with you from a previous area. You are playing on hard, so 7 hits until you take it down. There are 10 rockets scattered around the area. If the player misses 7 rockets, he just wund't be able to kill it. That is what Valve was afraid of.

Of course, not all ammo crates were needed, the one before the headcrab part as an example, but I did not found that one much abusive. First, it was on an outpost, which it goes acordely with the game, and SMG ammo is everywhere. Also, I rather kill headcrabs with the crowbar, simply because ANY headcrab dies with one hit of it.

On the other side, yes, sometimes it looked weird to have an endless ammo supply every time you need it, but I do not think it made the game easier. And it can't really be compared with Half-Life 1, because there were no enemies that could be defeated with only one type of weapon.

To sum it up, it was necessary.

 

[Solver]

I liked it.

For the hard battles, it was a good way to ensure that new players wouldn't run out of ammo. Think Nova Prospekt, two Gunships. That's 14 rockets. Even experenced players are likely to miss some. For less experienced players, it wouldn't be enough to put 20 "stray" rockets around there. Not really fun.

The fact that those green rocket creates are in an open area make it hard enough, as you need to grab the rocket and run back behind your cover.

Some SMG ammo and Grenade crates... well, I never felt like they really made a difference, but it was nice.

 

[Absinthe]

They were necessary. If you ran out of rocket ammo for certain enemies, you'd be well ****ed.

 

[Black Mesa corp]

Orginally posted by sinkoman:

NO! They made the game all around more enjoyable, because they gave you something to fight for, and a fake base of operations in certain levels.

I remember having loads of fun running to the crates, and setting up base at them. Moving barrels and crates here and there to create little shields, good fun.

But if you ask me, this is a stupid question. No offense

EDIT: Oh and yeah, some portions of the game would be impossible without them. I can think of a million times where killing something was your main objective, and without one of those things nearby, you would've either not had enough ammo, or there was the possibility that the player'd waste all the ammo, because they didn't have a very good shot.

Exactly what he said...

 

[ríomhaire]

I would have removed the one from the buggy(have more ammo in the houses instead) and the one where you get the airboat.

 

[Sui]

I kinda agree with your argument... to me, it just seems a little lazy. At the very least they should have a limited amount of ammo! I just think the player should have to search for rockets to use against striders etc, and if you make the rockets respawn like Sulk said, it would work fine.

 

[Sieni]

Actually, I hated the green ammo boxes because every time I saw one, I knew there would be a big fight soon. They kind of spoiled the all cool moments of the game .

 

[jerkasaur]

Originally posted by Cyan Leader:
"...And it can't really be compared with Half-Life 1, because there were no enemies that could be defeated with only one type of weapon."

yes they were, the Garguanta 4 example, ( i don't know how to spell it an i'm too lazy to search 4 it...) you could only take it down with explosive weapons, 10 granades in easy mode...

 

[ríomhaire]

Originally posted by Cyan Leader:
"...And it can't really be compared with Half-Life 1, because there were no enemies that could be defeated with only one type of weapon."

yes they were, the Garguanta 4 example, ( i don't know how to spell it an i'm too lazy to search 4 it...) you could only take it down with explosive weapons, 10 granades in easy mode...

Or the tau rifle or the gluon gun.

 

[rocketman44]

i like the green boxes. they add a nice camo effect to the game. i mean, all the olive drab green <3

 

[Stalin]

Green Roxorzz your ..ummm fingZorz

hi yall, green ammo crates is teh Roxorzz

Visit Prototypers.co.nr

 

[Sam2k]

I kinda agree with your argument... to me, it just seems a little lazy. At the very least they should have a limited amount of ammo! I just think the player should have to search for rockets to use against striders etc, and if you make the rockets respawn like Sulk said, it would work fine.

Which is basically the same thing but with more running...

 

[sinkoman]

hi yall, green ammo crates is teh Roxorzz

Visit Prototypers.co.nr

Wow. Not only did you revive a dead thread, but you shamelessly plugged your own site.

Go away. Shoo!

 

[bboymatty]

the crates are lazy programming
in the hl2 universe, where even food and sex is restricted, you would think the combine would have gone to some lengths to make sure regular citizens dont have guns, and that random ammo crates are locked and kept in secure places.

 

[someone402]

At the end of Follow Freeman, when I was playing on hard, you have to fight two striders. When I fought them, I did not know there was a rocket crate nearby. I died over twenty times, trying everything to kill them. Finally I found the crate and destroyed them. Without the crate, I would have been stuck there forever. Plus on hard, striders can shoot a blue beam, which is VERY powerful.

I think that crates should be in the places where it is impossible to win without them.

 

[DannyC.]

At the end of Follow Freeman, when I was playing on hard, you have to fight two striders. When I fought them, I did not know there was a rocket crate nearby. I died over twenty times, trying everything to kill them. Finally I found the crate and destroyed them. Without the crate, I would have been stuck there forever. Plus on hard, striders can shoot a blue beam, which is VERY powerful.

I think that crates should be in the places where it is impossible to win without them.

Indeed. Not ones like the one in Entanglement when you set up the turrets (the second area).

It would be handy for the Combine to have 1 or 2 ammo crates at an outpost, so I guess that could be a reason for some places.

 

[Adabiviak]

I think Valve adjusted their weapon caches with a lot of thought involved, as is their modus operandi. In fact, I don't even question where they put them because of the amount of thought given to the total gameplay experience. If too much ammo made a certain section easy, they did it that way on purpose. With the gunship on the bridge, you only had enough rockets to piss it off until you got at least halfway back across the bridge. That trek was suspenseful, as you basically had to make a run for it along the girders until you got to the rockets. Note their location, too. Out in the open, and the shack you have for cover has openings that the gunship will use to shoot at you. Even when you get to the rocket pack, it's still somewhat challenging to step outside, reload, and attack. I thought that level was done quite nicely.

I also don't think every green ammo box signaled a big fight, at least one that wasn't transparent before you got to the green box. The houses along the coast, for example.

Again, with the first strider fight, you don't have a green rocket crate available until you get across the courtyard. If you blow it and run out of rockets with striders still on patrol, you've got to do some serious creepin'. This green box is another example of one that doesn't betray a big fight - by the time you find it, you're halfway through one.

You can also waste a strider with the alt-fire of the plasma weapon. You won't find enough ammo to take one down with this alone, but weaken it with rockets and finish it off with the alt-fire of the plasma weapon, and the strider will frag. Gross!

 

[ríomhaire]

You can also waste a strider with the alt-fire of the plasma weapon. You won't find enough ammo to take one down with this alone, but weaken it with rockets and finish it off with the alt-fire of the plasma weapon, and the strider will frag. Gross!

And gib!
Also nades(throw, pick up with GG and launch) and SMG nades.

 

[ForsakenOutlaw57]

Why get rid of them, how about just limiting the ammunition to something finite.

 

[oldagerocker]

The best moments of the game for me were those times when Ammo was short, i ran out of ammo in Ravenholm and had to kill endless zombies with a mattress.

The Bridge scene was incredibly tense for me, i think they got that ammo placement right, but in other parts of the game there was too much ammo around, or enough on the ground without the green crates.

 

[RandomX]

I needed the crates because... well, I suck at life... so my bad aim has me wasting tons of ammo. Those crates were a godsend to me, even though I kept ying even with them. They didn't make the battles any easier or harder for me.

 

[Hyperion2010]

They should be made portable! so you can pick them up and move them

*starts coding*

 

[RandomX]

But the portable ones should make you run slower, to make it more realistic... and makes you NOT wanna carry them.

*disables the code*

 

[Hyperion2010]

*makes the code make you run slower*

 

[Que-Ever]

I voted no, because it would have made the game more difficult, but then I think of the hudnreds of people whining about how they didn't know they could steer rockets...

 

[RandomX]

For those people, that's why you have the bottomless ammo boxes. Sometimes it's better to sacrifice difficulty for the sake of fun. Perhaps they should've made it so those crates only appear when you're running the game on "Easy", or, to make it unlimited only at easy, and lowering the amount of ammo at the harder difficulty levels.

 

[DoctorWeeTodd]

the crates are lazy programming
in the hl2 universe, where even food and sex is restricted, you would think the combine would have gone to some lengths to make sure regular citizens dont have guns, and that random ammo crates are locked and kept in secure places.

Notice they only appear at combat zones and military bases. Makes sense for them to be there don't it?

 

[ECUnlimited]

Well, in the purpose of rockets, they had to be there. If you only hit a strider with 2 rockets, missed the 3rd one and did'nt ahve any rockets left, the game would be over. That would'nt be fun, would it?

The ammo crates make sense. The combine would've used them and they would be placed whereever they needed them. Though, maybe they should'nt have been ujnlimited in some cases, other cases, like the one stated above, they need to be unlimited.

 

[noldevin]

I say they should stay, maybe be a little thinner spread, and have some sort of limit. And for god's sake, a padlock to break off with your pistol or crowbar.

 

[Zeus]

They need a limit, and I need a harder difficulty because this game was TOO FREAKING EASY! HL1 was much harder even on the normal setting, although I think Half Life 2 was a bitter better game (though thats quite debatable)