Hacking too simple?

sinkoman

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Am I the only one that finds hacking too simple? Everything is just "mouse one, mouse two, katana button, done". It takes too little skill. I think it should be something like, you really need somebody who is GOOD at hacking on your team for it to work out well. I'm not saying that a team should be hopeless without a dedicated hacker (not THAT difficult) but it's too easy right now to just bark at some newb with the implant "you, go get back the turrets, i'll watch your back".

Currently, a hacking/cyberspace episode plays out like this:

Corps hacker goes into cyberspace
Corps hacker ICE.mines and Passwords the Turrets
Punk hacker goes into cyberspace
Punk hacker wedges through ICE.mine and breaks password
Punk hacker takes turrets

I think eveything in cyberspace should have more of a linux feel to it. Like, to get anything good done, you have to actually script something to do it. Like, to set a password:

The Corps hacker gets to his turrets, and then sets a password on the node. Rather than just pressing mouse 3 or something and boom, password, Corps hacker has to either use a keygen or a password he's thought up, and a usename he's thought up. Either way, he's going to have to memorize/write down the password/username if he plans on reaccessing the turrets at a later time.

Corps hacker ICE.mines his turret node, but instead of just pressing 1 and boom, ICE.mined, he has to right click on the node entrance, bring up a scripting interface, and actually write up his own ICE.mine. There would be a simple code-set that would appear in the top left of his screen, so that noobs can still mine up nodes, but more advanced hackers can write out more complex blocks that are more difficult to break.

Maybe a simple block would look something like this.

while($USER != <insert corps hackers chosen user name here>){
$Access = 0 ;
}

It looks like a very simple scripting language, and it is.

But any hacker could just come up to this and use one of his hacking abilities (in this case, something that runs through numbers and letters quickly) to get into the script server, then right click to open a new scripting screen, and input

$USER = <insert corps hackers user name here> ;

A more skilled hacker could have more defenses coded in though, for example:

$x = 0 ;
$punk = <insert punk hackers chosen user name here> ;
$master = <some random word> ;

while($USER != <insert corps hackers chosen user name here> && $master != <random word>){

$Access = 0
}

It's not THAT much more complicated, but it could slow down a Punk Hacker for the few seconds needed to wipe him out.

Then REALLY advanced hackers/coders could write a really advanced mine, consisting of mulitple clauses, and perhaps objects! That'd really ruin a newbs day!

Of course, simple mines like the first one would be hardcodded into the game so that nubs who don't know much about coding could get by, but you'd always want to have a dedicated hacker on your team this way.

AND! If you tend to use the same mine over and over, the opposing hacker would obviously realise what you are doing, and completely bypass the whole cracking process and just input go straight to his work around.

The letters and number cracks I formentioned would work something like this:

Punk hacker goes upto a passworded node, but rather than the menu next to him saying "Press M1 for bla bla bla" appearing, he has to, on his own will, right click on the screen, open a new scripting window, and type:

run CRK_1010.exe

CRK_1010 would be a numbers crack, which would show him the numbers in the guys username/password. Then he'd have to:

run CRK_ALPHA_BETA_ZULU.exe

CRK_ALPHA_BETA_ZULU.exe would be a letters crack, which would show him all the letters in the guys username/password.

Then he'd have to input the password and username into the boxes (I said that the cracks would just show him the stuffs, not GIVE them too him) and then he'd have access to the turrets.

What do you guys think of my ideas? Too complicated?
 
I think it's too complicated yeah. It could work if you based a whole game around it, but in a Dystopia game I don't think there's time to be messing around with code. Besides, think of how many stupid people play.

I do, however, agree that hacking is too simple in Dys...maybe they should incorporate some kind of minigame for hacking. So that it takes at least some effort....
 
Sulkdodds said:
I think it's too complicated yeah. It could work if you based a whole game around it, but in a Dystopia game I don't think there's time to be messing around with code. Besides, think of how many stupid people play.

I do, however, agree that hacking is too simple in Dys...maybe they should incorporate some kind of minigame for hacking. So that it takes at least some effort....

Well, another idea I had was that pro hackers could prewrite code (this could mean really massive mines, which could cause more issues) and then assign it to CFG's that are loaded ingame. Then, once they get in, they just have to do somthing like:

include (<full path to cfg, C:\Program Files\Valve\...>)

Then they can get big mines in really fast, but having to retype the path starting from C:\ every time could slow them down. As I said though, this could cause issues with newbs running into mounds of code, while having no programming experience whatsoever.

The other issue I see with this is newbs just downloading mines off Dystopia fan sites, and then pwning everybody :eek:
 
Angry Lawyer said:
Stuff like this would make me too good at the game.

-Angry Lawyer

I'd be fairly good too :E

Probably why I like the idea so much!
 
I think it should just be like uplink... put "trace" timers on everything.. call them "lockout" timers or something instead though.. but yeah.. uplink!
 
See Sinkoman, to you and Angry Lawyer that's a relatively simple code language. To a noob like me, simple is the last word that comes to mind. :E
 
OH MAN! If they did implement my idea, think of the DEV team VS DEV team matches!

Really codders duking it out cyberspace! Who can make the most efficient password breaker!

Oh, another brainstorm!

Maybe for each line of code used (or maybe variable implemented, whichever works better ingame) you lose 2 points of energy. That'd really get coders going for the leanest and most efficient scripts possible.
 
Make it a seperate mod. It's a cool idea but only for you scary coder types. :p
 
Sulkdodds said:
Make it a seperate mod. It's a cool idea but only for you scary coder types. :p

hmm, yeah.

Maybe we could get the dev team to release "Dystopia: Haxage M0d".

Pretty much dystopia, accept it's a squad of hackers vs a squad of hackers, with maps designed around effective decking node placement.

Only class available is light, and ultra light. Ultra light carries no guns, only a katana, has only 50 health units, but has 200 energy units, and has stealth (in haxage, light's wouldn't have stealth). Lights only get the machine pistol (to balance the game more towards haxage), have 115 health units, and 100 energy units.

OOH! When you go to a decking node, you don't just stick your face into it, you actually jump into cyber space. Then you and your whole team go into cyberspace, come back out in another node, then pwn!

I'd pay 20 bucks for that.
 
Code:
while(true)
{
	$master=Rnd(6000000);
}

Anybody else see the potential for abuse? Four lines of code, randomises the password on every iteration. Would freeze the server too.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Angry Lawyer said:
Code:
while(true)
{
	$master=Rnd(6000000);
}

Anybody else see the potential for abuse? Four lines of code, randomises the password on every iteration. Would freeze the server too.

-Angry Lawyer

Well, it wouldn't be really coding into the source engine. It would be more like PHP. A proprietary coding engine coded into the source engine itself.
 
Angry Lawyer said:
It'd still be an unhackable lock, though.

-Angry Lawyer

Well see, since it's only a proprietary coding engine, the dev team could formulate ways to circumvent those kinds of things, even if in C++ it couldn't be done.
 
i hope anyone of you know the game: Enter The Matrix.

There was also some kind of hacking feature, that was so cute. It would be nice to see this in Dystopia.
 
I'm still thinking it'd be a bad idea. Maybe if it were a visual way of putting together code, like through shapes you put together. Most people are put off coding because it looks boring. It'd appeal to you, and me, and that's about it.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Angry Lawyer said:
I'm still thinking it'd be a bad idea. Maybe if it were a visual way of putting together code, like through shapes you put together. Most people are put off coding because it looks boring. It'd appeal to you, and me, and that's about it.

-Angry Lawyer

THAT'S A GREAT IDEA!

Somehow, different shapes equal different snippets of code. Then piecing together the shapes gives you quick and easy to create, yet fully customizable firewalls!

Of course, there'd be an extremely large library of shapes to chose from, but by god, that's an excellent idea.

Maybe recreating a shape with smaller shapes built for hacking the mines destroys a shape, and allows you to move onto the next shape. Then you'd be allowed to use maybe 1-4 complicated shapes, and maybe 6 simple shapes, to keep mine hacking fairly quick (keep dystopia fast paced), but not turn it into a "click click DONE" fest.

My god, we have to run this thread by the dev team asap!

I'll email it to the lead coder or the team leader first thing in the morning!

EDIT: I still want them to make that hacking mod though. I'll be sure to put that in the email.
 
and the owner of a rather large ego! :p Though im sure you've earned that right.

I agree that the dystopia hacking is too simple, it would be nice to have some visual firewall building/hacking or something to spice it up a bit.
 
blinking halo said:
and the owner of a rather large ego! :p Though im sure you've earned that right.
Just wait until you get to play Zombie Master.
blinking halo said:
I agree that the dystopia hacking is too simple, it would be nice to have some visual firewall building/hacking or something to spice it up a bit.

I'd love it if it were like those programs that create flowcharts by dragging and dropping shapes. Make it more like a puzzle-subgame, where intelligence, rather than reflexes, prevail.

I'm sure the dev team has something AWESOME planned anyways. The release is only a demonstration - an in-depth hacking system would take ages to tweak properly, so they likely only gave us the bare-bones.

-Angry Lawyer
 
I tell you what Sinkoman, you code it and send it to the developers and I'm sure they might consider implementing it.

I'm very much doubtful whether the Dystopia team want to go around messing with a scripting language. Also If you limited the success of the hack to a few strings that the game checked when you entered them hacking would just become laborious.
 
I have no idea what ANY of you are talking about.
 
I would love the coding idea, by writing it down, i can read, understand, and edit codes, but i cannot create them =(
 
Now you guys make me want to finish reading my C++ Coding book...
I'll be back in a few days.

Yeah, more complex hacking is a need.
 
YES! Dude, I want that! Having shapes with snippets of code... That would work out really well. More shapes, more energy... You could, over time, probobly design a complex trap to stop the other hacker or something. Awsome!
 
I think they should keep hacking the same, but make the structure of cyberpsace more complex and hard to navigate. After all, the whole point of Cyberspace is that it's a physical, spacial representation of data. It's a computer system made flesh. As such, the trials you go through should be less to do with hacking and more to do with navigating the twisted inards of someone else's system. Turrets, obstacles, maybe even stuff you have to shoot.

Besides, if you've ever read Neuromancer, nobody codes. They just steal uber programs from the military and corporations. :p
 
Pretty ignorant idea. So you want to make an elitist game? Make it yourself and watch it fail. Their really isnt much to hacking in the game, but if their was... noone would play it. Coding is cool as a hobby, but when its your job it blows.

I want to play to have fun, not learning to code, even in a most basic representation.
 
Foul said:
Pretty ignorant idea. So you want to make an elitist game? Make it yourself and watch it fail. Their really isnt much to hacking in the game, but if their was... noone would play it. Coding is cool as a hobby, but when its your job it blows.

I want to play to have fun, not learning to code, even in a most basic representation.

Did you read any of the thread.

Read the thread. At least then i'll be able to understand why you're bashing my idea.
 
Then REALLY advanced hackers/coders could write a really advanced mine, consisting of mulitple clauses, and perhaps objects! That'd really ruin a newbs day!

Sounds like what I said.

It really doesnt sound that complicated or even that terrible of an idea, but its all fluff... really unnecessary.
 
Nope, no cigar.

Read the whole thing. All of page two included.
 
I think at present, it's only easy when you're not up against an opposition hacker. Then it gets interesting.
 
that would be rediculously complicated, it's a stupid idea.
 
one thing:

hacking in dystopia (as it is now) isnt as easy as you guys say it is
Ok so maybe in most pub games its very easy, but i could give you loads of examples of pub games and noobs at work
The way its supposed to be played is that there are atleast 1 decker of both teams in cyberspace, fighting each other all the time, with very short time to hack, also lets not forget energy managment. I have played it the proper way and I can tell you its not easy at all, both teams need atleast 1 standby decker.
Also I think there woudnt be any time to write your own code, and if there was (by premade ones) there woudn't be enough time to crack it, since with premades ones you would have all the time to think over it and write it.
But still the concept of making cyberspace a bit more complicated ( or atleast more options, but then again dystopia is already kinda complicated, well not very but still pretty complicated to make) attracts me aswell
 
lets not forget its a pretty fast paced game.
and to get back on the easyness, tbh cyberspace isnt really about hacking, its just another arena where you need to outsmart and outskill your opponent

the game you are talking about exist, hacking competition :p
 
Don't forget that to much complication or overdoing one feature could ruin the game.
 
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