Half life 2 is overrated

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I am not here to troll or cause unrest, but i have to address something that i feel very strongly about,

The original half-life was a game that played every fps element to perfection, still having the most visceral and engaging firefights(only fear and halo have come close ever since), truly the first fps to have a solid and uncliched narrative that didnt just served as an excuse to blast things, dark and gritty graphics that played the essence of a collapsing black mesa to perfection, blockiness and twitchy animations promote that sense too funnily enough.(though not intended on valve's part), and a finale on the alien planet xen, the opinions on which are very mixed, though without this huge jump in difficulty and dramatic change in scenario and mechanics, half-life would have been a far lesser experience, imho. (still feel the satisfaction after beating Nihilanth, and sitting through the epic ending)

Hl2 and its eps are obvious labors of love, and the attention to detail and production values can be seen throughout. Everything is authentic, clean and articulate. Unfortunately this approach of not even thinking of putting a wrong foot down has led to a very stagnant and underwhelming experience. The atmosphere in the game is a bit too hollywoodesque,meaning we see what we expect to see, narrative is extremely predictable, and it plays on political correctness a bit too much(you cant kill friendly npcs, dialogue is cheesy etc.).

Combat is simply a pile of shit, i mean i cannot believe how they can f*** up this bad after having such a strong basepoint of enemy behavior shown in HL, and i'm not just counting the HECU soldiers, but the variety and individual challenges the slew of different xen creatures presented. The absolute satisfaction that was felt after beating each of the finely crafted combat set-pieces is no where to be found in HL2 or its eps, and HL1 was no slouch in the narrative department either, presenting an exciting story through natural progression and welcome breaks from the intense action to get brief and to the point dialogue that filled us in on the situation, whereas HL2 seems to be too eager to show off the "hollywood" standard voice actors, ready to jabber off their scripts every time another underwhelming combat or physics puzzle has been set aside.

To many people see HL2 is seen as the sophisticated choice, and Halo is called out frequently for lacking in narrative, however i believe that halo does what it has set out to do far well than HL2. Halo and FEAR are severely lacking in many departments but deliver on their lynchpin attributes(multiplayer, combat)immeasurably, and that is what in my opinion makes or breaks a game. HL2 does everything right but nothing extraordinaly, some say it has the best narrative but it is spoonfed through generic and predictable characters all around, and what is most painful is that HL2 is clearly relying on the narrative to be its "lynchpin".

HL1 was a solid experience that did not rely on any gimmicks, but solid all-round fps fundamentals to provide an epic experience of the stuggle of survival that far eclipses the derivative and underwhelming experience that i have gotten so far from the HL2 universe.(hoping ep3 doesnt dissapoint)
(phew, got that off my chest)
First post btw, plz be kind.:)
 
Hl2 and its eps are obvious labors of love, and the attention to detail and production values can be seen throughout. Everything is authentic, clean and articulate. Unfortunately this approach of not even thinking of putting a wrong foot down has led to a very stagnant and underwhelming experience. The atmosphere in the game is a bit too hollywoodesque,meaning we see what we expect to see, narrative is extremely predictable, and it plays on political correctness a bit too much(you cant kill friendly npcs, dialogue is cheesy etc.).

what are you talking about???? valves work on all of the half life games is unique and impressive; especially the dialouge. im not really sure what you mean by the "hollywoodesque" but you can explain that later.

you are probably one of those people who just likes the run and gun games and its proven from the 2 games you compared hl2 too. the hl2 series is meant to be enjoyed not destroyed. if you take your time in the game and pay attention the things then you can learn to enjoy the game. halo and fear never did anything like that in any of there games.
 
what are you talking about?
go play your gore-fest games,beause Valve probably won't make super gory,blood infested games
if anything,go play TF2,its a perfect run and gun game
agreed with Giant,the dialogue in the HL series very well made,if you watch mouth movement,it actually looks like they say the words you hear,in Halo,the marine open their mouths as though they were yelling,and you hear words even after they finish speaking
also,other then the fact that friendlies can get in your way,why would you want to kill them?
they're often helpful to the combat,during levels with snipers,the friendly npc's actually help allure sniper fire away from you,in Halo,the friendly NPC's can't even drive,much less shoot
 
What i was trying to get at with using those two games as an example was to show how a game can inherently be of a much lesser quality, but by playing to its strengths extremely well, it can end up providing a more satisfying experience.

The trouble with HL2 is that we all expect it to be absolutely great in everything, and while it does possess a wide variety of qualities that are extremely polished, and easily make it of a higher quality than the other tripe that is out there, somehow it still feels that it is missing the aspect that makes playing FPS fun to begin with and that is , gameplay and immersion. Gameplay while varied with some physics puzzles, is just generic point and click, and while that could be said of the fear,hl1 etc. it is still true that the process is far more engaging in those games because of the enemy difficulty, variety, placement etc. , while every combat set piece in HL2 is extremely easy and dull. Immersion in HL2 is not helped by the fact that for the most part I am being followed by Generic Kickass Chick Who Has Crush On Hero spouting cheerleaderish crap that makes me cringe.

I would not hold it against anyone if they think I just have time for “run n guns” based on my previous post, but just for the record I have played Deus ex, System shock 2, and HL2’s own little brother Portal, and these are games I consider to be far superior to the ones I mentioned earlier.
 
somehow it still feels that it is missing the aspect that makes playing FPS fun to begin with and that is , gameplay and immersion.

Immersion in HL2 is not helped by the fact that for the most part I am being followed by Generic Kickass Chick Who Has Crush On Hero spouting cheerleaderish crap that makes me cringe.

you have got to be kidding me.....you actually just said that.

hl2 has the most immersion than any other game i have ever played. if you truly played them without rushing and missing important dialouge and stuff that happens on the side then you wouldnt be saying that.

this is exactly what i meant in my first post.
 
yes,don't play Valve games for nothing but gameplay,I tried,it was boring
pay attention to dialouge and story helps makes the game more fun,as opposed to Halo,where there was a weak story and the only reason to play was to use the tanks
also,the Generic Kickass Chick Who Has Crush On Hero is Alyx,one of the main characters daughters,if you payed attention to the story,you would know
 
I find Alyx anything but Generic or spouting cheerleader crap.She has a personalty that makes her feel real.
I agree that Fear and Halo do certain things better but that's because they put alot of effort on those features, while Valve put their efforts on something else. Compare Alyx talking to that of a marine from Halo and you see
 
Ok hold on people. Before you grill him out and get this thread locked, take a chill pill for a second. I have to agree with a few pointers he has said. Some of these pointers were blatantly said in one of Yahtzees review of the OB. I agree with the movie-esque experience. A major aspect of HL being such a great game was that you know that you are trapped miles underneath this government facility. All this shit is going on, you got aliens teleporting in front of you, things turning your collegues into zombie things, and even the marines are after you. You don't know what's going on but are trying to stay alive. In HL2 you got Alyx yelling at you saying c'mon Gordon! You got people telling you what to do. The variety and amount of weapons/enemies is pitiful. In 1998 it was all about the crowbar. In 2004 it was all about the gravity gun. In 2007 it's still about the gravity gun and as I said, Yahtzee blatantly said this. I liked combat though and I don't agree with the whole FEAR/Halo thing. Don't even mention Halo on these forums. :LOL: Some points are valid while others are not. Btw, you got balls for making a topic like this and making the thread title like that. Especially the first thread/post is this. ;) *Also I don't like Valve defending the Source engine. It's obvious that Crysis looks miles better than Source. I can only imagine 5 years from now what it will look like.
 
Question if you consider HL2 overrated then what's Halo?
That is by far the most overated game
 
Let me make one thing clear first. I am a Half-life fan and not a Halo fan, and that is the reason it seems that I keep bashing HL2 whereas it is my scrutiny on the franchise which is making it seem so. I do not care about halo, although i recognize it has fantastic combat, and i would have liked combat of this level to be utilised in HL2. I have a pretty good grasp of all the story elements of the game so you can keep the patronizing remarks to yourself. What grates me is people throwing labels like "best game evar!" on a game which is lacking in many areas to be considered as such. Even though I still hope Valve can make Ep3 as epic as possible.
 
Question if you consider HL2 overrated then what's Halo?
That is by far the most overated game

first thing i thought when i was writing my first post but i didnt want to say it or it would kill the thread instantly
 
To be honest, when I replayed Half Life recently, I felt that the enemies like the Marines and Vorts were more tactically challenging. The level design of HL1 seemed to accentuate this opinion of mine, as it allowed Marines to flank, grenade, and rush you more often than in HL2. Even Xen put you in situations where the combination of mind-controllers and vorts put enough pressure to emphasize flanking and hiding tactics on your part. Plus HL1 had some very cool puzzles, like the interaction with laser traps and turrents.

The HL2 ai isn't poor by a long shot, but the level design doesn't really let them survive long enough to let them shine. Minerva really showed this weakness, as Cargo Cult's masterful placement of info nodes and hints transformed the Combine from cannon fodder to veritable storm troopers. Minerva put you in some situations where you were literally overwhelmed and you had to retreat, or get bowled over by a split up assault team. Minerva on hard mode imo is one of the best ai combat experiences in any game.
(That said, I got lost in the levels and some puzzles were unintuitive compared to HL and HL2's puzzles, so Minerva had it's share of weaknesses not related to combat)
 
To back up vanilla's statements, many parts in the HL2 beta were better than the final. I did play (a little) through the gunship plant. The enemies were smarter as well. Enemies probably dumbed down for the whole "cinematic" experience. *Yeah gunships were on these pulleys that held them up. Antlions would fly into the gunship yard below.
 
At the time it was released it was the Best Game Ever when you compare it with the original and all the other games round then. maybe now i wouldn't say its the best game ever but it's still one of the best. All Games lack certain things none are perfect but what Valve set out to do they did it near perfectly and that's the reason it highly rated the positives are more than the cons.
 
I remember thinking that Mafia's on-foot shooting action was incredibly exciting, much more so than playing HL2 or Halo. But I guess the sheer difficulty of the game as well as the unforgiving damage system played more a part than the AI being terribly clever.

PS::
I thought that it was known that the beta versions of Half Life 2 were heavily scripted for promotion purposes. Nothing wrong with that, as long as it is done right, and throughout the gameplay experience. However, in HL2, there were times where you could camp a hallway, and gun down Combine one after another, making combat more of a chore at times. In Minerva, the rooms were setup in such a way that you could be attacked in 2 more more directions, preventing you from leisurely waiting for the enemy in the underground segments.
 
vanillacrazycake has a few good points. Okay, just one. That Half-Life 2's narrative doesn't top the first game. I agree and to be honest, I never thought it would, so I didn't expect it to.

The rest of his post is another matter.

Combat is simply a pile of shit, i mean i cannot believe how they can f*** up this bad after having such a strong basepoint of enemy behavior shown in HL, and i'm not just counting the HECU soldiers, but the variety and individual challenges the slew of different xen creatures presented. The absolute satisfaction that was felt after beating each of the finely crafted combat set-pieces is no where to be found in HL2 or its eps
I truly don't understand how you could possibly feel that way. I wouldn't say Half-Life 2's combat is at the top of it's class, but it is still very good. Of course some parts are better than others. Ravenholm, for example, though atmospheric, produces almost no real tactical challenges, while Nova Prospekt is absolutely brilliant in this regard. (which is why it's my favourite chapter) If you don't feel any satisfaction from playing it, I feel sorry for you, but all I can say is it's you, not the game. I know I don't enjoy anything unless I'm in the right state of mind, maybe you were having a bad... month when you played the game through. :LOL:
 
Nice to see people are coming in who see my point relating to the combat in HL2, and i do agree that the poor showing of the ai in the game is largely due to the placement of the enemies, while the fact that most enemies have far too low HP also figures in. However hunters on hard difficulty have way too much hp against bullets, and fighting them is a chore too, which shows just bumping up damage resistance isn't going to solve the problem either.

The perfect enemy in my opinion are the Alien grunts and the controllers in HL1, against whom you had to constantly manoeuvre yourself while dishing out fire, and the most either could handle was two close-range double-barelled shotty blasts, which is a good enough cap.

PS: regarding MattyDienhoff's comment: while I do agree that the combat was enjoyable, but once you remind yourself of how much more fun you had in a game that was developed 6 years ago, the faults feel much harder to ignore...
 
I'm actually surprised anyone here allowed the poor guy to state his opinion at all.:O Fanboism pisses me off. Especially the jaded type of fanboism. Creds to everyone for being open-minded! Constructive criticism makes a better sequel imo. Good job Vanilla for your "professional" sounding opinions.;) I totally agree with you, except for the story part. I liked HL2's story. Oh, and be careful with your spelling around here. Some a$$holes here like to blow the whistle on bad spelling/grammar.;)
 
I think Ep 2 really hit a sweet spot with the enemy AI. Their tactical decisions are quite evident in the battle after the first advisor encounter, and during the ambush at the white forest in.
 
(only fear and halo have come close ever since)

That's about where you lost all respect and I stopped reading... I thought it was going to be a nice, functional, intelligent criticism about HL2 until I read that..
 
Well honestly my post a little harsh, Halo isn't a bad game, but it gets more credit then deserved (a hell of a lot more), it's a little above an average shooter. That's all. It pisses me off to hear people say that it is 'revolutionary' or 'innovative'. It does nothing new or anything.. Like I said - It's completely average, so why must people keep saying it's the greatest? TBH HL2 is alot better, atleast you can screw around with physics..
 
The only thing Halo did was bring FPS' to the consoles in full force, other FPS' before Halo 1 were not very well done and were heavy on autoaim.... super heavy, moreso than Halo. But it still has a kickass multiplayer.
 
Oh yea, I forgot to mention that! Halo 1 was better then the other 2 for the console shooters (but that's about it), but 2 and 3 were just eh. People only get them because everyone else gets them, and the only reason everyone else gets them is because everyone bought Halo 1 for the reason stated, so just because the first Halo did that one thing, and sold well, every thinks the others are good too, just because the first one sold well, and everyone bought that.... There should be a name for this kind of effect.

I shall call it - Dog--gy style effect. Yes that works out quite well.. Indeed.. Anyone want to pat me on the back? Shake my hand? Kiss their babies? Shake their willy?
 
Well, tbh I dont think that I started the misquotation and destruction of intent began somewhere else, and ruined the sanctity of my perfect little rant thread:frown:, so i thought a little bit of smartarsedness from my side would have quelled the damage, but anyways it was all in good fun so please forgive me if you think i was in the wrong.:cheese::angel:
 
:p
I like you more than other noobs.
And rant threads should always have supporters and haters. That's what makes it a rant.
 
The original half-life was a game that played every fps element to perfection, still having the most visceral and engaging firefights(only fear and halo have come close ever since)
(only fear and halo have come close ever since)
and halo have come close

Guess where I stopped reading?

Not to be an asshole, but I think you're putting HL on a pedestal based on your impressions of it at the time and degrading HL2 because it doesn't live up to how much fun you had playing HL years and years ago. Your criticism... well, it's weird. Go play HL again.

Also, you're completely insane to be comparing Halo to Half-Life 2.
 
I will tell you where you stopped you li- [eyes suddenly snap to the title Super Moderator]
Oh.. that.. um ..yeah!! I got the joke!! Great!!

Everybody has their own opinion. Cant think of much else to say considering I have already stated all I think about this topic previously.:thumbs:
 
Well, you're wrong. Harrumph. I have not the slightest problem with playing the part of the dickhead brickwall HL fanboy here.

Although I am not going to ban you for disagreeing, especially because you're not a moron (which is really a lot more than I can say about 99.9% of the internet and 95% of this site). I do find it a bit odd that you registered just to post a thread about how you think the game is overrated though :p
 
For threads with obvious noobs, I usually just go No. and leave. :p My interest is in this topic. If anything, compare HL2 to COD4 or STALKER. Anything but Halo. You're better off comparing it to Company of Heroes.
 
truly the first fps to have a solid and uncliched narrative that didnt just served as an excuse to blast things, dark and gritty graphics that played the essence of a collapsing black mesa to perfection
Sorry to point this out, but HL's narrative was both cliched and was an excuse to blast things.
The only reason it was hailed as revolutionary was because -
A) A coherent story was actually there
B) The narrative progressed in a natural manner

though without this huge jump in difficulty and dramatic change in scenario and mechanics, half-life would have been a far lesser experience, imho.
That's the problem right there. You took your own impressions and stated them as fact.
You turned "HL is better than HL2 IMO" into "HL2 is overrated".

Unfortunately this approach of not even thinking of putting a wrong foot down has led to a very stagnant and underwhelming experience.
Hardly, HL2 rewards players FAR more for exploring beyond what is required to finish the game. It improves on the puzzles that were in HL and the combat is more varied, frantic and free flowing.

meaning we see what we expect to see, narrative is extremely predictable, and it plays on political correctness (What the f*ck?) a bit too much(you cant kill friendly npcs, dialogue is cheesy etc.).
If you think HL2's dialogue is cheesy compared to HL, all I can say is :|

Combat is simply a pile of shit, i mean i cannot believe how they can f*** up this bad after having such a strong basepoint of enemy behavior shown in HL, and i'm not just counting the HECU soldiers, but the variety and individual challenges the slew of different xen creatures presented.
They removed enemies that were redundant or irrelevant to the new story arc, and added more interesting ones (antlions, antlion guards, fast zombies, hunters, striders). I concede that HL's smaller levels gave the marines a better chance to surprise you (and they were hard to kill).
But really, is there anything in the first game that challenges you as much as a pack of hunters? Is there any weapon that gives you as many tactical options as the Grav Gun? No and no.

AND they reduced the dependence on quicksave/quickload. How is that not a good thing?

whereas HL2 seems to be too eager to show off the "hollywood" standard voice actors, ready to jabber off their scripts every time another underwhelming combat or physics puzzle has been set aside.
HL was a quirky 'game' in every sense of the word, while HL2 aspires to be closer to real life (real life conversations aren't monologues that "fill us in").

Halo and FEAR are severely lacking in many departments but deliver on their lynchpin attributes(multiplayer, combat)immeasurably, and that is what in my opinion makes or breaks a game.
It's hard to fail when you set the bar that low. Making a tribes-style multiplayer + mediocre singleplayer game, or a corridoor shooter (literally) hardly involves any design challenges at all.
(And yet Halo 2 failed)

HL1 was a solid experience that did not rely on any gimmicks, but solid all-round fps fundamentals to provide an epic experience of the stuggle of survival that far eclipses the derivative and underwhelming experience that i have gotten so far from the HL2 universe.
HL is a brilliant, innovative game when you put in a historical context, but today it wouldn't be a patch on Stalker, FEAR, Halo 3, HL2, COD 4 or Bioshock - story or gameplay wise.

The lessons from Half-Life have been learnt and it's time to move on.

First post btw, plz be kind.:)
:cheers:
 
I know you are just trying to have a friendly argument about why you dont like the game, but really, this is just the wrong place to have it, its more pointless than the religious threads downstairs. Dont mean to sound harsh, but there is no point crying to us about how you disagree with this or dont like that, we are here because we enjoy the game, if the game doesn't hit your spot, then dont ****ing play.

Its that simple.
 
It isn't quite that simple. You can like some aspects of the game, yet be disappointed with others. That's when you come here and complain and get a slapping for it because some people here can't stand dissent. :p

It's quite outstanding how hostile many are here. I feel passionate about a lot of things, but I've never found that it somehow inhibits my ability to understand someone criticizing them. Nothing is perfect...

On the topic though, I think I enjoyed HL2 the most in the beginning, when I was completely lost. You wake up in a train and don't know where you are, then you can just keep running around until the part where they storm the umm building :p and you have to run your ass off to the roof. That was so nice because I felt so deserted and alone and scared.

Episode 1 I disliked because of ALyx, she's too much to bear when she's around almost all the time, and she helps too much! I'm a passive person, and if someone can obviously take care of the enemy on my behalf, I'll let them... but if I'm alone, it's all the more immersive because you can only rely on yourself to stay alive. Plus, I hate being told what to do. I'm a leader, dammit.:p "Throw the switch, Gordon." "C'mon Gordon, what're you waiting for?" "Nice shot!" oh PUHLEEZ I know it was a nice shot.. what an asskisser huh?? :p

Episode 2 is much better in that regard, thankfully. But I feel like it's too easy - so far I haven't had to replay even those scenes with hunters! I'm only playing on normal difficulty, though...
 
I know you are just trying to have a friendly argument about why you dont like the game, but really, this is just the wrong place to have it, its more pointless than the religious threads downstairs. Dont mean to sound harsh, but there is no point crying to us about how you disagree with this or dont like that, we are here because we enjoy the game, if the game doesn't hit your spot, then dont ****ing play.

Its that simple.
So does enjoying/liking something mean you should turn a blind eye to any faults or weaknesses you think it has? I think that's just silly and a bit sad. I would think a place like this would more appropriate to have this discussion than some random forum with no link to the game. There is always the option of not participating in a thread you feel doesn't belong here.

It might be one thing if the poster said something along the lines of HL2 completely sucks and everyone here is an idiot for liking it. I don't feel he did that, I think he made an honest post hoping for some honest responses.

vanilla-

I wouldn't say Alyx is a stereotypical female. She has an opinion and knowledge, she also has no cleavage showing. But I can see what you're saying, in recent years, at least on television (and some movies) there's been a sudden trend to have a story based around a heroine. I would say as far as video games go, which is what HL2 is, Alyx is quite the departure from the typical female character.

Some of the dialogue came off as a bit cheesy and I think it was an interview/article that talked about ep2 how they didn't want to have Alyx criticizing the player (while driving the car, etc). Which I don't agree with, I thought HL2 did have a mature rating after all. I would think most people would be able to handle a little criticism if/when they mess up.

I also agree with you about the AI, I've never thought it was as good as some people make it out to be. I thought the zombie soldiers in Doom 3 showed more combat tactics than anything I've see from Combine soldiers.
 
Both of you have completely missed my point.

Its not about being able to play it, enjoy the good, ignore the bad bits, its about the fact that there is no point bringing your dislikes of the game to this forum, what can we possibly do about your queries except defend the game we like, all you are doing is insighting arguments. If you have problems with the game then email Valve with it, they make it after it all, not us.

If you can play the game and enjoy it, then great, but if you have any dislikes, keep them to yourself. Put it this way, I played Halo 3 for about half an hour and turned it off, believing it to be the most overated game in the history of mankind, do I go on an Halo forum, make a topic called 'Halo 3 is overated' and start mouthing off my dislikes of the game? No, because the regulars will come in, downtrod my argument, gang up on me, and slate me out of the forums. Because those forums are not for slating the game, but for people who enjoy it, and want to talk about all aspects of that game in a good light.

People have and do state some of their dislikes of aspects of the game, mainly in previous major discussion of the episodes etc, however they are usually only small queries, but making an entire topic about it, then im afraid if you are looking for a friendly argument, then you wont get one.
 
it's a way of finding out if you're alone with your disappointment. it's nice to know it's not just your personal inability to enjoy the game, it might actually be a fault in the game. I suppose.

I really don't see what's so bad about voicing your disappointments in a forum full of fans.
 
Thanks a lot to Hullu and function9 for their comments :thumbs:, and yes, i do agree that HL2's opening was downright incredible indeed, but from that point on it began to trudge on a bit without any clear objective in sight, and became a typical shooter experience, not helped by the poor showing of the ai and gameplay.

I do admit that my past consensus on Alyx may have come across as a bit too critical, but i cant shake off the feeling that Valve have shoehorned an unnecessary love interest/romance element to enhance the "cinematic" experience for a new generation of gamers, and while I don't think that there is anything inherently wrong with seeking to do that, but it seems that and to have not been able to make the game as fun as it could have been. For example as Hullu said that Alyx helps during the combat a bit too much, and what could have been an epic "holy shit, I have to get out of here alive" feeling you got from the ambushes in EP2, because you are alone, fighting for your own survival, degenerates far too much in the presence of a sidekick.

To be fair to HL2 , it has progressed the original plot in a very good manner. They couldn't possibly have played the same "shit hits the fan/gotta save my ass" card that the original played, and has enhanced the scope of the plot quite well. However there are a lot of unanswered questions that have been left because of this increase in scope, and a full game and two eps in there is still a lot left to be covered in EP3 alone, and the news that there are going to be future HLs is both exciting and worrying, as it means that they will reveal too little in EP3, and leave most of it for future instalments. (hopefully not)
 
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