Havok physics engine application

[ComradeBadger]

Right, is it possible to apply the Havok physics to say, the leg or arm of a character, basically like Valve have said they applied to the crowbar, thereby creating an unarmed combat simulation. Thanks for your time

 

[Onions]

more than likely

 

[Sirius]

Doesn't the Havok engine take care of the ragdoll effect on player models? I believe so, if that's the case then I don't see why you couldn't do what you're asking.

 

[ComradeBadger]

Thanks for your help

But, as far as we know, the crowbar is physicised, and I would be classing the legs and arms as weapons, and I would like it to be possible to block and counter attack, thats why

 

[dawdler]

They have said that the player is physically modelled and that the crowbar is also physically model.

physics + physics = alot of bruises

 

[Sirius]

If the crowbar has physics applied to it, then why does it play the same animation everytime Gordon swings it? And why does it not react to hitting wood or another solid surface? Before you get started, I realize that the demos shown may not have everything in the game, or even finished, but it's still something to consider.

 

[dscowboy]

Originally posted by Sirius
If the crowbar has physics applied to it, then why does it play the same animation everytime Gordon swings it? And why does it not react to hitting wood or another solid surface?

This is what I've argued a number of times on these forums already (and I'm sure everyone here is sick of hearing my argument ). In order to animate the crowbar swing and have the path of the crowbar be influenced by the environment, you would have to animate the FORCES acting upon the crowbar via the arm. Generally when you animate a character, you animate the specific points in space that the model would appear at during the animation. Animating via points-in-space precludes the ability for the animation to be modified by the environment.

The chances of the crowbar swing animation being modifed dynamically by what it hits is extremely low. The best I expect to see is maybe the crowbar animation is reversed if the crowbar strikes a wall or an otherwise immobile object.

 

[82ross]

Like you could hit a wall it bounce back and hit you in the face?

 

[chapel]

Well, Gabe said himself that it will be physically modelled and have physics applied to it properly.

Its not that hard to make it work, because theres something called "animation blending" which in application allows multiple animations to be blended together based on certain actions or how its programmed. So in effect, they could have animations based on hitting certain items and where hitting them, as to what animation is triggered and then then it would blend with the main animation to make it physically modelled.

Anyways.

 

[Zore]

I don't like this notion of pre-animated models (even though it's all we can optimally do right now)... We've got to get away from this "quite static" trick when 64-bit computing goes mainstream. Say bye-bye to the motion-capture actors... or the character animators... adios!

 

[Vulcan3d]

Hmmm, If I read Gabe's statements right, the crowbar participates in the physics engine. In other words, the forces exerted by it would affect other physics objects. So if you simply modeled your hand as a view model and replaced the crowbar view model, it would apply the same forces as a crowbar. don't know about blocking... maybe you could have a routine where if A is exerting force and B is in a block state, the force is set equal to 0. Otherwise you should be able to knock people around, and every object that has physics applied to it...

 

[Plopfish]

Zore, if you havent seen this shit yet, Endorphin:

http://www.naturalmotion.com/pages/products.htm

you might like to read bout it, (also on Discover (mag) Aug 03, p-24-25)

its mostly about genetic algorithms that can create the animation (including stimuli from obstacles) for a charchter to walk from one place to another and impact damge animations, etc, thus, goodbye poor artists....(of course you still need animators now, and even with this stuff, but you better watch out of some program will take your job!)

 

[Zer]

Uhm yeah it will probably be so

 

[Cunbelin]

I'm actually fairly impressed with that thing, but it is no more a substitute for animators than motion capture, the collision stuff was excellent, and it certainly beats ragdoll, but it lacks the punch you get with good animation. The concussive blasts were meh at best, all their air work was atrocious they looked like they were working underwater (I mean tripping and being thrown through the air not the flying junk).

It's like this to my thinking, first off you are never going to have full human articulation in a model, even if you ever do the behavior algorithms for it would have to be amazingly complex to pull off an indvidual character. You can simplify things but you are still simulating, art isn't about simulating the world, it is about giving an impression of it, even film the closest thing out to reality is extremely stylized, and is better for it.

Anyway I think we will end up with a Hybrid system of Non-Linear Animation with the ability to alter it based upon certain pieces of information.