Hl3 on Source engine?

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adio2001

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I was just thinking about something. You know how Valve originally planned for Hl2 to be on the regular Hl1 engine, but then decided to build their own? Do you think that they will do the same for Hl3? Or just go ahead and use Source for it? If they do make another engine for Hl3 how much better do you think it will be? And will we have to wait another 5 years for Hl3? Would it be worth the wait if the increase was the same that Source has over hl1's quake based engine? Thoughts?
 
I think Source can do way more then what they show. Im sure if they tweak it and stuff it would look much sicker. Due to system specs they have to hold back intill people have faster hardware.
 
I get the feeling that Source is an ongoing project: in fact it's ongoing right now even past the point of what will ship with HL2 (there was a tech split last Sept.) Though who knows: maybe they'll scrap it and write a whole new engine too.
 
they will either use a whole new engine ...or modify the source engine so much, that it will be closer to a new engine anyway.....
 
If HL3 comes out within 3 years, I think they will just tune Source as much as they possibly can. Most likely, it will be the same way like Quake 3: The original is good at the time, degrades as time goes by, but then comes a modified engine that does all you want it to :)

If its longer though, like 5 years until HL3, they might create a new engine...

But then again, considering we will have the NV50 and R500 by then, along with 6-7 ghz computers, one can take the old engine, tune it for modern hardware, and up the polycounts and details to the extreme, just like HL mods do today, and what basicly every game developer has done that uses an older engine.
 
I think it's a bit too early to start thinking about HL3 :)
HL2 hasn't even been released yet ^_^
 
I'd be very interested to see what games, besides Vampire Bloodlines, license Source and what they do with it...
 
Originally posted by tewmten
I think it's a bit too early to start thinking about HL3 :)
HL2 hasn't even been released yet ^_^
Click to expand...

agreed.

Originally posted by dawdler
But then again, considering we will have the NV50 and R500 by then, along with 6-7 ghz computers, one can take the old engine, tune it for modern hardware, and up the polycounts and details to the extreme, just like HL mods do today, and what basicly every game developer has done that uses an older engine.
Click to expand...

Now thats just plain scary.
 
I wonder how long it will take before VR gets a decent breakthrough. I wanna be IN half-life 3.

shares in Valve, oh yeah
 
You guys also forget there will be new 64-bit technology more widespread. I mean look at the new AMD Opteron 64bit processors.. I think things might exceed 6-7ghz.
I mean just a few short years ago 1ghz was the SHIT!
 
Source is Valve's magnum opus, I'll bet they'll use it for Half-Life 3, albeit in a much more modified and improved form.
 
I read in i think a magazine scan at the start of all this that source is planned for use with HL3. Only the "finished version".
Development on the core engine ceased last september and they left some stuff out that they couldent fit in due to time constrants. However i would guess that they would be included for hl3. :)

thats my input for today.

i have to go now so good day/night to you.
 
I sent Gabe an e-mail yesterday asking about 10 topics... one of which was if he thinks Source will be forward-compatible enough to build a game for 2006 or 2007... "for the purpose of this discussion let's call it 'Half-Life 3'."

I sent it late a night so I haven't gotten a response yet...
 
According to Valve, the Source engine is "on-going". So basically, they're gunna be like Unreal tech engine.
 
Originally posted by dawdler
But then again, considering we will have the NV50 and R500 by then, along with 6-7 ghz computers
Click to expand...

Processor speeds double every 18 months, computers will be alot faster in 5 years.
 
In respect to the power of pc's in 3 or 4 years time the maximum processing speed available on the market doubles every 18 months. It has done for the last 35 years and it will do for a few more at which point the techiniques used to create processors will not be physically capable of producing smaller components.

It's called Moore's Law and has been holding true since it was declared years back in 65.

With the advent of things like steam and other content delivery techniques that will no doubt appear in the next 5 years I'm sure software on machines will actually be updated from old rather than replaced sooner rather than later. Or alternatively when Internet2 comes round there will probably just be one copy of the game and we'll all log in to play it.

Shortly after that monkeys will take over the world and we'll all live in a zoo.
 
Originally posted by frog
Processor speeds double every 18 months, computers will be alot faster in 5 years.
Click to expand...
What I meant was that NV50 and R500 will be common . And people will actually have that kind of speed in relativly mediocre computers. One up the lower demand of the game, the upper limit just come as a sideeffect :)
(for example the budget computers then can play what a 9800Pro overclocked to the max on a 3.2ghzer can do now, if not faster. Meaning you could see Source pushing 10x the polycounts and details on the top of the line)
 
I think you'll just see dual 64-bit processor computers rather then going to higher speeds.
 
Originally posted by adio2001
I was just thinking about something. You know how Valve originally planned for Hl2 to be on the regular Hl1 engine, but then decided to build their own? Do you think that they will do the same for Hl3? Or just go ahead and use Source for it? If they do make another engine for Hl3 how much better do you think it will be? And will we have to wait another 5 years for Hl3? Would it be worth the wait if the increase was the same that Source has over hl1's quake based engine? Thoughts?
Click to expand...

You're thinking of TF2. TF2 was supposed to use a modified HL1 engine. They were planning on making a new engine for HL2 the whole time.

Gabe said in a magazine article that they stopped work on Source a year ago and saved everything else they wanted to do for HL3 or whatever. So it's possible they will make a new engine (Source II) or they will highly upgrade Source for HL3. I think they will make a new one, and here's why:

They have time to. It is in their best intrest to take 5 years and make a new engine. If they use the same one, they will have to rush to make HL3, because if they take too long, the engine will be out of date. Secondly, they want to build up the community. A fast HL3 release will destroy the HL2 community and move everyone to HL3. If they spend 5 years to make a new engine that will be the best of the best 5 years from now, the HL2 community can grow to bigger proportions than HL1 ever was, so they can keep making money, have a huge playerbase, and be able to take their time to make Source II and HL3 the best engine/game ever made. I certainly would not mind playing HL2 and HL2 mods for the next 5 years if it is as good or better than the HL1 community.

And that's what I think Valve is going to do. Take it easy, let HL2 grow, and begin working on a game that will eclipse HL2 in every way. And to start that, they will begin building the best engine to date, Source II. Now with a fairly good amount of experience under their belts in engine design, I'm sure it will be even better. I'm also sure they will use some code from Source, but it will be mostly new code, enough to consider it a whole new engine.
 
I pity the modelers who have to build those ultra realistic characters. They must be like "Oh God No! My poor hands! Damn you Moore's Law!!!"
 
Most modelers build their models high poly anyway, then reduce them to fit the games constraints. So it might even get easier for them. :)

Also with increased cpu power, you get better tools to make things with.
 
Re: Re: Hl3 on Source engine?

Originally posted by Slash
It is in their best intrest to take 5 years and make a new engine. If they use the same one, they will have to rush to make HL3, because if they take too long, the engine will be out of date.
Click to expand...

I was about to agree with you then I was wondering... The current engine took 5 years to make and never went out of date, even within the last year which has been strictly "no-more-features" as Gabe said.

So if they take Source and just upgrade and add to it for another couple of years then it probably still won't go out of date. For example, if PCs are fast enough by then they could add full dynamic lighting (ala D3) etc.

I guess then they could build HL3 alot quicker, instead of re-inventing the wheel as it were. I suspect there is a lot of basic stuff in Source that would be similar for any game.

Anyway, its all just speculation.
 
hl3 will take at least 6 years to develope.
 
Originally posted by MoJo|Night
Or alternatively when Internet2 comes round there will probably just be one copy of the game and we'll all log in to play it.
Click to expand...
Is internet2 a hypothetical thing or...? What would be the difference? And am I making a fool out of myself by acting like a gullible moron?
 
Hmmm, according to Moores Law, in 2060 computer's processors will be about 880 gigahertz. Thats right, gigahertz. Pretty damn fast.
 
Originally posted by schweppes
Hmmm, according to Moores Law, in 2060 computer's processors will be about 880 gigahertz. Thats right, gigahertz. Pretty damn fast.
Click to expand...

Not !

Here how it goes :

2003 & 6 months = 3 Ghz
2005 = 6 Ghz
2006 & 6 months = 12 Ghz
2008 months = 24 Ghz
2009 & 6 months = 48 Ghz
2011 = 96 Ghz
2012 & 6 months = 192 Ghz
2014 = 384 Ghz
2015 & 6 months = 768 Ghz
2017 = 1536 Ghz > OMG!!

So when HL 3 comes out in about 6 years.. we have like 48 Ghz PCs ! lol
 
Does anyone know a game sequel that uses the same engine as the previous game? I know Star Trek EF II, but the first one wasn't purely based on the Quake III engine.
 
Originally posted by El_Chi
Is internet2 a hypothetical thing or...? What would be the difference? And am I making a fool out of myself by acting like a gullible moron?
Click to expand...

lmao internet two..... I think thats broadband
 
Originally posted by El_Chi
Is internet2 a hypothetical thing or...? What would be the difference? And am I making a fool out of myself by acting like a gullible moron?
Click to expand...

I believe it has to do with having 64-bit IP addresses implemented everywhere therefore expanding the internet.
 
from my cisco classes, I remember the teacher saying that our 32 bit IP addresses limit the amount of computers on the internet. Therefore a 64 bit will increase the amount of computers added. Also MAC addresses on Network cards will be upgraded as well.
 
Originally posted by DelaZ
Not !

Here how it goes :

2003 & 6 months = 3 Ghz
2005 = 6 Ghz
2006 & 6 months = 12 Ghz
2008 months = 24 Ghz
2009 & 6 months = 48 Ghz
2011 = 96 Ghz
2012 & 6 months = 192 Ghz
2014 = 384 Ghz
2015 & 6 months = 768 Ghz
2017 = 1536 Ghz > OMG!!

So when HL 3 comes out in about 6 years.. we have like 48 Ghz PCs ! lol
Click to expand...

Delaz if you're trying to rip off moore's law, which then was redefined by intel. Then it's about the number of transistors, and not clock frequency.

Well i dont think they'll rebuild it from scratch, unless it had a technical limitation over the current source.

I just think they'll keep developing for it.
 
Originally posted by antimatter
I believe it has to do with having 64-bit IP addresses implemented everywhere therefore expanding the internet.
Click to expand...
You sir, are correct
 
128bit is the next target not 64.

And it's not the internet, but the adresses that connect you, that changes.
 
http://marshallbrain.com/robotic-nation.htm

computer-trends.gif
 
I was watching a show on techtv once and they were talking about this new technology in building microprocessors. Using electron microscopes, the guy said that they will be able to build processors with 4 trillion switches whereas todays Intel P4's have around 44 million. Don't quote me on the numbers, this was a while ago but you get the idea.
 
Yeah so back on topic... I just skipped page 2 meh...

Valve have so much more flexibility this time around. It's their own engine, they built it from the ground up. Before they were stuck in the constraints of a 3rd party engine.

I have a feeling Source will be with us for sometime. We're already going to get a lot of use out of it - Half-Life 2 and its expansions, CS2, TF2... and there'll be a lot more.

People had better start seeing the good side of Steam too, they'll be needing it.
 
Damn our brains are fast! A quadrillion operations a second, whew. Anyways, yeah I don't see any reason for Valve not to use source for Hl3. Unless engines in 3 years highly surpass what it's capable of. I would like to see them build a new engine and see what they come up with though. They have done a great job, from what i've seen, with source. Maybe they can do an even better job on another engine. In time we shall see, I can only imagine the possibilities.

-edit spelling errors.
 
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