IE8 Beta 2 Now Available

Of course people still use IE. People still use DOS.

It's probably all for the novelty value.
 
Omega's comment was obviously a joke, gentlemen, way to miss it completely. I agree though, didn't know that piece of shit was still functional.
 
I got this earlier today and I get a lot of runtime errors on some sites and while I know its a beta and all, but is there anyway to disable it asking me if I want to debug? I usually just click no and everything seems to load up fine anyway but I'd rather not have that box come up.
 
I have to occasionally use IE for websites that just don't work right in Firefox. No need to get some beta though, I'll just stick to 7 for now :)
 
The only time I use IE is when I use the IETab extension for FireFox on certain sites.

But so far, it seems like this version is doing rather well.
 
Dumb Dude said:
I got this earlier today and I get a lot of runtime errors on some sites and while I know its a beta and all, but is there anyway to disable it asking me if I want to debug? I usually just click no and everything seems to load up fine anyway but I'd rather not have that box come up.
Click to expand...

Report the sites if you can.
 
I use IE6 because it doesn't consume a lot of memory.

Does this new beta consume a lot of memory like all the other new browsers everyone just loves so much? Firefox, IE7?

I used Firefox a couple days ago to go on a site I go on all the time with IE6, and I was attacked by popups and even a virus. I never had any of that when visiting with IE6.

Might be just a fluke, but I see nothing worth my time in any new browser, especially if it's going to cost me more memory usage.
 
Oh man. I remember that hilarious episode of the Simpsons. :D
 
Nobody is going to expect that IE8 is going to be a new perfect renderer the first time around.

I've said it before, but the transition with IE8 going into default standards mode is going to be painful. Everyone is going to be bitching about how much MS sucks and can't create a good browser, blah blah blah...

So, the point that MS should have devoted every single engineer to the rendering engine is a horrible argument. He should probably read Mythical Man Month because it talks about people trying solutions at that. If you have a problem, and let's say it will take one person a month to do it, adding a second person does not necessarily mean it will now only take two weeks (and etc etc)... Thus, if MS would put all of its engineers on the rendering engine, not only would it not necessarily be better, but it could potentially take longer since everyone's fingers would be touching the code and changing stuff every day. That means each morning you need to figure out what stuff has changed so you know if anything someone wrote broke some of your code.

Thus, MS should put engineers creating "fluff" (if that's even the right word). Would anyone really want to upgrade to IE8 if the only difference was a rendering engine, that would break a lot of websites? I don't think I would. Thus, adding those features is definitely needed to help encourage users to upgrade to a standards compliant browser.

So yes, the point is that it is in fact still a beta is a very strong argument, especially when it comes to web browsers. The author seemed to dismiss that argument right away, but look at the changes from beta 1 to beta 2, and then think of similar changes that could occur from beta 2 to RTM.

Personally, I'm moving to IE8 when it is released. I'm still using a beta, but IE8 is taking great strides forward and has some great enhancements over FireFox.

All I can say is that I'm glad to see that competition from Firefox is finally spurring a lot more active development from the IE team!

*Edit* Vegeta: IE6?! Dude, that's ridiculous. Time to upgrade your browser. :) That thing has memory leaks galore. Use the same instance for a few hours and it will start to eat up a lot of RAM. FF3 has decent memory usage (usually around 120MB or so) and IE8 is only a little bit more than that (and will continue to decrease until RTM, though I doubt it will get to FF3's usage)

Oh, and when looking at memory usage of browsers, be sure to look at their private working set, which task manager doesn't display by default.
 
WTB [Browser that works with PDF files with out freezing or crashing]

Seriously, FF3 & IE7 are already decent browser, but they suck ass with PDF files. Either PDF needs to be eliminated as a standard file type, or we need a solution to view PDF files in a browser without killing my internet experience.

A solid IE8 release seems like it can finally hold back the advancement of Firefox.

[Edit]: For work, I still use IE6, Office 2003, etc because it is mandated. Supposedly, the place I work at is still a year or two away from updated to IE7. It sucks using old software.
 
Loading up PDF files isn't IE's or FF's job. They simply open Adobe Reader to view them, and it's Adobe that takes forever to load and read them. I agree PDF's suck pretty hard, but with the latest versions of the reader, they've been paying much more attention to performance.
 
I use the add on 'PDF Download' v2.0 in FF3. Works great compared to without it. Or at least how it was in FF2.
Iced_Eagle said:
Nobody is going to expect that IE8 is going to be a new perfect renderer the first time around.

So, the point that MS should have devoted every single engineer to the rendering engine is a horrible argument.
Click to expand...
IMO that just looks like an excuse. I'm not in MS's shoes. I don't know behind the scenes at their offices. But the other browsers have a solid render engine that is pretty close to standard. Why can't MS get one out? They are the market leader with room to spare. They can take the tiem and a hit on market share for a release or two to that doesn't have fancy new features to perfect their engine and then hit a home run. And I don't think breaking web pages coded for old IE would be that bad since everyone would want to still support the new IE as their #1 priority. Websites would adapt...right?
Besides, can't a website tell what browser you are using.

And they have already made some big changes with Vista over XP. Why not just change across the board.
 
Nobody has renderers that are close to being completely standard, and there will never be one, and there will never be a 100% true standards compliant website (not a website meant to show standards and only that, but I meant like a real website like CNN.com or something that is in the top 100 websites)

I'll just answer some of those questions in order.

Yes, breaking all websites is horrible. MS has created enough of a mess by their previous IE's by making them non-standard and they need to ween them off of it and back onto the standard path. IE8 engine is a HUGE step forward and is well onto the rendering path. In one fatal swoop, MS has created a rendering engine that is so far from where they originally were. It was such a huge rewrite for them. Not only did they create an engine which is fairly standards compliant (not yet as good as FFox, Opera or Webkit) but they also increased a lot of performance of stuff behind the scenes also.

Yes, websites would adapt. And yes, that is exactly what a LOT of websites have to do now as well.

Yes, a website can tell which browser you're using, but the point of standards is that you code one website that works everywhere. It's not very good to have checks and do things different for different browsers, though it's an unfortunate reality.

Why not change IE8 like they changed to Vista you say? Erm, have you seen the response Vista has gotten for being such a big change? I don't think people would appreciate it.

And finally, MS can't really delay the release of IE8 and then just spend more time to rethink a bunch of core architectural changes which were probably done a year ago or more. They need to get the browser done in November since IE8 is going to be the default browser in Windows 7, and it needs to get into the beta builds that go out to IHV's and ISV's to make sure everything they do still works with IE8 + Win7.

That, and the fact that since IE is free, there is always another version. There's no denying that IE8 is still going to change a lot and start pushing everyone towards standards compliance now that people can see how broken the web is (unfortunately also partly due to IE). MS is going to take what it learns and put everyting into IE9, which I promise will be even more standards compliant. :)
 
Vegeta897 said:
I use IE6 because it doesn't consume a lot of memory.

Does this new beta consume a lot of memory like all the other new browsers everyone just loves so much? Firefox, IE7?

I used Firefox a couple days ago to go on a site I go on all the time with IE6, and I was attacked by popups and even a virus. I never had any of that when visiting with IE6.

Might be just a fluke, but I see nothing worth my time in any new browser, especially if it's going to cost me more memory usage.
Click to expand...

Unused memory is wasted memory. Simple as that. If a web browser brings your machine to it's knees you have bigger problems than a few $20 sticks of ram
 
Kyorisu said:
Unused memory is wasted memory. Simple as that. If a web browser brings your machine to it's knees you have bigger problems than a few $20 sticks of ram
Click to expand...
Maybe I want an internet browser open while I'm playing a game? Maybe I'm a mapper who always has the game open for testing my maps while I work, and have an internet browser or two open for reference on something.
 
Vegeta897 said:
Maybe I want an internet browser open while I'm playing a game? Maybe I'm a mapper who always has the game open for testing my maps while I work, and have an internet browser or two open for reference on something.
Click to expand...

Yet while you have that web browser open, it starts leaking the crap out of memory until after not too long, it's taking up more than IE8 or FF3...

Seriously, there's a beautiful thing called virtual memory. You don't have to worry about any of that.
 
Vegeta897 said:
Maybe I want an internet browser open while I'm playing a game? Maybe I'm a mapper who always has the game open for testing my maps while I work, and have an internet browser or two open for reference on something.
Click to expand...

Uh maybe you should read my post again. If a single web browser can bring your machine to it's knees (whilst other shit is running) you have problems, big problems. Ram is not an issue because it is so dirt cheap. In the end your reply could actually be shortened to "My machine sucks." and that would have been fine. I can do everything you just mentioned at the same time whilst running SMP + GPU folding clients for example.
 
The game is going to eat up all the remaining ram. Any less ram available to it due to my internet browser taking up more is not something I want.

I hate tabs.
 
Mostly I'm just sick of people looking at IE in disgust. Seriously, what makes it so bad? For a person that doesn't need or care about all your super cool features, why should I be considered stupid for not 'upgrading'?
 
If you don't want tabs, don't use them. I'm not sure why you hate them (maybe you just hate change) since everything is now accessed in one window, and you still always have the option of having different windows.

Oh, and I'm pro-IE, but IE6 is a horribly non-standard browser with serious memory leaks (which, if you're worried about your memory, why use a browser which leaks more memory than a sorority house leaking blood on their period) and also has a serious lack of features.

It's like using a stone tool in the iron age.
 
Vegeta897 said:
Mostly I'm just sick of people looking at IE in disgust. Seriously, what makes it so bad? For a person that doesn't need or care about all your super cool features, why should I be considered stupid for not 'upgrading'?
Click to expand...

Lack of standards and just recently with IE7/8 a shithouse UI. You're like an old lady in a retirement home, stuck in your ways and afraid of change. The way I see it your reasons for not liking modern browsers and all their snazzy features is rather stupid. Tabbed browsing is more efficient than spawning an individual process for every window. As an added bonus you actually get to see the title of every tab in front of you without having to click the taskbar.
 
Well maybe I think you're a punk who thinks he can tell me what I prefer!

Nyeah!
 
5 tabs of google versus 5 instances of google on a fresh retail XP image. Fun stuff. Funnier is how sure FF is using 50 odd MB right now those google instances of IE are still using more.

hurrrrrff3.jpg

hurrrrr2cx0.jpg


Tabs are crap aren't they?
 
Kyorisu said:
Lack of standards and just recently with IE7/8 a shithouse UI. You're like an old lady in a retirement home, stuck in your ways and afraid of change. The way I see it your reasons for not liking modern browsers and all their snazzy features is rather stupid. Tabbed browsing is more efficient than spawning an individual process for every window. As an added bonus you actually get to see the title of every tab in front of you without having to click the taskbar.
Click to expand...

Yeah Vegeta, park the old Impala and get on with the program. This is 2008 not 2001.

And who worries about leaked memory nowadays? ... I take that back; my freaking McAfee just leaked like a cheap diaper.

Carry On.
 
Kyorisu said:
Just wait for Google Chrome.

/evil laugh.
Click to expand...

:LOL: We'll see about that. From everything I read, it has nothing new to really bring to the table (except for tabs above the address bar! Revolutionary!!)
 
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