Is Breen evil?

[VortigauntLover]

Nowadays, its quite hard to define evil or not evil.
Some could be a hero to one person and completely evil to another.
Would you classify Breen as evil? Does he truly believe what he is doing is right?
It's hard to say really.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

I would say he's misguided, a bit mad, but not evil.
I don't think he beleaves that he think he's doing what is right however. At the end, he seems more concerned about giving Alyx, Eli and Gordon to the Combine to save his own skin than anything else.
He wants Eli to stop the rebellion not because its the best thing for humnaity, but because it'll save his own skin.
I think he's selfish, power-hungry, and misguided, but not evil.
Maybe theres two halves, one beleaves he's doing what is right, the otehr only cares about his own knoledge and power.

 

[Asknoone]

Selfish, driven by an unquenchable thirst for scientific knowledge, arrogant and very much up his own ass. But not evil. He knows whats happening is wrong, but at the same time feels there is no other alternative - the lesser of the two evils Extinction, or slavery?

Eli was his former colleague and friend, but Breen is willing turn his back upon even that to save himself.

 

[99.vikram]

A selfish scientist without regard for ethics. Borderline evil.

 

[Langolier]

Very evil, though he I think he does believe in what he's doing. He at no point shows any remorse for what is happening to the rest of humanity. "Or suffer total extinction, in line with all the other unworthy branches of the species." Yeah, he's bad.

 

[Polaris]

Well, he is evil but he did all dirty thing for good of mankind...
Morally wrong actions are sometimes necessary to achieve morally right outcomes
Breen is genial combination of Hitler, Lenin and Darwin...

 

[Asknoone]

Very evil, though he I think he does believe in what he's doing. He at no point shows any remorse for what is happening to the rest of humanity. "Or suffer total extinction, in line with all the other unworthy branches of the species." Yeah, he's bad.

Hah, I forgot about that line.

 

[Dr. Zoidberg]

Sad thing is he really believes what he and the combine says.

 

[Max35]

Wouldn't say he is evil. More like deluded, and has inflated sense of self-worth. Of course, he was in a tough position. Nothing else could have been done, except well, face extinction at that point and time. Sometimes submission is the best thing you can do.

HL2 tried to surpass the cliches really, instead of painting Breen black, they coated him with shades of grey.

 

[Asknoone]

Sad thing is he really believes what he and the combine says.

I wouldn't be so sure on the latter. At the end of HL2 he was rather pleased with the position he found himself in, as though he was holding all the cards and had the ability to dictate to the Combine themselves.

"With both of you in my keeping I can dictate the terms of any bargain I care to make with the Combine!"

Deluded.

 

[CrazyJeepDriver]

I dont think he had much of a choice really, he had to surrender Earth to the Combine otherwise there wouldnt be any more of humanity - it would have been wiped out.
I agree with Max. He is deluded, and over time has come to believe that what he is doing is right for humanity.

 

[Asknoone]

I'm not really sure. I don't think he believes what he is doing is right, I don't think he wholeheartedly thinks that being transformed into slaves is the right step - even if they do become immortal, they still have to serve an eternity at the hands of the Combine. Breen knows it is wrong, and he knows it is sick. But he chose the lesser of the two evils.

Either we were wiped out, or survived and went on to become a part of something (ha!) much larger. He secured us a place in an alien superpower. But at what cost? It isn't bad for Breen, he benefited from the whole affair - he is driven by this unquenchable thirst for scientific knowledge.

 

[Max35]

I never pictured Dr. Breen as much of a "scientific mind," he seems to have more of a bureacrat-personality. He has a way with words, that's obvious, and he doesn't approach the scientific obsession that surrounds, say, Dr. Kleiner. He was a scientist sure, but with the prospect of being able to assert yourself above the entire species, I doubt he cared much.

Was Dr. Breen's decision to surrender humanity evil? No, he picked the only "right" action that he could concieve. He had no choice, unless he wanted to feed humanity to the meat grinder. Some fell, sure, but not as many as there could have been.

 

[Crowbar-at-hand]

I think (even though its off topic) We still stood a fighting Chance Against the Combine, and what Breen did was traitorious: and if 2 of Historys most well Reguarded Well known Figures were to hear of such Traitory, Figure's such as: Sir. Winston Churchill, and General. George S. Patton would be discussed with us WE SHALL NEVER GIVE UP, WE SHALL NEVER NEVER SURENDER TO THE ENEMY, and teach those bastards a lesson. Also IF patton were to see this, he would Breen shoot Breen himself if nobody would.


And when I say we stand a Fighting Chance as me being an Ignorant American but as Humanity as a whole. TO THE BITTER END, TO THE LAST MAN.


Thank you for taking your time in reading my Post.

 

[VortigauntLover]

To be fair, that wouldn't have worked out well. We probably would have been mostly exterminated and I doubt Eli and Kleiner would have lived. Even though humanity has been enslaved for 20 years, we have a much better chance of defeating the Combine now.

 

[Rennmniscant]

I never pictured Dr. Breen as much of a "scientific mind," he seems to have more of a bureacrat-personality. He has a way with words, that's obvious, and he doesn't approach the scientific obsession that surrounds, say, Dr. Kleiner. He was a scientist sure, but with the prospect of being able to assert yourself above the entire species, I doubt he cared much.

Really? I thought he had the combined charisma of a dry horse turd and a dead toad. And true, he's bureacratic, but isn't that because he was the administrator at Mesa? Sure, he's a scientist, but not quite the scientist that Kliener or Vance was.

He's a bit too comfortable with sacrificing humans for scientific knowledge and imortality, and the like. But who's to say that we really would become imortal? If you ask me, even death isn't certain, and the only certain thing is change. Getting a bit off topic...

He's not terribly noble either, come think of it. Cowardice is his middle name, naturally. But given his position, I think he just happened to be in the right place at the right time (Black Mesa) to grab the top job as administrator. He's just doing what's right by him, saving the human race by the most cowardly means possible, he just happens to be in a seat of power at the time. Might have got to his head too for all we know.

We need more character stories in future episodes of the others telling you more about Breen and the war, and the combines baleful influence, etc. etc... because so far the HL2 series hasn't been as imersive in plot as the first. I can only assume that Breen's a coward that got slipped into a high seat, and is just making the most of it. Oppertunistic coward. I voted the second one.

 

[Llama]

Between 3 and 4.
He has good intentions, but shitty methods of achieving those intentions

 

[Asknoone]

I think (even though its off topic) We still stood a fighting Chance Against the Combin

We had no chance. We were trounced in 7-hours. The fact that in HL2 there is hardly a human poulation left on Earth proves this.

I never pictured Dr. Breen as much of a "scientific mind," he seems to have more of a bureacrat-personality. He has a way with words, that's obvious, and he doesn't approach the scientific obsession that surrounds, say, Dr. Kleiner. He was a scientist sure, but with the prospect of being able to assert yourself above the entire species, I doubt he cared much.

Kleiner is more abstract. Eli hands on. Breen? Bit of both. He is all about science. You can see he is willing to sacrifice his entire species for further knowledge. "This Chamber will be bathed in deadly particles that have yet to be named by human science. Perhaps when I have the leisure to do the work myself, I'll name one of them after you! That way you won't be completely forgotten." It is all science for Breen.

Though he is of course a slight bureacrat.

 

[Crowbar-at-hand]

Earths Aircraft Would have killed Combine Ground Forces like striders etc. but we would Devastate Combine Air forces, Please Gun ships, Striders, Hunter-choppers, and APC's, IMO I think we could Have won. we could've stand a fighting chance.


Striders vs. Main Battle Tanks (they would be equally matched) but tanks would win because they a go 41-45 top speed and I dont think Striders legs can go that fast. But A 120mm main gun with uranium tip rounds vs a Striders Main Cannon in a fight, both would go down (3 RPGs kill a strider, so a 120mm would be more devastating) but then a Striders cannon can vaporize anything it touches.



Gunships vs. Jet Fighter Aircraft, A Jet would win there no way in hell a gunship can take down missles comming at supersonic speeds, it could probably dodge one(I doubt it) but 3-5 missles "BOOMSHAKALAKA" plus we fight in groups or squadrons, no chance A Gunship is like a Helochopter just as manuverable but as easy to take down.


Infantry fighting lets see now The Combine would a have an edge because they have them Pulse rifles w/ Energy orbs, but they do not have any Support, LMG'er, or S.A.W not a dedicated one. It also seems our weapons have a faster rate of fire like the M249 S.A.W(1000rpm) and the Machinen Gewehr-3(1200-1400rpm) M16A2 (750-900rpm) it seems the Combine weapons like the Pulse rifles have a restricted R.O.F of 600rpm



This is what I take of it, I think we have should've never gave up, rahter we adopted a policy of Defeatism(Dr. Breen) and thats how we lost, but we shall never know, BTW France Surendered first.

 

[Asknoone]

Earths Aircraft Would have killed Combine Ground Forces like striders etc. but we would Devastate Combine Air forces, Please Gun ships, Striders, Hunter-choppers, and APC's, IMO I think we could Have won. we could've stand a fighting chance.

Erm, APCs and hunter-choppers were not used...they came after the Combines occupation of Earth. They are adaptations of human technology. They came with a far superior force to anything you see in HL2. It is 20 years on from the 7-hour war, they have adapted the forces on Earth to suit their needs.

You haven't seen what they attacked with - and I can assure you, it sure as hell wasn't Striders and gunships. There were no Combine soldiers - those are adapted humans that again, came after. They didn't have Pulse rifles either.

 

[Max35]

Kleiner is more abstract. Eli hands on. Breen? Bit of both. He is all about science. You can see he is willing to sacrifice his entire species for further knowledge. "This Chamber will be bathed in deadly particles that have yet to be named by human science. Perhaps when I have the leisure to do the work myself, I'll name one of them after you! That way you won't be completely forgotten." It is all science for Breen.

Though he is of course a slight bureacrat.

So you're saying Kleiner is more of the "thinker" and Eli is the one who brings Kleiner's visions into reality (builds them). I still would say that Kleiner is a bit more dedicated when it comes to scienc than Breen. Bordering on autistic tendencies. That's besides the point, though. As for Breen, I see your point, but I think he still prides himself on being a poet of sorts, slightly more than science. Look at how many times he addressed the citizens in HL2.

But, on the flip side of the coin, I think Breen also has delusions of granduer (well, obviously), and he prides himself as a genius, which fuels his desire for scientific knowledge. Above anything, I think, he is an arrogant man who loves hearing the sound of his own voice

 

[Asknoone]

So you're saying Kleiner is more of the "thinker" and Eli is the one who brings Kleiner's visions into reality (builds them).

Yup, that is exactly how it is.

 

[ktimekiller]

Good points you make here samon, Thumbs up

 

[Crowbar-at-hand]

Breen has some of the best grammar I have ever seen a man speak, I can't even speak that good.

 

[Planeforger]

Breen isn't evil. He's just an opportunistic coward.

 

[Asknoone]

Breen has some of the best grammar I have ever seen a man speak, I can't even speak that good.

QFT

 

[Ferroque]

Hey, Breen did what he had to do. He had to choose between the extinction of the human race (which would have been badly weakened already; remember that due to the portal storms most of the world would have resembled a cross between 28 Days Later and Starship Troopers) and the possibility of having some humans survive in a post-human state in return for the delivery of useful local teleport systems to the Combine.

EDIT: And yes, he is a very good speaker. One thing I found interesting in Half-Life 2 was that he seemed markedly less impressive when speaking without a script, which was a neat touch.

 

[15357]

Dr. Breen isn't evil. He's doing what he believes are right.

 

[bbson john]

Dr. Breen isn't evil. He's doing what he believes are right.

evildoers always think what they're doing is right.

 

[Asknoone]

Dr. Breen isn't evil. He's doing what he believes are right.

Take your fascism elsewhere please.

 

[15357]

eh?

All I'm saying is that the ones that know what they're doing is evil but do it anyway are the true evil ones.......

 

[Asknoone]

It was a joke based on your political stanceness...

 

[15357]

The lack of tone in the internet has failed me.

 

[Asknoone]

Yes.

 

[Black Op]

I have to go with that fourth option. Breen may have brought forth enslavement on to his species yet save his own ass, but then again he could have let humanity suffer a worser fate. Humans may think he's evil, but I see Breen as supporting the human race as much as possible..... to the extent his Benefactors will allow.

 

[Darkside55]

I always side with Dr. Breen. I went with the "saintly" option. Dr. Breen's methods may seem cruel and inhumane, but there's really little alternative. He understands that, while the rest of the population doesn't, so while he comes off as cold and "evil" to some, in truth he's just a realist and a scientist. Logic and pragmatism, people. And I say he's saintly because say what you want, at the end of the day we survived another two decades because of him, and our species was well on the way to immortality because of his efforts.

Furthermore with teleport technology and Gordon Freeman in his grasp who knows what he would've bargained for from the Combine? Perhaps he might've given humanity at least slightly better living conditions. And he did do things on his show in an attempt to keep the populace upbeat. Breen's a good man and a good leader, it's just the circumstances of his rule are extremely negative, and there's only so much he can do about it. Plus, again, he comes off as sort of cold and aloof to the plight of the public because of his scientist background. But even so, Breen was far from evil. Breen might not have been "good" either, but he was RIGHT.

 

[XANA]

you know, Samon, SOMEHOW i guessed you would reply to a thread about dr. breen. anyway, i don't think that breen's evil per se. he prob'ly just wanted to stay alive, so he just did as the combine wanted him to do.
"Therefore, I say yes, I am a collaborator. We must all collaborate, eagerly, willingly, if we wish to reap the benifits of unification. And reap, we shall."
-Dr. Wallace Breen
see, collaborator. he's working alongside the combine, most likely protecting himself.
"...They know you betrayed them, they'll turn on you! Judith- Dr. Mossman! Please!"
-Dr. Wallace Breen
even though dr. breen has guards, they can go against him at any time... well, dr. breen has to do something dumb first. i'll see what else i can dig up.

 

[Inyssius Grey]

Breen might not have been "good" either, but he was RIGHT.

I agree completely. Administrator Breen did the best anyone could do with what he had. If Breen hadn't been there to negotiate a peace, humanity would now be extinct.

 

[MTG_Maro]

It depends from whose point of view.

To Breen, he prolly doesn't think he is evil at all. Now to a Rebel, they prolly think he is. And as for the Combine, they don't think, I think....

 

[Langolier]

I'm just going to state once again: Anyone who sympathizes with Dr. Breen is a testament to just how manipulative and evil the he is. He is certainly charismatic, that much is certain. Look how he has convinced these innocent humans to defend him, despite the suffering and slaughter they themselves have witnessed and none other than Dr. Breen's guiding hand?

It's a pitty. In some ways you low-level collaborators are the most tragic victims in the Combine's enslavement of humanity.