Is Space Exploration Worth the Cost

Of course its worth it. Haven't you ever watched star trek? Its the final frontier!

The final ****ing frontier!
 
Reading this thread, it's clear that Cheomesh has a pretty tenuous grasp of what sarcasm is.

I hope I'm not-dead-enough to see another world one day.
 
$7 billion a year, as opposed to $10 billion a month on Iraq. That's $120 billion a year. Seventeen times more. That's obscene.

-Angry Lawyer
 
I forget who originally said it, so I'm obviously paraphrasing here, but a space program focuses all the best things about a nation in the way that a war focuses all the bad ones. Its a chance for people to voluntarily come together over something that is a positive cause.
 
I would have said that space exploration is a waste of money when there are more urgent humanitarian problems that need attention. I would have said that space missions don't do much for us other than looking cool and advancing our understanding of the universe, which, while being something we all want, should come after we stop people dying on the streets.
Well, that POV got completely owned by that freakonomics article. There are a load of points there I never would have thought of, not least the fact currently so little is spent on space exploration anyway. Of course there are other more pressing matters, but you can say that about pretty much anything, except the most pressing thing. It doesn't mean we shouldn't spend anything on them, just that we should spend in proportion, and 7 billion a year IMO is not in proportion.

@Darkside: Yeah, I get the fealing that the main reason a lot of people want to explore space is that it's so ****ing cool. I mean come on, who doesn't doesn't orgasm at the thought at the thought of going to Mars and landing on asteroids?
 
I think Space Exploration is a far nobler cause to die for than any war.
 
"Justifying space exploration because we get non-stick frying pans is like justifying music because it is good exercise for the violinists right arm."
Richard Dawkins
 
Solaris said:
"Justifying space exploration because we get non-stick frying pans is like justifying music because it is good exercise for the violinists right arm."
Richard Dawkins
Click to expand...

Poor comparison :rolling:
 
Solaris said:
Not at all.

Exploration for explorations sake is a fantastic thing.
Click to expand...

It is a poor comparison.
That doesn't mean exploration for it's own sake isn't awesome (it IS, hell I hope to work in research when I graduate), but the tangible benefits are nothing to be dismissed and even WITHOUT the discovery of new things they would justify the space program imo.
 
Eejit said:
It is a poor comparison.
That doesn't mean exploration for it's own sake isn't awesome (it IS, hell I hope to work in research when I graduate), but the tangible benefits are nothing to be dismissed and even WITHOUT the discovery of new things they would justify the space program imo.
Click to expand...
That's why he's saying Justifying it BECUASE of the benifits.
 
Solaris said:
That's why he's saying Justifying it BECUASE of the benifits.
Click to expand...

The way I read it was that space exploration for benefits is like music for exercise, i.e. trivial.
 
Solaris said:
"Justifying space exploration because we get non-stick frying pans is like justifying music because it is good exercise for the violinists right arm."
Richard Dawkins
Click to expand...

Bleh, Dawkins.

For me, space exploration is simply the next step in our evolution, a logical one. Plus, taking populace off the planet will help reduce the overpopulation and rebuild Earth.
 
Dawkins is our infallible leader. Heritics must be purged.
 
Mikael Grizzly said:
Bleh, Dawkins.
Click to expand...
For the love of the Selfish gene! Kneel down and sacrifice yourself to the almighty force of natural selection!

It's the next logical step in the technological evolution, not biological evolution of man.
 
Eejit said:
The way I read it was that space exploration for benefits is like music for exercise, i.e. trivial.
Click to expand...

I'm fairly sure you're missing the point he made. The end product of the 'exercise' given by the activities, whether they're space exploration or performing a concerto, are more important than the trivial side effects the exercise produces.
 
Mikael Grizzly said:
Bleh, Dawkins.

For me, space exploration is simply the next step in our evolution, a logical one. Plus, taking populace off the planet will help reduce the overpopulation and rebuild Earth.
Click to expand...

If you want to reduce population, you should just reduce the number of people, rather than sending them to space. It's a hell of lot cheaper, for one thing. As for putting them on other planets, we'd just overpopulate them as well.
 
Yes, it is.

The problem is that many of the technological and scientific benefits of space exploration aren't immediately obvious. The technology derived from space exploration "trickle down" into commercial applications in ways that are subtle.
 
repiV said:
Of course, but I'd prefer that space travel wasn't reserved for the elite of the elite. Less than 500 people have ever been into space in our history, and we've had space travel for over 50 years. A few years after powered flight, we had warplanes, and 50 years later we had transatlantic passenger liners.
Space travel shouldn't be just the preserve of governments - commercialisation would make the dream a reality for us all.
Click to expand...

Eh, patience. Think about how long it took for humanity to move from paddles and canoes thousands of years ago to modern aircraft carriers. Although hopefully it won't take that long.

I think at the best, we're the generation thats living in the time of the "Wright Brothers". We'll see the foundations of spaceflight being set in stone, but we won't see the Boeing 747's.
 
If not for the space program(s), we wouldn't have satellite. Nuff said.:p
 
Worth any cost. Would you rather we just sat and sang folk songs round camp fires and never aspired to anything? We should pour every resource and every last breath we have into going as far as we can.

Instead we pour most of our money into killing each other, and the rest into killing the planet.

C'est la vie.
 
jondy said:
Reading this thread, it's clear that Cheomesh has a pretty tenuous grasp of what sarcasm is.
Click to expand...

What did I **** up on now man :|

Worth any cost. Would you rather we just sat and sang folk songs round camp fires and never aspired to anything? We should pour every resource and every last breath we have into going as far as we can.
Click to expand...
I love the space program, but I will never support mass-dictation of resources for it.
 
Yes, for these reasons:

1.We live in space.
That is, anything that happens in "space" can have a direct impact on life on Earth. Earth is a tiny, tiny island in the vast cosmos, and we human beings have almost all of our resources, all of our eggs in this one tiny basket. Let's say that Tommorow an asteroid strikes the Earth and kills everyone there. There'd be nowhere to go, nothing to do, it would simply be the end of the human race. We need "backups" per se. Humanity must spread to other planets to increase our chances of survival. What can be a better way to spread ourselves out and increase our survival than to go the final frontier? Space is the only option for expansion and survival beyond the limited life of our planet.

2.Science needs space exploration.
There is alot of stuff out there in space. There are unexplored phenomena, new and strange modes of physics, perhaps new life and new civilizations. If science is to progress, we simply must send probes and people to distant worlds and explore them. We must also continue improving telescopes, which means, inevitably, building much bigger, more powerful space based telescopes.

3. Space opens up opportunity on earth.
Let's say we need more energy than our measly planet can provide. Let's say we need more resources, more land, more..space to survive. The only way to get these things is to expand into space, and the only way to expand into space is through space research and exploration. Spinoffs of space technology are already impacting our lives. Teflon has already been mentioned, but velcro, infrared thermometers, anti-UV sunglasses, GPS systems, satellite TV, Google Earth, they all came from research in space. More research means more new products and economic opportunities for everyone.

4. It's Cool
Damnit, don't you agree? What could be more awesome than being the first man on Mars? How about being aboard a private asteroid miner? How about a cruise to Jupiter? How about living on a generational ship to Alpha Centuri? Exploring the Galaxy like science fiction? These things are truly awesome, truly amazing experiences which we humans will never have if we don't continue to invest in space.

5. Our Gift to the Universe
We may be the only intelligent species for hundreds of thousands of lightyears. We may even be the only source of life in the universe. We can give the universe the gift of life. We can populate lifeless worlds with our plants and animals. We can turn the deserts into forests, the mighty wastelands into mighty cities, and the vacuum of space into a buzz of electrical activity and whizzing space ships. We can make the desolate complex, the uninhabited cultured, the untamed civilized. I know this argument sounds like a variation on the "white man's burden", but we as humans may be the only hope for a populated, lively universe. The only question is, do we want to make it one?
 
I love the space program, but I will never support mass-dictation of resources for it.
Click to expand...

Foolish.


Logic dictates that since space is a vast place full of resources that essentially outweigh our Earth quite conclusively, any Earth spent resources in getting us up there and exploiting the resources in space is a win-win situation, because humanity will always make back anything it spends and then some, thats the beauty of expansion.


5. Our Gift to the Universe
We may be the only intelligent species for hundreds of thousands of lightyears. We may even be the only source of life in the universe. We can give the universe the gift of life. We can populate lifeless worlds with our plants and animals. We can turn the deserts into forests, the mighty wastelands into mighty cities, and the vacuum of space into a buzz of electrical activity and whizzing space ships. We can make the desolate complex, the uninhabited cultured, the untamed civilized. I know this argument sounds like a variation on the "white man's burden", but we as humans may be the only hope for a populated, lively universe. The only question is, do we want to make it one?
Click to expand...


*sniffl* *salute* Ooooh Teeerraaaa, a blue and blessed wooorld! (.e _ e.)



(lol)

I concur with all you said otherguy and indeed, a good post.

Leaving aside the practical points for a moment, what more noble cause for mankind can their be then to spread life?.

Forgive the hippy mode for a second, but perhaps exploration, settlement, exploitation, and scientific experimentation in space will consume enough human energies as to make war a fairly small and infrequent occurance, eventually.

Space is indeed cool, it just so happens to be our inevitable future to, if we wish to survive as a species.
 
Dictator. It must be a willful and collaborative effort. You will never win people over by taking things away for your own agenda.
Click to expand...


Mistaken.


Did I ever say I was gonna take over the world for my own plans?.

Either you weren't paying attention, read what you wanted to, or are putting words in m mouth for some evil purposes, projecting onto me perhaps?.

Seig Hail mein glorious fuhrer?.

I'm just saying, claiming exploitation and exploration of space is a waste of resources is an erroneous statement.
 
We may be the only intelligent species for hundreds of thousands of lightyears. We may even be the only source of life in the universe. We can give the universe the gift of life. We can populate lifeless worlds with our plants and animals. We can turn the deserts into forests, the mighty wastelands into mighty cities, and the vacuum of space into a buzz of electrical activity and whizzing space ships. We can make the desolate complex, the uninhabited cultured, the untamed civilized. I know this argument sounds like a variation on the "white man's burden", but we as humans may be the only hope for a populated, lively universe. The only question is, do we want to make it one?
Click to expand...

Even if we eradicate a planet's potential to create it's own life and extinguish future civilizations?
 
Mikael Grizzly said:
Even if we eradicate a planet's potential to create it's own life and extinguish future civilizations?
Click to expand...

For what, billions and billions of years? That's like saying we shouldn't build in Antarctica because someday it might shift to a warmer climate.
 
theotherguy said:
For what, billions and billions of years? That's like saying we shouldn't build in Antarctica because someday it might shift to a warmer climate.
Click to expand...

You missed the point. By terraforming a planet, making it Earth-like, we prevent any natural life formation and eradicate an entire ecosystem, and if intelligent life would be born from this, an entire possible civilization.

Quite selfish. Guess the religious concept of anthropocentrism is still well and alive, even in secular circles.
 
theotherguy said:
Yes, for these reasons:

1.We live in space.
That is, anything that happens in "space" can have a direct impact on life on Earth. Earth is a tiny, tiny island in the vast cosmos, and we human beings have almost all of our resources, all of our eggs in this one tiny basket. Let's say that Tommorow an asteroid strikes the Earth and kills everyone there. There'd be nowhere to go, nothing to do, it would simply be the end of the human race. We need "backups" per se. Humanity must spread to other planets to increase our chances of survival. What can be a better way to spread ourselves out and increase our survival than to go the final frontier? Space is the only option for expansion and survival beyond the limited life of our planet.

2.Science needs space exploration.
There is alot of stuff out there in space. There are unexplored phenomena, new and strange modes of physics, perhaps new life and new civilizations. If science is to progress, we simply must send probes and people to distant worlds and explore them. We must also continue improving telescopes, which means, inevitably, building much bigger, more powerful space based telescopes.

3. Space opens up opportunity on earth.
Let's say we need more energy than our measly planet can provide. Let's say we need more resources, more land, more..space to survive. The only way to get these things is to expand into space, and the only way to expand into space is through space research and exploration. Spinoffs of space technology are already impacting our lives. Teflon has already been mentioned, but velcro, infrared thermometers, anti-UV sunglasses, GPS systems, satellite TV, Google Earth, they all came from research in space. More research means more new products and economic opportunities for everyone.

4. It's Cool
Damnit, don't you agree? What could be more awesome than being the first man on Mars? How about being aboard a private asteroid miner? How about a cruise to Jupiter? How about living on a generational ship to Alpha Centuri? Exploring the Galaxy like science fiction? These things are truly awesome, truly amazing experiences which we humans will never have if we don't continue to invest in space.

5. Our Gift to the Universe
We may be the only intelligent species for hundreds of thousands of lightyears. We may even be the only source of life in the universe. We can give the universe the gift of life. We can populate lifeless worlds with our plants and animals. We can turn the deserts into forests, the mighty wastelands into mighty cities, and the vacuum of space into a buzz of electrical activity and whizzing space ships. We can make the desolate complex, the uninhabited cultured, the untamed civilized. I know this argument sounds like a variation on the "white man's burden", but we as humans may be the only hope for a populated, lively universe. The only question is, do we want to make it one?
Click to expand...
Amen, brother.

Mikael Grizzly said:
You missed the point. By terraforming a planet, making it Earth-like, we prevent any natural life formation and eradicate an entire ecosystem, and if intelligent life would be born from this, an entire possible civilization.

Quite selfish. Guess the religious concept of anthropocentrism is still well and alive, even in secular circles.
Click to expand...
Without our help, Mars and Venus could never have life. It lacks the basic conditions to develop it. As for other solar systems; if they haven't developed life when we get there they're not going to. Look at our planet, life started here as soon as the conditions were right. We have no reason to believe that the same thing doesn't apply to other planets.
 
Without our help, Mars and Venus could never have life. It lacks the basic conditions to develop it. As for other solar systems; if they haven't developed life when we get there they're not going to. Look at our planet, life started here as soon as the conditions were right. We have no reason to believe that the same thing doesn't apply to other planets.
Click to expand...

Titan is close to the state of Earth just before first proteins were formed. Conditions may vary for different lifeforms, some might even substantially differ from what we perceive as alive.

Why is it that everyone perceives humanity as divine, as that other guy said, paraphrasing, the bringer of life to the galaxy? The universe works perfectly without the flea called humanity, yet we still claim we are special.

Why is that?
 
Mikael Grizzly said:
Why is it that everyone perceives humanity as divine, as that other guy said, paraphrasing, the bringer of life to the galaxy?
Click to expand...

Because we can.

Terraforming/settling Titan is a different story since it may support life already even.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

jverne
My quick plan for the near future of space exploration
Replies
25
Views
1K
Phobie
Phobie
Back
Top