Nu Zalem
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ríomhaire said:
I'm thinking the exact same thing, but I'm only positive on it. Sometimes, my Steam games will just update out of nowhere and it won't even ask or give me a choice. I wish it wasn't so controlling when it comes to that, especially when the fact remains that I'm a dial-up user (long story on that one).
Negative... but no longer Strongly Negative thanks to some real improvements Valve made.
I guess I see the positive points of Steam rather well, and understand why it's good for average users. As a power user, it annoys me. My biggest annoyance right now is no control whatsoever over patching process. I can't deinstall a patch. I can't roll back to some intermediate update, if, say, the latest one causes me trouble but I want to go back to the previous one.
My previous big complaint was the ridicilous amount of RAM Steam would use. I'd often have it use around 20 MB when starting, and have usage grow to 60 later. Yes, computers have a lot of RAM now, but that's not an excuse. An application taking up 51 MB RAM is still taking up 10% of total memory on a 512 MB machine. And that's poor coding. However, now the Steam memory usage and general performance seems to be quite improved.
Finally, I have a grudge at Steam for punishing legal users as opposed to pirates. As you all know, HL2 was released on pirate networks the day it was released, as it happens with all games. And, the legal HL2 had that bad stuttering bug on release. But, the problem is, pirated versions, who ran HL2 directly, without Steam, didn't have this bug, and the pirated version was better than the legal one. Gahh!
I guess I see the positive points of Steam rather well, and understand why it's good for average users. As a power user, it annoys me. My biggest annoyance right now is no control whatsoever over patching process. I can't deinstall a patch. I can't roll back to some intermediate update, if, say, the latest one causes me trouble but I want to go back to the previous one.
My previous big complaint was the ridicilous amount of RAM Steam would use. I'd often have it use around 20 MB when starting, and have usage grow to 60 later. Yes, computers have a lot of RAM now, but that's not an excuse. An application taking up 51 MB RAM is still taking up 10% of total memory on a 512 MB machine. And that's poor coding. However, now the Steam memory usage and general performance seems to be quite improved.
Finally, I have a grudge at Steam for punishing legal users as opposed to pirates. As you all know, HL2 was released on pirate networks the day it was released, as it happens with all games. And, the legal HL2 had that bad stuttering bug on release. But, the problem is, pirated versions, who ran HL2 directly, without Steam, didn't have this bug, and the pirated version was better than the legal one. Gahh!
Cole
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I see 100mb as small....not hard to leave your internet on overnight for a few nights for a 500Mb, I've dled a 600Mb file no prob.
Yes im a 56ker.
I keep my steam up to date. To get the size lets see...you know much % it is done, how big your Cs:S\HL2 file is..... use some math like I do. Though I agree they should make this more convient.
Whats
C
_Chaz_
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Ok here's an example - just today there was a steam update, my Source SDK updated for a bit. It was running absolutely 100% fine. Today I try and run hammer, for CSS or HL2 or HL2DM, it doesnt matter, and I get an 'Access Denied' error. Yes I have restarted steam, etc etc. It's these totally pointless mandatory updates that piss me off, thanks to the steam content delivery system my Source SDK has been patched so that it refuses to open. Great.
Nathaniel
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It kinda goes against my principles to have more programs installed then the one I actually need. If if Buy HL2 I don't want to HAVE to install and maintain a bunch of other software aswell. It just gets annoying, not to mention there are more elements that can go wrong.
Also, Steam as a piece of software, isn't very intuitive or nice. It's bulky, ugly, resource-heavy and doesn't really add anything useful. I'd rather JUST start the game if the game is what I want to play. Having Source running in the background for no good is just stupid, right?
point is, all the things Steam adds are things I could add myself with third party products, IF I WANTED THEM. That's the key word here. I don't want or need Steam, yet I'm forced to use it...
Also, Steam as a piece of software, isn't very intuitive or nice. It's bulky, ugly, resource-heavy and doesn't really add anything useful. I'd rather JUST start the game if the game is what I want to play. Having Source running in the background for no good is just stupid, right?
point is, all the things Steam adds are things I could add myself with third party products, IF I WANTED THEM. That's the key word here. I don't want or need Steam, yet I'm forced to use it...
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It f*cking well is when you don't pay the bill. There is no hope in hell that my parents would let me leave the internet on all night. So don't bloody well speak for everyone. Took me 2 weeks to get LC.Minerel said:
kupocake
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...ríomhaire said:
...
i'm speechless.
You mean that they even still have pay per-minute dialup now? Wow. Sorry, but if you're using pay per minute dial-up in this day and age, you have no right to complain whatsoever. I appreciate that Broadband isn't in every area on the planet, but monthly payment dialup ISPs have been the standard for at least half a decade now.
Barney_Calhoun
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Used to be negative, following the demise of WON (RIP dear friend), but recently I think I like it, quite a lot.
DiSTuRbEd said:
Yes, I am crazy, but I do get the info
. The AI disabled problem is something that anyone with the slightest bit of brains should be able to fix themselves. And for the rest, there are ready fixes floating around the same P2P networks.
kupocake
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Yeah, i've been there tooríomhaire said:
Parents can be really unyielding with stuff like this. My parents always refused on the grounds that I used the PC so much already, so i'd just get worse once on the net. They were right of course, but they can be more inclined to listen when: a) your school grades come out perfectly fine anyway b) you save them money and c) you meet them half-way. For a long time, I had "surftime" internet. Basically, I could only use the internet off-peak so that saved them money and meant that there'd always be a time of day when I'd just crack on with work (though I did have the advantage of not being one of those unfortunate school kids who has to commute miles between school and home).For the ammount of time we see you around these forums, your pay-per-minute phone bill can't be cheap. Paying monthly, even for off-peak only calls would save your parents money. The challenge is getting them to see that
hungryduck
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I've never had an issue, ever. I think the problem is that people who have had issues complain alot and the majority of people who like don't bother saying anything....
Varsity
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I hovered between positive and strongly positive, going for strongly in the end. It's great for most people these days, but there are 56kers and people only interested in SP who don't get any of the benefits. There's also an incredible amount of untapped potential.
100th vote!
100th vote!
Shasta
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That about sums it up nicely.Nathaniel said:
The problem is choice, and the fact that steam does not offer us one, or any useful information. I'm sure that one day someone will offer a great program similar to steam, but much more user-friendly, one that gives people choices and information, and doesn't hog resources in the background! But at the moment, it's like someone has invented the first ever boat- with holes all through it. Your'e sure it will be useful for something one day, but at the moment it's a piece of crap waste of space- to you. Some people may not mind it, and use it as a fruit holder untill it gets "patched up" enough to be useful. :|
Dr. Freeman
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kupoartist said:
well aside from having beefs with game developers, people such as yourself need to understand that not all gamers are as fortunate as you or myself...
some areas are just plain old and don't have new technology...and yeah i realize its the year 2006 now and people should "get with the program" but the point is that if broadband or other decent 56K ISP's are not available, its not the fault of gamers by any means.
internet connection aside, what do game developers have to say to those who do not care for the internet? this (may or) may not be an issue of the technology being available but maybe just something as simple as some people not wanting to have the internet but at some level are gamers.
all i am saying is that i was one of those people who installed Steam during the beta stages and put up with all the infested bugs and stuff and now have this well-oiled machine in Steam.. i was hoping...and at some point expected Valve would release some sort of patch that separates the single player portion of Half Life2 from any and all multi player aspects.
just that Steam has evolved so much since the beta stages that something as simple as separating SP from MP has still not been addressed.
Cole
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You bet it has, I mean it uses less ram than msn messenger when closed(4\6 vs 8) and 7/8 vs 17 when open.
Closing out of Msn Messenger when you play will free up more ram.
Just because the pirate versions didn't use steam dosn't mean Steam caused the stuttering bug.
6megs is resource heavy? Damn.
Rather steam isn't just a way to play. Server Browser, when they get friends back up...friends, gives more money to valve instead of the publisher($35 instead of $7), mod launcher, and what do you mean Source? Source is a game engine I think you mean steam.
rosseh
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People seem to be forgetting that Valve released Steam long before they came even close to finishing Half-Life 2. The old "WON" style of things (manually updating with huge patches etc..) was abolished a long time ago, and Steam came in as a better means of content delivery. I mean come on, who remembers having to wait in queue 2 hours on fileplannet before their 300+mb download would even start?
Half-Life 2 is basically part of Steam. Although I can see why people who bought Half-Life 2 without previously owning Half-Life will see Steam as a burden. But it just isn't. The fact is, for a few years now if you want to play Half-Life, or any of its mods, you've had to have Steam. It's just with the release of Half-Life 2 a lot of new people have come along, not expected it and instantly slated it because it's a little more work setting up. But once you've done your little bit of setting up and waiting, it does everything else for you!
Half-Life 2 is basically part of Steam. Although I can see why people who bought Half-Life 2 without previously owning Half-Life will see Steam as a burden. But it just isn't. The fact is, for a few years now if you want to play Half-Life, or any of its mods, you've had to have Steam. It's just with the release of Half-Life 2 a lot of new people have come along, not expected it and instantly slated it because it's a little more work setting up. But once you've done your little bit of setting up and waiting, it does everything else for you!
Dr. Freeman
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kupoartist said:
6CharAznable[/QUOTE]
hmm...did you miss my point when i mentioned that not all gamers are fortunate enough to have decent broadband or other ISP's?
i do not pretend to know all the ISP's and their services around the world but i am willing to give the benefit of the doubt to gamers who have pay per minute dial-up until theres a sign that points to just bad ISP choice.
monthly payment dial-up ISP's may be the standard/basic in most parts of the world but until its in every part of the world its better to just ease up than brow beat people with "get a better damn ISP"
kupocake
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Sorry, but I think it's pretty safe to assume that Ireland has subscription dialup as standard or at the very least, an affordable option. Riomhaire basically hinted that it was down to parental control more than anything else. Then you come riding in telling me first and foremost that I was wrong to assume that all people had broadband when I'd already quite clearly stated that I'm fully aware that not everyone can get it. Only then do you say that I'm wrong to assume that all people have Dialup as standard. Well I didn't do that either. Riomhaire is from Ireland. With a short search, I can tell you that eircom do flat-rate internet packages http://home.eircom.net/products/flatrate/ between 30 and 10 euros a month.
Now please kindly stop telling me to clearly understand things that I already clearly understand.
edit: to be fair, the ISPs do seem to have slightly harsh limits on how many hours you can use the service for. But nothing that would stop you from updating steam overnight.
edit2: not to mention that I'm actually one of the utter minority that doesn't even have the internet in the room in which I live away from home in.
Now please kindly stop telling me to clearly understand things that I already clearly understand.
edit: to be fair, the ISPs do seem to have slightly harsh limits on how many hours you can use the service for. But nothing that would stop you from updating steam overnight.
edit2: not to mention that I'm actually one of the utter minority that doesn't even have the internet in the room in which I live away from home in.
DEATH eVADER
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I didn't like the fact that I had to install HL2 over the net, but the time that I did, I found Steam great. Stayed online for 6 months after installing HL2, so I made good use out of the app. The content delivery was useful, I was able to find most HL1 net-mods (distinct lack of single player lists though), and quick to find what I wanted. Not to mention the tech support which I found outstanding.
The fact that I can play offline, without the CD's is a plus too (can't with HL1 or Op4 though), I'm expected to be back online in like a month
The fact that I can play offline, without the CD's is a plus too (can't with HL1 or Op4 though), I'm expected to be back online in like a month
I should, for the sake of fairness, list a few things I like about Steam:
* No CD check. CD checks are annoying.
* The ability to download the game should I lose or break my CDs.
* Generally good for multiplayer
Now, I'm a single player kind of guy, and Steam isn't as good for, say, SP mods as it is for MP, but nothing intolerable.
* No CD check. CD checks are annoying.
* The ability to download the game should I lose or break my CDs.
* Generally good for multiplayer
Now, I'm a single player kind of guy, and Steam isn't as good for, say, SP mods as it is for MP, but nothing intolerable.
