Just some speculations

[neozero]

Hey, considering that the source engine will be geared towards storytelling (with its facial expressions and all), I'm wondering how many of you will utilize this in your modding. I know I'm exstatic for this, its just that the gaming community doesn't seem to focus as much on the dramatic part of a game as they do on the action part.

Just speculating

 

[The Dark Elf]

many wont because they just don't have the skills required to do it right

 

[qckbeam]

many wont because they just don't have the skills required to do it right

aren't you just Mr. Optimistic today

 

[ankalar]

What he pointed out is true. In any case, I do not believe many mulitplayer modifications will include much dialogue.

 

[torso boy]

actually, people might... They might put pre defined emotion into preset phrases in multiplayer mods.....And the tools seem pretty user freindly

 

[The Dark Elf]

aren't you just Mr. Optimistic today

It's true though It's this same class of person (he who thinks he has a company just by registering a .com) who thinks he can pick up a camera and become the next Ridley Scott. It's just not that easy, and requires far more people to get it right than just one kid who's doing a media studies course at his highschool, if it was so simple then every movie ever made would be an instant classic. Thats not the case.

The biggest problem will be many who try, are going to be heavily influenced by the generation x movie, the kind with lots of action, no plot, naff dialogue spattered with plenty of profanity. They'll of course have terrible acting, some guy from the midlands trying to do an American accent using the microphone that came with his dell computer. Camera angles are going to be basic, or planned out with the minimum of thought.

Lighting too, little to no thought will be put into that. You know, with today's best consumer camera's, there is very little difference with the kind most of the smaller studios use, heck you can buy the same camera's they used on 28 days later for a few hundred dollars now. But there's a reason why Billy's home movie looks so bad compared to one done properly, and thats lighting, no film, even if they want natural light, will make do with natural light, they will always use proper lighting rigs, reflective sheets, mood lighting. Never will they just turn on "the big light" as Peter Kay would say.

So just with the lighting alone, there are people out there who have been working in that area of the film industry for decades and their still learning new things. So someone with no real knowledge will have a chance. Granted this is a game not a film, but the same principals still apply. For example, a CG shot of some building outside in the sunlight. Many will just stick a single distance light in there and make it yellow. That simply wont work, sure, they could turn on radiosity to get some bounced light onto surfaces in shadow, but its still not going to look realistic. You need to use quite a few more lights, negative point lights, spotlights, yes spotlights have their uses beyond looking like a spotlight. All these things together needed just to get an almost faithful representation of a realistic outdoor scene. Now how many can honestly say they knew that? Not many I wager.

And then we're onto sound. Well like lighting you could fill volumes on the subject and still not have covered everything. There are people out there who get paid thousands for getting the sound just right, just like the other area's. Now say you did a scene in a busy street, most would just stick some noise in, maybe a crowd noise and some cars. But thats not even the start of it. If you go outside with a decent microphone and record some ambient noise for a minute, then play it back again and again you can hear countless layers of sound, all kinds of things, from different directions, doppler effects, echo's, even insects. The basic law of sound is every bit of it has a purpose, its not there for the sake of it, there's a reason for every little thing you hear, now in film that can't always be helped, you haven't always got control over the ambient noise depending on where your filming, thats why most audio is fixed in post. But with scenes in games, you've got complete control, so you have to make sure there's a reason for everything, and a source to it too. Don't put a buzzing noise in a corridor cause it sounds cool, do put a buzzing noise in a corridor if there's a faulty light nearby, but only if it would actually make a noise like that, some dont, depending on the fault some click and snap, some buzz, some crackle

Scenes in general. What should be happening in your scene. I've found sometimes people will do scenes in crowded places, the "extra's" look the same and if they even are moving, move around like Type E zombies Put some life into the scene, write a little story for EVERY character in there, if someone is sat behind your talent, what are they doing, are they having a cup of coffee perhaps? maybe they just broke up with their lover, perhaps waiting for an important call, give them a life, make them appear as a real person would, go out and sit in the middle of town on a bench and just watch the world go by, watch how everyone has a story, a reason. tiny little touches like this make an incredibly huge difference to the overall quality. Might not think so now, but I challenge anyone to create a similar scene as I've used as an example here, and do two versions, one with life to the extra's to the depths I've said, and one without, and I challenge that person to come back and tell me the lifeless version works better. I can promise you not one person will, apart from those just out to be annoying, but we're not allowed to put pillows over their faces at the moment so we just have to make do with their presence

I'll probably run out of characters allowed in a post if I continue, there are just so many area's involved that it should be clear that its best to avoid it unless you really know what your doing. You only have to look at some of the commercial attempts from the past few years, they are generally very basic. Heck I hate to say this but even Warcraft III's cinematic cutscenes have problems. Though at the same time, they are some of the best out there, that I've seen anyway.

The fact is very few people have the talent to do something like that, by all means try, but don't complain if it turns out looking crap and people laughing at it.

 

[qckbeam]

wow Fenric, have your fingers fallen off yet?
I totally understand what you're saying though, and I agree with you 100%

My God man, I was only joking

 

[ankalar]

Oh come on, Fenric, tell us how you really feel!

 

[The Dark Elf]

wow Fenric, have your fingers fallen off yet?
I totally understand what you're saying though, and I agree with you 100%

My God man, I was only joking

fingers? fingers?? I had to type with my toes, my fingers fell off last night from all the typing yesterday

 

[neozero]

Hmm fenric are you thinking what I'm thinking.

Assuming that the gaming communit sucks with conveying any sense of feeling, and with the new .dev site that should be put up. why don't we see if we can make this up for discussion? you know, have a small section where people can add any little bit of wisdom.

What Unreal Wiki (WIKI WIKI) does for coding, we could do for storytelling.

Just a thought....

 

[The Dark Elf]

Hmm fenric are you thinking what I'm thinking.

Assuming that the gaming communit sucks with conveying any sense of feeling, and with the new .dev site that should be put up. why don't we see if we can make this up for discussion? you know, have a small section where people can add any little bit of wisdom.

What Unreal Wiki (WIKI WIKI) does for coding, we could do for storytelling.

Just a thought....

They'll probably be something like that on it. Best bet is to ask Majestic about it, he'll know for sure whats planned for it.

 

[Majestic XII]

Everyone will be able to write a article/tutorial for .Dev (about writing storylines/whatever), so im pretty sure you will see some interesting stuff on the site.

I'll see if i can catch a good writer to do stuff for the site. I will also poke Fenric to do stuff

More ontopic. I will try my hardest to bring a very good and emotional story to the modding scene. Its not the normal CS kind of story, its something different. My mod isnt public yet, but it will be soon. Keep an eye out for it.

 

[Sprafa]

I have to agree with Fenric.

the Gen X has killed the "films", niow they're just "movies".....unspired, comercial crap...

How can we want good cutscenes and all with such inspiration?