Karl Rove is a traitor

As a reporter, the ability to refrain from revealing your sources is a double-edged sword. It is important, necessary even, to allow people to speak out against the government when the need arises without the threat of being hunted down and/or "silenced." On the other hand, it could be used by dishonest reporters to present fake stories, propaganda, and slanderous remarks as if they are true. Still, in this case, I think the reporters should be partly to blame for... well... being retarded. I mean, really, how stupid do they have to be to reveal the identity of an undercover agent?
 
OCybrManO said:
As a reporter, the ability to refrain from revealing your sources is a double-edged sword. It is important, necessary even, to allow people to speak out against the government when the need arises without the threat of being hunted down and/or "silenced." On the other hand, it could be used by dishonest reporters to present fake stories, propaganda, and slanderous remarks as if they are true. Still, in this case, I think the reporters should be partly to blame for... well... being retarded. I mean, really, how stupid do they have to be to reveal the identity of an undercover agent?
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it goes beyond stupidity, revealing certain names of undercover agents can put their lives on the line depending on what they are doing, and even if that isn;t the case here this should be a lesson to other reporters to be more careful and intelligent about these things
 
Icarusintel said:
it goes beyond stupidity, revealing certain names of undercover agents can put their lives on the line depending on what they are doing, and even if that isn;t the case here this should be a lesson to other reporters to be more careful and intelligent about these things
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It was the case here. The CIA asked Novak directly not to release that name as it would put many lives in danger. The question is why isn't Novak taking any heat for this while Miller has been arrested today and Cooper was forced to testify.
 
CptStern said:
he works for msnbc, how left could he possibly be? partisan sure but not a lefty ...if he's a lefty, I'm true-blue conservative (I've been pushed so far left that I've come full circle)
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Are you kidding? He's a raving lefty, listen to his rantings.

His short bio shows him working with some of the most left in the senate.

From 1993 through 1995, Mr. O’Donnell was the Democratic Chief of Staff of the United States Senate Committee on Finance. The Committee has jurisdiction over legislation involving taxation, international trade, health care, Social Security, Welfare, and other income security programs.

In 1992, Mr. O’Donnell was Chief of Staff of the United States Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works.

From 1989 until 1992, Mr. O’Donnell served as Senior Advisor to Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan. He began his professional association with Senator Moynihan (D) as Director of Communications in the Senator’s 1988 re-election campaign.
 
RakuraiTenjin said:
Are you kidding? He's a raving lefty, listen to his rantings.

His short bio shows him working with some of the most left in the senate.

From 1993 through 1995, Mr. O’Donnell was the Democratic Chief of Staff of the United States Senate Committee on Finance. The Committee has jurisdiction over legislation involving taxation, international trade, health care, Social Security, Welfare, and other income security programs.

In 1992, Mr. O’Donnell was Chief of Staff of the United States Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works.

From 1989 until 1992, Mr. O’Donnell served as Senior Advisor to Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan. He began his professional association with Senator Moynihan (D) as Director of Communications in the Senator’s 1988 re-election campaign.
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i dont know how you can equate the democrats with the left ..they barely make centrist. I hate that most republicans label anyone who didnt agree with the war as "left"
 
CptStern said:
i dont know how you can equate the democrats with the left ..they barely make centrist. I hate that most republicans label anyone who didnt agree with the war as "left"
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I was more referring to the committees he's on. Regardless of party, I'm saying he is a raving liberal. If you asked him if he was he'd say he was a liberal just as I'd say I'm a conservative if you asked me. There's no saying he's not one.
 
yes but what you say is liberal doesnt mean liberal anywhere else ...I mean would you equate say Hilary clinton and Noam Chomsky as both being liberal? They're so far removed from each other that there would be little to no similiarities ..in fact Hilary would have more in common with a conservative than with Chomsky
 
"I revealed in yesterday's taping of the McLaughlin Group that Time magazine's emails will reveal that Karl Rove was Matt Cooper's source. I have known this for months but didn't want to say it at a time that would risk me getting dragged into the grand jury."
 
No Limit said:
I am stupid?
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Yes.
How much would you like to bet Glirk, Foxtrot and possibly others would be in here defending him?
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I don't know, its their prerogative. How much would I like to bet that some idiot lefty would make a thread immediately proclaiming "Karl Rove is a traitor" which has absolutely no basis in fact whatsoever? Don't try and be hypocritical and think you can get away with it, it insults us all. Maybe in soviet russia you dont have to have a trial before youre "condamned" by No Limit, but in America you do. Until then, shove it.
If Glirk or Foxtrot doesn't condamn that statement I expect a full apology from you.
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Tell you what. if Glirk or Foxtrot dont "condamn" that statement, I'll apologize for calling you stupidfor jumping to unproven conclusions. HES A TRAITOR LOL. :rolleyes:
 
gh0st said:
Yes.

I don't know, its their prerogative. How much would I like to bet that some idiot lefty would make a thread immediately proclaiming "Karl Rove is a traitor" which has absolutely no basis in fact whatsoever? Don't try and be hypocritical and think you can get away with it, it insults us all. Maybe in soviet russia you dont have to have a trial before youre "condamned" by No Limit, but in America you do. Until then, shove it.

Tell you what. if Glirk or Foxtrot dont "condamn" that statement, I'll apologize for calling you stupidfor jumping to unproven conclusions. HES A TRAITOR LOL. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
I wont waste my time responding to your personal attacks. There is plenty of evidance Rove had something to do with this, you can ignore it if you'd like. What I will say is when Rove is proven to have something to do with this and you and your republican friends defend him I will point you to this thread.
 
No Limit said:
I wont waste my time responding to your personal attacks. There is plenty of evidance Rove had something to do with this, you can ignore it if you'd like. What I will say is when Rove is proven to have something to do with this and you and your republican friends defend him I will point you to this thread.
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There is lots of "evidance" that lots of things happen. Some are unsubstantiated, some this some that, people get proven innocent all the time. If he's genuinely a traitor NO republican will defend him. Especially me. I've already said so in this thread. Until his verdict is decided by judge and jury, you have no basis to call him a traitor. Oh, and when he's acquitted of all charges, I will point back to this thread and how arrogant you were thinking you can just label people how you want.
 
On Friday, I broke the story that the e-mails that Time turned over to the prosecutor that day reveal that Karl Rove is the source Matt Cooper is protecting. That provoked Rove’s lawyer, Robert Luskin, to interrupt his holiday weekend to do a little defense work with Newsweek and the Los Angeles Times. On Saturday, Luskin decided to reveal that Rove did have at least one conversation with Cooper, but Luskin told the Times he would not “characterize the substance of the conversation.”

Luskin claimed that the prosecutor “asked us not to talk about what Karl has had to say.” This is highly unlikely. Prosecutors have absolutely no control over what witnesses say when they leave the grand jury room. Rove can tell us word-for-word what he said to the grand jury and would if he thought it would help him. And notice that Luskin just did reveal part of Rove’s grand jury testimony, the fact that he had a conversation with Cooper. Rove would not let me get one day of traction on this story if he could stop me. If what I have reported is not true, if Karl Rove is not Matt Cooper’s source, Rove could prove that instantly by telling us what he told the grand jury. Nothing prevents him from doing that, except a good lawyer who is trying to keep him out of jail.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/theblog/archive/lawrence-odonnell/update-on-rove_3584.html


I have a call in to Bob Luskin, Karl Rove’s lawyer, but I’m not holding my breath for a call back. He knows I know too much, since I broke the story last week that his client is one of the secret sources Matt Cooper has been protecting for the last two years. I have three questions for Luskin:

Q: You’ve said Rove is not a target of the investigation. Is he a subject of the investigation?

Q: Since Time delivered its e-mails to the prosecutor on Friday, have you asked the prosecutor whether Rove’s status has changed? From witness to subject? Or subject to target?

Q: You told Newsweek that your client “never knowingly disclosed classified information.” Did Rove ever unknowingly disclose classified information?

Luskin spent the weekend on the phone with reporters from Newsweek, the Washington Post, and the Los Angeles Times trying to put out the fire I started on Friday. He relied heavily on the claim that the prosecutor had assured him that Rove is not a target of the investigation.

Here is the U.S. Attorneys’ Manual's definition of target: “A ‘target’ is a person as to whom the prosecutor or the grand jury has substantial evidence linking him or her to the commission of a crime and who, in the judgment of the prosecutor, is a putative defendant.”

Getting an assurance that you are not a target is pretty easy until the prosecutor really has the goods on you -- “a putative defendant.”

Here’s the Manual’s definition of subject: “A ‘subject’ of an investigation is a person whose conduct is within the scope of the grand jury's investigation.” Subjects frequently have their status upgraded to target when prosecutors get new information, like this one did on Friday.

Subject is a scary status. Prosecutors have to attach an "Advice of Rights" form to all grand jury subpoenas served on any "target" or "subject" of an investigation. Here’s what the form says:
* You may refuse to answer any question if a truthful answer to the question would tend to incriminate you.

* Anything that you do say may be used against you by the grand jury or in a subsequent legal proceeding.

* If you have retained counsel, the grand jury will permit you a reasonable opportunity to step outside the grand jury room to consult with counsel if you so desire.

Mere witnesses don’t get those forms attached to their subpoenas. Was it attached to any one of the three subpoenas Rove got from the grand jury? Three trips to the same grand jury is frequently an indicator of subject status.

I have no problem with Luskin reading my questions here before he gets on the phone with me or any of the reporters he has already been willing to talk to. These aren’t the kinds of questions you can easily fudge the answers to. I would never waste a lawyers’ time with one of those. All I need is a yes or no. Won’t take a minute.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/theblog/archive/lawrence-odonnell/three-questions-for-karl-_3683.html
 
Judith Miller's fellow inmate is the terrorist Moussaoui. Haha that's a whopper.
 
Show where he was convicted. Oh you cant? Then shut the **** up, whether he's guilty or not, he's innocent until proven. You have no basis to say what you just did.
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Exactly. It seems many from the left post this shit in an attempt to get a rise out of the right. Very inflammatory. Just make your posts without the unnecessary crap.
 
seinfeldrules said:
Exactly. It seems many from the left post this shit in an attempt to get a rise out of the right. Very inflammatory. Just make your posts without the unnecessary crap.
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Ya think? Everything No Limit posts is to get a rise out of the right.

Every one of his threads has something along the lines of this:

I can't wait for a right winger on here to come in and defend the actions of Rove, saying treason is okay if you are a republican.
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Which was posted in the main post of this topic, and is only slightly varied in each thread. Its all about calling out to the 'stupid right'.
 
Raziaar said:
Which was posted in the main post of this topic, and is only slightly varied in each thread. Its all about calling out to the 'stupid right'.
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Yeah, you got me all figured out. Like when we have one of the best and most meaningful discussions on the Iraq war we ever had on this board and that 1 right wing asshat comes in and gets the thread locked. I wonder why I need disclaimers like that? But, I'm trailing off-topic.

Back to topic, since you all seem to be attacking me for saying Rove is a traitor let me ask you this. If it is proven that Rove was the source for Cooper and he was the one that gave Plame's name will you all consider him a traitor?
 
No Limit said:
Yeah, you got me all figured out. Like when we have one of the best and most meaningful discussions on the Iraq war we ever had on this board and that 1 right wing asshat comes in and gets the thread locked. I wonder why I need disclaimers like that? But, I'm trailing off-topic.

Back to topic, since you all seem to be attacking me for saying Rove is a traitor let me ask you this. If it is proven that Rove was the source for Cooper and he was the one that gave Plame's name will you all consider him a traitor?
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Your posts speak for themselves man. In nearly every one its about "I bet the right won't, will, etc etc etc". Its all about seeking to antagonizing 'the right'. I don't view them as disclaimers... I view them as challenges. Challenges to get them riled up.
 
Raziaar said:
Your posts speak for themselves man. In nearly every one its about "I bet the right won't, will, etc etc etc". Its all about seeking to antagonizing 'the right'. I don't view them as disclaimers... I view them as challenges. Challenges to get them riled up.
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Challanges are fine, but come on, I don't think even you will defend people like Foxtrot that have turned this board upside down to shit. Go look at the thread about Iraq baselessness; it was a great thread until he stepped in. And this was not the first time that happened. Yes, I am a little hard on the right wing but I expect them to be hard on me at the same time; that way both sides are presented farily and people can judge for themselves who's right and who's wrong. I respect a lot of right wingers on here, you being one of them. But you have to understand when someone posts constant flamebait without even trying to make some sense and every thread they post in gets locked it gets a little old and I get extremely frustrated.

If you are looking at getting an unbiased post from me you will be extremely disappointed like I would be if I expected an unbiased post from Seinfeldrules. Its politcs baby, if I am wrong on something point it out and you will find I'm not that hard headed. I will admit there isn't definiate evidance of Rove being a traitor; but I've followed this since it broke and I believe Rove is behind it despite there not being enough evidance to actually convict him at this time just like you might think Michael Jackson is guilty even if there isn't enough evidance to convict him. We will know in time, who knows, I could be wrong but at the same time you might also be wrong. We'll have to wait and see.
 
No Limit said:
Challanges are fine, but come on, I don't think even you will defend people like Foxtrot that have turned this board upside down to shit. Go look at the thread about Iraq baselessness; it was a great thread until he stepped in. And this was not the first time that happened. Yes, I am a little hard on the right wing but I expect them to be hard on me at the same time; that way both sides are presented farily and people can judge for themselves who's right and who's wrong. I respect a lot of right wingers on here, you being one of them. But you have to understand when someone posts constant flamebait without even trying to make some sense and every thread they post in gets locked it gets a little old and I get extremely frustrated.

If you are looking at getting an unbiased post from me you will be extremely disappointed like I would be if I expected an unbiased post from Seinfeldrules. Its politcs baby, if I am wrong on something point it out and you will find I'm not that hard headed. I will admit there isn't definiate evidance of Rove being a traitor; but I've followed this since it broke and I believe Rove is behind it despite there not being enough evidance to actually convict him at this time just like you might think Michael Jackson is guilty even if there isn't enough evidance to convict him. We will know in time, who knows, I could be wrong but at the same time you might also be wrong. We'll have to wait and see.
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Nice, blame everyone but yourself, you bait, so I post, then you get pissy about it. It is your game, sftu or stop playing.
 
I don't even know who Karl Rove is. I stopped paying attention to new steaming heaps of politic bullshit.
 
Raziaar said:
I stopped paying attention to new steaming heaps of politic bullshit.
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Honesly, I think everyone needs to start paying more attenton, it would make this country a much better place.

Nice, blame everyone but yourself, you bait, so I post, then you get pissy about it. It is your game, sftu or stop playing.
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How many times have I asked you to stay out of my threads now? Did you not notice a pattern where the thread is fine but as soon as you step in it gets locked? Forget it, I think I'm just going to ignore you from now unless I really need to address something you say.
 
No Limit said:
How many times have I asked you to stay out of my threads now? Did you not notice a pattern where the thread is fine but as soon as you step in it gets locked? Forget it, I think I'm just going to ignore you from now unless I really need to address something you say.
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I'm not defending him, but these forums are open for everyone to come in and express their opinion, you cannot make a thread and tell people not to post in it and expect them to follow it, there is a right to free speech on the internet
 
No Limit said:
Honesly, I think everyone needs to start paying more attenton, it would make this country a much better place.
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Its fine if you keep up to date on politics... but getting involved in political debates all the time? It makes your life a living hell. It has mine. I want that to change. I don't have fun posting about politics on these boards, but for some reason i'm drawn to do so. It just brings down my day in doing it.



How many times have I asked you to stay out of my threads now? Did you not notice a pattern where the thread is fine but as soon as you step in it gets locked? Forget it, I think I'm just going to ignore you from now unless I really need to address something you say.
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I don't think telling somebody to stay out of a thread is going to do anything. They are not exclusive. If you have a problem with somebody, ignoring them is the best option, like you said.


I'm not defending him, but these forums are open for everyone to come in and express their opinion, you cannot make a thread and tell people not to post in it and expect them to follow it, there is a right to free speech on the internet
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There's not a right... there's just a lack of 'no rights'.
 
 
Icarusintel said:
I'm not defending him, but these forums are open for everyone to come in and express their opinion, you cannot make a thread and tell people not to post in it and expect them to follow it, there is a right to free speech on the internet
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I understand that, but you have to understand that 90% of threads he posts in that were otherwise good get locked. If you are going to post and add to the discussion that's great, but if you post flame bait to get the thread locked it is over the line. I know I can't tell him to not post in my threas, I'm certainly not a mod; but I'm just making the point that his bullshit needs to stop.

Its fine if you keep up to date on politics... but getting involved in political debates all the time? It makes your life a living hell. It has mine. I want that to change. I don't have fun posting about politics on these boards, but for some reason i'm drawn to do so. It just brings down my day in doing it.
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Believe it or not I don't dwell on politics in my daily life even if I sound like I take it personal here.
 
I know at this point of the thread your all bitching, but i saw this, probably is a guilty(of something):


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/theblog/archive/david-corn/explosive-new-rove-revela_3933.html
Time to get ready for the Karl Rove frog-march? David Corn at Huffington
I don't usually log on Saturday evenings. But I've received information too good not to share immediately. It was only yesterday that I was bemoaning the probability that -- after a week of apparent Rove-related revelations--it might be a while before any more news emerged about the Plame/CIA leak. Yet tonight I received this as-solid-as-it-gets tip: on Sunday Newsweek is posting a story that nails Rove. The newsmagazine has obtained documentary evidence that Rove was indeed a key source for Time magazine's Matt Cooper and that Rove--prior to the publication of the Bob Novak column that first publicly disclosed Valerie Wilson/Plame as a CIA official -- told Cooper that former Ambassador Joseph Wilson's wife apparently worked at the CIA and was involved in Joseph Wilson's now-controversial trip to Niger.
To be clear, this new evidence does not necessarily mean slammer-time for Rove. Under the relevant law, it's only a crime for a government official to identify a covert intelligence official if the government official knows the intelligence officer is under cover, and this documentary evidence, I'm told, does not address this particular point. But this new evidence does show that Rove -- despite his lawyers claim that Rove "did not tell any reporter that Valerie Plame worked for the CIA" -- did reveal to Cooper in a deep-background conversation that Wilson's wife was in the CIA.
 
If he is found guilty I hope he is punished as such. However, just being in the source doesn't mean it was him.

In any case, leaking this kind of information is very bad, doesn't matter which political side they are on(shouldn't matter, unless people only see 2 sides to politics). It's not like everyone coniders themselves conservative or liberal and bands together as such to fight the evil other side. It's politics, everyone should have their own views, just thought I should clear that up as no limit has apparently declared war on the war mongering right wing and won't let up with anything less than blood.
 
Foxtrot said:
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1490296&postcount=127
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488850&postcount=39
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488749&postcount=44
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488437&postcount=116
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488393&postcount=29
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488365&postcount=111
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488321&postcount=100
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1487352&postcount=31
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1487172&postcount=10

I have made a little list highlighting some of No Limits quality posts, where he is obviously not flaming, trolling or anything event remotley close to that.
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No Limit,
YOU JUST GOT SERVED!!!
:)
 
Foxtrot said:
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1490296&postcount=127
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488850&postcount=39
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488749&postcount=44
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488437&postcount=116
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488393&postcount=29
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488365&postcount=111
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1488321&postcount=100
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1487352&postcount=31
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1487172&postcount=10

I have made a little list highlighting some of No Limits quality posts, where he is obviously not flaming, trolling or anything event remotley close to that.
Click to expand...

Ah, c'mon. Ad hominem attacks are part of No Limit's charm.:E :E
 
Hapless said:
Says the guy with over 7,000 posts.
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I'm talking about the politics forum...and what I mean by "too caught up in it"...Is about attacking each other because they don't like your side and so on.
 
Total.

I would think dick was more of the dick. LOLOLOL PUN INTENDED
 
I've never seen so many people obsessed over one man before in such a negative way. Heh. Live are being wasted, here.
 
Raziaar said:
I've never seen so many people obsessed over one man before in such a negative way. Heh. Live are being wasted, here.
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Are you speaking of the hate and contempt for michael moore, yeah its pretty much a waste... After all he's just a film maker, not a politician who affects millions of peopls lives or anything...
 
Innervision961 said:
Are you speaking of the hate and contempt for michael moore, yeah its pretty much a waste... After all he's just a film maker, not a politician who affects millions of peopls lives or anything...
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Heh.... you people will still be obsessed about him years and years after he's out of office. Yes, he's a politician, that should be good concern, and reason to pay attention about him. But you all go so much further than that... you've made a lifestyle out of him. lol
 
Hapless said:
Did you just say "eh?" What are you, Canadian?:E :E :E
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I say eh all the time, and i'm not Canadian. lol.
 
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