Lisbon Treaty - Ireland votes on 12th of June

PvtRyan said:
Why the fuck even have a referendum? It's like asking an accountant to build a skyscraper.
Click to expand...
Because of our constitution we require a referendum to ratify all EU treaties.
 
Nemesis6 said:
Ah, that's the same act that the British police use to harass protesters who call Scientology a cult. You see, anyone who does is arrested.
Click to expand...
That incident's what I was taking a swipe at ;)
 
It just got ratified by Gordon Brown last night. People are pissed, and he is an absolute tool.
 
What I don't understand is, why not just keep the current EU system?
 
It's fairly obvious, they want to centralise the control of the union even more. This is a preconceived agenda, it's about centralising power aswell as economic descision making, step by step, treaty by treaty.
 
clarky003 said:
It just got ratified by Gordon Brown last night. People are pissed, and he is an absolute tool.
Click to expand...

Thats alright, a high up judge told Broon he shouldn't continue with ratification until a court case brought questioning the legality of ratifying it without refurendum has been resolved, so thats shit in Broons face.




The current EU system is broken, its unwieldy, corrupt, undemocratic and un-accountable to the people, centralization of power for the sake of it, hugely unpopular without any democratic call for its agenda of creating one highly artificial nationality.

The fact alone the EU's behaviour to the Irish no vote proves its obviously not for the little man, not a union of equals but a union of certain states controlling it. Oh and finally, the treaty was so flawed I cant believe anyone with a brain supports it, but then thats why the pro-EU lots only answer to a genuine issue is to call you a Nazi, xenophobe, "Little Englander" or whatever, ignorant, or any number of insults without actually answering the point.


I don't know, frankly the EU needs to be dismantled, and a new organization built up to take its place to deal with European trade and co-operation, of course some of the EU states can keep the EU for their masturbation efforts towards union, and good for them, let them live together as one highly artificial country, but yeah, even if the EU got everything it wanted, it would soon fall apart as *gasp* surprise, surprise, the Germans and French realize they don't wanna live together, and the sheer amount of independence movements that would pop up would see the EU crumble before it even got started.




Love Europe, hate the EU, bye Brussels, Don't worry, after the EU is gone you'll still have to deal with the fact the Wallonians and Flemish don't even want to live together in your own country, so you'll have some type of union to cement.
 
You can't win with these bastards. If you support the EU, it's obviously because you're as enlightened as the government, and if you don't it's obviously because you just don't see the light.
The sheer audacity they display in completely ignoring public opinion (which they have been doing LONG before the Irish vote, indeed the reworded Lisbon treaty itself was created solely to circumvent public opinion) and even in suggesting that they should hold more referendums in Ireland (until they give the "right answer", of course), is beyond belief.

Like with the government paper on national road pricing, which lays out how they intend to beat a viciously opposed populace into submission through propaganda and making people think it's going to happen anyway and there's nothing anyone can do about it, so they will resist no longer.

I really question the worth of any man who can happily sit there and cheer for whatever hairbrained scheme the government is forcing upon us this time in the most disrespectful and contemptuous manner possible. Are we a society of Victorian women or something?
 
Sarkozy is being an absolute dickhead, about the Irish no vote
 
repiV said:
80% of the laws brought in here are EU laws. We have to comply with all sorts of nonsensical regulations in the name of "harmonisation", that we have absolutely no control over because we do not elect the EU government.

We pay a fortune into the EU and get very little financially out of it - this is good for us why?
Click to expand...
Can't you see how much an open market would benefit everyone?

OK, in the short run there will be some erosion of freedom but if it gives people the chance to make more money by collaborating, I think that's a good thing.
 
He's trying to make legal loopholes to pass the treaty regardless of the no vote.
 
Mr Stabby said:
He's trying to make legal loopholes to pass the treaty regardless of the no vote.
Click to expand...

I know, he is such a dickhead.

Frankly, I am more pro-EU than most Britons (and almost certianly more than the other british posters in this thread) but I can't help but feel that it is scared of something. As I said earlier, after the EU constitution failed to pass, Ireland is the only government to have a referundum on anything else EU related.

And you know what pisses me off the most? The Labour Government promised the British people a vote on the Libson Treaty...and we didn't get one. Anyone who has lived in Britain for even a short time will know that it wouldn't pass...but thats besides the point, the government ignored democracy and the voice of the people.

With this, on top of the new recreational drug restrictions (I don't do cannabis, but I know several stoners who are extremely docile and harmless and will be effected by the ludicrous new laws), 10p tax thing, etc. I am seriously considering leaving for another country. Somewhere like Holland, Austrailia, Canada, the USA...anywhere where freedom still has meaning and the government is reasonably comptent tbh.
 
Good post, Atomic, actually you'll find allot of British anti-EU opinions in here are exactly because of how the EU is behaving more then any flat out opposition to foreign co-operation and integration.


Personally, I am mostly of the mind that Britain works for the UK for the foreseeable future, I also have soft leanings towards Scottish independence, but I won't lose sleep if it never happens.

Likewise I am not completely opposed to the eventual union of Europe into a single state, but it has to be an incredibly useful, competent and democratic and accountable regime.

I certainly have no desire to be a citizen of any potential EU state stemming from the current union and how it stands.

As it stands now its a complete and utter mess, and it could flout every benefit its brought to Europe till its face goes blue, but I want nothing to do with such a large unwieldy super-state project while it cant even meet the democratic and accountable ideals I have grown up with an embraced as the only way I or most other Britons would want to live.

Not to mention the near impossibility of trying to convince a continent where some of these nationalities have existed for centuries upon centuries, their right to exist having been paid in blood and sacrifice, that suddenly they aren't real and subservient to the incredibly artificial European nationality.



So until such a time as the EU can see itself turning into an efficient competent loose federation with a high degree of national autonomy and most importantly meets my snobbish standards for accountability and democratic rights, like, oh say having my vote on its existence and big ol constitutions, called such or otherwise, than no thanks.


If worst comes to worst New Zealand is always an option, not Australia, strange place that, and so many poisonous critters...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

nurizeko
Sooo...that Lisbon treaty...
Replies
33
Views
2K
unozero
unozero
Back
Top