More demands from IslaM - Pat Condell

[repiV]

Wow, you seem to know more about my country than I do. We are united in the sense that we live in the same country, every foreigner has their own culture. I'm originally polish so I think I know what I am talking about in this respect. This kinid of culture mixing here has been going on for centuries and thats what defines america despite what the right wing here would like you to believe. We are no more patriotic than any other country. We hang american flags here, you hand british flags there. We have a national anthem you have a national anthem. It is no different than any other place on earth eventhough we have the most diverse population on the planet.

I don't remember the last time I saw a British flag. I don't even know our national anthem, nor do most people. We don't do pledges of allegiance either...
In fact, it's not unusual to hear of organisations (typically public sector) banning the flag because it could be construed as racist.

Really, the US is far more patriotic than any other country. Almost sickeningly so in cases.
I've spoken to far too many Americans in my time to believe that it's "no different to any other country". And I've also been there. The USA really is unique. And besides, unless you've experienced immigration UK style, how can you say that it's just the same?

You didn't answer the second part of my question, how many muslims do you think that applies to?

Well...it's 18% that believe the tube bombers were martyrs, and almost 50% that believe suicide bombing civilians is justified. Similar figures in favour of instituting Sharia law in the UK.

The link you posted doesnt say anything about how many muslims are doing that. If you dont like the pharmacy because a muslim wont sell you brith control go to a different pharmacy.

What right do they have to work in the local equivalent of Wal-Mart and then decide which products they will and will not sell me? Besides which, the main point here is the fundamental conflict between Islam and the West which happens to manifest itself as little things in everyday life, but really runs far deeper.

You have a gripe with cab companies allowing their cab drivers to do that? Ride a different cab. I was under the impression you liked the free market.

Actually, licensed taxis aren't allowed to refuse passengers for reasons like that. And again, the same applies as above - alcohol is a core part of our culture. If you can't accept it, you don't belong here.
Actually I read an article recently about these Muslim medical students that refused to study certain parts of the course including the effects of alcohol intoxication, birth control and one male student who took the option of failing his degree after years of study over performing a routine examination on a female patient. Nice waste of taxpayer money that was.

I will agree with you that they have no right to refuse to do what is required of them to complete public school and if you guys want to change your laws I will support that, but again, this is a small minority. When you say most thought the london bombers were martyrs can you post a source for that if you have it, I know someone posted it here before but I cant find it.

It was really hard to find last time and I don't really feel like trudging through the 'net again for it - but it's on the BBC somewhere. So is the Sharia law poll. That should help.

If I make it to London next summer I'll be sure to do that.

Cool.

That's your opinion. They are adapting in my country perfectly fine. And from what most people in the UK said in that other thread they are adapting there perfectly too. But I guess I should take your word for it.

They're really not adapting fine.

 

[jverne]

Free societies are NOT about "a bunch of different cultures living together in peace". The term you are searching for is "multicultural societies", which are being proven a total disaster all over Europe.

The US, a free society the last time I checked, puts a great deal of emphasis on the American identity and that immigrants must become Americans above all else and believe in the American ideology and the American way. It's the total antithesis to "having lots of cultures living together in peace". Until very recently, America had ONE culture. The mistake we make is not following suit.

What behaviour? I've gone over this countless times, why do you need me to repeat myself? It's a general failure/refusal to integrate that is specific to Muslims.

If you can't see the difference between saying that Islam is barbaric and that all Muslims are barbaric, I don't know what the point of even talking to you is. Furthermore, if you can't make the connection between uncontrolled immigration from barbaric societies and cultures that run counter to Western values, and social breakdown, then I think you need a reality check.

i agree with repi on the multiculturalism issue. in reality it is total bullshit, since alot of cultures demand the dismantling of another.
so why should we harbor someone who wants to "kill us"?

in real life...the melting pot method probably produces the most effective results. but of course it depends on what the smelter wants to do with it.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Well...actually it would solve a lot of them. Islam clearly is the biggest threat to the free world at present, not because it is militarily powerful, but because of the combination of the overwhelming power of the extremist ideology and the apathy and complacency of Western people and governments towards the threat. We allow it to flourish within our midst, and unless we take action now then I can guarantee that, sooner or later, it will eventually end in the attempted takeover of the Western world by Islam from within. We could stop this from happening now, and it wouldn't even have to be violent, but because people refuse to see Islam for what it is, it will become violent in due course. An Islamic revolution 50 years down the line isn't so hard to imagine, is it?

No, but to say that islam is the centre of all of the worlds problems is retarded and stupid.

 

[jverne]

No, but to say that islam is the centre of all of the worlds problems is retarded and stupid.

at least it would be the end of one retarded and stupid problem

 

[repiV]

i agree with repi on the multiculturalism issue. in reality it is total bullshit, since alot of cultures demand the dismantling of another.
so why should we harbor someone who wants to "kill us"?

in real life...the melting pot method probably produces the most effective results. but of course it depends on what the smelter wants to do with it.

What I was getting at when I asked No Limit about the purpose of culture is something very fundamental to human civilisation...clearly culture is a condition which evolves over time to allow a group of people to act as a cohesive, productive, harmonious unit. It sets both boundaries and common ground.
Evidently, society is designed to function around ONE culture - when cultures are mixed up in some kind of jumbled mess, problems inevitably arise. When the cultures are as diametrically opposed as Western culture and Islam, that's a recipe for disaster.
A healthy society must maintain ONE culture. It's not just politics, it's surely nature.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

at least it would be the end of one retarded and stupid problem

Hahahaha..ha...ha...h.

 

[Absinthe]

The link you posted doesnt say anything about how many muslims are doing that. If you dont like the pharmacy because a muslim wont sell you brith control go to a different pharmacy.

...No?

You would be outraged if pharmacists were refusing to fill prescriptions for birth control in deference to their Christian faith. Why should Muslims be allowed an exception? It's not like they're the ones doing the prescribing. That's done by an actual doctor. Pharmacists are middle men that are meant to supply you with what is virtually yours, and they are in no position to impose their morals onto you. It is not their perogative to "save" customers according to their faith. Just like it is not a Muslim cab driver's perogative to turn down the blind with their seeing-eye dogs on the grounds that they don't want to be in the company of "filthy animals".

If your faith is not compatible with your profession and prevents you from doing your job properly, then you have no business being in it. These examples are not under the protection of the free market. They are subject to rules and standards that are meant to ensure equal treatment of customers. But Islam is getting a pass in many cases. That's ridiculous and should not be tolerated in the least. The correct way to go about a Muslim refusing service is to complain until he's hopefully fired. Not retreat elsewhere and shoot yourself in the foot.

 

[jverne]

...No?

You would be outraged if pharmacists were refusing to fill prescriptions for birth control in deference to their Christian faith. Why should Muslims be allowed an exception? It's not like they're the ones doing the prescribing. That's done by an actual doctor. Pharmacists are middle men that are meant to supply you with what is virtually yours, and they are in no position to impose their morals onto you. It is not their perogative to "save" customers according to their faith. Just like it is not a Muslim cab driver's perogative to turn down the blind with their seeing-eye dogs on the grounds that they don't want to be in the company of "filthy animals".

If your faith is not compatible with your profession and prevents you from doing your job properly, then you have no business being in it. These examples are not under the protection of the free market. They are subject to rules and standards that are meant to ensure equal treatment of customers. But Islam is getting a pass in many cases. That's ridiculous and should not be tolerated in the least. The correct way to go about a Muslim refusing service is to complain until he's hopefully fired. Not retreat elsewhere and shoot yourself in the foot.

agreed...


how can anyone even think of defend the muslim pharmacist who wouldn't sell contraceptives?

nobody should impose rules derived from fairy tales. only a doctor should be allowed to judge yes or no...and even that should be based on your health not on his believes.


from a theoretical point of view what you said No limit is utterly retarded, but practically it would be less a hassle to go to another pharmacy than try to argue.
but you get my point.

 

[No Limit]

...No?

You would be outraged if pharmacists were refusing to fill prescriptions for birth control in deference to their Christian faith. Why should Muslims be allowed an exception? It's not like they're the ones doing the prescribing. That's done by an actual doctor. Pharmacists are middle men that are meant to supply you with what is virtually yours, and they are in no position to impose their morals onto you. It is not their perogative to "save" customers according to their faith. Just like it is not a Muslim cab driver's perogative to turn down the blind with their seeing-eye dogs on the grounds that they don't want to be in the company of "filthy animals".

If your faith is not compatible with your profession and prevents you from doing your job properly, then you have no business being in it. These examples are not under the protection of the free market. They are subject to rules and standards that are meant to ensure equal treatment of customers. But Islam is getting a pass in many cases. That's ridiculous and should not be tolerated in the least. The correct way to go about a Muslim refusing service is to complain until he's hopefully fired. Not retreat elsewhere and shoot yourself in the foot.

And thats up to the individual business to decide. A pharmacy is a business like any other place. If pharmacy B doesn't want to offer the drug because they have a crazy christian pharmacist then I can go to pharamacy A. Are you saying as a business owner I don't have a right to decide what I want to sell and what I don't want to sell?

If an employee sues the business for being fired for not offering certain drugs then I would totally support throwing that lawsuit out. But if a business is allowing this to happen let them, you are not forced to shop there.

Edit, I had to cut the above short:

I don't know why you assume that if I am not outraged by this when a muslim does it I would be outraged when a christian does it. Do I think they aren't doing their job? Sure. It is up to the employer if they want to take action, I don't care if its a jew, a muslim, or a christian doing it. But that's the entire point, this happens throughout most religions. Yet people like repiV single out a single religion, use it as an example that they aren't integrating, and then say they should be thrown out of the country. Why is this a big deal when a muslim does it and its not a big deal when a christian does it? And why do you, Absinthe, continue to add your credibility to help him make that point. You are smarter than that, you should be able to see through his bullshit.

This religious pharmacist bullshit has been going on for decades as I stated, not once did I run into a case of being denied birth control or the day after pill. Does it happen? Im sure it does, but once again this is not an epedemic and is extremely rare. Most religious people are smart enough to know what they are signing up for when they join pharmacy school.

The study he posted once again shows how biased and how ridiculous their media is. They once again singled out muslims in this case which is less than 3% of the population. They made no mention of christians doing this which population is much greater. They are hyping a cultural war which isn't there, people like repiV are playing right in to that bullshit and you continue to help them do it.

 

[Mr Stabby]

What if hypothetically a pharmacy doesn't want to serve black people or gay people? Gays and Blacks should go elsewhere?

 

[No Limit]

What if hypothetically a pharmacy doesn't want to serve black people or gay people? Gays and Blacks should go elsewhere?

This doesn't have anything to do with the customer's skin color, religion, or anything else for that matter.

 

[Absinthe]

And thats up to the individual business to decide. A pharmacy is a business like any other place. If pharmacy B doesn't want to offer the drug because they have a crazy christian pharmacist then I can go to pharamacy A. Are you saying as a business owner I don't have a right to decide what I want to sell and what I don't want to sell?

Most of these businesses aren't owned by Muslims. These are cases where business owners are exempting Muslim workers from the same standards and rules that apply to every other employee. If it's privately owned, you may not be able to assail it from a legal standpoint. But it is morally and ethically bankrupt, especially if we're talking about something as serious as medicine. People should not be dicked around over this by pharmacists, Islamic or otherwise.

Perhaps I'm a tad too reactionary at this point, but I feel like facepalming myself when topics critical of Christianity attract people in droves while ones critical of Islam illicit a lot of what looks like tacit defense to me.

Also, you should probably stop painting me as an unwitting assistant to Christian/conservative bias just because I agree with repiV on some things. Of course there are hypocrites, but that doesn't change the fact that many Muslims still engage in detrimental behavior with horrid aspirations for Islamic revolution. Christians have their own share of wackos, naturally. But I shouldn't have to try to equalize my criticism between the two faiths under the idea that it's "fair".

 

[Mr Stabby]

This doesn't have anything to do with the customer's skin color, religion, or anything else for that matter.

It's about the pharmacist's personal views conflicting with his job

 

[No Limit]

And most of the time I agree with you. What bothers me is what repiV posts is usually alarmist propogenda. It has nothing to do with fairness. If you want to be fair then I will admit I have been more critical of christians than I have been of muslims in the past, I can not dispute that. Most of that has been because of my own personal experiances and I try to avoid this as much as I can. I'm certainly not perfect and I have been wrong on more than one occasion, but the reason I get so defensive when muslims are mentioned is because of the unfair way they are treated compared to other religions. It seems like when any other religion does something (yes, mostly I am speaking of christianity) they are given a free pass by the media and by people like repiV, when muslims do it they use it as an example of a cultural invasion. I don't understand why these people can't simply accept that most religious people are a bit crazy, but overall 99.9% of them are regular people just trying to get by without bothering the rest of us.

 

[No Limit]

It's about the pharmacist's personal views conflicting with his job

Sure, and its the employers call about what they want to do about it.

 

[jverne]

how about we treat all religions like shit, so no one will be more offended than the other.

seriously

 

[Asknoone]

<3 Pat Condell.

...No?

You would be outraged if pharmacists were refusing to fill prescriptions for birth control in deference to their Christian faith. Why should Muslims be allowed an exception? It's not like they're the ones doing the prescribing. That's done by an actual doctor. Pharmacists are middle men that are meant to supply you with what is virtually yours, and they are in no position to impose their morals onto you. It is not their perogative to "save" customers according to their faith. Just like it is not a Muslim cab driver's perogative to turn down the blind with their seeing-eye dogs on the grounds that they don't want to be in the company of "filthy animals".

If your faith is not compatible with your profession and prevents you from doing your job properly, then you have no business being in it. These examples are not under the protection of the free market. They are subject to rules and standards that are meant to ensure equal treatment of customers. But Islam is getting a pass in many cases. That's ridiculous and should not be tolerated in the least. The correct way to go about a Muslim refusing service is to complain until he's hopefully fired. Not retreat elsewhere and shoot yourself in the foot.

Agreed.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Absinthe wins as usual eh?

 

[repiV]

A free pass for Christianity?

Christianity is so insignificant in this country it's barely worth discussing.

Hell, I was chatting with my colleague yesterday who was born and grew up in Islamabad, but moved over here a year ago - I pointed out that London is completely different from the rest of the country and one city in particular where I spend a lot of weekends (Exeter) is beautiful.
His immediate reply was "probably because there's not many asians there", laughing. "Wherever we go, we seem to screw everything up...you get these pockets and it ruins places."
If a Muslim who grew up in Pakistan and has only this experience of being abroad can recognise the problem, then it's about time everyone else did too. Ironically Exeter actually is one of the most homogenous places in the country - 99.9% white British population.

 

[No Limit]

A free pass for Christianity?

Christianity is so insignificant in this country it's barely worth discussing.

Hell, I was chatting with my colleague yesterday who was born and grew up in Islamabad, but moved over here a year ago - I pointed out that London is completely different from the rest of the country and one city in particular where I spend a lot of weekends (Exeter) is beautiful.
His immediate reply was "probably because there's not many asians there", laughing. "Wherever we go, we seem to screw everything up...you get these pockets and it ruins places."
If a Muslim who grew up in Pakistan and has only this experience of being abroad can recognise the problem, then it's about time everyone else did too. Ironically Exeter actually is one of the most homogenous places in the country - 99.9% white British population.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/britain/article/0,,1395548,00.html

Tower Hamlets has the highest proportion of Muslim residents of any local authority in the country . . .

? . . . but even there it remains smaller than the Christian population.

London's Muslim population of 607,083 people is probably the most diverse anywhere in the world, besides Mecca.

? The 2001 census contained an optional religious question for the first time. A total of 621,366 people (8.7%) did not answer it . . .

? . . . which was the third most popular choice, after Christian (58.2%) and No Religion (15.8%).

I promised myself I would be done with this discussion with you but how in the world can you possibly say something like that. You think a population of less than 3% is more siginificant than a population of 58%? Are you willing to sit here and tell me that christian pharmacists in your country have never tried to deny certain drugs to people because of their religion? Or tried banning the teaching of evolution to children?

 

[repiV]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/britain/article/0,,1395548,00.html





I promised myself I would be done with this discussion with you but how in the world can you possibly say something like that. You think a population of less than 3% is more siginificant than a population of 58%? Are you willing to sit here and tell me that christian pharmacists in your country have never tried to deny certain drugs to people because of their religion? Or tried banning the teaching of evolution to children?

Christianity in the UK bears absolutely no resemblance to Christianity in the US. No, we don't have creationist loonies here, no we don't have people who try to ban the teaching of evolution here. It. Just. Doesn't. Happen.
Most of those 58% might identify themselves as Christian, but that doesn't mean they follow the religion. It's extremely rare to meet a proper Christian here, let alone a literalist one. Atheism has the overbearing credibility here that Christianity has in the US.
Tony Blair is actually a devout Catholic, but he has always stood by his belief that faith has no place in government. The one and only thing I can give him credit for.

 

[KagePrototype]

No, we don't have creationist loonies here, no we don't have people who try to ban the teaching of evolution here. It. Just. Doesn't. Happen.

Actually we do, but not as many as the US. You don't hear much about them, but they do exist.

 

[repiV]

Actually we do, but not as many as the US. You don't hear much about them, but they do exist.

Well, of course. But they're utterly insignificant. New World Order conspiracy theorists are more influential...

 

[No Limit]

Oh please, what a load of crap. The exact same thing can be said here about the christians. Most of them are sane and don't really follow their religion. Same exact thing applies to muslims, why you have such a hard time understanding this is troubling. But you again didn't answer my question, are you telling me christian pharmacists never denied birth control to people in your country? They never tried to change the way evolution is taught in your schools?

 

[Ravioli]

i dont get why people get so upset when you start challanging islam...or christianity for that sake. We cant just sit idly by and say "oh i have to respect their beliefs". Challanging someones beliefs shows respect, because you want to share your view of the idea and spread your knowledge.

I dont know about you guys, but im a pretty hardcore atheist, i never show respect for any religion because no religion shows respect for me. Respect is earned, not obligated, and religion hasnt earnd my respect. To put it in other words, this dude pretty much clears it for me: (hes doing a response to a ****tard christian who says that you should not challange someones beliefs because its "rude" and that atheist should not be allowed to speak their mind because its offensive to christians and islamic ppl lol )

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5ChJfg2oqY[/YOUTUBE]

 

[repiV]

Oh please, what a load of crap. The exact same thing can be said here about the christians. Most of them are sane and don't really follow their religion. Same exact thing applies to muslims, why you have such a hard time understanding this is troubling. But you again didn't answer my question, are you telling me christian pharmacists never denied birth control to people in your country? They never tried to change the way evolution is taught in your schools?

Correct. Now if you're done, your cocksure ignorance about Christianity outside the USA is embarrassing.

 

[Mr Stabby]

Northern Ireland unlike the rest of the UK, is full of fundamentalist Christians, I don't think they have ever tried to get creationism taught in schools. American fundamentalism is unique to America, it exists in an environment where it is not ridiculed.

 

[No Limit]

Correct. Now if you're done, your cocksure ignorance about Christianity outside the USA is embarrassing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/1872331.stm

and just so you don't claim this is an isolated incident here is one more:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4896652.stm

So you were wrong when you said they never tried to change the way evolution is taught, do I have to do another google search to prove you wrong on the pharmacist thing?

How can you possibly make such an idiotic claim that they have never tried to do this? It is common sense that fundamentalists from all religions do this all the time, it is not confined to one religion. And you are calling me ignorant?

BTW: As I've stated here many times I've lived outside of this country for over 7 years, in fact I wasn't even born here so I think I know enough about the world.

 

[No Limit]

Northern Ireland unlike the rest of the UK, is full of fundamentalist Christians, I don't think they have ever tried to get creationism taught in schools. American fundamentalism is unique to America, it exists in an environment where it is not ridiculed.

I have a really hard time believing that what happens here is unique. I grew up in Poland where you would have thought the government had a religion since the catholics were in control of everything, including public education.

 

[Nemesis6]

Ravioli, be really careful when quoting YouTube atheists. Some of them are quite nutty. One of them was banned, and I think it might have been The Amazing Atheist who wanted to leave because of it, but when you looked at the reason for the guy being banned, he posted a persons address, etc, so, my point being: Tread lightly within that community on YouTube.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

RepiV, you accept that christians can be liberal and sane. Is it too much of a strech of an imagination to say that most muslims are liberals or moderates?

 

[repiV]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/1872331.stm

and just so you don't claim this is an isolated incident here is one more:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4896652.stm

So you were wrong when you said they never tried to change the way evolution is taught, do I have to do another google search to prove you wrong on the pharmacist thing?

So a faith school/some rogue teachers decided to bend the curriculum a bit and that's evidence of a movement to change the way evolution is taught? Are you completely mad, or just slightly insane?

How can you possibly make such an idiotic claim that they have never tried to do this? It is common sense that fundamentalists from all religions do this all the time, it is not confined to one religion. And you are calling me ignorant?

Yes.

BTW: As I've stated here many times I've lived outside of this country for over 7 years, in fact I wasn't even born here so I think I know enough about the world.

Evidently not in this case.

 

[repiV]

RepiV, you accept that christians can be liberal and sane. Is it too much of a strech of an imagination to say that most muslims are liberals or moderates?

Why would I assume that most Muslims are liberals or moderates despite all evidence to the contrary, just because some people who follow an infinitely less violent, less intolerant, less political religion are?
The only moderate Muslims around are the ignorant ones who've never actually bothered to figure out what Islam is really all about, or those who know but refuse to disassociate themselves from it.

 

[Mr Stabby]

I have a really hard time believing that what happens here is unique. I grew up in Poland where you would have thought the government had a religion since the catholics were in control of everything, including public education.

America is the country where the head of state questioned the validity of evolution, and there is a creationism museum. The fact the American fundamentalism has such wide spread support is the issue. In the UK, anyone wishing to teach creationism would be ridiculed even by most Christians.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

In the UK, anyone wishing to teach creationism would be ridiculed even by most Christians.

Ya, I saw the archbishop of canterbury saying a literal interpretation of genisis is ridicoulous. It was pretty funny to imagine the creationists faces when he said he supported evolution.

 

[Ravioli]

Ravioli, be really careful when quoting YouTube atheists. Some of them are quite nutty. One of them was banned, and I think it might have been The Amazing Atheist who wanted to leave because of it, but when you looked at the reason for the guy being banned, he posted a persons address, etc, so, my point being: Tread lightly within that community on YouTube.

I know, ive been following the community for over a year now, spending hours everyday watching it, its like a TV show hahaha (yes i have no life). Brett Keane was a cool guy, but he was quite stupid on falling for the trap of getting himself banned.

 

[No Limit]

So a faith school/some rogue teachers decided to bend the curriculum a bit and that's evidence of a movement to change the way evolution is taught? Are you completely mad, or just slightly insane?

What is the difference between this and what you posted?

Not sure if you are suffering from hyocracy, delusion, or both.

And since I have a few mintues to spare this morning, an edit:

http://www.christiantoday.com/artic...in.high.court.over.abortion.campaign/9240.htm

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A5490-2005Mar27?language=printer

The trend began to spread to pharmacists with the approval of the morning-after pill and physician-assisted suicide in Oregon, with support from such organizations as the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops and Pharmacists for Life International, which claims 1,600 members on six continents. Its members are primarily in the United States, Canada and Britain.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/21469/Jail-threat-to-vicars-under-gay-hate-law

 

[repiV]

What is the difference between this and what you posted?

Not sure if you are suffering from hyocracy, delusion, or both.

The occasional nut with no credibility does not a movement make. Individuals using their right to free speech is not evidence that there is either a concerted effort to bring about political change nor that their ideas pose any threat whatsoever.
If you can't see the difference between the fundamentalist Christian movement in the States, and a few odd whackos over here that's ridiculed by everyone then you're not as smart as I thought.
This is a country where Christian leaders ridicule Christianity, after all.

And since I have a few mintues to spare this morning, an edit:

http://www.christiantoday.com/artic...in.high.court.over.abortion.campaign/9240.htm

What on earth does this prove? Other than that an old woman feels strongly about something and decides to be a have-a-go activist - subsequently getting punished for it?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A5490-2005Mar27?language=printer

That's from the USA. Irrelevant.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/21469/Jail-threat-to-vicars-under-gay-hate-law

All that proves is the disturbing erosion of free speech and civil liberties within our society.

 

[No Limit]

The occasional nut with no credibility does not a movement make. Individuals using their right to free speech is not evidence that there is either a concerted effort to bring about political change nor that their ideas pose any threat whatsoever.
If you can't see the difference between the fundamentalist Christian movement in the States, and a few odd whackos over here that's ridiculed by everyone then you're not as smart as I thought.

What evidance do you have that muslims do this more often than christians? Your gut feeling? This has nothing to do with the states. It has to do with clear examples of christians doing this type of shit in your country once in a while. How you can believe that muslims, which are part of only 3% of the population do this more often than christians which are 48% of the population? You have absolutely nothing to back this up other than your own speculation based on bigotry.

This is a country where Christian leaders ridicule Christianity, after all.

Examples?

What on earth does this prove? Other than that an old woman feels strongly about something and decides to be a have-a-go activist - subsequently getting punished for it?

It means you have your share of christian whackos, it is not restricted to Islam.

That's from the USA. Irrelevant.

The group that is doing this here in the US is also set up in Britain as well as Canada as I pointed out.

All that proves is the disturbing erosion of free speech and civil liberties within our society.

It proves there are christians and muslims in your country a like that are trying to say its okay to incite hate against gay people.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

I'm with Pat on this one. Good god, I hope he gets bodyguards though.