New video of Halo 3 Docu. about Brutes

[Warbie]

Whats this massive strategy business? The great thing about Halo is you can take the battle to them and kick ass.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

Awesome video, hope to see more.

 

[Jintor]

Whats this massive strategy business? The great thing about Halo is you can take the battle to them and kick ass.

Lolz, Legendary.

I can't remember Halo 1 Legendary. Except for whatever the last chapter was called. The Maw. That was fun. I did that all on Legendary just to see that tiny extra movie bit at the end.

Halo2 Legendary is, like, impossible unless you know every single detail of how the enemy reacts, the exact layout of the room and the precise number of shots that will kill an enemy. No room for error at all.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

as long as there's a single piece of cover and i have atleast 1 plasma gernade, its not that hard. (and everything is cover)

 

[ChiChi]

Did anyone feel as if the Brutes were still the same? In the gameplay vids the moved the exact same is in Halo 2, despite Bungie dedicating a whole documentary about how different they were in Halo 3. I did like the animations shown half-way through(the marines getting his arms pulled out, brute flipping the warthog etc.)

 

[Kyorisu]

HL2.net bash Halo - who would ever have thought it??!!

Climb back into your protective bubble wrap of quick saves and fps that take no skill - there's no place for you in Halo

Woohoo - 6k

Enjoy repeating the same level 10 times because you screwed up repeatably. Heck I had more fun playing Doom and Hexen co-op than Halo.

Ontopic: As for the Brutes, I don't see them being any different to Halo 2.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

Enjoy repeating the same level 10 times because you screwed up repeatably.

That's just noobage talking there, I didnt die that much the first time I played legendary (Halo 1). The only way u can die that much is if you dont learn from your previous mistakes.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying its a piece of shit. The first one was actually pretty good, except assualt on the control room. I think I just took a banshee and skipped to the end. Arbiter was the best thing about Halo 2 IMO, though I feel like the only person in the world who thinks this.

 

[Jintor]

Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying its a piece of shit. The first one was actually pretty good, except assualt on the control room. I think I just took a banshee and skipped to the end. Arbiter was the best thing about Halo 2 IMO, though I feel like the only person in the world who thinks this.

I liked him because of stealth, but i didn't like how he had no flashlight.

God the library was dark.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Yeah, sort of ironic he had all the dark levels. Except where the flood go to that mushroom spaceship where the covenant live.

 

[Sparta]

Enjoy repeating the same level 10 times because you screwed up repeatably.

Yeah, i never had the patience to work through Halo on Legendary. I tried going through Halo 2 on Legendary and go up to the snow level with the Elite character and lost interest. Although playing through Legendary on Halo 1 was awesome fun. Except the library and the third level, they were ****ing hard. I look forward to Halo 3, just because i want to see how they handle the end of the story. And the multiplayer should be good, but i'm not holding breath on the single-player

 

[Kouler]

I dont see why people say Halo is overrated, nearly everyone on the internet hates it.

 

[Warbie]

Most of these complaints, other than the the cut and paste level design (something which has been exagerated a good deal) are because Legendary is hard. I hate to agree with DEATHMASTER's carefully chosen words, but he's right. It's possible to thrash Legendary without spending the whole time hiding behind a box and gradually killing poeple one by one. This is my entire point - the learning curve is there if you put in the practise. You can speed run Halo on Legendary, flying through levels, clearing rooms full of elites in under a minute. This is what makes Halo's combat stand out - the game requires you to actually get good at it, other fps don't. Gameplay/combat wise, it's far deeper than anything else. If you're spending the whole time hiding and counting bullets it's probably time to drop a difficulty setting

Halo 2 is certainly harder, but the same is true for most of the game. Unfortunately, Halo 2 is let down in a number of other ways.

// bah - I told myself I wouldn't go into another Halo rant

 

[Jintor]

This is what makes Halo's combat stand out - the game requires you to actually get good at it, other fps don't. Gameplay/combat wise, it's far deeper than anything else. If you're spending the whole time hiding and counting bullets it's probably time to drop a difficulty setting

The thing is, getting 'good' at combat is sort of... arbitrary. I suppose the best definition would be 'Surviving' but is it being efficient at combat, getting a challenge out of combat... ai yah, i dunno anymore lah.

Anyway, I admit Halo and Halo 2 are fun. But I just hope they cut back on the "Cut and Paste" level design for Halo 3. Oh, and that the story will r0x0r my s0x0rs. It better.

 

[oldagerocker]

Legendary pisses me off. It's probably just me but I cant stand doing the same thing repeatedly again and again.
Doing the same stretch of map 10 times to get past that one elite or whatever. It's not getting better at the game, it's getting lucky.

 

[Warbie]

Not true - if that is the case then drop a difficulty setting. Halo rewards skill more than any other singleplayer fps - which is why, for me, it stands head and shoulders above the rest in combat.

 

[esplin]

The interview was pretty good, I like that Bungie finally has acknowledged the problem with the Brutes in Halo 2. However, I don't have much hope for their AI changing.

At one point in the interview one of the developers says, "What makes characters look like they are aware of eachother? Have them do the same thing."


WTF?


Then he says something like "We gave the Brutes a new ability where they would all chuck grenades at once."

Doesn't sound very tactical to me. It would be much better if one Brute threw a grenade to draw you out while the others got in a position to flank you. Or just have them split into two groups and pincer you.

While I heard the word "tactical" a lot, I did not hear "suppressing fire" "flanking" or "squad tactics" once.

 

[Rim-Fire]

Doesn't make very good gameplay? What does in Halo lolololol.

I found Halo 1 to me mostly very fun

I also found playing on Legendary to be enjoyable (except the Library :bonce

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

I enjoyed the libary. Very retro shooting; it was a nice break.

 

[Adabiviak]

Am I the only one here who thought that the levels in Halo were pretty good? They had jungles, beaches, alien vessels, snowy mountains/valleys, operational and destroyed Pillar of Autumn, rolling hills, Forerunner structures, looming cliffs, etc., all of which I thought were pretty well done. The Forerunner structures seem to be the areas where people get the idea that all the levels were the same, and that is because, if I'm not mistaken, you went in on a mission, found something rather unpleasant, and came back out the same way. Have an issue with the art direction for the Covenant war engine? Surely the color choices amplify the 'alienness' of the Covenant (admittedly so, since the assumption here was that it was a bad choice for combat). Would you rather have them dress in camoflage when they find themselves fighting in the snow, buildings, beaches, etc.? The Covenant use their invisible cloak for camoflage, which is arguably better.

More on topic, what exactly was horrible about this video? I just saw it and thought it looked pretty good, especially when it appears to be a work in progress. We'll see how it looks when it comes out, but what I saw made me want to play it for sure.

 

[AmishSlayer]

I think Halo deserves some serious props for something overlooked:

Vehicles

So many FPS's out there try to throw in a vehicle portion to the game and it ends up feeling tacked on with clunky control and stupid gameplay to go with it.

Halo 1 & the earth level in Halo 2 have the BEST vehicle gameplay I've played in any SP FPS ever.

EDIT:

Am I the only one here who thought that the levels in Halo were pretty good? They had jungles, beaches, alien vessels, snowy mountains/valleys, operational and destroyed Pillar of Autumn, rolling hills, Forerunner structures, looming cliffs, etc., all of which I thought were pretty well done. The Forerunner structures seem to be the areas where people get the idea that all the levels were the same, and that is because, if I'm not mistaken, you went in on a mission, found something rather unpleasant, and came back out the same way. Have an issue with the art direction for the Covenant war engine? Surely the color choices amplify the 'alienness' of the Covenant (admittedly so, since the assumption here was that it was a bad choice for combat). Would you rather have them dress in camoflage when they find themselves fighting in the snow, buildings, beaches, etc.? The Covenant use their invisible cloak for camoflage, which is arguably better.

More on topic, what exactly was horrible about this video? I just saw it and thought it looked pretty good, especially when it appears to be a work in progress. We'll see how it looks when it comes out, but what I saw made me want to play it for sure.

Thank you. Forerunner structures need some variety and Two Betrayals uses many of the same areas as Assault on the Control Room, but other than that I liked the level design in Halo.

 

[knut]

Yeah, I liked the levels, even the one's you had to backtrack through. I've said this before, and I really don't want to get into a arguement about it, but if anyone here has actually been inside anything remotly facility/military like you will see that, yes, most of the areas will look the same. Hell, I'll dumb it down for people; what about your schools? All the schools I've been through have, for the most part, stayed in the same style of architecture and design throughout every corridor, entrance way and hall. It's just... how it is. It would be totally unrealaistic if one room was bright orange then the next was dark and dull, then after that another bright room, only this time green. :| Whilst we are on the subject of ''Halo and HL2'' (as always happens ) even the Citadel did it with it's environment - and it works.

 

[Adabiviak]

So... what are the brutes like in combat anyway? It sounds like they're going to revamp their AI for Halo 3. I'm still waiting for Halo 2 to come out on PC.

 

[Rim-Fire]

Thank you. Forerunner structures need some variety and Two Betrayals uses many of the same areas as Assault on the Control Room, but other than that I liked the level design in Halo.

IMO the 2 best levels.

Edit:
I hate brutes, with a passion. I didn't like any of the new enemies in Halo 2, or the new weapons...or the new vehicles. Halo 2 added nothing good except duel wilding (for which they nerfed alot of weapons), the plasma sword and using the Arbiters stealth (who retardedly had some very dark levels despite having no means of illumination). The levels where also not as fun or epic-feeling as those in Halo 1.

 

[knut]

So... what are the brutes like in combat anyway? It sounds like they're going to revamp their AI for Halo 3. I'm still waiting for Halo 2 to come out on PC.

As the bloke said; pretty much just sponges in the fact that all they do is soak up ammo. They'd dance around a bit, take fire, hit you with Brute Shots and eventually drop their weapon and charge/pound you like an ape. Personally, I didn't like them.

 

[Adabiviak]

Did the demonstrations of the improved brute behavior seem promising in comparison?

 

[Asknoone]

I think Halo deserves some serious props for something overlooked:

Vehicles

So many FPS's out there try to throw in a vehicle portion to the game and it ends up feeling tacked on with clunky control and stupid gameplay to go with it.

Halo 1 & the earth level in Halo 2 have the BEST vehicle gameplay I've played in any SP FPS ever.

Water Hazard takes that spot for me. I enjoyed the Airboat very much, and the pacing and gameplay were tuned to a tea. However, I'd agree with Halo 1. I loved driving the Warthog, but I'm afraid Halo 2 suffers from the exact same 'clunky controls and stupid gameplay' you described.

 

[Adabiviak]

Have you played Scrapland? The storyline is perhaps a bit childish, but the vehicles in my opinion are the best. It's like a GTA-style environment, but 3-D. The control/response rocks, and is noticeably different between vehicles. It's the only reason I still play - just navigating around the cities at high speed is still fun, and combat races are intense.

 

[AmishSlayer]

Water Hazard takes that spot for me. I enjoyed the Airboat very much, and the pacing and gameplay were tuned to a tea. However, I'd agree with Halo 1. I loved driving the Warthog, but I'm afraid Halo 2 suffers from the exact same 'clunky controls and stupid gameplay' you described.

I thought the airboat had crappy controls that felt way too unrealistic. There was no drift whatsoever. It turned on a dime pretty much.

Halo 2 ruined all the vehicles but I still had a lot of fun with them on the Earth level.

 

[Warbie]

I thought the airboat had crappy controls that felt way too unrealistic. There was no drift whatsoever. It turned on a dime pretty much.

I have to agree. Alot of effort went into the sequences, and there were some cool moments, but this is the type of vehicle inclusion I hate with a passion - tacked on, there to tick a box, awful controls, just plain bad.

 

[Asknoone]

It was in no way there to tick a box, nor was tacked on. It was paced perfectly, and it didn't feel out of place or missing something. I can understand not liking it, but it certainly wasn't either of those things.

 

[kupocake]

Am I the only one here who thought that the levels in Halo were pretty good? They had jungles, beaches, alien vessels, snowy mountains/valleys, operational and destroyed Pillar of Autumn, rolling hills, Forerunner structures, looming cliffs, etc., all of which I thought were pretty well done.

On the one hand it's the kind of variety that you don't see as often in an FPS... but on the other, it's every scenario cliche gaming has ever thrown up. Tropical Island, Snow, Ancient Ruins, Technological Nightmare, Spaceship, Desert, Jungle? Am I describing Halo or Sonic the Hedgehog or both? Most FPS games have stuck to creating only a handful of these, and from the point of view of immersion, isn't that more interesting? Halo, despite being a rarely used and interesting setting in itself, is presented as more of a loose association of level-cliche types strung together with cut-scenes. Compared to somewhere like Black Mesa, or City 17 (which is a particularly underused and clever setting) Halo just doesn't have the same kind of coherence in design. You jump in the foehammer or the teleport chamber and it's no different from busting open the egg-chamber or climbing the flag outside the castle.

Kudos to the Bungie team in the video for knowing full well when something is wrong with something they've designed. This isn't something i've particularly doubted though, as many of the things that piss me off about Halo 1 don't feature in Halo 2... it's just a shame that they went and made new mess ups for the second game!

 

[Warbie]

Maybe I was being over harsh - i've a knee jerk reaction to mandatory vehicle sections. It did feel out of place to me though, and ruined the pace.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

I hated the Warthog in Halo 1. Maybe my driving skills just suck, but I was almost always sliding around like a dead hooker on ice.

 

[Adabiviak]

...like a dead hooker on ice? I daresay you just made that up, although for a combat vehicle on what one would expect to be its 'native' terrain, it sure had a lot of drift.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

Yes, like a dead hooker on ice. Should have payed up, yo.

Still, it was fun mowing down Covenant.

"Run, little blue midgets, RUN!"

 

[Rim-Fire]

I thought the airboat had crappy controls that felt way too unrealistic. There was no drift whatsoever. It turned on a dime pretty much.

I loved the airboat section!

 

[AmishSlayer]

I hated the Warthog in Halo 1. Maybe my driving skills just suck, but I was almost always sliding around like a dead hooker on ice.

That's what made it so fun. Too many vehicles in FPS games have rigid control with no sense of fluid movement. They nailed it with Halo 1...then they took away the fun in Halo 2 by making it have a lot more traction.

 

[destrukt]

I hate how the vehicles explode in H2. At many XBLANs after a while of 'serious' play we'd just make a game on Blood Gulch with the max amount of Warthogs you could have (I think you could get like 4 on the right settings IIRC) and we'd just go into the middle and ram each other till someone fell out of their Warthog and we'd run them down. ^____^

It was surprisingly fun and I miss other things like getting onto the top of maps, jamming Warthogs in the bases, etc.

Did anyone ever use the 'Halo Cache Editor' ? That was insanely fun. It let you edit the cache files (I would've never guessed) and you could do things like swap guns, for example, you could make the small machine gun on the tank shoot rockets or the normal tank gun (If you had 2 tanks with the machine gun shooting the tank cannon buttles in the same area it'd light up so much).

You could also enable 'Spiderman' mode and you could basically walk on any walls and there were tons of other things you could do but to have it work in multiplayer both of you had to have the EXACT same settings so we'd sit there with 1 person calling out EVERY setting and people with the other Xboxs would go 'Check' or whatever - this led to many headaches. :/

 

[Jintor]

Yeah, twas more fun when you could just snipe the bastard in the tank without damaging the tank. Sacrifice realism for fun! Your game is full of aliens anyway.

No, the main level bit was probably the Covenant battleships. I never had a sense of "This is an armoury, this is a loading bay" - just "This is garish-purple-room number 1, this is garish-purple-room number 2... which looks the same as 1... oh, wait, there are corpses, this is 1. Damn."

Vehicles for Halo 2 were... sorta fun, but not brilliant. The Pum- uh, I mean, the Warthog handled really strangely, too me. It fealt... really, really light.