No Mutants Allowed = Crybaby manboys?

[Tagaziel]

Why does it have to?

Because, I don't know, Fallout and Fallout 2 were designed to be as close to P&P RPGs as possible? And Fallout 3 is their successor?

It's kind of like Half-Life 2 Episode 3 becoming a go-cart racing game.

 

[KagePrototype]

Because, I don't know, Fallout and Fallout 2 were designed to be as close to P&P RPGs as possible? And Fallout 3 is their successor?

It's kind of like Half-Life 2 Episode 3 becoming a go-cart racing game.

That's a bit of an unfair comparison, since Fallout 3 isn't trying to jump genres (even then, it could end up being a good go-kart game). I guess the question should have been:

What's wrong with making it FPP and having the combat more KOTOR-ish, rather than entirely turn-based and top-down?

 

[Fliko]

It's kind of like Half-Life 2 Episode 3 becoming a go-cart racing game.

That's an unfair comparison in my opinion.
Say more like, Half-Life 2 and Codename Gordan? (I thought Codename Gordon was pretty fun and interesting.).
Or maybe Half-Life 2 turning into a TPS, which would be interesting nonetheless.

 

[Bad^Hat]

Eh. Regardless of what's "best" for the series, you know the combat's gonna suck. If they can't make it interesting or cohesive in their own franchise over multiple games and more than a decade, how can they be expected to do it for someone else's property?

Also, on the whole genre switch/change of perspective thing, I think a more fair comparison would be - what if the Half-Life series changed to third person? I doubt very many people here would keep quiet over that...

 

[Absinthe]

Well, switching HL to a third-person perspective would destroy a big part of the game's core and puncture its narrative style. It's the same reason you don't have any mirrors that allow you to see yourself.

Any way, I personally approach RPG games differently than I do most FPS games. I care more about an RPG's universe, story, and characters. The combat is just a timesink in between the content. Fallout for me is not defined by its gameplay mechanics. And I don't see any evidence of Bethesda raping the Fallout world.

Am I totally optimistic about FO3 without reservations? Hell no. Bethesda doesn't have a perfect track record and their more recent output is still flawed even if enjoyable. But it's been almost ten years since Fallout 2, Van Buren was canned, and it's not like the originals sold like hotcakes. After all this time, big changes should have been foreseen as somewhat inevitable. And, you know, it's not like I was having the god damn time of my life shooting super mutants in the groin after every six-second pause. I guess I'm just willing to give them the benefit of the doubt until at least a demo comes.

 

[Tagaziel]

We don't give anyone the benefit of doubt now, when it comes to Fallout. If you want evidence that Bethesda is raping Fallout, a few things first spring to mind: nuclear catapult, exploding fusion powered cars and the Behemoth, uber mutated mutant. Plus, Vault thugs. Mr Handy with an AI to insult you. Dumpster PA. Brotherhood on the East Coast, miraculously becoming a powerful organization in 20 years after 80 of going downhill. Etc.

Kage: The problem is because it stops being a P&P cRPG game like previous two titles and is out of sync in terms of presentation. It wouldn't be a problem if Bethesda didn't add the above random crap.

The nuclear catapult could be a plasma launcher, which would be grounded in Fallout backstory, where plasma grenades and rifles are the penultimate weapons. Or make it a gatling plasma.

The Behemoth could be made less of an oversized glob of flesh, changed to be more in the vein of Fallout 1's Supermutant Lieutenant.

The player escaping not from Overseer's thugs but defying the Overseer and escaping into the wastes to search for the father.

The Brotherhood could be made, for instance, the "Watchmen", a powerful, ex-military organizaton in the vein of the Hammerites from Thief.

Etc.

 

[Absinthe]

Nuclear catapults were developed in the 1950s. This really isn't so shocking. You had a car in Fallout 2 that could be powered by micro fusion cells. Uber-mutated mutant? The Master. I'm really not seeing any problems with anything else you listed.

I'll grant that the insinuation of the Overseer being some kind of outright villain is somewhat lame, but I'll see for myself.

 

[Bob_Marley]

Well, thats not entirely true. The smallest nuke ever deployed would be the W54, which is indeed capable of being fired from a 120mm or 155mm recoilless rifle. It is not, however, a practical personal weapon. Even the smallest launch units are tripod mounted and crew served. Also, the warhead would deliver a massive dose of radiation to everything in the imediate area.

The W54 is about as small as you can practically go with a nuclear weapon, so the idea that you could have a personal "nuclear catapult" is not viable. And at the ranges I would expect you to be engaguing targets in FO3 you'd either die in the explosion, die instantly from a massive dose of radiation or die later, from a massive dose of radiation.

On the subject of the Brotherhood on the East Coast, it might be possible, but I would be rather doubtful. Not an abject game killer for sure, but it'll need some serious explanation.

 

[Absinthe]

Until I see with my own eyes what exactly it is and how it works, I see no cause for alarm for the time being since it's not like there hasn't been weaponry that would be impractical in real life (ie. Gauss pistols). If they can explain it in a reasonable fashion, I couldn't care since it's not like the FO franchise is built upon technical accuracy.

I'll admit that I don't really care for the idea. But it's a single weapon. If I can drive around the wasteland with nuclear materials under the hood of my car, I can load them into my weapons. And I have. In two previous games.

 

[Flyingdebris]

Fluff is never EVER constant unless its one person behind an IP, and sometimes not even then.

Stop whining about minute changes in the fluff. Stuff like aesthetics and tiny retcons are common to all settings that get developed over time.

 

[Tagaziel]

Absinthe, fusion =/= fission. Plus, the nuclear catapult has been demonstrated in numerous ways. The screenshot in Game Informer shown it in action. Plus, one of the online previews mentioned you need five nuclear catapult charges to kill the Behemoth.

Also, it's not minute changes in aesthetic or "fluff". So far the only undeniably good thing about the game was the fact FOT was discarded in storyline terms, with the trailer coming close second.

The trailer captured the atmosphere almost perfectly, but the previews later and material from magazines is showing this game is more of an FPS that (worse) doesn't even attempt to follow the aesthetic of previous games. Or the canon.

 

[CptStern]

I dont think you'll like the game no matter what (this isnt an insult just an observation and from past experience of following a game too closely only to be let down) ..you're just too close to it's development that your expectations couldnt possibly be met

 

[Tagaziel]

I will get the game propably. And play it through. I got FOT shortly after it's release after all.

Quite propably I will play a large role in overhauling the game to fit Fallout.

 

[Wanted Bob]

Well, now I know how this forum gets people that yell at everyone to be quiet and not to make false judgements about games. I used to dislike those people (partly because those where the games I was following), but I couldn't help but think about joining NMA to tell people to get a grip and wait until it at least gets closer to release.

 

[Jintor]

If they make it moddable, it will be bearable.