November 16 the best way to get the game pirated.

[killahsin-[CE]]

Illegal TOC is a type of "copy" protection. You should really learn the topic you are going to talk about.

Again please provide me with some "background" on this as I can not find it. It is all "heresay".

How come no other has gone down because of piracy?

I think because there is no other (cept theirs and others word) that piracy was the demise of Looking Glass.

I also believe from what I read the Publiser was already pumping money into someone else for Thief 3 before LG even folded.

**ILLEGAL TOC**
This protection can be recognized when looking at the CD tracks. Usually there seems to be a second Data track (usually after some audio tracks). The CD ISO standards don't allow this thus the name Illegal TOC. In most cases the second Data track is pointing to the first Data track or parts of another track.

How about you just read looking glass's press release from when they shut down. They stated themselves piracy was a major factor. And forgive me i read what you wrote previously wrong. ToS came to mind.

The reason looking glass had major issues was because in the first thief they didn't do a cd key. So it led to mass copying/downloading. It was a title when pc gamign wasn't a massive industry like it is now. And EVERYone who was into pc gamign back than knew how to get warez.

 

[JER9542]

:cheers:

 

[Aknot]

How about you just read looking glass's press release from when they shut down. They stated themselves piracy was a major factor. And forgive me i read what you wrote previously wrong. ToS came to mind.

The reason looking glass had major issues was because in the first thief they didn't do a cd key. So it led to mass copying/downloading. It was a title when pc gamign wasn't a massive industry like it is now. And EVERYone who was into pc gamign back than knew how to get warez.

I "googled" and could not find anything. Thats what I want is more reading material.

Also first you said they had NO protection now you are just saying they had no CD key protection. You also said piracy was THE reason now it was a MAJOR reason.

Yet they still were able to produce three more games after that and THEN have to go belly up.

That tells me a few things:

They either did not learn from their lesson and had 3 more games pirated. (hard to believe)

Or they had a bad business and it went under and they needed a scapegoat. (more likely)

Dont get me wrong I do not condone piracy BUT I find it hard to believe it took down a company that had a few (decent) games under its belt BEFORE Thief and 3 more after it.

As for CDkeys they are "breakable" especially for single play and are not that "secure". I mean all it takes is one person to buy a legit copy and post the key.

**sorry for the "snippy" response earlier. I do love an intelligent debate/conversation and I stepped a little over the line **

 

[killahsin-[CE]]

Do you know anything about looking glass? It seems as if you don't. They went from self funded, with theif. A smash hit game of the year(it beat hl as goty). To being completly broke, actually in debt. Thief didnt even sell 1 million units. But millions of people played it... Think about that. Thats when they started to become publisher funded. Than system shock 2....again highly warez. One of the best games of all times. Yet not even close to one of the best sellers. Thats when they went bankrupt and got bought out by edios. Which than killed them off and kept the IP. That is why i said ONE of the reasons. Because it was the main reason they went broke! BUT edios was the ones who put the nail in their coffin.

Looking glass created nothing but smash hits. Yet ...

 

[Parasite]

Did i mention anything about seasons? No!.
I was talking about the GAP until its released.

So this "Pirate" you talk about would likely not pirate it if he had too do it in 2 weeks as opposed to 4? Good point...pirates are lazy...if only companies realized this and cut the gap down to a week or less, no games would ever get pirated. O wait...they will just pirate it after the game comes out like they usually do :/

Seriously, the game will be pirated regardless...wether or not it will be leaked before release date depends on one factor....the people who come in contact with the game, not the time between gold and release. The game will pass through the same amount of hands either way and we can only hope none of them are attached to an asshole.

 

[A2597]

correct me if I'm wrong, but has Valve enabled VAC yet?

I'd imagine that as some point, they will stop ALL warez boys from playing

 

[Aknot]

Do you know anything about looking glass? It seems as if you don't. They went from self funded, with theif. A smash hit game of the year(it beat hl as goty). To being completly broke, actually in debt. Thief didnt even sell 1 million units. But millions of people played it... Think about that. Thats when they started to become publisher funded. Than system shock 2....again highly warez. One of the best games of all times. Yet not even close to one of the best sellers. Thats when they went bankrupt and got bought out by edios. Which than killed them off and kept the IP. That is why i said ONE of the reasons. Because it was the main reason they went broke! BUT edios was the ones who put the nail in their coffin.

Looking glass created nothing but smash hits. Yet ...

I just go by what I can "read" and find.

"Despite strong sales of Thief II, the company was rumored to have financial problems." (http://slashdot.org/articles/00/05/25/031255.shtml)

"The Thief series has its genesis on PCs. Originally created by fan-beloved but commercially unsuccessful Looking Glass Studios"
(http://www.overclockersclub.com/news/news-archive-15-2-2004.php)

"Looking Glass Studios was hardly stomped by giants. They over extended themselves and got into a cash flow problem. They imploded. Not being saved by a big company is not the same as being crushed by a big company."
(http://www.planetcrap.com/topics/90/)

Again there is more "talk" that the company just couldnt cut it as a business. As people, developers of games, etc. they may have been the best but the most I can find points to "bad business".

Who/How were the other first six games funded?

 

[azertyu]

Those people who downloads the game never intended to buy it anyways. Valve only lost potiental money

 

[Aknot]

My bad I was wrong. Eidos was not pumping money to someone else for T3 it was for......Daikatana....

"Looking Glass Studios (creators of Thief, Thief II, and other games) declared bankruptcy. The irony was, their publisher, Eidos Interactive, was pumping all their money into Ion Storm's effort to finish Daikatana."

(http://slashdot.org/articles/00/08/12/0452205.shtml)

 

[Aknot]

Those people who downloads the game never intended to buy it anyways. Valve only lost potiental money

Not true "all the time".

Dont be shocked but I have played "pirated" games. BUT only long enough to find out if Im going to buy it or not.

The return policy (which can be blamed becasue of piracy) of most stores have forced my hand.

So instead of buying a game playing it for a day and realizing it is crap and returning it Im stuck with it. So now publishers/developers get a "false" sense of success. So THAT you can blame piracy for.

Demos do not always give you a feel for the game (although I have found I do not DL games as much as I used to becasue of demos)

Hell I cant remember to be honest with you the last game I did.

But any I liked I bought, and any I didnt I deleted.

 

[alexkraemer]

it brings up an ethical argument: If you download a pirated copy, play the game for 15 minutes, decide you hate it and never play it again, is that really piracy? The law may say it is, but the game developer was never going to get your money anyways, so where's the crime?

 

[Aknot]

it brings up an ethical argument: If you download a pirated copy, play the game for 15 minutes, decide you hate it and never play it again, is that really piracy? The law may say it is, but the game developer was never going to get your money anyways, so where's the crime?

I think "piracy" is the "boogey man" for most people. Yes it is "big" but I do not think it is as big a problem as everyone thinks it is.

How do you gauge that? I mean as you said if I NEVER intended to buy it, DL it and even play it how does that "hurt" the business if I never intended to buy it in the first place? How do you say you lost something you never had?

Now if everyone did that I can see it "catching" up.

But I like to think MOST people are honest. And the fear of the "boogey man" keeps them in check.

Im 40 do you know how many "copied" VHS movies I had growing up and also my friends? The movie companies are still in business. Still slowly raising their prices as they always do. Regardless of commercials at the Theater and $6 buckets of popcorn.

 

[FthrJACK]

I bet the CDs will be encrypted like the pre-load.

The preload hasnt got the full game there, theres bits missing.

And encryption ensmiption, like the XBOX encryption you mean?

yet again microsoft "navar be cracked, navar!" and it was.

they can also install the "encrypted" disks (not that they will be) then rip the files from the hard disk, make an installer, with registry keys (simple snapshot programs out there that detect and show registry changes between two points, like before and after installing the game)

mimic steam, same way as was done for CSS, or even strip steam out and make the game not check for it, and.. bada-bing.

It will be done, dont be so bloody nieve, its going to happen weather we like it or not.